Clarifying! Wow, what a difference!

[turtlelover]

My hair has been tangling a lot and kind of rebellious lately. I've never really "officially" clarified much before, but I did today with some Neutogena stuff, and WOW, did it make a MASSIVE difference! I didn't even need conditioner. It feels like silk! I wonder what exactly was building up on my hair....hmmm. Has anyone else had a RADICAL difference after clarifying?

[Horrorpops]

Wow thats excellent!

I did after using a clarifying and chelating shampoo - whatever was making my ends tangle and go crunchy was taken care of and my hair felt so soft and was really wavy! Here is a pic :)
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17688&d=1434186479
I did do an SMT after it because I was worried it might dry my hair out but my hair was so gorgeous after I will have to do it again soon!

[spidermom]

Yes! I remember a time in the past when I thought that my hair was beyond help, then my Burmese python released musk on me (P!U!). I had to wash my hair 3 times from scalp to tips to get that putrid smell out of it, and my hair was so beautiful, shiny, and silky after that. Before it was dry and fly-away and felt rough.

[Saproxylic]

Same here, post clarifying hair is something totally awesome! It just falls differently. On hair as fine as mine even very little harmless buildup makes it feel different, not bad, but different.

[missblueeyes]

Same. :) When I first clarified, the difference was like night and day.

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15933&d=1424011438

[Johannah]

Same. :) When I first clarified, the difference was like night and day.

Wow, that's a MASSIVE change.

[Arctic]

Same. :) When I first clarified, the difference was like night and day.

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15933&d=1424011438


OT, do you have a Torrin Paige fan t-shirt?

[missblueeyes]

OT, do you have a Torrin Paige fan t-shirt?

Nah, lol! It's a League of Legends T-Shirt that says "Tons of Damage" in the back.

[Arctic]

Nah, lol! It's a League of Legends T-Shirt that says "Tons of Damage" in the back.

:D Ha ha, I was sure it was something other than Torrin Paige, but found the though very funny! :D

[Scarlet3636]

Same here. I was having problems with a flaky scalp, and I went to my salon for a clarifying shampoo followed by a conditioner. It removed all the buildup from my scalp and now there are no more flakes!

[lapushka]

I weekly wash and usually with a sulfate shampoo (even the lengths sometimes). I think that's enough; feels like it's enough. I just don't like to give build-up a chance. Once every... about 2 months I will go in with a "real" clarifying shampoo, the Pantene clear bottle with navy top.

[henné]

Conversely, I'm one of those that if any sort of sulphate makes it to my scalp, it makes my scalp go absolutely nuts. I only and solely clarify my length. I used a 'normal' (as in with sulphates) shampoo about two weeks ago and I immediately got flakey itchy scalp ... I had to do just a WO wash after that just to help my scalp and then I used the soap-nut (shikakai) sulphate-free shampoo. Now my scalp is finally back to normalcy ...

Sulphates=absolutely horrible and the worst imaginable stuff for me (and as I understand it, for many others).

Heck, I can't even allow conditioner anywhere near my scalp. So it's only oil and mild sulphate-free shampoos that can come into contact with my scalp ... I learned the very long and hard way.

I clarify my length only about twice a month.

[swords & roses]

So what, exactly does clarifying entail? Like, what products & what procedures? I see clarifying mentioned lots of places on the LHC, but haven't found anywhere explaining how to do it. :flower: We have very hard water here, and I know DH has noticed much more tangling lately. Could the hard water be causing that? And if so, would clarifying help him?

[henné]

Swords & roses ... If you type in 'clarifying' or 'clarifying shampoo LHC' into Google, I'm sure you'll find some threads on the subject - look especially for posts by ktani, LHC hair-scientist that regretfully doesn't post anymore.

Basically, you clarify using a special shampoo - it really isn't special, it's just a shampoo that only focuses on cleansing hair and stripping it of dirt and other things - there are specific ingredients that you're looking for that I can't remember now. My clarifying shampoo is the cheapest one I found at the grocery store :D (I live in Sweden, so telling you what brand I use won't help you :) You want that shampoo to have as few ingredients as possible.

[henné]

If you have hard water, you also need to 'chelate' - look into that and into shampoos that have specific ingredients that help with that. I'm sure there are other posters here that will be able to tell you of specific shampoos that do that.

[Kome]

YES! My hair has been SUPER greasy for the last couple of months and I don't know why. I bought a clarifying shampoo and WOW! Sooooo much better. Kinda hard to detangle, but I can get away with using a leave in conditioner on it to help detangle and then it feels so smooth! :)

[Frankenstein]

Clarifying usually makes my hair feel much better. I did it for my last wash though and my hair is just kind of blah right now. That may be because I followed up with a runny Vo5 conditioner :rolleyes:

[parkmikii]

Wow, those are some amazing results! Sadly, where I live there are no clarifying shampoos available, so I can just stick to my normal sulfate one ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[lapushka]

So what, exactly does clarifying entail? Like, what products & what procedures? I see clarifying mentioned lots of places on the LHC, but haven't found anywhere explaining how to do it. :flower: We have very hard water here, and I know DH has noticed much more tangling lately. Could the hard water be causing that? And if so, would clarifying help him?

Normally washing with a sulfate, no silicone, shampoo will do the trick. There are shampoos that say "clarifying" on the label and they are maybe a little extra stripping but you don't need those, really. I happen to have the Pantene clarifying shampoo here (clear bottle, navy top) and it's a great product!

[meteor]

So what, exactly does clarifying entail? Like, what products & what procedures? I see clarifying mentioned lots of places on the LHC, but haven't found anywhere explaining how to do it. :flower: We have very hard water here, and I know DH has noticed much more tangling lately. Could the hard water be causing that? And if so, would clarifying help him?

Clarifying shampoos state something like "deep cleansing", "weekly clarifying", "deep clean", etc... on the label and have strong cleansers (normally, SLS but not necessarily, SLES/ALS/ALES and even cocoamidopropyl betaine can work - all those surfactants can remove non-water-soluble silicones and other build-up). It should contain not much else, avoiding coating/build up. So, no silicones but also, preferably, no 'quats, no oils/butters/waxes, etc.... And also no plant extracts, many of those can be coating or build up pretty fast. The less ingredients on the ingredients list, the better.

The technique is important: unlike a regular shampooing which is focused on scalp only (the rest is washed by suds running down), a clarifying wash should be massaged into the length too, to remove product build-up.

It's always best to follow up with a moisturizing conditioner/treatment, e.g. SMT. :flower:

Personally, I like to do a heavy coconut pre-poo oiling before a clarifying shampoo... I can't exactly explain why, but maybe because the oil binds to non-water-soluble cones, I get a cleaner wash somehow... :hmm:

[Saproxylic]

I actually use a cheapo men's ''hair and body'' wash to clarify, it's chokeful of SLS and cocoamidopropyl betaine and nothing much else, it's already there (as my brother showers with it) and works well. my skin and scalp wouldn't be too happy on regular exposure, but for the monthly fix it's great option!

[MiamiPineapple]

I agree this stuff changed my life. My hair was a tangled mess and as I was working in this shampoo my fingers glided through my hair like silk. It's a must-have!

[nakima]

I just picked up some vo5 clarifying shampoo a week or so ago 89 cents at local grocery store and it worked great! it says tea therapy on the bottle along with vanilla mint. love it :)

[vpatt]

My hair is not tangly, but someone suggested I use a clarifying shampoo to help brighten the gray/white instead of the purple shampoo. The clarifying shampoo won't hurt my hair will it?

[PalomaSincera]

I've never done it... Hmmm interesting.

[vpatt]

I just picked up some vo5 clarifying shampoo a week or so ago 89 cents at local grocery store and it worked great! it says tea therapy on the bottle along with vanilla mint. love it :)

That is what I found in Wal-Mart but I did not get as good a deal as you. I wonder if I should use my usual vinegar rinse with it or use a regular conditioner.

Oh, I just saw the tea therapy....mine, is kiwi lime.

[lapushka]

I doubt a clarifying shampoo can touch color. That's just MMHO, though!

[lilin]

Hmm, am I the only one who's not a fan?

Clarifying is certainly useful, but it's more something I do if it's simply an absolute necessity, and then I have to wait patiently for my hair to feel "right" again about a week later.

It does make it shiny and soft, but also completely flat and it pulls out nearly all of my rather significant wurls.

[vpatt]

I doubt a clarifying shampoo can touch color. That's just MMHO, though!

I do have purple shampoo left over from some time ago. Or I could try detoxing with mud......I did that quite often last year and liked it. I just thought maybe the castor oil I've been using might have yellowed it a bit.

[Crystawni]

My hair is not tangly, but someone suggested I use a clarifying shampoo to help brighten the gray/white instead of the purple shampoo. The clarifying shampoo won't hurt my hair will it?

In my experience, nup. :) I clarify every now and then, maybe monthly, and it hasn't hurt my whites at all. They can actually look brighter.

[renia22]

Hmm, am I the only one who's not a fan?

Clarifying is certainly useful, but it's more something I do if it's simply an absolute necessity, and then I have to wait patiently for my hair to feel "right" again about a week later.

It does make it shiny and soft, but also completely flat and it pulls out nearly all of my rather significant wurls.

Does it make a difference what product you use? I've noticed some clarifying shampoos leave my hair feeling dry, while others don't. Maybe it's a matter of quality of product, or does it happen to you regardless of which product you use?

[Groovy Granny]

I love the Pantene shampoo for SILVER hair; it clarifies and brightens without harshness (used twice a month).
An extra bit of leave in conditioner or oil may be used....but isn't really needed .....except maybe in the Winter when it is already fighting dryness.

[Stephanie]

I did after using a clarifying and chelating shampoo - whatever was making my ends tangle and go crunchy was taken care of and my hair felt so soft and was really wavy! Here is a pic :)
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17688&d=1434186479
I did do an SMT after it because I was worried it might dry my hair out but my hair was so gorgeous after I will have to do it again soon!
You have gorgeous hair...the texture I dream of having.


Same. :) When I first clarified, the difference was like night and day.

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15933&d=1424011438
That is impressive! Clarifying shampoo doesn't play well with my hair, but I can certainly appreciate seeing what it does for other people! Wow!

My grandmother used to use and love Neutrogena's anti-residue clarifying shampoo. I can still remember the smell of it. :)

[vpatt]

In my experience, nup. :) I clarify every now and then, maybe monthly, and it hasn't hurt my whites at all. They can actually look brighter.

I think I'll give it a try.....your hair is certainly beautiful, I've been admiring it for a while now.

Groovy Granny, I'll check out the Pantene.

Thanks everyone.

[meteor]

My hair is not tangly, but someone suggested I use a clarifying shampoo to help brighten the gray/white instead of the purple shampoo. The clarifying shampoo won't hurt my hair will it?

No, I don't think it will hurt :) , if you use it reasonably. Just don't use stronger formulas than you need and don't do it multiple times in a row, unless you have a lot of build-up to remove.
Clarifying can certainly be drying, so it's best to follow up with a good moisturizing treatment of your choice. In fact, clarifying prior to your favorite treatments will make them more effective (no build-up barrier -> increased penetration of good ingredients).


I doubt a clarifying shampoo can touch color. That's just MMHO, though!

I'm not so sure. UV rays and water are probably the biggest factors for color fading, but I think clarifying products might help fade deposited color faster, too. Clarifying is a traditional way of increasing the speed of fading color.
Clarifying, anti-dandruff and "harsh" shampoos are often used as the base for DIY color stripping treatments - though, there you'd usually apply it for quite a while, add some heat and add other stuff (e.g. Vitamin C).
You can see more at hair dye forums:
http://www.hairdyeforum.com/index.php?topic=1704.0
https://www.haircrazy.com/articles/beginner-guides/removing-hair-dye-safely-cheaply/
https://www.haircrazy.com/forum/general-questions/8468/


I do have purple shampoo left over from some time ago. Or I could try detoxing with mud......I did that quite often last year and liked it. I just thought maybe the castor oil I've been using might have yellowed it a bit.

I think purple shampoos are best for this. :D
But yes, clarifying will help brighten hair by lifting some of the build-up. Build-up can make haircolor appear duller and impart unwanted tones (yellow from oils or heavy ingredients in conditioners/styling products, green from copper and brassy orange from iron). But while product build-up is removed by clarifying shampoos, mineral build-up (say, from chlorine, copper or iron in water) can be removed by chelating (often marketed as "swimmers") shampoos.

For lighter-colored blonde or silver hair, clarifying and chelating can make a particularly visible difference in bringing the brightness back.
I also experienced increased brightness from using a bit of honey (honey lightening technique, honey rinses, honey added to conditioner), but I have no idea how it works on silver hair, and some other people reported more yellowness from it, so I don't know... but it might be worth experimenting with.

If castor oil yellowed your hair, don't worry, it won't be permanent, it's just that some oil has probably accumulated on your hair, and it can be washed away. ;) I get this whenever I do one too many oil rinses/treatments. If you just stop using it (or reduce usage), it will go away with standard washing routine over time.

[vpatt]

Thanks Meteor. I tried the one I had......Sally's generic for Clairol Shimmer Lights. I added water to it as, there is only a tiny bit left. I followed the directions and did use a bit of conditioner on the ends as it felt a bit tangled. I will see when it dries if i can tell a difference in the whiteness. Not sure it will be enough to see. I used this at one time until my hair began to get a gray blue tint from it, lol. It only took a wash or two to get that out. All this was back when I used all commercial products.

[Groovy Granny]

Groovy Granny, I'll check out the Pantene.

Thanks everyone.
Aqua Net can be harsh and if used often can tint your whites..blue; I noticed that on my hubby who is pure white and used it too much at first ;)
*I actually had a hard time getting it last year, and found/tried Pantene

Pantene also has a conditioner that I used to use for brightening, but now I just use my joico moisture conditioner all over after I brighten/clarify, and put a dab of shea moisture leave in conditioner on the ends.

[vpatt]

I see that joico has a violet shampoo. It looks pretty pricey on Amazon. Is this what you use?

[lapushka]

I'm not so sure. UV rays and water are probably the biggest factors for color fading, but I think clarifying products might help fade deposited color faster, too. Clarifying is a traditional way of increasing the speed of fading color.
Clarifying, anti-dandruff and "harsh" shampoos are often used as the base for DIY color stripping treatments - though, there you'd usually apply it for quite a while, add some heat and add other stuff (e.g. Vitamin C).
You can see more at hair dye forums:
http://www.hairdyeforum.com/index.php?topic=1704.0
https://www.haircrazy.com/articles/beginner-guides/removing-hair-dye-safely-cheaply/
https://www.haircrazy.com/forum/general-questions/8468/

For natural hair as well? I can understand dyed hair fading faster from a clarifying shampoo, but natural hair?

[Anje]

For natural hair as well? I can understand dyed hair fading faster from a clarifying shampoo, but natural hair?

My guess is that it might lift some color-altering buildup, but I'd expect chelating to do a lot more with light hair. (Having darker hair myself, that's definitely not from personal experience.)

[Darkhorse1]

Pantene made a new clarifying shampoo??? We don't have that in my area yet!! Darn it all!

I have to use a clarifying shampoo daily given my work with horses, and having a scalp that is prone to SD. I loved the original Drama Clean by Herbal Essence, but they since changed it and I find it way harsher. As a result, I now do condition/wash/condition and my ends are as happy as my scalp! Now I"m curious to find the pantene clarifying! Loved their stuff, though HE was gentler.

Neutrogena is also a good clarifying shampoo :)

[meteor]

For natural hair as well? I can understand dyed hair fading faster from a clarifying shampoo, but natural hair?

No, only for fading dyes, AFAIK. :)

Clarifying just removes a lot of build-up, which can help brighten one's natural color, as well. :)

[meteor]

My guess is that it might lift some color-altering buildup, but I'd expect chelating to do a lot more with light hair. (Having darker hair myself, that's definitely not from personal experience.)

Yes, definitely. :agree: Chelating can help with green/grey or brassy orange-y tints from chemicals in swimming pools, for example. The lighter the hair color the easier it is to stain with anything, of course. :) Which is why it's a bit harder to stretch washes with blonde hair and to oil heavily without it looking greasy relatively fast.

[vpatt]

Well I can't see a big color difference, but I think it is a bit brighter looking. And it does feel a bit smoother and drier. Don't you think that would mean there was not a lot of buildup from the oil?



I would guess the the silver and white hairs mixed with brown are going to look a bit blondish, don't you think? So part of that could just mean I have accumulated more white or gray hairs.

I do miss the fragrance from commercial shampoos. I realized that as soon as I opened the shampoo bottle. It made me think of a shampoo from my childhood.

[vpatt]

Well I can't see a big color difference, but I think it is a bit brighter looking. And it does feel a bit smoother and drier. Don't you think that would mean there was not a lot of buildup from the oil?

I would guess the the silver and white hairs mixed with brown are going to look a bit blondish, don't you think? So part of that could just mean I have accumulated more white or gray hairs.

I do miss the fragrance from commercial shampoos. I realized that as soon as I opened the shampoo bottle. It made me think of a shampoo from my childhood.

I don't know much at all of the difference between chelating or clarifying.

Well rats, I guess I hit reply instead of edit.

[Groovy Granny]

I see that joico has a violet shampoo. It looks pretty pricey on Amazon. Is this what you use?
I use the Joico Moisture Recovery S&C; the large bottles are my best buy...it lasts a long time.
I thought their VIOLET was for color treated hair; I could be wrong....but that's why I never looked into it.
Aqua net was cheap and at my grocers when it was available; then when they dropped it, I got Pantene because I used it years ago and loved it.

[vpatt]

I use the Joico Moisture Recovery S&C; the large bottles are my best buy...it lasts a long time.
I thought their VIOLET was for color treated hair; I could be wrong....but that's why I never looked into it.
Aqua net was cheap and at my grocers when it was available; then when they dropped it, I got Pantene because I used it years ago and loved it.

Thank you.

[Groovy Granny]

I don't know much at all of the difference between chelating or clarifying.

Well rats, I guess I hit reply instead of edit.
I am clueless re:chelating as well....and not all that versed re: clarifying either!
The blue stuff does both....and does it well for me; that's as far as I got lol

[Groovy Granny]

Thank you.
Any time; so much fun to share info....you learn something new daily here :)

[meteor]

I don't know much at all of the difference between chelating or clarifying.


I am clueless re:chelating as well....and not all that versed re: clarifying either!
The blue stuff does both....and does it well for me; that's as far as I got lol

Clarifying removes product build-up: silicones, polyquats, waxes, etc...
Chelating removes mineral build-up from water, so things like chlorine, iron, copper etc...

Some products can both chelate and clarify. Joico K-Pak Clarifying, I believe, is an example of that.
Otherwise, you can just pick up a clarifying shampoo and a chelating one ("swimmers' shampoo"). ;)

[vpatt]

Thank you Meteor. I am slowly learning.

[Groovy Granny]

Clarifying removes product build-up: silicones, polyquats, waxes, etc...
Chelating removes mineral build-up from water, so things like chlorine, iron, copper etc...

Some products can both chelate and clarify. Joico K-Pak Clarifying, I believe, is an example of that.
Otherwise, you can just pick up a clarifying shampoo and a chelating one ("swimmers' shampoo"). ;)
Thanks for the info ~ much appreciated :)
I have it bookmarked on Amazon,and will buy some on my next purchase!!

[meteor]

^ No problem, guys! :D Oh, and by the way, if your water is soft and you don't swim in chlorinated pools or at sea, your hair may not even need any chelating at all! ;)

I think it's only really critical for people who swim frequently or right before a chemical processing (that causes metals to bind to hair) - that's why there are so many professional salon chelating products out there).

[Groovy Granny]

^ No problem, guys! :D Oh, and by the way, if your water is soft and you don't swim in chlorinated pools or at sea, your hair may not even need any chelating at all! ;)

I think it's only really critical for people who swim frequently or right before a chemical processing (that causes metals to bind to hair) - that's why there are so many professional salon chelating products out there).

Ohhhh; I am glad you said that...I may just wait!

I think we have iron in our water (can get those orange/brown stains); not sure about hardness....and I am not a swimmer.

If it ain't broke don't fix it as they say ;)

My hair is behaving and looking just fine!
I just brighten my silver, and clarify if I have used styling products 1-2x/month.
Think it is best that I just keep this in the back of my head until I do NEED it lol
Thanks again!

[brickworld13]

Ohhhh; I am glad you said that...I may just wait!

I think we have iron in our water (can get those orange/brown stains); not sure about hardness....and I am not a swimmer.

If it ain't broke don't fix it ;)
My hair is behaving fine; I just brighten my silver, and clarify if I have used styling products 1-2x/month.
I will just keep this in the back of my head until I do NEED it lol
Thanks again

Chelating would help with the iron deposits on your hair. Mine goes utterly berserk when I visit my dad's home because of the iron and lime in his water.

[Groovy Granny]

Chelating would help with the iron deposits on your hair. Mine goes utterly berserk when I visit my dad's home because of the iron and lime in his water.
How would I know there are deposits?
I am happy with my texture/color etc.
Perhaps my silver shampoo is doing the trick ;)

[brickworld13]

As long as your hair is behaving in a way that doesn't bother you, I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep it in mind as a potential solution if ever it goes all funny for no reason at all. :twocents:

[Groovy Granny]

As long as your hair is behaving in a way that doesn't bother you, I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep it in mind as a potential solution if ever it goes all funny for no reason at all. :twocents:
Will do...because the staining isn't even worth mentioning.
Iit is mostly from standing water on the shower spray and seat crevices ...and not on porcelain at all.
Thanks :)

[lapushka]

No, only for fading dyes, AFAIK. :)

Clarifying just removes a lot of build-up, which can help brighten one's natural color, as well. :)

I didn't realize that. Good to know! :) Thanks, meteor!

[vpatt]

Ok.......after pulling my hair up I see more bright shininess. My hair on top has gray in it but it is much more silvery underneath. I wasn't thinking of that at first.......so when I pull it up in a twist I can see an improvement. I'm not sure it is enough to show in a picture or that others would notice. But I can see it and will clarify or chelate on occasion.


:happydance::joy::applause

Thanks y'all

[meteor]

^ Yay! That sounds awesome, vpatt! So happy to hear about the brightness and shine! :applause

I think sometimes clarifying gets a bad rep when it's overdone (done too frequently, with excessively harsh or just inappropriate products, not followed up by moisturizing treatment...). But if done right and at the right times, it should be a perfect re-set, and it helps with detangling, smoothness, shine... :)

[lapushka]

That reminds me my next clarifying session is in a couple of weeks. ;)

[Groovy Granny]

Ok.......after pulling my hair up I see more bright shininess. My hair on top has gray in it but it is much more silvery underneath. I wasn't thinking of that at first.......so when I pull it up in a twist I can see an improvement. I'm not sure it is enough to show in a picture or that others would notice. But I can see it and will clarify or chelate on occasion.


:happydance::joy::applause

Thanks y'allIt looks great ~ I love your colors! :)

[Crystawni]

Yay, vpatt!! *dons sunnies for the glare* :p And thank you for the hair admiration. :flower: It's great to see a few more people embracing all their colours. BTW, my whites are soooo resistant to dyes--it's like they're encased in armour or something, but can look drab with oils after a while (thus the good ol' deep cleanse every now and then).

[vpatt]

Yay, vpatt!! *dons sunnies for the glare* :p And thank you for the hair admiration. :flower: It's great to see a few more people embracing all their colours. BTW, my whites are soooo resistant to dyes--it's like they're encased in armour or something, but can look drab with oils after a while (thus the good ol' deep cleanse every now and then).


I love your color...it doesn't need to be dyed.
After my hair completely dried (which takes much longer than I would think since it is so short.) I can tell it is really much smoother, too. And slippery. Now I think when this comes up again I will try detoxing with mud and see if that compares at all to clarifying. And when I use the clarifying shampoo I will know to use plenty of conditioner.

ETA
Oh I see what you are saying.....why do you think the oil will penetrate and dye won't?

[Cinnamonagouti]

I clarified for the first time ever today, with baking soda and shampoo, and then an ACV-rinse. After that I deep conditioned and now I'm waiting for my hair to dry. I started CO-washing a few years ago (switched to a soap-based shampoo bar half a year ago) and haven't used silicones/mineral oils/sulphates since. We also have really soft water where I live and I prefer lakes over the sea, so I haven't really found it necessary to clarify (to be honest, I didn't even know what clarifying meant until pretty recently :P). However, recently I've felt like my hair doesn't get completely clean when washing and it's also been mopre frizzy than usually, so I thought I would give clarifying a chance. Looking forward to see the results :D

[divinedobbie]

I splurged on the joico clarifying shampoo (was going to go for the neutrogena because it was almost half the price but I wasn't sure if it was actually a chelator too so then I'd have to buy a seperate chelating shampoo and it would add up to the same thing).

I gather quite a bit of product build up - I use a lot of cones (coney conditioner, hair serum, moisture spray, hair oil that contains cones) and use a sulfate free shampoo as my regular and use a sulfate one (pantene ice shine) every week but I can't tell if that's cutting it so I'm excited to see what this will do.

[brickworld13]

I need to take a trip over to Sally's and pick up a chelating shampoo. I need to go over there anyway. My Tangle Teezer has just about had it.

[meteor]

Since looking for products that both clarify & chelate was mentioned, I should also add Kenra Clarifying (http://www.amazon.com/Kenra-Clarifying-Shampoo-10-1-oz/dp/B0013V8ZB6/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t/191-8544645-7572902) to the list. That one is both clarifying & chelating, as well. :)

And since baking soda was mentioned, I think it's important to note that it's abrasive and also very alkaline, which is problematic for skin and hair, unfortunately. :flower: The scalp pH is 5.5, and the hair shaft pH is 3.67 (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4158629/). And high pH products can temporarily disrupt skin's barrier function, which can lead to dryness, irritation, and also increases negative charge of hair fiber, making it more likely to have static and to be harder to detangle (which ultimately increases mechanical damage from combing/handling).

My hypothesis is that some people like the initial effect from baking soda, because it softens the hair (but that's not a good thing when it's done via high pH, because that kind of softness would come from disulfide bonds in your internal hair structure being weakened by the highly alkaline solution) and also because the high negative charge it leaves hair with makes cationic conditioning ingredients in conditioners/masks/rinses stick to hair more (positive charge attracted to negative - read more on this mechanism here (http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2014/01/deep-conditioning-part-i.html))... that's not necessarily a good thing in and of itself. After all, ideally, we don't want to raise pH and raise negative charge unnecessarily. :hmm:

KittyBird recently linked a very interesting blogpost on using baking soda: http://blog.kanelstrand.com/2014/01/baking-soda-destroyed-my-hair.html It's really worth checking out, if only for the demonstration with pH testing strips of what logarithmic scale of pH really means for how difficult it is to use it safely (each whole pH value above 7 is ten times more alkaline than the value right before it, so it's incredibly hard to dilute enough and still get any effect):
"Based on all I've been reading by people who wash their hair with baking soda in the past 3 years, if I dilute 1 tbsp. in 2 cups of water, the pH should go down. BUT IT DOESN'T. The pH remains 9.5 until I dilute 1 tbsp. baking soda in 10 cups of water and then again, it is way to alkali to use on the hair.
Again, there is no difference between 10 and 20 cups of water, the pH of the mixture is 9.0
Only when I dilute 1 tsp. of the mixture (consisting of 1 tbsp. baking soda and 20 cups of water) in 1 cup of water, the pH gets down to pH 7.0 -- again, extremely alkali for use on hair, even if it is followed by ACV rinse."

[Arctic]

I have to chime in about baking soda pH, since it's brought up frequently. I don't think the pH of it is a problem. I say this, because I live in an area where water has basically the same pH as baking soda, and my hair and skin are fine (as in: not negatively affected), and not damaged at all. I don't test my water myself, but my water facility posts an annual avarage pH along softness/mineral content info (we have very soft water) and on many years the avarage has been about pH 8,2. (2014 it was slightly lower, but still well above pH 7.)

[meteor]

^ Wow, that's pretty alkaline for water. :agree: I'm curious, with this water, do you like ACV or any other acidic rinses? :)
I'd also love to do pH tests on shampoos/conditioners sold locally... I'm curious if shampoos sold in Finland have lower pH to help counteract that? :hmm: I have no idea if it's true, but according to this (from 3:40 till 4:00) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovaKu1EsbnA) international companies slightly adjust their shampoo formulas sold in different markets to suit local water mineral composition for surfactants to stay effective.

I guess, high pH is less of a problem for virgin hair. More damaged/processed hair (higher negative charge, lifted/chipped cuticle) should do better with more acidic formulas, which is why so many professional salon products (e.g. shampoos and reconstructor-type treatments) are made very acidic (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4158629/).

[Arctic]

Yeah it is quite alkaline, I was very surprised years ago, when I first realized I'm washing my hair with something comparable to baking soda when it comes to pH :laugh: We have soft water, which is usually more on the acid side, but the pH is manipulated towards more alkaline by adding calcium. This is to protect the pipes from erosion. I think this is quite common in Finland for those in city water area. Well water probably is more acid naturally.

I'm quite sure this is the exact reasons, along with typical hairtypes of a specific area, why shampoo companies formulate their products differently for different marketing areas. (The typical Finnish hairtype is of very fine and thin quality quite often.) The shampoos and conditioners sold here most seem to be pH balanced at or near skin's own pH level.

I used to love vinegar rinses but it was about the effect they had on my scalp. My hair didn't change after acidic rinse that I could notice back then. I fell out of the vinegar habit long ago, though, and the few times I've tried in the recent past my hair hasn't liked them (my wiry hairs poof up like angry hedgehogs). Now that I've been experimenting with shampoo bars i've been trying citric acid rinses, for the first time in my life, and I do like them. I don't have enough experience with them yet that I can say if the effects are from shampoo bars or acidic rinses or combination of them. But in general I have to say I don't feel I need acidic rinses (with the possible exeption of in tandem with shampoo bars).

[meteor]

^Wow, really fascinating stuff! :D Thanks a lot, Arctic! :flowers:

[Arctic]

No problem! You know I have often wondered, how it would be like to live in area with more acidic water, or hard water. Would be interesting to compare notes about my own observations!

[vpatt]

Well this morning (third day from clarifying) I looked in the mirror and my ends were very slightly dry looking. I have oily hair so this is not usual. I had to go to town so I picked up some Fructis Marvelous Oil Deep Nourish Hair Elixir. I had no idea what to get and another lady in the store steered me to this. She was also a bit older and growing out her hair, but seemed puzzled why I wanted this. Low and behold when I got home and looked in the mirror I could see no dryness. Lol.....so now I have this spray and I guess I may use it as my hair grows out. I know even if the scalp is oily that the ends will be dried as it grows. Don't know why it looked dry and then changed.......maybe I am nuts.....well there is no doubt about that, lol

[lapushka]

vpatt, work a little of the spray into your ends after a wash. I do the LOC method (leave-in, gel, serum on the ends) after washing and it keeps my hair hydrated - usually it does. Your lengths will get even dryer with length, that's what happened to me, especially after reaching BSL, so that spray will come in nice and handy!

[turtlelover]

I went to visit a friend w/ softer water, and my hair was MUCH nicer during the visit. I guess I may have to invest in a water purifying shower head. Maybe chelating would help, too, I have the Neutrogena anti-residue shampoo, and my hair WAS better after using it (hence, the existence of this thread!) but I am pretty sure that doesn't chelate. Hmmmm....

[lilin]

Does it make a difference what product you use? I've noticed some clarifying shampoos leave my hair feeling dry, while others don't. Maybe it's a matter of quality of product, or does it happen to you regardless of which product you use?

For me, yes and no. Some are less drying than others, definitely.

But all of them have this flattening affect for me, even if my hair doesn't feel dry.

[meteor]

No problem! You know I have often wondered, how it would be like to live in area with more acidic water, or hard water. Would be interesting to compare notes about my own observations!

Oh yes, I've always noticed pretty significant changes to my hair's feel/texture/appearance whenever I travel :agree: - the only exception is if the visit is so short that I don't get to wet my hair there. Strangely, I even notice a difference if I wash my hair in my sink vs. shower. I could be just fooled by my own senses there, of course, but could it be due to differences in mineral build-up on pipes? :hmm:
In hard water area, I feel the need to compensate with oils/serums and the products I go for are more moisturizing and more acidic (here is a list of pH of some shampoos (http://www.thenaturalhavenbloom.com/2012/02/ph-of-shampoo-ultimate-list.html) and conditioners (http://www.thenaturalhavenbloom.com/2012/02/ph-of-conditioners.html)). My hair loves soft water and high humidity... sadly, that's not what I get where I live. :lol:


Well this morning (third day from clarifying) I looked in the mirror and my ends were very slightly dry looking. I have oily hair so this is not usual. I had to go to town so I picked up some Fructis Marvelous Oil Deep Nourish Hair Elixir. I had no idea what to get and another lady in the store steered me to this. She was also a bit older and growing out her hair, but seemed puzzled why I wanted this. Low and behold when I got home and looked in the mirror I could see no dryness. Lol.....so now I have this spray and I guess I may use it as my hair grows out. I know even if the scalp is oily that the ends will be dried as it grows. Don't know why it looked dry and then changed.......maybe I am nuts.....well there is no doubt about that, lol

Oh, that could be due to humidity change during the day, for example. :) Did you "seal" your hair with anything (esp. coney serums, oils, leave-ins, styling gels or other products)? If not, it's pretty normal to get that reaction on hair that's just gone through a "deep cleanse", so to speak.

If the dryness comes back, you can always run a bit of conditioner on dampened length and/or drop or two of oil/serum through your ends, spread thoroughly with palms of hands or BBB. That GF product you got seems like a good sealant, for sure. ;)

[vpatt]

Thanks Lapushka and meteor.......no I hadn't used anything to seal the hair.

I am amazed by this fructis oil....that I tried it on the tips and it seems to disappear into the hair....wow.

[meteor]

^ I'm a fan of GF serums, too. :hifive:

[lapushka]

^ I'm a fan of GF serums, too. :hifive:

Yep, love them too! I have another one by Schwarzkopf too (tiiiny bottle) and that's great too, and last time my local Aldi had serum from their own brand (Kyrell) and it is and smells amazing!!! I got some bottles for 1 euro (100ml) - awesome!

[meteor]

^ Sadly those brands aren't available here, lapushka, :wail: though I know Schwarzkopf makes some really good quality reputable leave-ins. ;)

[vpatt]

I see some schwarzkoph hair products on Amazon but don't know which one you mean or if it is there.

[lapushka]

I've got this one:
http://www.schwarzkopfshampoo.nl/content/dam/sk-shampoo/nl/NL-Images/Zoom-producten/267x640_zoom_Beauty_oil.jpg

But this one might be available in the US, IDK for sure:
http://www.dolledup.ie/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/shw001-schwarzkopf-got2b-oil-licious-with-argan-oil-50ml1.jpg

[vpatt]

I washed today with my shampoo bar/vinegar rinse and still have the wonderful feel of clarified hair! Silly, I know, but I was afraid it might go away quickly, lol.

My hair grows oily so quickly. What I mean is it may stay clean for three days, but once I think it may be feeling just a wee bit oily or the pre-oily stage in just an hour or two it can be OILY for real. I can take just washed hair to oily by using a BBB. So I only ever use that if I am doing pre-wash stuff. I would love to be able to brush my scalp with one everyday. I guess the oil helps protect the fine hair a bit? And I just ordered an Eternally in Amber comb....yep.

[missrandie]

I clarified this morning.. Now my front right side is no longer trying to jab me in the eye, but I have curlies sproinging up all over the place. Random curlies that never show themselves unless they are squeaky clean.

[vpatt]

I clarified this morning.. Now my front right side is no longer trying to jab me in the eye, but I have curlies sproinging up all over the place. Random curlies that never show themselves unless they are squeaky clean.

Lol. Some of my ends have more wave now.

[missrandie]

Lol. Some of my ends have more wave now.

It's funny.. Right after clarifying, the right side is fairly straight with a little bit of a j at the end, but nothing drastic. The top hairs look to be at least 2c individually curling hairs, like 20 of the little buggers just curling crazy and shrink springing all over the place. 7 inch hairs become 3 inches long and an inch wide lol.

The process reverses over the next 3-4 days, until my hair becomes well oiled and in need of shampooing again, then the process repeats, but not quite as drastically. Little j hairs try their darnedest to make a complete gravity defying circle, and curlies become straighties. Rinse and repeat until time to clarify again!

Silly hair.. I love it.

[MoreAutumnForMe]

Double post :doh:

[MoreAutumnForMe]

What a big difference :thud:

For the last half year or so, my hair has been progressively more unmanageable and leaving buildup on my comb. I didn't realize that buildup would be a side effect of switching off SLS-containing products, I think back in Feb 2014 when I started doing my own trims. It changed the quality of my hair sooo gradually. Seriously, I was combing for 4 hours earlier today, and every time I took my hand off the length it would turn into one huge mat again.

I just shampoo'd 4 times with suave naturals (I know, not clarifying, but has SLS!) and for the first time in ages I can get my fingers through my hair.

I'm definitely making a note to clarify every six months or so from now on. I'm so happy to have fluffy hair again (not to mention my tangle-induced soreness fading) that I'm feeling seriously emotional right now.

:cloud9:

ETA! It was Down Under, not Suave. :P

[MoreAutumnForMe]

Oh no! I meant to edit ;w;
I can't figure out how to fix it - I'm sorry!

[Arctic]

Oh no! I meant to edit ;w;
I can't figure out how to fix it - I'm sorry!

No worries, you'll need 25+ posts before you can edit, meanwhile, don't worry about it :flowers:

[Kendrix]

Oh my. I was having tangle problems like this and after reading this thread, I tried the suave basic clarifying shampoo followed by overnight smt and OH MY. My hair was so much better for a while after giving up shampoo. But wow. Just wow. My hair is soft again.

[Elly May]

I tried the Neutrogena clarifying shampoo followed by a good conditioning. It did remove a little of my old color, but my hair is a lot greasier than it should be at this point. I had to break out the dry shampoo this morning. I wash once a week on Sundays and don't want to get off schedule or mess up my routine so that I have to shampoo more often.....

[turtlelover]

Now that I've gotten the clarifying thing down, I really want to try to chelate. Is there anything available at Sally's that would do the trick for that?

[excentricat]

EDTA is a chelating agent. A special shampoo may have more of it, or more ingredients to help, but unless you're really doing a number on your hair, anything with EDTA should help you out.

I don't use a clarifying shampoo per say, but when my hair starts feeling buildup-y I wash root to tip with my normal sulfate shampoo. This is roughly once a month, and the rest of the time I alternate sulfates and non-sulfates scalp only washes about 3 times a week. It always brings back my bounce.

[Frankenstein]

For the first time in probably six years, I clarified my length. This week I've had a ton of coconut oil stuck in my hair with cones on top of that and I had enough so I bit the bullet. It's not totally dry yet but it seems to be mostly clear of all the gunk finally and feels soft; although I could find out otherwise when it fully dries. I might try this more often.

[meteor]

Now that I've gotten the clarifying thing down, I really want to try to chelate. Is there anything available at Sally's that would do the trick for that?

L'Anza Swim & Sun Chelating, Ion Swimmers Shampoo or Ion Chelating pack...
Some products can both clarify and chelate. That's probably ideal, because they will remove not only product build-up but also mineral build-up from water. Joico K-Pak Clarify and Kenra Clarifying are examples of that. For chelating, it's important to let the hair soak in the shampoo for a bit (check the instructions).
For chelating products, look for chelating agents like EDTA or Sodium Citrate, etc high up on the ingredients list (they are only stabilizers or pH adjusters if they are listed low on the ingredients list). HTH! :flower: