silicone based products

[DollyDagger]

Hi all,

Im currently in the experimental phase of a silicone hiatus.

There seems to be differing opinions on silicones. What has your experiences with them been like.

do you still use products that contain silicone?

what sort of products are they?

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?

Do you know your hair porosity?

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )




T.I.A for sharing
:blossom:
DD

[Nadine <3]

Hi all,

Im currently in the experimental phase of a silicone hiatus.

There seems to be differing opinions on silicones.
What has your experiences with them been like.


do you still use products that contain silicone?
Yes

what sort of products are they?
My favorite is a leave in from Garnier. It's the one in the orange bottle, I think it's called Frizz Defy. It has a cone that builds up, but I love it. I don't use it every wash, the effects last through 2-3 washes for me. The rinse out conditioner I use that has cones is from Pantene. I love the Ultra light, the cones don't build up and they're light so my hair doesn't get weighted down.

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
Slip, mostly. A nice protective barrier around my fragile ends. I have some damaged layers left in my hair from my chin length, razored mess I had. They like grabbing onto my other hair and holding on for dear life. The cones help detangle and keep it detangled.

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
I found LHC because I had just chopped my hair off from APL to chin, because my hair was so crunchy. I had tried using a sulfate free Burts Bees shampoo and conditioner set, and that went fine, but I tried using a "moroccan argan oil" serum with it. I didn't know any better, but it was basically just a bottle of silicone. It had worked well for me when I was using sulfates, so I continued to use it. Eventually, I cut off my hair to chin length because it was so dry and snappy. I kept trying to use the serum after the cut to "fix" the dryness, even trying to use it as an overnight treatment. My hair just kept getting worse and worse, so I started googling and I found LHC. When I realized I was using cones and not using anything to remove them, I ditched the serum for a bottle of olive oil. I clarified my hair and ditched cones, and started trying all sorts of sulfate free stuff. Eventually I realized I need sulfates, and cones are becoming increasingly helpful as I gain length. My hair is fine and gets weighed down by cones really easily, so I just use them sparingly.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
My waves! Cones tend to pull my waves out a little bit but other than that not a whole lot.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
Oils. For the longest time I used mostly olive, then I tried coconut (doesn't work as a leave in...like at all) and then I discovered grapeseed. I still use these on days I don't use my coney leave in.



T.I.A for sharing
:blossom:
DD

Hope this is helpful! I've jumped back and forth from cone to cone free quite a few times lol

Edit...um okay so I quoted you and then accidently just answered the questions in the quote...not really what I had in mind but...shush I just woke up...lol

[DollyDagger]

Hope this is helpful! I've jumped back and forth from cone to cone free quite a few times lol

Edit...um okay so I quoted you and then accidently just answered the questions in the quote...not really what I had in mind but...shush I just woke up...lol

helpful and lightening quick :) wow youre good!

no worries..it worked out fine. I know what you mean my coffee hasnt quite kicked in yet :)

[alexis917]

When I use silicones on healthy hair, I find I get buildup/tangles, and it gets greasy more quickly. However, as my hair is a bit damaged now from dye, I apply a silicone serum from Hask to my ends. I don't really notice a significant difference with or without silicones.

[lapushka]

do you still use products that contain silicone?

Yes I do, all the time!

what sort of products are they?

Conditioners, leave-ins, serums. All except for in my shampoo. I have SD and an oily scalp, so I stay away from oils and silicones on the scalp.

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?

Slip, a *lot* of slip, and if you have the right conditioner(s), you barely need to detangle! No knots. Awesome!!! And totally worth it.

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?

Yes. Horrible tangles!

Do you know your hair porosity?

Medium/Normal.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?

No benefits from stopping, only downsides, esp. on longer hair. It really doesn't matter much on shorter hair, but on longer hair... it does!

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?

Nothing (as far as stylers go) as I didn't have any available to me. Stuff like the Inecto coconut conditioner.

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )

They're not the devil. Don't let anyone fool you. If you clarify on a regular basis, nothing can basically go wrong.

[meteor]

do you still use products that contain silicone?

Yes. More so now than I used to (when hair was shorter).

what sort of products are they?

Rinse-out conditioners, leave-in conditioners, serums.
I don't use silicones in pre-poo treatments and in shampoos. Also, I tend to go easy on volatile silicones (because they can seemingly cause some dryness as they evaporate).


If so - what benefits do you think they provide?

Protection, slip, shine and excellent detangling properties.

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?

Yes. I got serious tangling and also some breakage in weaker, more fragile areas where I manipulated hair more.

Do you know your hair porosity?

Low (normal) porosity roots and length. High porosity ends.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?

In the short run: more volume, more wave and texture, cleaner feeling, voluminous hair.
No benefits in the long run, only downsides - especially tangling and lack of protection.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?

Mineral oil and grapeseed oil and other drying oils were OK as replacement. But why bother, if silicones do the job without attracting as much lint/dust and without all the "drying oils" problems (http://ktanihairsense.blogspot.ca/2011/12/understanding-drying-capacity-of-oils.html)? :)

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )

I think if you like some benefits of silicones but also have issues with them building up, feeling dry or greasy, it might help to find products with lighter silicones (e.g. amodimethicone) or clarify periodically or rotate products with cones with products without cones.

You can check out lighter vs. harder-to-remove silicones here: List of silicones and their solubility - http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2014/04/silicone-ingredient-solubility-list.html

[martyna_22]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
Not as much as in the past, but sometimes, yes.


what sort of products are they?
Conditioners :) Mind you - I don't use them on a daily basis!


If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
They make my hair sleeker - I have to watch out for build-up, though.


Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
Yup, I cut down on 'cones, because once I start using them regularly, my hair starts to split. It's like passing a magic border, one day, they still work, the next - oh, nope, my ends become crunchy and I have to clarify. If used sparingly, they seem to provide.. some kind of protection :P


Do you know your hair porosity?
From my hair's behaviour, I believe it's low porosity.


If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
No excessive splitting.


What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
Coconut oil, I guess, and more thorough conditioning.


and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
Not really. It's okay to have them in case of need, but I use them as little as I can. In this way, I can benefit from them!

[Marika]

I feel like lapushka and meteor said it all :D I went cone-free for 2+ years (my hair was virgin back then, so not very damaged) and I've never had so much breakage than I did during those two years. I still can't believe how stupid I was and didn't go back to cones sooner :brickwall

I do use cone-free products like shampoo but I can't go 100 % cone-free if I want long hair. More like 70 % cones and 30 % cone-free works best for me.

I like my shampoos to be cone-free because my scalp starts to itch easily. And coney shampoos leave my hair feeling 'dirty', so that's another reason why I prefer cone-free. But when it comes to conditioners, I prefer cones because I need all the slip and 'protection' I can get. My hair is very fine, fragile and tangle-prone. I think it's low porosity because I don't see any benefits when using oils etc. They just sit on top of my hair.

I think cones vs. cone-free is something everyone has to experience themselves. There isn't just one way to long hair and it took a little while before I learnt it. It's so easy to come here on LHC and read about 'new' stuff like not using cones, conditioner only washing, henna etc. Yeah, not that great (for me :p) but fortunately I've gotten some great tips too over these years.

ETA: meteor has a good point. Not all silicones are the same. I usually avoid cones like cyclopentasiloxane but don't mind amodimethicone for example.

[DollyDagger]

Thank you all so far for sharing your knowledge and personal experience on the subject!

@alexis917- good point that more damaged hair could probably have a greater need for it.

@lapushka- I think youre right in saying they are not the devil that theyve been made out to be ..much like carbs :) vilified and misunderstood. Its all about context. My hairs already tangling at BSL.. i cant even imagine at longer lengths how exponentially difficult it becomes..I cant wait to find out though :)

@meteor- thanks for the link about the drying oils.I love sciency hair blog :) a wealth of info! I guess using them judiciously could definitely be an option.


@martyna_22- sounds like your experience with them was somewhat precarious.

@Marika- My hair is fine and fragile too ..not to mention wurly and super-tangle prone! :) Im in the initial phases of experimenting. I will definitely keep your anecdote in mind!

[Frankenstein]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
Yes. Not constantly, I like to switch between cones and no cones.

what sort of products are they?
Mainly conditioners but I have a few shampoos I use from time to time although I prefer cone-free 'poos.

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
Slip, shine, detangling, smoothness, softness

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
There was a long period of time when I was basically cone free, yes, although I still used them occasionally. I did add them back in because I thought I'd give them another chance - the conditioners I was using before were probably too heavy.

Do you know your hair porosity?
No but I suspect it to be normal to low.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
My fine hair was much less weighed down and did not get that gunky-greasy feeling.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
Suave Naturals conditioners and gentler shampoos.

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
I think everyone should at least give them a shot to see how they work on their hair. And I agree that they're not the devil :)

[Groovy Granny]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
yes

what sort of products are they?
Joico Moisture S&C

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
slip/detangling

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?

Yes....I tangled terribly without them

Do you know your hair porosity?
yes ~ LOW

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?

None

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?

Shea Moisture/raw shea butter products

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
Need 'em....love 'em :D

[lapushka]

@lapushka- I think youre right in saying they are not the devil that theyve been made out to be ..much like carbs :) vilified and misunderstood. Its all about context. My hairs already tangling at BSL.. i cant even imagine at longer lengths how exponentially difficult it becomes..I cant wait to find out though :)

It started at around BSL for me too. Which is why I went back to my silicone products about that time!

Happy growing! :D

[DollyDagger]

It started at around BSL for me too. Which is why I went back to my silicone products about that time!

Happy growing! :D

thnx same to you! :)

[Baby]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
Yes

what sort of products are they?
a "water sulable" silicone serum from a local Swedish brand Klippoteket

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
they provide slip, shine and antistatic. My hair easily becomes static otherwise. What is positive with this particular product is that it is fragrance free and I do not need to use it on my scalp. I use a fragrance free sulfate free shampoo and this silicone serum. I have yet to experience buildup but the positive in skipping conditioner is that my scalp do not itch and I dont get pimples or raches.
Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
Yes, they are not good for the environment so I tried to skip them and used the "shine on" product from John Masters Organics insted and experiemented with various different oils. But it is not really the same as silicones. I think the one I got the best results from was shea oil/butter, it is somewhat antistatic and my hair seemed to like it. Coconut oil in very small amounts made it look good aswell.
Do you know your hair porosity?
No, not really. My hair is fragile and reacts positively to small amounts of protein(tried a bunch of different proteins in the hunt for something to replace silicones with aswell) but gets really upset if I use it repeatedly.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
None really. Except never needing to bother with buildup and getting too much silicone in the hair so it looks oily and ugly.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
I think for me It could be replaced by shea oil, light proteins like silk-protein and the like but that takes a lot of work for me to maintain and is very unreliable. With silicones I can wash it and put the silicone serum in and know that my hair will look good even if I don´t do anything else with it. I will follow this thread eagerly because I would like to find an easy envirommentally friendly hair care routine that still will make my hair feel and look good while maintaining its health and prevent it from damage.

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )

Well for me with fragile, thin and straight hair that gets static very easily and a scalp that is very sensitive there is no real option to silicones. But I will follow this thread and see if any other alternatives that I have not tried comes up.

[allierat]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
Yes

what sort of products are they?
A leave in oil product that has silicones in it and heat defence spray

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
They stop my hair getting too tangly.

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
Yes, I wanted to see if eliminating them would improve my hair. With no silicones my hair gets more tangles, with too many silicone products my hair looks lank and greasy. I added back small amounts of silicones not very frequently and it seems to work well for me.

Do you know your hair porosity?
Nope.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
My hair had more body and wave.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
Boots pink curl creme, silicone free conditioners and oils.

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
It's hard to find decent styling products without silicones!

[lapushka]

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
It's hard to find decent styling products without silicones!

That is *so* true, and pretty sad for people who'd like to have the option. In the US now you have the range "Shea Moisture", and there's a few leave-in creams that are silicone-free in that range. Downside? Expensive.

[meteor]

^ Yes, also, Kinky Curly products are silicone-free. And the Kinky Curly Curling Custard and Kinky Curly Knot Today both seem to enjoy a bit of a cult following. (More on this thread: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=16221)

Actually, I think there are more and more "curl" products out there that are specifically cone-free.
DevaCurl products, for example, and some Ouidad products...

Silicones can straighten the texture quite a bit, so some curlies avoid them.

[DollyDagger]

Silicones can straighten the texture quite a bit, so some curlies avoid them.

This is very true..if i ever used my One n only argan oil serum from sallys when i had a bit of curl going on it was sure to weigh them down and relax them considerably.

[lapushka]

That's odd because since switching to silicones (and double conditioning), I actually have more of a wave pattern going than ever before. I think it has to do with moisture, TBH. I think the more good moisture you bring to the hair, the bouncier the wave/curl will be, but that's just a wacky theory of mine.

[Robi-Bird]

I use Herbal Essences, for the moment and switch between various "types", all of which contain dimethicone. I use Tresemme keratin smooth on poof days and it has a variety of different 'cones. If I'm making my own conditioner, in the ideal set up, I'd have dimethicone and cyclomethicone but time/money = Herbal Essences is good enough. I have had success using Bamboo bioferment in my own experiments as a silicone sub but it is more expensive and less effective than the 'cones so I stick with them.

[JustPam]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
Occasionally yes

what sort of products are they?
Serum only. I stopped using coney conditioners because it made oiling between washes a bit redundant, and I need to do that with my amount of damage.

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
Less tangles when I want to wear my hair down or just in a ponytail

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
For a while yes, but my midlengths to ends are processed and damaged so they needed some cones to prevent tangling

Do you know your hair porosity?
Not officially but if I were to guess I'd say my virgin hair is low and my processed hair is medium/high

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
I applied oils and humectants more often to try and fight the dry tanglyness, which was a good habit to get into for the health of my hair but it couldn't get the same "slip" effect as cones.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
Instead of using my coney detangler spray after a wash I now use Kimberlilys defrizz spray (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=277). And my conditioner is cone-free.

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
Everybodys hair has different needs, so cones are neither the devil nor the holy grail. My hair likes a little bit of cones, usually just before I'm due a wash anyway which is when I'm most likely to leave my ponytail loose (reduces the greaseball look). I did not do well on coney conditioner, I couldn't get enough moisture in and my ends started to feel like synthetic hair. I think I've found a process that works for me.

[meteor]

That's odd because since switching to silicones (and double conditioning), I actually have more of a wave pattern going than ever before. I think it has to do with moisture, TBH. I think the more good moisture you bring to the hair, the bouncier the wave/curl will be, but that's just a wacky theory of mine.
^ Sure, moisture level is critical for bouncy, defined curls :agree: , but anything that can weigh things down too much or cause build-up (e.g. some occlusives, including silicones) could potentially be a problem for some textures.
Which is why some traditional "curly routines" focus on cone-free products - e.g. the Curly Girl Method (http://www.naturallycurly.com/curlreading/no-poo/the-curly-girl-method-for-coily-hair/) (by Lorraine Massey), while others - e.g. Tightly Curly (http://www.tightlycurly.com/products/combingconditioners/) (by Teri LaFlesh) - are not against cones, but may recommend awareness of which ones are in which products.

Obviously, different products have different amounts of silicones, and some silicones are way lighter and cause less build-up than others, so it's very much up to experimentation and very YMMV. ;)

[meteor]

I use Herbal Essences, for the moment and switch between various "types", all of which contain dimethicone. I use Tresemme keratin smooth on poof days and it has a variety of different 'cones. If I'm making my own conditioner, in the ideal set up, I'd have dimethicone and cyclomethicone but time/money = Herbal Essences is good enough. I have had success using Bamboo bioferment in my own experiments as a silicone sub but it is more expensive and less effective than the 'cones so I stick with them.

Awesome! :D So cool that you make your own conditioners from scratch sometimes. ;) That bamboo bioferment sounds like something that might help strengthen hair. What benefits did you notice from it? :)

[Robi-Bird]

Awesome! :D So cool that you make your own conditioners from scratch sometimes. ;) That bamboo bioferment sounds like something that might help strengthen hair. What benefits did you notice from it? :)

It's really easy and I love formulating. When I am back from my cruise (leaving in five days) I want to buy more supplies and get back at it. I mostly make solid syndet shampoos and conditioner bars. It's nice to create some just for my hair and my needs. The bioferment basically acts like silicones. it improves slip and shine. It's a natural source for silica which is why it is a good replacement for dimethicone, etc. I can't say anything for increased strength, my hair is a work horse.

[meteor]

^ Very cool! :applause Thanks a lot for sharing, Robi-Bird! :D

[DollyDagger]

Obviously, different products have different amounts of silicones, and some silicones are way lighter and cause less build-up than others, so it's very much up to experimentation and very YMMV. ;)
Absolutely YMMV applies ..the product i mentioned One n only argan from sallys is a serum with quite a thick consistency. The first ingredient is dimethicone which i think is a heavier silicone.. So with my fine strands and such a heavy product my curls totally wilted if i ever used it when styling curly. Mostly i used minimal amounts when flat ironing only...maybe those with courser strands would really love the stuff.

[allierat]

That is *so* true, and pretty sad for people who'd like to have the option. In the US now you have the range "Shea Moisture", and there's a few leave-in creams that are silicone-free in that range. Downside? Expensive.

It seems like the US has some stuff if you can look for it/afford it, never really found anything in the UK.

[lapushka]

Obviously, different products have different amounts of silicones, and some silicones are way lighter and cause less build-up than others, so it's very much up to experimentation and very YMMV. ;)

Yes totally, I can accept that! :D

[lapushka]

It seems like the US has some stuff if you can look for it/afford it, never really found anything in the UK.

The Boots own brand "curl cream" is supposed to give fairly good hold (not that much) but define your wave/curl great. I don't know whether or not it has silicones, tough. Not sure!

[allierat]

The Boots own brand "curl cream" is supposed to give fairly good hold (not that much) but define your wave/curl great. I don't know whether or not it has silicones, tough. Not sure!

Yes that's the only one I've ever found, and it's cheap! It is silicone free, it's not great hold but it works ok, but if you use too much it leaves a heavy coated feel on your hair until you wash it out.

[RainbowBowser]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
Yes, but not all the time.

what sort of products are they?
Aussie 3MM, this deep conditioner is still SMT friendly and contains a water soluble silicone, so I feel relatively justified in incorporating it into my routine.
(semi- regular, once a month type deal) My hair doesn't get too built up from it so I am not completely anti-silicone
Chi Silk Infusion and other varying heat protectants for the occasions I do use a heat tool (few times a year max)
(Dimethicone loaded, needs to be clarified out after)

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
It coats the hair, which is a double edged sword.
On one hand, some greatly benefit from it and feel less tangles, lock in moisture, etc.
On the other, they're hard to wash out, and as a F/M type I've struggled in part with buildup on my ends and actually causing more tangles.
The other reason people use silicones is for the shine, but my hair does that naturally anyway.

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
I reduced my silicone usage because my hair benefits from a more breathable/lightweight regimen.

Do you know your hair porosity?
Yes, its rather low, so thats why cones are more of a disadvantage on a regular basis for me.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
My hair is just less tangly and prone to damage.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
I just switched conditioners so now I use suave lavender (I'm currently loving it)
Cheap, silicone free conditioner is my favorite, and I still maintain silicone usage for conventional styling.
I solely use oil leave-ins on a normal basis as well

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
Differing hair types seems to have a lot to do with who benefits from them the most

[lapushka]

Yes that's the only one I've ever found, and it's cheap! It is silicone free, it's not great hold but it works ok, but if you use too much it leaves a heavy coated feel on your hair until you wash it out.

Yes I think you'd only need a fingertip's worth for your length and volume. When I use cream, I only use a eurocoin's worth of the stuff for classic length hair, so that should tell you something.

[Johannah]

do you still use products that contain silicone?
Yes

what sort of products are they?
Shampoos, conditioners, sprays, serums... The ones I use are from a Dutch brand.

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
Less tangles. And my HG conditioner contains silicones. It saved my hair so I keep on using it, with or without silicons.

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
Yes. It's hard to find good products without silicons because my hair loves protein. And quit using silicons didn't do much for my hair, so why bother?

Do you know your hair porosity?
Definitely low porous.

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
Not sure. I went completely natural and my hair was softer for some months, but I think this has more to do with SLS than with silicons tbh.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
Petal Fresh shampoo and conditioner, a Dutch brand conditioner for CO, and MO as a leave in.

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
If I could go back, I wouldn't quit using them. If you use products with silicons and your hair is healthy/feels good/looks good, no need to experiment. But off course that's your decision!

[parkmikii]

do you still use products that contain silicone?

Yes, I do

what sort of products are they?
Conditioners and a leave in that I use pretty rarely

If so - what benefits do you think they provide?
They provide pretty nice slip and shine, they basically make my hair less tangly

Did you eliminate silicones from your regimen and then eventually add them back in? why?
I did. They are back now because sadly silicone free conditioners are hard to find here and the only one I found isn't produced anymore

Do you know your hair porosity?
I think it's pretty low, I'm not sure though

If you stopped using silicones what improvements and benefits did you observe?
I didn't notice any big difference. My hair was pretty happy anyhow as I am using a dilluted sulfate shampoo.

What did you replace your silicone-based products/stylers with?
With oils mostly, but I also used the cone free conditioner.

and anything else about silicones you'd like to expound on ..: )
I think it was worth trying to go cone free and I didn't quit it especially because I wanted to skip the silicones, but the cone free conditioner was pretty much way cheaper than the silicone one.