hair comments I had today to Glam up

[Agnes Hannah]

My hair is fine, I know that and accept that is the way it is, and it is always up. However, today whilst out for lunch, a friend of mine commented about it, she asked why it was so long and up all of the time, she went on to say that it would look better shorter and that it was too fine to be long. Furthermore, she said that wearing it loose looked much better and that I should "glam up" and stop wearing buns.

How can I "glam up" then as I want to protect my hair and certainly don't want to cut it!

Feeling a bit confused...

[Nique1202]

You could add some accent braids or rope twists to the hair from the front leading into your buns, and do more braided styles so that you can still protect it pretty effectively but also show off the length sometimes, or stuff like crown or coronet braids that look really fancy but still keep hair up and out of most dangers.

Ultimately, though, your hair is your choice and you can tell that to anyone who makes that kind of comment about it. "I value your opinion when I ask for it. If you grow your hair long, you can do whatever you like with it. I like wearing my hair this way, so I will continue to do so, and I'd appreciate it if you'd accept that for me."

Also if it's a friend you can really talk with deeply, try talking about the "if you can't fix it in 30 seconds in a bathroom don't say anything at all about someone else's appearance" rule. A lot of us are taught to judge and criticise the appearances of others but if you leave the house looking that way, then there's a reason for it and it's not anyone else's place to say you shouldn't.

(Mind you, a lot of buns DO only take 30 seconds to put up and less to take down, but hopefully your friend doesn't know how easy long hair styling can be when you've got the routine down.)

[lapushka]

I'd say the hell with her comments, and you just do what you do and keep on wearing your hair the way *you* want! The nerve!

[Groovy Granny]

I'd say the hell with her comments, and you just do what you do and keep on wearing your hair the way *you* want! The nerve!

:agree:

Your hair is long, beautiful, and healthy!

All the naysayers can 'curl up and dye'...... if they choose to ;)

[Seeshami]

I am not a nice person and none of my friends or family would have the balls to say something like that to me but I probably would have told her when I want her opinion on my hair I will ask her for it and if she keeps volunteering it she had better be ready for my brutally honest opinion about her.

[oceanlove]

That wasn't a very nice comment your friend made. I don't think its anyone else's business how you wear your hair. Unfortunately, a lot of people give unsolicited advice. The fact that your friend stated your hair is too fine to be long and you should cut it, makes her sound a little envious of your long tresses. I'm sure thats all it is and your hair looks great the way it is...whether you wear it up or down as long as you like it then that is all that matters.

[rags]

AgnesHannah, as you know I've been the recipient of such comments as well. If it help you any, I only got a couple of compliments when I cut it too. :rolleyes: Sometimes people just like to "pick", I think!

Anyway. if you want different you could consider bangs or face framing layers. But without cutting, I'd do accent braids, especially a lace braid that goes across the front like a headband and then to the back. That gives visual interest and changes things up. You can also do rag curls/ braid waves (and still put it up). They make a bun look totally different, plus they give volume and make it look softer and more romantic, in my opinion.

Braids are a beautiful option while still somewhat protective, also (though for my fine hair I find I can't do them every day, but once or twice a week works.

But all that is only if YOU want to "glam it up". Otherwise, keep wearing YOUR hair the way you like it and don't worry about what she says. If I had a penny for every time someone told me I'd look better with shorter hair (and with it dyed, because of course you shouldn't let your hair be silver!) I'd be rich. I'm not kidding, cashiers, family, a waiter at a restaurant, lots of people have told me this. But where are they now it's cut? Or even when it was cut last time, when it wasn't nearly as thin? No compliments, it didn't magically make it look better. it's still fine and thin - just now it's short. One person (a hairdresser!) actually admitted this last time that had it not fallen out in such a weird pattern - that it looked better longer and up. Hah!

Wear YOUR hair the way YOU want and ignore them all, i say!

[Upside Down]

Honestly those comments just sound mean.

None of my friends would ever say anything like that to me.

[ositarosita]

I'd say the hell with her comments, and you just do what you do and keep on wearing your hair the way *you* want! The nerve!

HERE HERE ... if your hair style makes YOU happy then that's all that matters

[DweamGoiL]

That wasn't a very nice comment your friend made. I don't think its anyone else's business how you wear your hair. Unfortunately, a lot of people give unsolicited advice. The fact that your friend stated your hair is too fine to be long and you should cut it, makes her sound a little envious of your long tresses. I'm sure thats all it is and your hair looks great the way it is...whether you wear it up or down as long as you like it then that is all that matters.

This!!! Also sounds like your friend suffers from foot in mouth syndrome...don't pay her any mind. Just remember:

http://rlv.zcache.com/not_my_circus_not_my_monkeys_mouse_pad-r4473017d72d84da0a84364f004cbd00e_x7ef8_1024.jpg

[luxurioushair]

she went on to say that it would look better shorter and that it was too fine to be long
Well I'm sure that she saw clearly, that your hair is in fact long, meaning it can be fine and long at the same time....

[Anje]

I'd probably flip the bird at anyone who told me to glam up my hair or anything else. Serious lack of respect for personal style choices! (Realistically, no one who knows me would tell me that except in jest. And they'd fully expect my response.)

[hennalonghair]

I'd say the hell with her comments, and you just do what you do and keep on wearing your hair the way *you* want! The nerve!

Exactly. If you wanted her opinion you would have asked for it, otherwise she should mind her own business.

P.s. Not you lapushka; the other woman .

[hennalonghair]

I'd probably flip the bird at anyone who told me to glam up my hair or anything else. Serious lack of respect for personal style choices! (Realistically, no one who knows me would tell me that except in jest. And they'd fully expect my response.)

:lol: My thoughts precisely. :thumbsup:

[Isilme]

If you do want to "glam up" a bit, decorative side combs are an easy way to do it fast and easily. If not, ignore her or let her taste her own medicine.

[Sarahlabyrinth]

I would have said "And you are saying this because...?" and wait for her to put her foot even further into her mouth.

[vendethiel]

I hope your friend didn't intend to be mean, but was rather trying to be "helpful". I have a friend like this, they get some idea in their head that things need to be a particular way and then they try to help by pushing me in that direction. I usually just smile and nod and completely ignore their advice. They need to tell someone how they think the world should be and I'd rather it be me, who can take it with a huge grain of salt, than someone who might actually become hurt by their words. If you want to glam it up, the other suggestions in this thread are great, but honestly, I think long hair is plenty glam all on its own. So, do what you like and remember people tend to have a disconnect between their brains and their mouths. :)

[spidermom]

I agree with something along the lines of "when I want your opinion, I'll ask for it".

Recently I (not some friend but me-myself)became very dissatisfied with the way I looked in my constant bun. I thought to get it cut so that I could wear it loose more often, but I knew I'd miss the feel of long hair when I'm combing it out in the evening, so I spent time on YouTube looking up ways to flatter my face shape and features more. I got a lot of good ideas, so now when I want to feel more attractive, I'm armed. Again - I did this for me, not someone else.

[teddygirl]

While I value my friends honest advice and opinions (apparently more than pp's who think everyone should just stfu lol), I don't think she went about it in the right way. I would want my friends to tell me these things, but it doesn't sound like she was doing from a place of care or friendship...
If you want to 'glam up' your hair, I agree with braids. You can even french braid into a bun - was pretty trendy recently - if you still want to bun.
http://dirtylooks.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/upside-down-braided-bun.jpg
You can also add accessories - someone suggest combs, you can also use flowers (real or fake)
http://hairextensions-usa.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Braid-in-Side-Bun.jpg
Or even just try some new buns. Also varying the height of the buns will add some interest.

[Nadine <3]

I would have told her to stick a cork in it.

[burny]

If you almost always have your hair in a simple/plain style, and especially if you wear little/no makeup, and plain/simple clothing. It's common for people to think that you "just don't know" about fashion.. you've seen it in hundreds of movies, the plain girl that no one pays attention to, gets straightened or curled, studio makeup, and some classy dress, then does a slow-mo hair drop, and everyone suddenly notices her and wants to be nice to her... People want to experience that magic, and think that if only you knew the joys of fashion, you would be so much happier.

Some people just enjoy being plain, and don't want to be noticed. On the other hand though, if you are interested in fashion, and want to 'glam up' some times, different styles of braids/buns might be the way to do it. Recently had a work party, and one of my co-workers 'glamed up', just by moving her part from middle to side.. any sort of change is often noticed by people.

[curlylocks85]

My hair is fine, I know that and accept that is the way it is, and it is always up. However, today whilst out for lunch, a friend of mine commented about it, she asked why it was so long and up all of the time, she went on to say that it would look better shorter and that it was too fine to be long. Furthermore, she said that wearing it loose looked much better and that I should "glam up" and stop wearing buns.

How can I "glam up" then as I want to protect my hair and certainly don't want to cut it!

Feeling a bit confused...

It sounds to me that your friends comment caused you to question how you look and feel about yourself. Live up to your own standards and not someone else's standards. She may be your friend, but your opinion is the only opinion that matters.

[lapushka]

Exactly. If you wanted her opinion you would have asked for it, otherwise she should mind her own business.

P.s. Not you lapushka; the other woman .

I got as much. :lol: Thanks for saying so, anyway! :D

[lapushka]

Maybe stick a big decoration piece (watch torrinpaige for ideas) in the side of your bun, see what she says next. ;) :p

[sarahthegemini]

You don't need to style your hair to please her. Do it how you want. My friend's opinions on something so trivial mean nothing to me in the grand scheme of things.

[Nique1202]

While I value my friends honest advice and opinions (apparently more than pp's who think everyone should just stfu lol), I don't think she went about it in the right way. I would want my friends to tell me these things, but it doesn't sound like she was doing from a place of care or friendship...

That's why so many of us are saying that it's probably best to disregard this friend's comments. A caring friend who's got a real concern for you might say, "I'm worried your hair is giving the wrong impression. You wear it so plainly, when I know you're such a lively fun person. Have you thought about wearing it differently or adding some accessories?" But saying "Your hair is too fine to be so long, it's boring, you should glam up" is just all criticism, it's not supportive or considerate of your feelings at all, only their opinions of what's "right" for hair.

In general, though, it's still a good rule to just not criticize anyone else's appearance if it can't be fixed on the spot. If I leave the house wearing sweatpants, or in heavy makeup, or with my hair in a braid that's shredding layers all over the place, whatever it might be, I know what it looks like and I'm probably already worried about people judging me and treating me differently. In that case, I don't need a friend piling on to the "what the heck is wrong today, why do you look like trash?!" train and make me feel bad about something that either I didn't have the energy for OR that maybe I was even proud of (if I couldn't get a braid to hold before at all, or if I felt pretty in all that makeup) and now I feel ashamed of because of someone's comments. However, if I have a piece of broccoli in my teeth or my lipstick is a little smeared in one spot, I probably DON'T know that and it's quickly fixed, so that's the kind of thing you should tell someone (politely).

[sarahthegemini]

That's why so many of us are saying that it's probably best to disregard this friend's comments. A caring friend who's got a real concern for you might say, "I'm worried your hair is giving the wrong impression. You wear it so plainly, when I know you're such a lively fun person. Have you thought about wearing it differently or adding some accessories?" But saying "Your hair is too fine to be so long, it's boring, you should glam up" is just all criticism, it's not supportive or considerate of your feelings at all, only their opinions of what's "right" for hair.

In general, though, it's still a good rule to just not criticize anyone else's appearance if it can't be fixed on the spot. If I leave the house wearing sweatpants, or in heavy makeup, or with my hair in a braid that's shredding layers all over the place, whatever it might be, I know what it looks like and I'm probably already worried about people judging me and treating me differently. In that case, I don't need a friend piling on to the "what the heck is wrong today, why do you look like trash?!" train and make me feel bad about something that either I didn't have the energy for OR that maybe I was even proud of (if I couldn't get a braid to hold before at all, or if I felt pretty in all that makeup) and now I feel ashamed of because of someone's comments. However, if I have a piece of broccoli in my teeth or my lipstick is a little smeared in one spot, I probably DON'T know that and it's quickly fixed, so that's the kind of thing you should tell someone (politely).

I really can't comprehend why a friend would even have 'genuine concern' about their friends hair style in the first place. I mean, unless OP is using some.weird substance in her hair, an ordinary bun is hardly offensive and hardly requires a need for genuine concern.

[Agnes Hannah]

Thank you all for your lovely comments, they made me smile!

I usually wear make up and nice clothes, I'm a very girly girly person and had made more of an effort to dress up because of the meal we were going to have. However, I feel that curlylocks85, you may have hit on something there. I am nearly 50 which isn't helping me at all, and I feel less attractive at the minute. My husband doesn't help because he just agreed with my friend about me getting my hair cut short. Her hair is very short, bleached platinum blonde and is the same all of the time. I am going to try using accent braids though,and looking at torrinpages videos for bun inspirations and try using flower clips. I also have some antique large hairpins which really do stand out.

I really don't want to have my hair cut, I have invested so much time and spent so much money on hairtoys and henna. Still couldn't afford to have it cut every six weeks though! And feel why should I. Its not my circus, they're not my monkeys, I love that!
Maybe I should avoid her for a while, she isn't doing my self image any good and this is particularly fragile right now anyway, something I have to deal with soon.
Her comments were hurtful, I can't get away from that, and they have made me question myself, but I am not a short haired person, and to have it cut off would feel like a punishment for getting old.

[spidermom]

It really did help me to get tips on YouTube on styling that flatters my face shape and features more. Now I know I look better if my hair is parted and is soft over the top of my ears than if I skin all my hair straight back (for example).

[DreamSheep]

My hair is fine, I know that and accept that is the way it is, and it is always up. However, today whilst out for lunch, a friend of mine commented about it, she asked why it was so long and up all of the time, she went on to say that it would look better shorter and that it was too fine to be long. Furthermore, she said that wearing it loose looked much better and that I should "glam up" and stop wearing buns.

How can I "glam up" then as I want to protect my hair and certainly don't want to cut it!

Feeling a bit confused...

Meh, you're not there to decorate her world :)
I think buns do look quite elegant, and I think how you choose to wear your hair is your call, and what should count is what you prefer, what you feel as glamorous, what you feel as comfy and what you want to do. :) :blossom:

[lapushka]

Oh look. You have to know whose opinion to value here. My dad sometimes teases my mom about going to a hairdresser (he doesn't mean it), because all her life she's done hers herself (coloring, cutting, everything). He teases me as well asking me about how much he should cut off my hair when it's been freshly washed and isn't up. We *know* him, that's the point here and we know how much we should "value" his opinion. ;)

[KittyCatCarrie]

Personally I ignore most unsolicited advice from anyone because my hair is a very personal aspect for me. If you love your hair everyone else can go shove off. As for the glam aspect, when I find myself getting bored with my plain bun I'll change:
my part (middle vs. deep side part)
my hair toy (plain chopstick I saved from a sushi place vs. fancy dangly stick)
the location (top knot vs. low side bun)
or add some pretty silk flowers or something.

[spidermom]

I think we should try not to ascribe evil intent to unsolicited suggestions. Some people are conscious of fashion and style, and I think they really are trying to help those of us who appear to be clueless.

[JadedByEntropy]

That was rude of your friend. I agree with everyone, its not your problem what her opinion is, and long pretty hair shouldn't ever be a problem. She's probably feeling left out, also, not an emotion that is your problem.
If you want to spend extra time making your buns differently it could make them 'glam' but i'm not sure what that even means. Buns are the classiest of updos.


I really can't comprehend why a friend would even have 'genuine concern' about their friends hair style in the first place. I mean, unless OP is using some.weird substance in her hair, an ordinary bun is hardly offensive and hardly requires a need for genuine concern.
Oh, you wouldn't believe what married friends will say when you are still single and they think its because you aren't showing enough honey to attract any bees. -.- It comes from a nice place of wanting to see us happy, but having their life/opinions clearly isn't making them happy.. so i'm not sure looks has anything to do with it.

[Horrorpops]

Hey there, it seems like PPs have addressed your friends comments fairly thoroughly so i won't touch on that really.

However I love decorating buns and I always find it more fun and interesting on me than just having my hair up. Granted personal tastes vary but I personally love (and get lovely comments from people) wearing floral bun toppers like this (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51nN7r7gxiL._SY300_.jpg) or this (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/b9/74/a0/b974a015d3b4288e2763c1fd7d6e1bec.jpg)around the outside of a high or low bun. Similarly I often use little floral clips to pretty up a regular updo like this (https://edanafashion.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/2470152740a51f977781d322d5acef7c.jpg).

If flowers aren't your thing, accent braids are something else I love to add a bit of glam to an updo - like this (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/83/c3/10/83c3101c2f0c4ddeec4e67460a90b89e.jpg). Similarly I find for me, having some parts out that frame my face looks a lot more fashionable and flattering having my hair all pulled back - but this is a very personal thing. Many people pull of the slicked back updo look and it can be very glamourous and beautiful too!:)

And apart from buns I love braiding my hair - I always feel quite elegant when I sweep all my hair into a side fishtail braid (like so (http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa419/lefashion/lefashion121/2-Le-Fashion-Blog-30-Inspiring-Fishtail-Braids-Blonde-Side-Braid-Hair-Style-Via-Glamour.jpg)). I also follow a youtuber called Missy Sue (https://www.youtube.com/user/msncook11) as she has great hair tutorials, most of which are braided or updos that use minimal hairspray/heat styling. I go to her channel (and others) if I feel like my hair is getting boring and I want some inspiration! :)

However - the above suggestions are provided with the assumption you'd like to change up your styling a little. If you don't want to, or if you already do this kind of thing (because you've mentioned you have a very feminine, fashionable style) then feel free to disregard this :D

ETA: I just re-read your update - please don't let you friend or husbands comments get you down! 50 is such a beautiful and relatively young age, I really hope you can keep finding things you love and find beautiful about yourself. I think sometimes people say careless things and don't realise how it can hit a nerve they might not know existed. I personally find it a real shame that women mandate to each other that after a certain age we need to cut our hair off short. Please keep wearing your hair however makes you happiest. :flower:

[neko_kawaii]

I would have smiled and replied that I don't do glam, but if I ever need costume ideas along those lines I'll seek her advice. But that is me. I don't do glam and I don't decorate anybody's world. If you feel the need to add a touch of something you have been given good advice for long hair here. So the question I would be asking myself if I was upset by such a comment is why did it upset me? What advantages are there to modifying my appearance? Do those advantages satisfy me in a way that makes them worth the time and cost?

In terms of attraction, remember that there is no universal definition but a wide range of personal tastes. Who do you most want to please and why do you want to please them?

[Yarrow]

I find that part of the beauty of long hair is its versatility. You can make long hair appear short but it's harder the other way around. If you want try short haired for a day or so,just to switch things up,there are many tutorials on the web. Such as here http://www.hairromance.com/2012/03/hair-tutorial-how-to-create-a-faux-bob.html ( minus the teasing )or here http://691superlonghair.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/new-youtube-video-ginger-rogers-half.html on arc691's blog.
You wear so many different hairstyles with longer hair!
Also if you want a drastic change, there really is no need for cutting or dying it. Nowadays there are many good looking cheap wigs available that cost the same as getting it done at a salon. And the upside is, just take the wig off to have your hair back.
So there are many alternatives to getting your hair cut, if you want to change something once in while.
If you like the way you look, then any ways all is good!

[Nique1202]

I really can't comprehend why a friend would even have 'genuine concern' about their friends hair style in the first place. I mean, unless OP is using some.weird substance in her hair, an ordinary bun is hardly offensive and hardly requires a need for genuine concern.

There still aren't a lot of situations I'd consider it appropriate to say something anyway. I can't think of any offhand where I'd really take it in the helpful spirit it was intended, honestly, but I suppose if your friend knew you were unhappy with your current situation and thought that a new look would give you more confidence or something... I don't know specifically when I'd think it was appropriate until I read the situation, but I'm not discounting the possibility that maybe 1% of the time, style advice could be really helpful.


I think we should try not to ascribe evil intent to unsolicited suggestions. Some people are conscious of fashion and style, and I think they really are trying to help those of us who appear to be clueless.

I don't. Unsolicited advice is unwanted advice, 99% of the time. If you ASK for help from someone fashion-conscious that's one matter because then you WANT it, but someone coming up to me and saying, "your hair is too dark and too heavy to wear long, you need to have a better face frame, you need layers, you need to lighten it up with some dye" when I am obviously happy enough with what I have? That's just rude, plain and simple. There's almost no reason for someone to comment on hairstyle or clothing or makeup style or anything else about your appearance unless YOU complain about it or ask for their help.


I would have smiled and replied that I don't do glam, but if I ever need costume ideas along those lines I'll seek her advice. But that is me. I don't do glam and I don't decorate anybody's world. If you feel the need to add a touch of something you have been given good advice for long hair here. So the question I would be asking myself if I was upset by such a comment is why did it upset me? What advantages are there to modifying my appearance? Do those advantages satisfy me in a way that makes them worth the time and cost?

In terms of attraction, remember that there is no universal definition but a wide range of personal tastes. Who do you most want to please and why do you want to please them?

These are all very good questions to ask yourself. Especially "why did this upset me?" because we all get insecure sometimes, especially when someone we care about or whose opinion we value criticizes us. It's important to know yourself well enough to process criticism and come out the other side still being your best self, whoever that is. It's OK for that best self to change in the process, but you have to be sure you're doing what makes you the happiest and most comfortable you can be, not just because some people think they're better equipped to make decisions for you than you yourself.

[QMacrocarpa]

People sometimes have made comments to me that probably permanently left their minds within seconds, but haunted me for months to years with insecurity and self-doubts. Now I try to ignore things like that. Even if they're kindly meant, I don't find them helpful.

[kikuhoshi]

My mom hates my hair, and always has. It's nothing personal, but she started wearing her hair short and I think she got so used to the "mini-me" comments that it kind of confused her when I wouldn't wear my hair similarly. She'd tell me my hair was gross, unhealthy, etc., but then would turn right around and accept the compliments from her friends who loved my long, healthy hair. I've learned to ignore her, and on the few occasions she made me cut my hair, I'd just grow it back out. It drove her nuts (I think she was hoping a bob would grow on me - pun intended), but ultimately, I'm not her, I like my hair how it is, and she can't tell me how I like to wear it. I'd kind of suggest the same attitude towards your friend. Just pretend she didn't say anything and either continue the old conversation or start a new one. If she pushes, just tell her that's not up for discussion (don't say the words "right now"). I'd be one thing if she didn't think your hair looked healthy or wasn't healthy, but you said she seems to not be coming from a friendly place. Just remember: it's your hair, not hers. :)

[hanne jensen]

As many others have said, if you want to glam up your updos, do it for you, not the rest of the world.

Hairtoys are a good way to glam up an updo. Nowadays you can buy hairtoys that are gorgeous, cute, nerdy or whatever fits your mood that day. When I want to glam up a bun for everyday I use hairscroos with pearls on them. Pearls are acceptable for day wear. I've seen bun covers with pearls on them. U shaped hairpins with colored rhinestones. It's up to your imagination and mood.

There are several members here who have fine hair and their hair is very long so it is possible.

You could tell your friend that you save a fortune by not going to a salon which is why you can afford to sit there with her. That usually shuts people up. When I get those comments about how I'd look younger and better with short hair I usually ask them if they're willing to pay for me to visit a salon every month. They shut right up.

[embee]

Personally I ignore most unsolicited advice from anyone because my hair is a very personal aspect for me. If you love your hair everyone else can go shove off. As for the glam aspect, when I find myself getting bored with my plain bun I'll change:
my part (middle vs. deep side part)
my hair toy (plain chopstick I saved from a sushi place vs. fancy dangly stick)
the location (top knot vs. low side bun)
or add some pretty silk flowers or something.

I think this nails it. And these are the things *I* do when I want a change.

Additionally, to really "glam up" means earrings. I love those things. With a bun I get to enjoy earrings fully! Earrings with a necklace is even better. More pretty sparkly things. :D

[vpatt]

if she thinks you would look good with short hair then she should love it up.

I actually heard so many negative things before I quit work that I began to take joy in doing those things that my co-worker was commenting on. Mostly it was clothing...so I made sure to wear those outfits she put down as often as l could. She did begin to harp on my hair coloring (at the time I was bleaching) and that is when I let the bleach grow out and discovered lots of silver. I think you have to reach a certain age to enjoy acting this way. I was basically laughing at her because she was being so ridiculous over things that were not important.

Edit.....and today I am going by to visit at that job.....with all my silvers showing and letting it grow. I hope it blows her mind, lol.

[embee]

Heh heh, well done, vpatt! We "children of the 60s" have this defiant-attitude-thing in the blood, I think. :)

[spidermom]

Oh, I don't know; I think that defiant attitude thing is a personality trait. My daughter, a child of the 80s, told our neighbor that she wasn't washing her jeep just because she knew it bugged him to see it sitting outside dirty. He actually gave her $50 to wash it.