Searching for scalp washing tips...or ways to survive daily washes!

[Imalath]

I have been searching the forums for scalp washing advice, and coming up short. My scalp needs daily washing with strong shampoo to stay happy, but the ends of my hair are getting pretty dry and brittle, and it feels like my hair is never really dry. I have the time to blast my scalp with a blow dryer on cool, but drying the length daily is just not possible at this stage!

I have tried a few different ways of washing just my scalp and failed miserably. Is there a knack to it that I've been missing? Will I acquire the skill after lots of practice? I'm just kind of throwing a line out here to see what everyone has to say.

Alternatively, any tips on keeping my length from losing condition from the constant wet/dry cycle? More oil/thicker conditioner/more trims?

Help me LHC'ers, you're my only hope! :wink:

[diddiedaisy]

Maybe try to put conditioner on your ends before you shampoo, that way you should get some protection from the shampoo.

[LongHairLesbian]

Is there any possibility that you could have a scalp issue? I get that some people wash their hair every day because they don't like any oil in their hair, but if your scalp gets super itchy, smelly or scabby after only one day, maybe something else is causing that. Barring that, CWC (condition-wash-condition) is great for protecting the ends from shampoo. I like to apply a little coconut oil to my hair before I shampoo; it drastically reduces tangles, and keeps my ends decent at past hip length. I don't wash every day, so maybe if you were to use this method, you would need to apply more oil to your lengths than I would. Experiment, and see what works! :)

[Panth]

Yeah, I agree with LongHairLesbian - what do you mean by "happy scalp"? What happens to your scalp if you don't wash daily? Is it just that your hair looks unacceptably greasy (this can, in some people, be trained out by stretching washes) or is it that you get itchies/scabs/dandruff/smell/etc.? If the latter, that's a medical condition and you should go see your doctor to get a proper diagnosis, then treat accordingly.

If it is nothing more than greasy-looking hair and it can't be trained out by stretching washes (not everyone's can), you could try: gentler shampooing (e.g. use less-harsh sulphates (e.g. SLES, ALS and ALES rather than SLS), use sulphate-containing shampoos but dilute them, use sulphate-free shampoos (cocoamidopropyl betaine-containing shampoos are great, as they will remove 'cones unlike most other non-sulphate cleansers, but are still gentle)). CWC can protect your length, but it can also cause build-up in some people (depends on product combination, water type, etc.) because shampoo and conditioner are oppositely charged, so when used together can lump together and stick in a way that neither ingredient would on their own. Alternatively, you can try to just condition your length more heavily and with targetted things - e.g. if it is damaged consider protein, if it's dry consider moisturising ingredients and humectants, etc.

[CathyGo]

What scalp unhappiness are you having and what kind of shampoo are you using? I can tell you that shampooing twice with coal tar shampoo and making sure to gently work it all the way down to the scalp works miracles for me. I normally wash my hair every third day but will go to daily if my scalp is flaring up.

I did a lot of experimenting with conditioners and have finally learned to just feel my hair in the shower and try to gauge how much oil was stripped out. I use a heavier conditioner if it feels drier and my lighter stuff if it feels like there's still oil in there. If it feels really dry I'll also use a leave-in conditioner. I use Aussie Hair Insurance most frequently(my hair loves that stuff) but you can also just put a small dab of conditioner into a spray bottle with warm water. I use a second bottle of just water or a wet comb to dampen the hair slightly and then do a light mist with the conditioner/water mix. Warm or hot water really makes it work much better.

[Imalath]

Thanks for all the replies! I guess I should have been a little more specific about my situation; I recently learned I have SD, and work in a warm, moist environment that makes it absolutely thrive. I can keep it controlled with daily washes of over-the-counter dandruff shampoo (right now Denorex works the best). Even stretching to every other day leads to outbreaks--I can skip a day now and then, but not regularly. I already CWC, and use a blend of coconut and olive oil on my length and ends both before and after washing. My ends have some minor damage that oil and leave-ins kept soft and barely noticeable, but the change in shampoo has dried them out and made them crispy.

I am looking for methods of scalp washing that can keep the harsh shampoo off the length of my hair, or a way to keep it from stripping the moisture from the ends when I do wash. If nothing else fails, I can always start trimming regularly instead of just once or twice a year. It will take longer to reach my goals that way, but I don't like for my ends to look like i trim my hair with a butcher knife, lol.

Thanks for the help!

[Wosie]

Imalath, I'm very much in the same situation as you! My scalp condition has flared up into one of the worst episodes I've had in recent years.

Currently I'm washing my hair every other day but my scalp wants to get washed every day for sure. I daren't use Ketoconazol (Nizoral) every other day, as it's quite strong, so I use a SLS free shampoo 50% of the time. Nothing seems to help, and I've tried many different things. :| When I go to my dermatologist, she just prescribes more Ketoconazol and a solution I'm supposed to use on my scalp, but it just makes it worse. She doesn't even know if my scalp condition is atopic eczema or SD; when I asked her she said hesitatingly "...a mix of both... but it doesn't really matter". :shrug:

I tried scalp only washes for a while, but the lengths got wet anyway, so it didn't help much. Please tell me if you find a solution and I'll make sure to keep you posted as well. :blossom:

[embee]

I do not have SD, but I do not want to get my length wet in winter, I'll freeze! Here is what I do: I put my hair into a topknot bun using a plastic/acrylic hairstick, and I wrap the bun in plastic - a shower cap, a bag, whatever - and put an elastic over it to hold it in place. Then I can get my scalp wet in the shower but my length stays mostly dry. It's surprising how well the water can run under the topknot if I pull it up a little bit.

[Beezle]

I do the same as Embee but put my hair in a low bun held loosely by a hair tie, wrap the bun in a disposable shower cap, because that's lighter plastic, and secure with a large claw clip. I tip my head forward towards the shower so only the top scalp as far back as the crown gets wet and use diluted shampoo. The rest of my hair may get slightly damp but not enough to worry about.

[Entangled]

I braid my hair and roll it up, then wrap a bandanna around it. The plastic bag goes over the bandanna bun. I use the bandanna to catch any drips, and the bag I use is a grocery bag doubled.

ETA: I wrap a ribbon around the bag to hold it on.

[lapushka]

If you have to wash that often with a harsh cleanser (I feel you - I have SD), then use a deep conditioner often or try conditioning twice after washing (WCC - link in my signature). The LOC method is a natural follow-up for this method. It's especially for people who can't CO-wash or otherwise have to use a harsh cleanser.

[Madora]

Imalath, could you possibly dilute your strong shampoo with a bit of water?

As far as drying your hair, here is a technique I developed over the years:
Hair should be completely detangled and slightly damp before starting. The more water you can express from your strands, the faster the air drying will be.

Part your hair from nape to center of forehead so that it is in two sections. Band off one section with a scrunchie to keep it separate from the other section.

Take a pencil thin size sliver of hair in your hand.
Bring your hand up to your ear and then extend it all the way out (to the side)
Slowly let the strands drop to the floor

Take another pencil thin section and repeat steps 1-3

Repeat with the rest of the hair. Keep repeating the hair fanning motions until the hair is dry.

Once you notice that the hair is becoming drier, you can take larger portions of the hair, but use a wide tooth comb in place of your hand. Go slowly and gently when using the comb.

When hair is dry, band off the section with a scrunchie to keep it out of the way. Repeat the hair fanning procedure with hair in the other section.

When finished, you can leave hair as is, or apply your favorite oil, etc. and style as desired.

The technique was developed by me after years of having to wait forever for my very thick, long hair to dry (using the hair laying on a towel down the back approach). It took forever and I wanted a faster method.

Outside, my hair dries in 20 to 25 minutes. Indoors it takes about 45 minutes, using a portable electric heater (standing about 4 feet away).

The secret to drying your hair quickly is to thoroughly detangle it when you start, and to keep the air circulating through it as you fan the strands.

[Panth]

If it's SD and you're currently suffering a bout, then get a proper antifungal shampoo, i.e. Nizoral. Regular "antidandruff" shampoos are not designed specifically for SD and also are not as effective. Absolutely do not dilute the Nizoral and use it exactly as per the instructions (twice a week, leave the suds on the scalp for 5 mins before rinsing). If you need to wash more frequently than that, use regular shampoo for the in-between washes - whatever works for you. You may still need to use stronger shampoos (e.g. SLS-containing) or you may get away with less-strong shampoos (e.g. diluted SLS shampoos or undiluted SLS-free shampoos). YMMV - depends on frequency of wash, water type, hair type, how dirty your hair gets at work, etc.

Your absolute first priority should be to get the current bout under control. Then you can start thinking about prevention.

Prevention will be very personal and require some experimentation. It can involve things like: not stretching washes too long; not leaving sweat on the scalp (washing off promptly, even if it's just with a WO rinse); not letting scalp stay damp for ages (i.e. crack out the blow dryer and use it on cool - you can just dry your scalp hair and leave your length and that'll be fine, alternatively use Madora's drying method); never putting oil or oil-containing treatments on the scalp; using somewhat harsher cleansers. Not everyone needs to do all of these things - you'll need to work out the best compromise for your scalp and hair, given your routine.

I wouldn't use coal tar shampoos - those are for dry scalp conditions, e.g. scalp psoriasis.

For keeping the length happy, try lapushka's suggestions. You're best to do everything you can for your scalp, then try to protect your length (rather than compromising your SD treatment/prevention because you're afraid of hurting the length) as chronic SD is very often associated with severe shedding. If you don't get that scalp under control, you may not have as much length to be concerned about...

[pelicano]

Interesting thread, as I'm the same with my hair/scalp - currently having to wash it daily. I've not yet tried a scalp only wash, but I wonder if my hair is long enough to actually manage it. Will experiment!

[SongofLove]

I wash my hair twice a week in the shower (scalp only) but I wash at least my bangs/fringe every day at the kitchen sink. Some days I wash nearly my whole scalp while leaning over the sink with my hair in a bun and the length doesn't get wet. Have you tried this yet?

[Imalath]

Imalath, I'm very much in the same situation as you! My scalp condition has flared up into one of the worst episodes I've had in recent years.

Currently I'm washing my hair every other day but my scalp wants to get washed every day for sure. I daren't use Ketoconazol (Nizoral) every other day, as it's quite strong, so I use a SLS free shampoo 50% of the time. Nothing seems to help, and I've tried many different things. :| When I go to my dermatologist, she just prescribes more Ketoconazol and a solution I'm supposed to use on my scalp, but it just makes it worse. She doesn't even know if my scalp condition is atopic eczema or SD; when I asked her she said hesitatingly "...a mix of both... but it doesn't really matter". :shrug:

I tried scalp only washes for a while, but the lengths got wet anyway, so it didn't help much. Please tell me if you find a solution and I'll make sure to keep you posted as well. :blossom:

Thank you! I haven't tried Nizoral yet; I am using up the last of a bottle of my current product with an active ingredient of 3% salicylic acid. I will try the nizoral afterwards. If that doesn't work I will get some of the stronger solutions from my doctor, who was willing to let me try over-the-counter products first.

I was also running into the same problem with scalp washes; it is faster to wash just my scalp in the kitchen sink, but I always ended up getting so much of my length wet I should have just washed in the shower.


If it's SD and you're currently suffering a bout, then get a proper antifungal shampoo, i.e. Nizoral. Regular "antidandruff" shampoos are not designed specifically for SD and also are not as effective. Absolutely do not dilute the Nizoral and use it exactly as per the instructions (twice a week, leave the suds on the scalp for 5 mins before rinsing). If you need to wash more frequently than that, use regular shampoo for the in-between washes - whatever works for you. You may still need to use stronger shampoos (e.g. SLS-containing) or you may get away with less-strong shampoos (e.g. diluted SLS shampoos or undiluted SLS-free shampoos). YMMV - depends on frequency of wash, water type, hair type, how dirty your hair gets at work, etc.

Your absolute first priority should be to get the current bout under control. Then you can start thinking about prevention.

Prevention will be very personal and require some experimentation. It can involve things like: not stretching washes too long; not leaving sweat on the scalp (washing off promptly, even if it's just with a WO rinse); not letting scalp stay damp for ages (i.e. crack out the blow dryer and use it on cool - you can just dry your scalp hair and leave your length and that'll be fine, alternatively use Madora's drying method); never putting oil or oil-containing treatments on the scalp; using somewhat harsher cleansers. Not everyone needs to do all of these things - you'll need to work out the best compromise for your scalp and hair, given your routine.

I wouldn't use coal tar shampoos - those are for dry scalp conditions, e.g. scalp psoriasis.

For keeping the length happy, try lapushka's suggestions. You're best to do everything you can for your scalp, then try to protect your length (rather than compromising your SD treatment/prevention because you're afraid of hurting the length) as chronic SD is very often associated with severe shedding. If you don't get that scalp under control, you may not have as much length to be concerned about...

It turns out that my massive shedding over the past few years were due to SD outbreaks, which I always just thought was plain dandruff. In the past I treated them by washing daily with dandruff shampoo until the outbreak was controlled, then slowly substituting regular shampoo until I washing twice a week with the dandruff shampoo. After a while of having it controlled I would usually get lazy and try to stretch washes, and it would start all over again in a vicious cycle.

This last shed was the worst by far and actually sent me to the doctor to see what was going on. I now have a plan of attack for the SD which is working, if slower than I'd like. About a month in I am still dealing with a lot of itching and flakes, but they are just white now instead of the greasy yellow-green that they were before. Instead of shedding several hundred hairs a day, I am down to just twenty or thirty, which makes me very happy.

I am more than willing to sacrifice the condition of my hair to actually have hair at all, but I wanted to see if I could get some tips here for having both! Thank you for the advice.


I wash my hair twice a week in the shower (scalp only) but I wash at least my bangs/fringe every day at the kitchen sink. Some days I wash nearly my whole scalp while leaning over the sink with my hair in a bun and the length doesn't get wet. Have you tried this yet?

I have, but I haven't managed to do so without soaking my length, even when it is tucked up under a shower cap. I will keep trying though!

[Imalath]

Imalath, could you possibly dilute your strong shampoo with a bit of water?

As far as drying your hair, here is a technique I developed over the years:
Hair should be completely detangled and slightly damp before starting. The more water you can express from your strands, the faster the air drying will be.

Part your hair from nape to center of forehead so that it is in two sections. Band off one section with a scrunchie to keep it separate from the other section.

Take a pencil thin size sliver of hair in your hand.
Bring your hand up to your ear and then extend it all the way out (to the side)
Slowly let the strands drop to the floor

Take another pencil thin section and repeat steps 1-3

Repeat with the rest of the hair. Keep repeating the hair fanning motions until the hair is dry.

Once you notice that the hair is becoming drier, you can take larger portions of the hair, but use a wide tooth comb in place of your hand. Go slowly and gently when using the comb.

When hair is dry, band off the section with a scrunchie to keep it out of the way. Repeat the hair fanning procedure with hair in the other section.

When finished, you can leave hair as is, or apply your favorite oil, etc. and style as desired.

The technique was developed by me after years of having to wait forever for my very thick, long hair to dry (using the hair laying on a towel down the back approach). It took forever and I wanted a faster method.

Outside, my hair dries in 20 to 25 minutes. Indoors it takes about 45 minutes, using a portable electric heater (standing about 4 feet away).

The secret to drying your hair quickly is to thoroughly detangle it when you start, and to keep the air circulating through it as you fan the strands.





Good to know Madora. Thank you! I will try it tonight when I wash my hair; the worst part of washing daily is that my hair never really dries before I have to wash it again. Does it cause many tangles? My hair likes to twist and tangle from even the slightest movement when wet.


If you have to wash that often with a harsh cleanser (I feel you - I have SD), then use a deep conditioner often or try conditioning twice after washing (WCC - link in my signature). The LOC meth moment's noticeod is a natural follow-up for this method. It's especially for people who can't CO-wash or otherwise have to use a harsh cleanser.

I will check it them both out, thank you!

[Madora]

Good to know Madora. Thank you! I will try it tonight when I wash my hair; the worst part of washing daily is that my hair never really dries before I have to wash it again. Does it cause many tangles? My hair likes to twist and tangle from even the slightest movement when wet.

Imalath, you detangle your entire head of hair very carefully, with a wide tooth comb, before you begin to do the air drying technique.



I will check it them both out, thank you!

Imalath, you detangle your entire head of hair very carefully, with a wide tooth comb, before you begin to do the air drying technique.

[GetMeToWaist]

If all else fails I would recommend doing CWC and completely coating hair in conditioner or oil before you shampoo. Does cowashing work for SD or not? That would be milder.

[DarleneH]

Related questions brought up by answers in this thread:

(1) How do you know if you've got fungal problems on your scalp? I'm having lots of sore scalp issues and I'm wondering if stretching washes like I do is contributing to some fungal or bacterial problems and I need to start scalp washing more, just like the this thread is discussing. I really don't think I have SD; not flakiness anyway.

(2) When you coat hair with conditioner or oil before shampooing, do you apply the conditioner/oil to dry strands or wet/damp hair?

[lapushka]

(1) How do you know if you've got fungal problems on your scalp? I'm having lots of sore scalp issues and I'm wondering if stretching washes like I do is contributing to some fungal or bacterial problems and I need to start scalp washing more, just like the this thread is discussing. I really don't think I have SD; not flakiness anyway.

You know because you've had a doctor check it. :)

[Wosie]

lapushka, Not if you're visiting my doctor (who seems reluctant of saying much of anything about my scalp condition). ;( I think I'll ask for a new one, even if it'll be awkward (doctor, not scalp :laugh:)...

[GetMeToWaist]

Related questions brought up by answers in this thread:

(1) How do you know if you've got fungal problems on your scalp? I'm having lots of sore scalp issues and I'm wondering if stretching washes like I do is contributing to some fungal or bacterial problems and I need to start scalp washing more, just like the this thread is discussing. I really don't think I have SD; not flakiness anyway.

(2) When you coat hair with conditioner or oil before shampooing, do you apply the conditioner/oil to dry strands or wet/damp hair?

Wet hair always, it won't penetrate dry hair as the cuticle is closed. When its wet the cuticle opens.

[ChloeDharma]

When I used shea butter on my hair I found it quite resistant to being washed out. What about applying that to your length to protect it from the shampoo?

[Anje]

Here's a weird one that I once saw suggested, but haven't tried. I imagine the longer the hair, the better it works:

Braid your hair, loose at the scalp. Get a coat hanger and somehow clip the end of your braid to the coat hanger. Hang that out of the shower spray (maybe on the rod supporting the curtain? Obviously, this would require some tweaking) so that the length of your hair is mostly going upward and off to the side when you stand with your head under the shower spray.

Then, you should be able to shampoo your scalp and rinse and such, but because the length is elevated, it's not going to get shampooed and could mostly stay dry. This rather appeals to me over the standard "put your length in a baggie and hold it up while you shampoo with the other hand" method. :)

[Wosie]

You could always ask somebody for assistance (holding the hair above your head) while doing a scalp wash, it should only take a couple o' minutes so it shouldn't be a big hassle for the helper. I'll ask DBF and we'll see how it goes. %)

[Entangled]

Here's a weird one that I once saw suggested, but haven't tried. I imagine the longer the hair, the better it works:

Braid your hair, loose at the scalp. Get a coat hanger and somehow clip the end of your braid to the coat hanger. Hang that out of the shower spray (maybe on the rod supporting the curtain? Obviously, this would require some tweaking) so that the length of your hair is mostly going upward and off to the side when you stand with your head under the shower spray.

Then, you should be able to shampoo your scalp and rinse and such, but because the length is elevated, it's not going to get shampooed and could mostly stay dry. This rather appeals to me over the standard "put your length in a baggie and hold it up while you shampoo with the other hand" method. :)

People do that? My arms would hurt! I usually keep it in some sort of bag, but keep the length secured up in a claw clip before I wrap it.

I wish my hair was long enough for the hanger method.

[Imalath]

Tried a baggie-covered bun for a scalp wash tonight and managed to keep everything below collarbone dry until i started detangling. Now my whole length is damp. I think it might work better in the kitchen sink with the hand-held sprayer to direct the water flow directly under the bun. I think for now I will try every-other-day scalp washes and see if my technique improves with practice. Or experimenting!

Anje, I think the hangar idea sounds interesting too....but alas, my braid is way too short for that atm. Maybe in a few years I can try it and get back to you, lol

ChloeDharma, thanks for the shea butter idea. I might try using a little bit of it on my ends before my next wash.

[ChloeDharma]

ChloeDharma, thanks for the shea butter idea. I might try using a little bit of it on my ends before my next wash.

You're welcome, I've never managed to get the hang of scalp only washing either to be honest. I heavily oil my length before I wash it to protect it as much as possible but my hair is fine and quite delicate so it's essential. As I say, the shea butter was very hard to wash out so I'm thinking for you it might give the protection your length needs. I hope you find something that works.

[kidari]

Related questions brought up by answers in this thread:

(1) How do you know if you've got fungal problems on your scalp? I'm having lots of sore scalp issues and I'm wondering if stretching washes like I do is contributing to some fungal or bacterial problems and I need to start scalp washing more, just like the this thread is discussing. I really don't think I have SD; not flakiness anyway.

(2) When you coat hair with conditioner or oil before shampooing, do you apply the conditioner/oil to dry strands or wet/damp hair?

Stretching washes is a long process of training yourself as well as your scalp. I would wash my hair at night and by the afternoon the next day my hair would be a greasy mess. So stretching to even washing every other day took me some time. When I just couldn't wait until the next day I would do a water only wash or a CO wash of some sort (I felt like at least it wasn't shampoo). Since switching to a gentler shampoo, I find that stronger ones make me greasy faster and make my scalp sore now. I have stopped relying on clarifying and chelating shampoos and use a vinegar rinse instead; I only use the chelating shampoos once in a blue moon now if I really am forced to use it. A sore scalp for me is usually from not stimulating the scalp. I have relatively straight hair so I brush mine thoroughly from scalp to ends bent forward with my head upside down (all this is YMMV). Also, If I wear my hair up in a high bun for too many days in a row and I take it down or put it in a low bun, my scalp will be sore. If I feel like it's from bacteria or fungus I mix up some EOs that I know have antibacterial and antifungal properties like peppermint and tea tree oil with some distilled water and spray directly onto my scalp, making partings and then gently massaging. Sometimes I do this with rose water too.

Oiling is different for everyone. Some people do it on dry hair, some do it on wet hair, some even spray warm water prior to oiling since the heat really helps the oil spread and penetrate. Others cannot put it on their scalp, and not one oil works for everyone. Personally, I oil on dry hair prior to washing. I had issues before with oiling my scalp. It caused shedding but now it seems to help my scalp as it's gotten sensitive to shampooing often.

[Panth]

It turns out that my massive shedding over the past few years were due to SD outbreaks, which I always just thought was plain dandruff. In the past I treated them by washing daily with dandruff shampoo until the outbreak was controlled, then slowly substituting regular shampoo until I washing twice a week with the dandruff shampoo. After a while of having it controlled I would usually get lazy and try to stretch washes, and it would start all over again in a vicious cycle.

This last shed was the worst by far and actually sent me to the doctor to see what was going on. I now have a plan of attack for the SD which is working, if slower than I'd like. About a month in I am still dealing with a lot of itching and flakes, but they are just white now instead of the greasy yellow-green that they were before. Instead of shedding several hundred hairs a day, I am down to just twenty or thirty, which makes me very happy.

I am more than willing to sacrifice the condition of my hair to actually have hair at all, but I wanted to see if I could get some tips here for having both! Thank you for the advice.

Sorry, didn't mean to be too aggressive. But yes, you sound quite a bit like me - and in my case the shedding has been quite severe (3 7/8" circumference down to 2").

I would definitely try the Nizoral. In my experience that works the charm within two or three weeks, even with severe bouts. With less severe ones, it resets things within 2-3 washes. Once you've got an effective treatment, then you can start thinking about preventing recurrences.

[lapushka]

Sorry, didn't mean to be too aggressive. But yes, you sound quite a bit like me - and in my case the shedding has been quite severe (3 7/8" circumference down to 2").

I would definitely try the Nizoral. In my experience that works the charm within two or three weeks, even with severe bouts. With less severe ones, it resets things within 2-3 washes. Once you've got an effective treatment, then you can start thinking about preventing recurrences.

A good sign that the Nizoral is working is that the itching goes *almost* straight away. It gets better the more you wash with it.

[Imalath]

A good sign that the Nizoral is working is that the itching goes *almost* straight away. It gets better the more you wash with it.

That sounds fantastic...I am still fighting the itching more than anything else atm. Will make a point to pick up some Nizoral on the way home from work tomorrow...