My George Michael Salon Experience (NYC)

[Crumpet]

I had my first George Michael salon experience just a few days ago. This post will give details about what I experienced there. Madora has written up her own experiences at this salon in great detail, which I doubt I can come close to. If someone can link to her post, I'll pop it in here (I couldn't find it when I searched just now).

Background: My last salon visit was in May 2013. I never liked going to salons, but this one ended the experience for me because the hairdresser cut in extreme layers that I did not ask for and which looked terrible. I'm still growing out these layers today and scared of salons as a result. My goal is to grow out one-length hair of at least hip length, but hopefully more. I'd like to have long, even, healthy hair for my wedding in about a year (we're still picking a date). I made this appointment to trim out the layers and to get a good growth plan from them.

Salon Experience: I had an appointment with Iris. She was at the reception desk when I arrived (I was a few minutes early). I changed into their lilac-colored gown and took my hair down. At the chair next to me was a woman with the most beautiful (I'm guessing since she was seated) knee-length hair I have ever seen in real life. Straight, black, medium-thickness and all gorgeousness. I felt a little silly with my waist-length blondette mess next to her hair (it looked particularly bad that day after a week of buns and no washing -- I wash once a week).

Iris looked at my hair and I told her why I was there. She said I could get by with about half an inch off but suggested about an inch to even out the hemline (I'm a self-trimmer) and speed up getting rid of layers. I agreed that she could take an inch off. She took off a bit more than that in the end, which rather surprised me (this happened to a few other clients too). The trim took very little time and was done on dry hair. First the back, and then she did the sides/front.

Then she washed my hair -- two rounds with their signature shampoo. She washed all of the hair, which I don't normally do. I usually just wash the scalp and put condish on the length. After the two rounds of shampoo, she put on the 1 hour treatment, wrapped my hair around my head, and put paper over it (I think it was baking paper, but I'm not sure). She then plugged me into a Mastix heated hair treatment cap for an hour. I read and chatted with the woman next to me -- her mother-in-law had gone to Madora/George Michael back in the day. She had waist-length hair and followed the George Michael plan faithfully, even when she moved away to Canada. The woman I spoke to decided to go to the salon while in town in memory of her mother-in-law and also to get rid of some damage etc. Iris took about 3 inches off of her hair (she was okay with this).

After about an hour (Iris disappeared to do other tasks and so came back some time after the timer went off) Iris washed off the treatment and then put my hair in curlers and under a dryer hood. She asked if I wanted curly or straighter hair. I went with somewhat curlier. She attended to other clients during this time, including a woman in her 60s with waist-length white hair. She was so elegant and had the most lovely white hair I have ever seen in real life. It was inspiring seeing her hair.

Finally, Iris took me out of the dryer and took the curlers out. She then styled my hair in a half-up reminiscent of the style Madora is seen wearing in the salon photos. Its very old-school looking as well as glamorous -- something I would never do myself so I was happy to have it done.

I ended up purchasing a new comb, which Iris helped me to pick out. And that's it!

Assessments: It was a good experience. My hair feels really moisturized and happy after the 1 hour treatment and its still holding those curls (thanks to my waves!). I'm a bit disappointed with how much she took off given that we discussed and agreed only one inch. My fiance thinks it was about two inches (!!). She took my hair up to MBL, I think. As a result, I will skip my usual microtrims for February and perhaps March. I was also surprised/disappointed that she did not trim the split ends, which I saw happening to a few other clients by one of the other people working there. She has also said that she would check the trim again when my hair was washed/dried, but she didn't do this.

She thinks I'll be done with my layers by summer or autumn next year if I keep trimming all of my growth, which is good news (and what I calculated also). She thought my hair was in good shape, but suggested eating more protein as she said I shed more than I ought to (I've thought I shed a lot before also, but chalked it up to once-a-week washes). I'll try to do this and also will get my thyroid checked to make sure everything's okay.

In sum, it was a good experience and I'd like to do it again sometime, but I may wish to use someone else there.

Questions:
(1) I had looked forward to the S&D and a longer hair discussion than the one I got. Do you think my experience would be different with a different stylist?

(2) Has anyone else had more hair taken off at the salon than they asked for?

[Sarahlabyrinth]

Thanks for sharing your experience, Crumpet. I'm surprised that she would cut more than had been agreed on and that she didn't S & D. Do you have any photos to share? Awesome that you got to see so much beautiful hair, though.

[Gertrude]

Apples and Oranges, different salons. The London stylist worked with GM himself. Treatment and trim is very different.

Shampoo first, twice, just scalp. Then treatment, and there's plastic foil over the baking paper, same heatcap, 1 hr. Then rinse, creme rinse, rollers always to straight ( as your hair will go) , then long S&D and chat and trim standing up last. For me it is the lengthy S&D that makes the trim worthwhile to be honest. The treatment and shampooing and rollers is of course the same, it's the sequence that's different and the trim completely different.

This sounds more like a haircut me , complete with the " hair stylist's inch" that's rather more. My 6 year old daughter gets the same trim at the children's salon. Even there the stylist is very careful not to take more off than expected. No S&D of course, but to me it's not GM without S&D.

* It is a different salon and both GM and Maria , the salon owner, have passed on. So things may have changed?

* In London I haven't ever had more cut off than I expected, actually in practice less than I expected , and lots of happy trim customers who travel long distances. The only thing I ever heard about cutting off more was very second hand, and the customer had a more pronounced U hemline, so the trim varied from one quarter inch at the sides to one a half inches at the bit in the middle of the U if that makes sense.

But my own experience was that I had very uneven hair to begin with, one side longer than the other, and that was evened up over three trims, so more than 6 months rather than all in one go. As I didn't want that. Perhaps saying you want to get rid of layers may have made Iris cut more off, but she should have consulted you. Changing stylists within a salon is difficult in my experience. The gorgeous long hair you saw is of course testament to their good care as well as the diligent home care.

[meteor]

Changing stylists within a salon is difficult in my experience. The gorgeous long hair you saw is of course testament to their good care as well as the diligent home care.

Out of curiosity, do you know why it's difficult to change stylists there? :) It's such an expensive experience that it seems that the customer should be able to get another stylist, if necessary.

Crumpet, I'm very sorry that you didn't get the much-anticipated S&D and got a bigger-than-expected trim and had to change your trimming schedule in preparation for your wedding. I really hope your hair will grow out fast for the event and more! :flower:
I'd love to see your Madora's half-up hairstyle. :D It sounds amazing, but I can't picture it - does that hairstyle have a name so we could look it up? :)

[lunalocks]

My experience 2 years ago was with a stylist named Agnes. She was lovely. She did the S and D and trimmed an inch, what we had agreed on.

By the way, I may have also seen the same elegant, white haired lady when I was there.

[Madora]

Thanks for a very interesting review, Crumpet.

Two things popped out after reading your critique: you had your hair trimmed BEFORE the treatment and you were asked if you wanted curly or straighter hair. I haven't a clue why your hair was trimmed first and not later on, after you'd had the treatment. I never knew that you had options (curly or straighter) when the rollers were being deployed.

I am sorry that Iris (who has been there for many years) cut off more hair than you requested. On the bright side, you'll now have a shorter period of time waiting to get rid of your layers. I do envy you those long hair sightings...especially the lady with the white waist length hair.

I haven't a clue if your experience would have been more satisfactory if you had used another technician. I've only used Agnes in my 3 visits. Maybe Iris didn't trim your splits because she thought your hair didn't need it? Were you able to observe any other patrons getting the trim before the treatment? Thank you for sharing your experience!

[Annalouise]

Your signature says WL, which I assume is waist length. And you said she cut your hair to mid-back length!?
OUCH. That is surprising for a 'long hair' salon to take off so much length without your approval.

Was your hair full of split ends is that why she cut more off? I can understand her taking more off if it was in bad condition.

Also, I noticed you picked out a comb. Which comb did you get? Did she give you any advice about what your hair care should be?
Did she recommend you use a bbb?

[Annalouise]

Oops, sorry, one more question about your shedding - how much hair do you shed?
And also, do you eat a lot of protein already or is your diet low in protein?:) Sorry for all the questions...:p

[CurlMonster]

I'm sorry to hear that they cut more than expected. That certainly puts a damper on the whole experience. :(
I would still love to see pictures though if you have them!

[Theobroma]

So sorry they chopped more than they said they would! Apparently one isn't safe from that probability even in a salon that claims to specialise in long hair. :(

About the shedding, the first thing that occurs to me is that you might have reacted to the deep treatment. How does your scalp respond to oils and conditioners in general? I can't CO wash or do scalp oilings because it makes my hair come out by the handful, and if the deep treatment involved slathering conditioner on your hair all the way up to the scalp and then wrapping the length round your head and leaving it there for an hour, that would mean your scalp was well and truly marinating in the treatment along with the length. So I wouldn't be surprised if that had made you shed!

Getting your health checked out is a good idea, though. Have them test your iron levels as well while you're at it. My shedding has decreased from what were previously "normal" levels for me since I got my iron to a level slightly higher than the low normal range where it's been for most of my life. (But don't, whatever you do, go supplementing before you know you need it. Too much iron in your blood can cause hair loss too!)

[LauraLongLocks]

I'm so sorry you had what I would consider a bad experience at a salon that is supposed to cater to long hair. Getting the S&D would have been the most important part to me, and cutting off twice what you agreed upon is unacceptable. I hope it grows back fast for you. What a disappointment paying for a less-than-satisfactory experience. :grouphug:

[Crumpet]

Thanks for all of the supportive comments everyone. I think it was a 'good' experience but I'm rather wary of it now.

Iris mentioned she didn't want to be working that day to me several times (she's mostly retired) so she may have skimped on what they usually do. I think that if I go back that I will see someone else. They don't have a computer to track clients/hairdressers so I think I could change without it being a big deal. She is also in phased retirement so I think it would be natural for me to move to someone who is staying there.

Theobroma: thanks for the suggestion. I think that the double-shampoo made me shed a lot. I also wash once a week and am not a dedicated BBB brusher (yet -- thanks for the help Madora!) so I tend to loose a lot of hair when I wash each week. I'll still check things out with a doctor.

Annalouise: Iris said my hair looked healthy when I asked her about its condition. She suggested the 1 inch trim to get rid of the layers and even out my hemline (I'm a self-trimmer so it was a bit wobbly). She didn't go through the ends carefully though, which, as LLL says is the part that is so exciting to have done in a salon. Its also what I feel like you are really paying for. My trim took about 2 minutes total. The person I saw who got the split end S&D went through that for about 20+ minutes, which makes it seem well worth the price for the trim.

I eat protein, but I almost never eat meat. I eat lots of fish and vegetarian food. I'm very athletic and in generally good shape, but its worth taking a look at my diet again to make sure its as good as I think it is (its SO easy to lie to ourselves!). I'm not sure how many hairs I shed, but I do imagine it was a lot. I have shed very little since the salon and so I think she loosened a lot of hairs that were ready to go with all of the shampooing.

As for comb suggestions, she suggested the Madora Detangler Comb #59. I like it a lot and it works well on my fine hair. I didn't like the fine hair specific detangler comb as was kind of long and thin (and awkward in my hands).

In sum: I don't want to put anyone off of the experience. It many ways it was amazing as my hair feels wonderful after the treatment and the trim was good. I expected the S&D and a bit more discussion as well as assurances about precisely how much would be removed. As a result, I felt it was expensive for what I received. I may go back (will ponder!) but I'll use someone else. Iris may have just had an off day (she was trained by George Michael and worked there for YEARS) but I'm a bit wary of using her again.

I got photos taken at the salon so I'll try to post those soon (I'm terrible at posting photos -- I'm very shy about my hair...AND lazy!).

[Kapri]

I have been reading through this thread and noticed a 2009 review which resonated with my recent experience. I had a disappointing visit to Neil Ward also. I visited him at his new base at The Salon New Bond Street.

I phoned beforehand to say that I had very fine hair and a long face. On the phone he said he had women with fine hair grow their hair to mid-back and that it was a matter of how you wear your hair.

Like one of the other reviewers, I wasn't offered tea or coffee and Neil was distracted with answering the phone on 2 occasions. On the plus side, he is a nice guy who seems to know his stuff. However, he identified new growth as breakage and then had to change his tune when he investigated further. I have virtually no breakage or split ends but do have dry hair.

I was given some good hair care tips - such as scalp massage to enhance blood flow to the scalp and prevent shedding - and then he said that the longest I should go, both in terms of my texture and in proportion to my height etc was just above shoulder length. He cut off a good inch and softened the fringe I am growing out. It was a good cut but I have had it cut to this length at many hairdressers and wasn't clear afterwards why he was so adamant I could not grow it no longer. To have a long hair specialist give you the usual just above the shoulder cut is a little disappointing and I felt a bit 'ordinary' afterwards.

I bought the products - I will report back on whether they improve the moisture levels of my hair. I don't know if I will go back. I think he is probably great for many women - just not sure he and I are a match.

[Kapri]

BTW, i am still puzzled because when I arrived Neil said 'Where is all this fine hair then?' - meaning that my hair looked much better than I had described on the phone. I had washed it and it looked healthy and swingy and just heading towards my collar bone. It does make me puzzled that he decided that just above the shoulders was as long as I should go - especially as he showed me a pic of a woman with very fine hair indeed to encourage me that mine isn't a big probelm. I am 5 ft 6 so ordinary height. He checked the length from the top of my skull to a particular part of the skull and apparently this measurement is a crucial one for understanding the proportions of a person. I think it must be about my face shape in the end - ie being too long- and he wasn't being open about that.

[lapushka]

Kapri, anyone can grow their hair long. Don't let this visit fool you. It wasn't a good visit. Chalk it up to that. And just check out the fine and thin hair thread on this forum. Lots of people there and there are quite a bit with hair longer than waist. I'd also try and join a no trimming challenge, just to see how long you can go. If it's healthy, hair doesn't need frequent trims.

[Kapri]

Thank you Lapushka - I appreciate your feedback and will look into what you suggest! :D

[Babyfine]

Wow I'm surprised a GM salon would discourage anyone from going for longer lengths.
Anyway, I have very very fine hair that is also wavy and very fragile. I keep it at BSL with a sideswept bang which I am growing out.
Of course my stylist(a small town rural stylist which is fairly inexpensive) thinks I should keep it shorter for maximum thickness and health but I like this length as I can do a lot more things with it and
also wear it down-longer lengths I have to keep it always up.
I've tried growing beyond BSL but the ends get thin and tangley, probably because I color, but I could probably prevent that by wearing it up all the time. Which I really don't want to.
I have a lot of grey, hence the color. Anyway, If "I" can get my hair to MBL, color treated and all, anyone can.
No heat styling and gentle handling for me.

[Kapri]

Neil Ward trained at the George Michael salon and uses their products and methodology but is not technically a George Michael salon - more of an affiliate I think.http://longhairinlondon.com/about/

Thank you for your encouragement and example. Your hair looks lovely in your pic btw. Personally, I am aiming for just below shoulder length/collar bone length so nothing too ambitious. I wanted some encouragement to get it a few inches longer. BTW, I grew out my coloured hair - partly because it was an ongoing struggle to keep colouring every 2 weeks and the hair 'took' the colour less and less well and partly to improve condition. That has improved the condition but - it is of course a personal choice!

[leayellena]

Answers to your questions:
1. No. They're all the bunch same. Period.
2. Yes. Every. Single. Time.

[cathair]

BTW, i am still puzzled because when I arrived Neil said 'Where is all this fine hair then?' - meaning that my hair looked much better than I had described on the phone. I had washed it and it looked healthy and swingy and just heading towards my collar bone. It does make me puzzled that he decided that just above the shoulders was as long as I should go - especially as he showed me a pic of a woman with very fine hair indeed to encourage me that mine isn't a big probelm. I am 5 ft 6 so ordinary height. He checked the length from the top of my skull to a particular part of the skull and apparently this measurement is a crucial one for understanding the proportions of a person. I think it must be about my face shape in the end - ie being too long- and he wasn't being open about that.

I would email him and politely ask him to explain. If he cares about what he does, he won't have want you to have come away feeling confused.

"Hi Neil,

great to meet you the other day.

I was wondering if you could explain why you think I shouldn't grow my hair longer than shoulder please? I left your salon feeling a bit down and confused.

Thanks for your help" - something along those lines.

If you don't get a good response, nothing lost. You weren't sure if your wanted to return and that will make your decision for you.

[MusicalSpoons]

BTW, i am still puzzled because when I arrived Neil said 'Where is all this fine hair then?' - meaning that my hair looked much better than I had described on the phone. I had washed it and it looked healthy and swingy and just heading towards my collar bone. It does make me puzzled that he decided that just above the shoulders was as long as I should go - especially as he showed me a pic of a woman with very fine hair indeed to encourage me that mine isn't a big probelm. I am 5 ft 6 so ordinary height. He checked the length from the top of my skull to a particular part of the skull and apparently this measurement is a crucial one for understanding the proportions of a person. I think it must be about my face shape in the end - ie being too long- and he wasn't being open about that.

Maybe so, but that has absolutely nothing to do with how long someone 'should' or 'shouldn't' grow their hair. Fineness is no problem for length. Thinness (as in, how much hair) is no problem for length. I'm honestly flabbergasted a 'long hair salon' dares to suggest that somebody shouldn't grow long hair!! What utter codswallop :shake:

[lapushka]

Just because it is "supposed to be" a GM salon doesn't mean they are *right*. You are the boss and master of your own hair, and if you decide to grow it, Kapri, then just do it. Did you find the fine and thin threads already? I'll give you the link!
https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=17115

[Kapri]

Hi Cathair, That is a great idea. Thank you. He is away on holiday at the moment but I will do that in two weeks' time when he returns.

[Kapri]

Do you know Lapushka - I was beginning to formulate that kind of thought. I will check out the link to the thread you sent. Thank you!

[Kapri]

Musicalspoons - hoorah for this! Thank you!! Very affirming. It was partcularly astonishing precisely because I had decided to sacrifice the trendy salon I usually go to for the sake of achieving more length.

[lapushka]

Hi Cathair, That is a great idea. Thank you. He is away on holiday at the moment but I will do that in two weeks' time when he returns.

Personally, I would not invest my time and energy. I'd decide no longer to give him my time or business. But that's me.

Have you heard of Feye's self-trimming instructions? This is a way to do your "own" hair. I mean, just let it grow and learn to self-trim, most of us do something along those lines here.

[EssleyBlue]

re: is it possible to have fine and thin long hair, YES! Two examples below.
1) Haartraum has this YouTube video about long hair that's fine and thin. The two ladies in the example, have gorgeous fine thin hair that look like silk.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5GGpYzJW_A
2) Also this one by Tamara Jade "How I grew out my thin fragile hair"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERi2D1GfBEQ

I personally don't want to grow my hair much longer than BSL or WL, but seeing that it's possible makes a difference in my own hair goals. When I was in my late 20s (10+ years ago) I did end up going to the George Michael Salon and got their deep treatment (no cut). I had mid-back length hair back then. I didn't love the double shampoo, it felt too vigorous for my taste, like hair was going to be ripped out of my skull. The deep conditioner was okay, nothing that blew my mind. I'm sure some people have great experiences, but I left feeling like I could have done the same myself at home.

My husband cuts my hair :D so I don't have the experience of asking for a trim and getting inches whacked off. It sounds like it happens on the regular, as the internet is littered with those stories. Coffee and makeup has an excellent video about getting the haircut you want, the length you want. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2u_f24GFHuk&t=70s She's hardcore i.e. printing out a photo of her hair length and drawing a line where she wanted it the cut. In short you have to be assertive, and maybe be willing to reward handsomely for the rare hairstylist who listens. I'll be using her tips if I do end up seeking a professional cut.

[Kapri]

Hi again Lapushka, Thank you. I have contemplated self-trimming on a number of occasions. I checked out and have bookmarked the page on Fey's self-trim. I think I would rather get my hair cut next time with a professional blunt cut - go back to John Frieda - and a nice sideswept fringe and then grow that style down. I had a cut at John Frieda that gew out beautifully and it was at the 3 and a half month stage when I went to Neil Ward's. When my hair is longer I would contemplate one of these self-trim approaches.

[cathair]

Personally, I would not invest my time and energy. I'd decide no longer to give him my time or business. But that's me.

Have you heard of Feye's self-trimming instructions? This is a way to do your "own" hair. I mean, just let it grow and learn to self-trim, most of us do something along those lines here.

I'd probably not give him any more of my money, but I'd probably always wonder if I didn't ask.

[Kapri]

EssleyBlue, I love the first video in particular. Inspiring. Thank you. I am only aiming for slightly over the shoulders but want my hair to be in good condition so the advice is great.

Re your experience wtih the GM deep condition - I read a review where the writer said very much the same. My deep condition is in 8 weeks if I go back to Neil Ward but I probably won't. https://www.hairboutique.com/articles_p/review-of-george-michael-12-minute-conditioner/

I am watching Coffee and Makeup's video on communicating with hairdressers. Thanks again!

[Kapri]

I am still thinking this would be a good thing - my only concern is that he would say something that would reduce my confidence. My hair is so fine that it is transparent and is natural silver. Looks blonde in some lights. He might be thinking that my face is too long and that I will look horsey with long strands - that is my secret worry. But I'll decide when he gets back.

[MusicalSpoons]

I am still thinking this would be a good thing - my only concern is that he would say something that would reduce my confidence. My hair is so fine that it is transparent and is natural silver. Looks blonde in some lights. He might be thinking that my face is too long and that I will look horsey with long strands - that is my secret worry. But I'll decide when he gets back.

We have many members with very fine hair; for instance Crystawni has extremely babyfine hair which is gorgeous. It really, honestly, does not matter - long hair of literally *any* type can be stunning if it's well cared-for :)

[cathair]

If the idea makes you anxious perhaps it is best to put it behind you and move on. It's makes it worse he's on holiday now which would drag things out. I think you've already articulated the worst he could come back with though.

Long silver hair is beautiful. What suits what face shape is only opinion. I'm sure you know better than he does what you want and need.

[cjk]

Most hair stylists are more concerned with molding the hair into a style than with the hair itself.

[Kapri]

Musicalspoons - thank you for the contunued encouragement - I am so glad I posted about this you and the other ladies have been super affirming!

[Kapri]

Good thinking Cathair! I am feelin so much better after reading the encouraging posts here.

[Kapri]

CJK - that is why I was so surprised that a long hair specialist would advise me the way he did. Thank you too - I would agreeethat in general there is a blind spot in the styling world.

[lapushka]

Kapri, you say you have silver hair. Have you ever watched Melanie (MrKongsMom) on YT. She is 39, and has a silver A-line bob that sometimes grows beyond collarbone. She is now contemplating having it cut again; but watch her. She has thin, fine hair as well. Maybe it's good for some inspiration! :flower:

Here's her channel:
https://www.youtube.com/user/MrKongsMom

[Lady Stardust]

The standard advice that I’ve seen for long face shapes is to add width to balance out the length. I have a long face, and although my rebellious side tells me not to conform to what is advised for my face shape, I have to admit that some width helps.

You have already added width with a sideswept fringe, which I think is a lovely flattering style. The other place you can add width is in the space between your chin and your shoulders, as seen in 1940s hairstyles with height at the top and curls above the shoulders.

My guess is, you were told that just above the shoulders is the best length because having the hemline there adds a slight amount of width. I doubt it was anything to do with your hair condition or texture. I wouldn’t take it personally at all - hairdressers tend to want to create the best image on the day that you are in the salon. I agree that it’s ridiculous for a long hair salon not to consider how long you want to grow your hair. Maybe, because you mentioned that you have doubts whether long hair will suit you, they wanted to try out what they considered to be “best fit” for you, in the hope that you would agree when you saw the finished cut.

Long, fine silver translucent hair sounds beautiful and ethereal to me! If you were happy at the previous salon then yes it makes sense to go back there and chalk this latest cut up to experience that you don’t want to repeat. As you said earlier in the thread, it seems that you and the hairdresser just didn’t gel. Getting your hair cut should be fun and a treat, and it really is when you find a hairdresser you trust.

If you want to find other ways to add width, you could wear earrings (hoops or danglies that hang to around chin length or longer), or wear a choker, a neck scarf or a long narrow scarf wrapped around. This brings the attention back up to your face as it creates a frame. There are some examples here
http://trendsurvivor.com/how-to-wear-a-skinny-scarf-this-fall/

Cat eye glasses are also amazing with long faces. Long faces are beautiful and there are lots of ways to accessorise :) It doesn’t all have to be about the hair.

[Kapri]

I like her. Can only [this morning] see her with the shorter bob but will sleuth through the youtube films to find her cuts. Her hair is shorter and finer than mine I think - it looks very pretty. Will investigate further Lampushka. Thank you.

[Kapri]

Lady Stardust,

Thank you - from one longer faced woman to another - this is really helpful and makes sense.

'The other place you can add width is in the space between your chin and your shoulders, as seen in 1940s hairstyles with height at the top and curls above the shoulders.'
Yes, I think I get what you mean here... it suits me if the hair is smooth and then kicks out with some interest or a rounded angle between chin and shoulder. A forties style would suit me very well.

Loving the new skinny scarf trend- really nice!

[Lady Stardust]

Lady Stardust,

Thank you - from one longer faced woman to another - this is really helpful and makes sense.

'The other place you can add width is in the space between your chin and your shoulders, as seen in 1940s hairstyles with height at the top and curls above the shoulders.'
Yes, I think I get what you mean here... it suits me if the hair is smooth and then kicks out with some interest or a rounded angle between chin and shoulder. A forties style would suit me very well.

Loving the new skinny scarf trend- really nice!

Oh good I’m glad it’s helpful, I wasn’t sure if I explained it very well. If this link works it should show Betty Grable with victory rolls...
https://goo.gl/images/VQqBXn

Rather than putting rolls or twists on the top you could clip them up in line with your temples, for more width again. I recently discovered The Pin Up Companion on You Tube, as recommended by a couple of ladies on this forum, and she does some nice easy styles. Here are some that don’t need rollers first
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1gPL1MLrWQ

[Kapri]

Lady Stardust, I just watched the Pin Up Companion and like the idea of trying a Gibson Roll - I actually stopped a woman at a station in London to ask her how she did her hair and it was something similar to that pinned style. With the Betty Grable style I would curl the hair chin to shoulder but not do the role on the top of the head. I've always admired that type of shape for hair.

[Lady Stardust]

Lady Stardust, I just watched the Pin Up Companion and like the idea of trying a Gibson Roll - I actually stopped a woman at a station in London to ask her how she did her hair and it was something similar to that pinned style. With the Betty Grable style I would curl the hair chin to shoulder but not do the role on the top of the head. I've always admired that type of shape for hair.

Yes that’s a great style, I tried it recently and was surprised at how easy it was at my (short) length. Here’s a link to the vintage/retro styles thread
https://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=129672&page=20

[Kapri]

Lady Stardust - I saw your pic and thought it looked lovely. Thanks too for the link - lots of fun to be had on this thread I think!

[Lady Stardust]

Lady Stardust - I saw your pic and thought it looked lovely. Thanks too for the link - lots of fun to be had on this thread I think!

Aw thank you :) Yes I love the retro styles :)

[lapushka]

I like her. Can only [this morning] see her with the shorter bob but will sleuth through the youtube films to find her cuts. Her hair is shorter and finer than mine I think - it looks very pretty. Will investigate further Lampushka. Thank you.

You're welcome! :)

[Babyfine]

Neil Ward trained at the George Michael salon and uses their products and methodology but is not technically a George Michael salon - more of an affiliate I think.http://longhairinlondon.com/about/

Thank you for your encouragement and example. Your hair looks lovely in your pic btw. Personally, I am aiming for just below shoulder length/collar bone length so nothing too ambitious. I wanted some encouragement to get it a few inches longer. BTW, I grew out my coloured hair - partly because it was an ongoing struggle to keep colouring every 2 weeks and the hair 'took' the colour less and less well and partly to improve condition. That has improved the condition but - it is of course a personal choice!
Thank you! Actually that picture was a number of years ago I need to update but my hair is still close to the same length-I've cut it to shoulders a couple of times since I've joined here-You've gotten some great advice here- Yes I've thought about stopping the color, too someday I hope of better hair quality.
I really like the retro styles myself, I agree they are great for adding height or width to the face.

[Kapri]

HI BabyFine and all your encouraging ladies - thank you for the great advice! :D