More splits after S&D

[lillielil]

Not too long ago I did a real S&D for the first time. Good light, sharp scissors, little section of hair, etc. I thought I did a pretty decent job of it, even though I had to cut a lot. Now I'm seeing more splits than ever. When I examine a small section of hair, I'm seeing a good 20% of the ends are split, white-dotted, frayed, or otherwise extremely damaged. Of course there were a few that I didn't find when I S&D'd, but this seems ridiculous. Is it possible my hair is so damaged that the ends I cut off immediately split again? What should I do? I'm trying to grow out layers and plan on trimming about half my growth every month to stay on top of the damage.

[lapushka]

I'd say in this case you're better off trimming a bit. You will lose a lot of density if you S&D a lot, if you have to. Maybe it's just damage that was there but you just didn't spot in one go? It's hard to keep an eye on every single strand of hair!

[lillielil]

I'm worried that if I trim more, the ends will just keep unraveling. I just trimmed about .5" last Friday, but am using the compact cut method to get rid of layers - moving the ponytail a bit further down each trim - so it was mostly just the longest layers that got trimmed.

[Sarahlabyrinth]

Were you using hairdressing scissors? Scissors which have never been used for anything else?

[lillielil]

Were you using hairdressing scissors? Scissors which have never been used for anything else?

I was using tiny cuticle scissors which have only ever been used for hair and are very new. I thought they were just as sharp as hairdressing scissors, but I could be wrong!

[lapushka]

Just to be on the safe side, I'd get some haircutting scissors especially for this purpose, lillielil!

[Kherome]

I was using tiny cuticle scissors which have only ever been used for hair and are very new. I thought they were just as sharp as hairdressing scissors, but I could be wrong!

Nooooooo

Hair shears are not the same as paper, cuticle, fabric etc scissors. Don't touch your hair with anything but hair shears.

[lillielil]

Ok, I'll get some proper scissors. I have two pairs at home, but DW used them both for other things so I can't use them any more :angry:. Are there any recommendations for tiny scissors? I find full length ones hard to manage for S&D.

That doesn't explain the partial split I just found 3" up, though!

[Kherome]

You probably have more damage then you realized. Layers often result in that. You're going to have to get used to regular sized hair shears. They don't come in micro sizes AFAIK.

[Anje]

I'm thinking it's most likely that you've got more damaged than you realized, and now you're looking for it so you see it everywhere. It happens. Frankly, I use little facial scissors geared toward mustaches and nose hair fairly often, because they're tiny and easy to stash somewhere. They're not hair shears, but they are meant for hair!

[lillielil]

I like the idea of mustache scissors! Would something like this (http://www.amazon.com/Tweezerman-7200-r-Moustache-Scissors/dp/B002HK2GN0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1447092838&sr=8-1&keywords=mustache+scissors)do the trick?

[meteor]

Yes, having more splitting right after a dusting or S&D is a good indicator that the scissors aren't sharp enough.

It's important to use hairdressing scissors, keep them dry and protected, and never let them cut anything other than hair (no paper, no textiles... keep them just for hair).

Another thing to consider when getting a lot of splitting right away: it's quite possible that the hair has accumulated some damage. I'd highly recommend checking that all combs are seamless and that you use them gently, wearing hair in protective styles, covering it with hats/scarves/buffs when it's windy/sunny, sleeping on silky smooth pillowcases (or using silky bonnets/scarves) to prevent further damage. Every little thing adds up with preventing damage. :flower:

A few things that can help in terms of treatments:
1) hydrolyzed protein treatments, for example, Aphogee 2 Step, DIY gelatin treatment (http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2014/04/gelatin-protein-treatment-recipe-update.html), Joico K-Pak Reconstruct, Redken CAT...
More on protein: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2015/10/protein-101-lots-of-basic-information.html and http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2013/09/more-about-protein.html and http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2011/08/mysteries-of-hydrolyzed-proteins.html

2) heavy oiling - use a penetrating oil, for example coconut oil, preferably as a pre-poo treatment, but also added to conditioner and/or used as a "sealing" oil (or part of LOC) post-wash.
More on how to make oils work: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2014/03/oil-pre-shampoo-or-pre-wash.html

3) regular deep treatments like the humectant-rich SMT and products marketed for "damaged hair", many of them will contain proteins, silicones, ceramides...
More on ceramides: http://www.thenaturalhavenbloom.com/2010/08/ceramides-patching-up-damaged-hair.html
More on silicones: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2011/07/riffing-on-silicones.html
More on deep conditioning ingredients that penetrate porous hair: http://www.thenaturalhavenbloom.com/2012/10/deep-conditioning-what-ingredients-in.html

[lillielil]

Thank you meteor! I am replacing my scissors right away. I do wear my hair in a protective bun 90+% of the time and only comb with a wide-tooth horn comb and occasionally use a tangle teezer, but sleep on a regular cotton pillowcase. I have been experimenting with oiling and protein, trying to figure out what my hair needs, but haven't yet tried any true protein treatments - just regular products with protein in them. I struggle a bit because in addition to being damaged, it is fairly thin and gets very greasy at the roots. I know I have existing damage, but am hoping to maintain enough length to successfully bun my hair (for me this is about BSL) while I grow/cut out the worst of the damage.

I'm not sure about -cones at this point. Do my damaged ends need them? Or am I better off without them? I fall into the category of "-You have very fine or thin hair that tends to get weighed down easily" under "avoid them" in your link.

Thank you for posting the link about ceramides. I had not read anything about them before. I like the idea of trying something that may "patch" some of the damage. I'm not sure what ingredients to look for, though.

[meteor]

Thank you meteor! I am replacing my scissors right away. I do wear my hair in a protective bun 90+% of the time and only comb with a wide-tooth horn comb and occasionally use a tangle teezer, but sleep on a regular cotton pillowcase.

^ Sounds like a great routine! :thumbsup:
I would try a silky scarf or blouse (or whatever you have) to wrap the pillow (like a pillowcase) and/or wrapping hair in silky scarf (like a bonnet bonnet) to see if it makes a difference compared to cotton, before making any investment. But it does make a difference for many people, especially with textured or dry or tangle-prone or frizz-prone hair. (Personally, I notice a difference if I sleep on regular cotton right away now.)
It doesn't even have to be real silk (material) or satin (weave), any silky smooth material will do. :)


I have been experimenting with oiling and protein, trying to figure out what my hair needs, but haven't yet tried any true protein treatments - just regular products with protein in them. I struggle a bit because in addition to being damaged, it is fairly thin and gets very greasy at the roots. I know I have existing damage, but am hoping to maintain enough length to successfully bun my hair (for me this is about BSL) while I grow/cut out the worst of the damage.

For greasy roots, you could try scalp-only washes (with length braided/bunned and covered in plastic wrap) or dry shampoos? :)
Try conditioning only from ears/chin down. You could experiment with pre-poo oiling (coconut oil is great for that, as it prevents keratin loss during washing/combing - http://journal.scconline.org/pdf/cc2003/cc054n02/p00175-p00192.pdf) to protect the length if you need to use harsh shampoos on your scalp.

For protein, how about experimenting with smaller ones: amino acids, peptides, hydrolyzed keratin, hydrolyzed silk, hydrolyzed collagen before trying any bigger ones (e.g. oat, wheat, soy)? You can check out this chart on protein sizes (http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-mjKAzB2jM48/UiY4IxHfTKI/AAAAAAAAAn0/UWgtWUeDPSs/s1600/hydrolyzed_protein_source_table.jpg). The latter tend to work for very damaged hair; the former are more likely to fit more hair types, but some of them might have less staying power (easier to wash out). (More info on how to select proteins for your hair type: http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2011/08/mysteries-of-hydrolyzed-proteins.html)

You could try a gelatin treatment, if you are into DIY. :)
For example, I dilute 1 tbsp of gelatin (1 Knox packet) in a bit of hot water, add about 1/2 cup of warmed upconditioner (enough to make it easy to apply) and 1-2 tbsp of honey and 1 tsp of oil.


I'm not sure about -cones at this point. Do my damaged ends need them? Or am I better off without them? I fall into the category of "-You have very fine or thin hair that tends to get weighed down easily" under "avoid them" in your link.

Yes, I think silicones are great for damaged hair, because they coat hair in a protective, occlusive film and provide much-needed slip. The downside is that they can build up so regular clarifying may be needed, and they can smooth down the hair so much that it can sometimes look lank or feel weighed down. If you get build up fast, you could use lighter cones (amodimethicone, for example) or rotate coney products with cone-free ones... It's very YMMV and you'll need to experiment to find what your hair likes the most. :flower:


Thank you for posting the link about ceramides. I had not read anything about them before. I like the idea of trying something that may "patch" some of the damage. I'm not sure what ingredients to look for, though.

Yes, ceramides can have a bunch of different names, which can be confusing... Many L'Oreal brands, e.g. Redken, L'Oreal Professionnel, L'Oreal Paris and Elseve/Elvive/Elvital (different names in different countries) products are heavy in ceramides. Here is a great thread by Firefox7275 which lists some products that contain them - List of Products Containing Ceramides and/or 18-MEA: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=120288

[Anje]

I like the idea of mustache scissors! Would something like this (http://www.amazon.com/Tweezerman-7200-r-Moustache-Scissors/dp/B002HK2GN0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1447092838&sr=8-1&keywords=mustache+scissors)do the trick?

Just so long as you don't stab yourself with them. I think my current pair is round-tipped. :)

[Aubren]

I agree that your hair was probably just more damaged than you thought. Unfortunately mine is too, I just do "dustings " like once a week, and even that is helping, plus I don't feel like I'm losing length that would make me cry.

[luxurioushair]

I would apply light oil to the ends more often to see if that helps minimize new damage after you cut the splits out. I think splits are inevitable but if you have to trim too often then something is wrong.

[trolleypup]

The shortest you'll find hair shears is about 4.0 - 4.5"...and likely to be expensive. I am very happy with my Japanese (or convex) style shears [both blades are acutely sharp rather than the more common blade against squared anvil (German) type.]

I'd recommend keeping up with the S&D since it targets the damaged strands while trims cut damaged and undamaged indiscriminately.