Impossibly Dry Hair

[Mufasa]

Hello! I'm a newbie here, but I've done a lot of research on the forums. Unfortunately, I have been unable to solve my hair problems on my own and would like some personalized advice.

That was then:
About two years ago, I had beautiful waist length hair that I didn't fully appreciate. I was having severe bacne and chestne issues that I knew was related to my hair habits (conditioner in particular). I decided to get my hair cut to bsl to alleviate these issues. I have had one-length hair my entire life, and didn't ask for layers, but the hair dresser gave me "The Rachel (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0a/Rachel_Green_Rachel_haircut.jpg)" - shoulder-length layered hair without regards to my initial requests.

This made my thick, curly hair look terribly thin and triangular. I eventually grew it out to apl and cut it back to one length because I couldn't stand the uneven, flippy layers. On top of that, I learned that hair length had nothing to do with my bacne and chestne issues. After lots of research, I learned that the panthenol (http://blog.reneerouleau.com/do-you-have-acne-breakouts-on-your-back/) in my hair products (and silicones) were likely the trigger.

This is now:
I am currently approximately two inches away from bsl and hope to grow it out to waist length. I have impossibly dry, poofy hair that will not look moisturized no matter what I do with it. I haven't used heat in the past 3 months. I do not believe that I have damage because I do not see split ends and my hemline is still blunt. My hair absolutely hates anything with protein in it. Protein makes my hair felt wiry and strange. Each hair strand looks twice its normal size.

I changed up my routine to this:
WCC 3X per week (I would go longer, but my hair seems to absorb smells very quickly. For example, if I go for a walk, my hair will have that "air" smell. Does this happen to anyone else?)
-Burt's Bees More Moisture Shampoo (SLS Free)
-Renpure Originals Argan Oil Luxurious Conditioner

Leave-ins:
-Macademia Oil Nourishing Leave-In Cream
-Coney Serum

I have tried clarifying and following up with an SMT. I also tried MO oil as a leave-in and as an oil rinse, but it makes my hair feel stiff and crunchy.

[gthlvrmx]

Did you use heat on all of your length? If so, you probably still have the damage you got 3 months back. If you cut the damaged hair out, then you wouldn't have the damaged hair to deal with. Heat styling causes damage, that's just how it works.

ETA:3 months of hair growth would be about 1 1/2 inches of hair. You have curls so maybe you might benefit from CO washing or the Curly Girl Method.

[Anje]

What happens if you skip the silicone serum? That stuff drys out my hair -- I think it's the volatile silicones. I also don't have luck with mineral oil, but coconut oil is OK and olive oil makes my hair feel very soft and moisturized. Olive oil is especially good at making my hair look oily and stringy too if I use even slightly too much, but in braided hair the day before a wash it's pretty easy to disguise.

[Mufasa]

Did you use heat on all of your length? If so, you probably still have the damage you got 3 months back. If you cut the damaged hair out, then you wouldn't have the damaged hair to deal with. Heat styling causes damage, that's just how it works.

ETA:3 months of hair growth would be about 1 1/2 inches of hair. You have curls so maybe you might benefit from CO washing or the Curly Girl Method.

Thank you, gthlvrmx! I did use heat infrequently on my length (blow-drier with round brush) probably 3 times a month or so when I could be bothered. I don't believe that my hair is extensively heat damaged to warrant a large chop. I have tried CO washing twice in the past and didn't like it. I tried VO5 and Suave conditioners (that had panthenol) and my skin didn't like that. My scalp never felt clean no matter how much I took care to massage the conditioner into my scalp with the pads of my fingers or how long I rinsed afterwards. It also caused my curls to look wonky.

[Mufasa]

What happens if you skip the silicone serum? That stuff drys out my hair -- I think it's the volatile silicones. I also don't have luck with mineral oil, but coconut oil is OK and olive oil makes my hair feel very soft and moisturized. Olive oil is especially good at making my hair look oily and stringy too if I use even slightly too much, but in braided hair the day before a wash it's pretty easy to disguise.

When I am lazy and skip any leave-in products my hair seems to be a bit better, now that you mention it, Anje. Would you recommend avoiding silicone in my conditioner as well? I'm afraid of using coconut oil because I know that it is comedogenic (I also live in a cold climate ... I have a friend that had it solidify in her hair once :P), but olive oil is something that I have never thought to use (I believe it is low on the comedogenic scale). Do you have luck using it post-shower in damp hair or only as an overnight pre-wash? Thank you so much, I will try it before my next wash!

[Nadine <3]

When I am lazy and skip any leave-in products my hair seems to be a bit better, now that you mention it, Anje. Would you recommend avoiding silicone in my conditioner as well? I'm afraid of using coconut oil because I know that it is comedogenic (I also live in a cold climate ... I have a friend that had it solidify in her hair once :P), but olive oil is something that I have never thought to use (I believe it is low on the comedogenic scale). Do you have luck using it post-shower in damp hair or only as an overnight pre-wash? Thank you so much, I will try it before my next wash!

Olive oil is by far my favorite oil. I have acne issues as well (face, back and chest. Lucky me lol) and I do not find it makes it worst at all. I use a drop or two of olive oil every morning before I detangle and put it up for the day. It doesn't make my hair greasy at all, but YMMV. My hair soaks up oil (particularly, olive oil) like dry leather

I bought a small glass bottle with a little dropper top to store my olive oil in. It makes me feel fancy and it allows me to really control how much I'm pouring.

[Mufasa]

Olive oil is by far my favorite oil. I have acne issues as well (face, back and chest. Lucky me lol) and I do not find it makes it worst at all. I use a drop or two of olive oil every morning before I detangle and put it up for the day. It doesn't make my hair greasy at all, but YMMV. My hair soaks up oil (particularly, olive oil) like dry leather

I bought a small glass bottle with a little dropper top to store my olive oil in. It makes me feel fancy and it allows me to really control how much I'm pouring.


Wow, thanks so much, Nadine. It's good to hear confirmation that olive oil likely won't cause my skin to go crazy! :disco: The glass bottle dropper idea sounds lovely, did you purchase yours online? I don't think that I've seen those anywhere.

[Nadine <3]

Yup, I ordered mine from Amazon!
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FRRFW0E?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00

I've seen them for sale in health food stores too :)

[Anje]

When I am lazy and skip any leave-in products my hair seems to be a bit better, now that you mention it, Anje. Would you recommend avoiding silicone in my conditioner as well? I'm afraid of using coconut oil because I know that it is comedogenic (I also live in a cold climate ... I have a friend that had it solidify in her hair once :P), but olive oil is something that I have never thought to use (I believe it is low on the comedogenic scale). Do you have luck using it post-shower in damp hair or only as an overnight pre-wash? Thank you so much, I will try it before my next wash!

I generally prefer doing a post-shower damp-hair oiling, partly because it makes tangles fall out for me, and partly because I've never noticed a particular benefit to my hair from pre-wash oiling. (Doesn't mean you can't try both! It just means that in my experimentation, my hair isn't impressed by it.) Oh, on a whim, I really like sesame oil, and it was recommended to me by someone with about the same hairtype as you. If you try that, look for the light-colored kind, not the flavoring oil, unless you don't mind smelling like food all day.

As far as conditioners go, I personally avoid things that have straight dimethicone and the volatile silicones (cyclomethicone, cyclopentasiloxane, etc.) in them for the same reason I avoid it in serums. I find I don't have any problems using conditioners with amine-functionalized silicones like amodimethicone and bis-aminopropyldimethicone. Herbal Essences Hello Hydration and Long Term Relationship are both very nice for moisturizing and containing only silicones that I like.

One last thing to try: After you rinse the conditioner out of your hair, it might be worth clipping it up and soaping up your chest and back to get any conditioner residue off. I've switched to that whenever I notice that I'm having body acne issues, which come and go for me.

[RavenRose]

It may be that silicones are not good for your hair, I know for me they build up very quickly, and leave my hair much drier, so I have a tendency to avoid them, except an argon oil serum that I occasional use when I want to wear my hair down, since it gives slip and prevents tangles. I generally like to use a small amount of coconut oil as a leave in.

[MsPharaohMoan]

It makes me feel fancy

-giggles-


Wow, thanks so much, Nadine. It's good to hear confirmation that olive oil likely won't cause my skin to go crazy! :disco: The glass bottle dropper idea sounds lovely, did you purchase yours online? I don't think that I've seen those anywhere.

The only way you'll really know that is if you try it ;)


One last thing to try: After you rinse the conditioner out of your hair, it might be worth clipping it up and soaping up your chest and back to get any conditioner residue off. I've switched to that whenever I notice that I'm having body acne issues, which come and go for me.

Excellent advice! Rich conditioners with butters and oils need to be soaped off of my back lest I get spots there.

PS, remember to make small changes in your routine and spend some time with the new changes.

[Verdandi]

I used to have problems with the combination silicones in my conditioner and body acne. I started to put my hair up when I had applied the conditioner and then bend forward when rinsing it so that the conditoner or suds never touches my body. Spares me a lot of acne :-)

[diddiedaisy]

I've recently had dry ends, what has worked for me is applying aloe Vera gel to slightly damp hair and sealing with olive oil, then leaving overnight and washing out in the morning. The avg and water moisturises and the oil seals the moisture in. Olive oil can also penetrate the hair shaft to a certain degree.

[lapushka]

Have you tried washing in the upside down position? That would solve the issues you have with your back and you could use whatever products you wanted.

[pailin]

I've actually found shampoo, rather than conditioner, to be a culprit with acne. I don't have any trouble with it on my back normally, but I had some for a while and assumed it was my conditioner. It wasn't bad enough to make me change it though. Eventually I actually changed my shampoo - a moisturizing one- because my scalp was itchy. But I continued using the same conditioner, and the acne went away. So I blame the shampoo.

[Arctic]

For me olive oil gave a very bad acne. It didn't at first, but with continuing use, the acne was worse I've ever had. Because it started so slowly (and because I loved what it did to my hair), I didn't connect the dots untill it was late.

Granted, I've never yet seen oil or butter that wouldn't eventually give me acne, but the oilive oil was in its own category because of how big and deep the acne was. It took a long time to heal. Coconut oil was bad too,instant acne if it touches my skin.

Oils are very much YMMV type of ingredients, and some people, even with acne prone skin, won't have any problems. Some even say oils helped to heal their acne. For me, oils are not good for my skin, so I have stopped using them (with a rare exception in deep treatments, or some small scale experiment). This is why I always feel wary of recommending oils for those with acne; I wouldn't want anyone go through the skin issues I had.

[diddiedaisy]

arctic I think your right about the oil and acne. If I put coconut oil in the bath it brings my back rash out, apparently it's contact dermatitis. If I do an overnight oil though I put my hair up and wear a tshirt to keep most of it off my skin.

Also with shampoos/conditioner, I bring my hair to the front so it's not sat on my back and after rinsing I bring it back round the front and rinse my back really well.

[Mufasa]

I generally prefer doing a post-shower damp-hair oiling, partly because it makes tangles fall out for me, and partly because I've never noticed a particular benefit to my hair from pre-wash oiling. (Doesn't mean you can't try both! It just means that in my experimentation, my hair isn't impressed by it.) Oh, on a whim, I really like sesame oil, and it was recommended to me by someone with about the same hairtype as you. If you try that, look for the light-colored kind, not the flavoring oil, unless you don't mind smelling like food all day.

As far as conditioners go, I personally avoid things that have straight dimethicone and the volatile silicones (cyclomethicone, cyclopentasiloxane, etc.) in them for the same reason I avoid it in serums. I find I don't have any problems using conditioners with amine-functionalized silicones like amodimethicone and bis-aminopropyldimethicone. Herbal Essences Hello Hydration and Long Term Relationship are both very nice for moisturizing and containing only silicones that I like.

One last thing to try: After you rinse the conditioner out of your hair, it might be worth clipping it up and soaping up your chest and back to get any conditioner residue off. I've switched to that whenever I notice that I'm having body acne issues, which come and go for me.

I have a feeling that silicones may be contributing to my dryness. I want to test if my hair will be better off without them, so I will first phase out the volatile silicones for two weeks and then test going completely cone-free after that. Thank you for the sesame oil recommendation, I will look into that if I find that olive oil is not right for me. I think that you are on to something, thank you so much. Are there any articles that I could read some more about this? Though as a newbie, I don't believe that I have access quite yet.


It may be that silicones are not good for your hair, I know for me they build up very quickly, and leave my hair much drier, so I have a tendency to avoid them, except an argon oil serum that I occasional use when I want to wear my hair down, since it gives slip and prevents tangles. I generally like to use a small amount of coconut oil as a leave in.

I agree! I feel as though the more products with silicone that I try, the drier my hair gets. Hopefully it's just the volatile silicones that Anje mentioned.

[Mufasa]

Verdandi
laphushka
I should really be more vigilant about this, these are great methods that would allow me to feel free to try more things. The current shampoo and conditioner don't cause any problems with my back even without putting my hair up. I think that panthenol was the problem ingredient as everything has cleared up.

MsPharaohMoan
Yes! It's definitely easy to get overwhelmed. Trying too many things at once can cause confusion about what actually works.

diddiedaisy
For some reason, I can't get AVG to work for me on damp hair. It leaves my hair feeling similar to the MO (crunchy and stiff). I'm assuming that it just doesn't work for some people?


For me olive oil gave a very bad acne. It didn't at first, but with continuing use, the acne was worse I've ever had. Because it started so slowly (and because I loved what it did to my hair), I didn't connect the dots untill it was late. This is why I always feel wary of recommending oils for those with acne; I wouldn't want anyone go through the skin issues I had.

Oh, I'm so sorry that your skin had such a horrible response to olive oil! It's so frustrating when what works for our hair makes our skin go absolutely insane. I'm very wary of oils after a similar experience that I had after trying a coconut oil treatment and watching my forehead and back completely erupt in acne. This was about 4 years ago, and have been afraid of it since.

I know that oils have disappointed you, but have you tried MO? My hair didn't like it all, but yours might. My $3 bottle will not go to waste though, because I have found that it is AMAZING on my damp skin. A few drops locks in moisture into my skin like nothing else, it has been proven to be non-comedgonic.

I think that there is no way of knowing if I will have a bad response to olive oil until I actually try it. I will definitely be hyper-vigilant and heed your warnings.


diddiedaisy My skin hates coconut oil, also :(

*** Sorry for the double post, I'm still figuring these things out. ;)

[Mufasa]

Update: Olive oil worked for my hair in terms of increasing softness, but caused skin problems :brickwall
I'm thinking that I just need to avoid all oils in my hair care routine. I also found that my hair prefers silicone-free products. Can anyone with an oil/cone free routine care to comment?
Thanks :love:

[maborosi]

You might like an SMT (Thread Here (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=128)), have you tried it? It doesn't have to have oils, unless they're already in your conditioner. I bleached my hair recently and so this has been my favorite deep conditioning treatment to ensure my hair doesn't get dried out.

I don't do well with a lot of oils, either. Coconut is extremely comedogenic for a lot of people, and olive oil honestly didn't do anything for my hair.
Coconut oil works for me but I can't get it on my skin. The best oil I've ever found for my hair has been mineral oil.

[school of fish]

Update: Olive oil worked for my hair in terms of increasing softness, but caused skin problems :brickwall
I'm thinking that I just need to avoid all oils in my hair care routine. I also found that my hair prefers silicone-free products. Can anyone with an oil/cone free routine care to comment?
Thanks :love:

Hmmm... well I'm not entirely cone-free and I have a different hairtype than yours but I certainly can relate to the dryness issue! About 2 years ago I had unwittingly let my hair get terribly dried out and brittle, just by not understanding what it needed and following a routine that was incrementally causing great damage. It took a long period of one-item-at-a-time trial and error to get it sorted out and turned around. The process takes time and patience for sure, but as you make your good discoveries it's worth it!

My hair HATES oils, each and every one of them - but it loves moisture. Weekly SMTs, and alternating S&C with CO washing have restored the moisture balance and got my hair back to feeling very close to the way I remember it pre-damage :)

You mentioned SMT - did you try it once or a few times? I can't say that it was a miracle the first time I tried it, but the cumulative effect of regular treatments has had a huge positive effect. Perhaps some repeated SMTs might be something to try? And maybe even try sneaking a few drops of olive oil into the SMT, so you get some of that softness benefit?

Just a thought in any case :) Hope you find your happy routine soon!

[Mufasa]

I tried one SMT and didn't see any benefits to my hair (I'm impatient, what can I say?) I think that the conditioner that I was using was part of the problem (it was Herbal Essences the Sleeker the Butter). I do think that I am in the terrible trial-and-error phase :meditate: but I am hopeful that I can find something! (Thank you everyone for being so helpful along the way :blossom: ) I will definitely have to go out and buy a conditioner from the approved list and hopefully try to do them once a week!
maborosi, our hair textures are completely different, but you have my dream hair! It is so pretty :thud:

[Rushli]

If looking to try new things, Shea Moisture has some great masks. I have not tried many yet, but their honey one was great for my hair. There might be oil in it, I'll have to check. If you have an Ultra near you, they are having a buy one get one 50% off and if they don't work for you, you can return them.

eta: yeah the honey one has lots of oil. This one has some oil waaaaay down on the list: SheaMoisture Fruit Fusion Coconut Water Weightless Hair Masque http://www.ulta.com/ulta/browse/productDetail.jsp?productId=xlsImpprod12731005

[maborosi]

I tried one SMT and didn't see any benefits to my hair (I'm impatient, what can I say?) I think that the conditioner that I was using was part of the problem (it was Herbal Essences the Sleeker the Butter). I do think that I am in the terrible trial-and-error phase :meditate: but I am hopeful that I can find something! (Thank you everyone for being so helpful along the way :blossom: ) I will definitely have to go out and buy a conditioner from the approved list and hopefully try to do them once a week!
maborosi, our hair textures are completely different, but you have my dream hair! It is so pretty :thud:

Yes! Conditioner is so important to the SMT- you would not believe how crazy bad SMT can turn out by using the wrong one...
I tried an SMT with Suave's Sun Ripened Strawberry and it left my hair matted and smelling...uh...not so great. Meanwhile my normal go-to for SMT is Suave's Wild Cherry Blossom and that is the conditioner from the heavens as far as I'm concerned.

And thank you very much! That is really nice of you to say!! :flower: