the very, very ends breaking off

[stachelbeere]

Hi every one,

So I was doing S&D today (just my side braid tassel) and I noticed that I have so much breakage going on, and it's for instance the very very ends (especially a bleached and green-toned section of hair I have above my ear...) - as in the last 1-3 mm of the hair (that is 0.03 - 0,1 inches) are breaking off and it's the finer strands that are doing this.


Is there anything I could do to help that? My bottom few inches have been dyed and processed in the past but I'm doing my best to care for them (oiling and conditioner). Is there anything else I could do? Except for chopping it all off - which is something I don't want to do yet. I've been sporting braids recently and I discontinued WO and am now doing SCC every 3 days or so.


btw - my ends are usually tangly but they haven't been for a while.

[Nadine <3]

I'm very interested to see the responses to this. I get those to...little white dots a bit up the strand, and if you tug it a bit, it breaks!

[spidermom]

I recommend regular small trims (1/2 inch or less every other month) to slowly eliminate the worst of the damage.

[kganihanova]

Just cut it off. Way less work that way in the long run.

[höpönasu]

I have random white dotted hairs too. I trim them off on my S&D sessions. I'm growing so cutting it all off at this point isn't an option. I'm not that worried about them either. I think my hair is healthy enough and it can survive with S&D only.

[MINAKO]

I think there's no difference in breakage, regardless of where it occurs, the cuticle is stressed from natural wear off, color, dryness, too much manipulation what so ever. Just cut it off and proceed in a way to avoid the cause as good as you can. I use alot of lanolin based creams and also cones in my hair to keep them protected, mostly in a bun as for myself, anything braided would never be as gentle on the hair as simply keeping it all together in a firm bun (but not too tight) bun.

[shinyspoon3]

I agree with the others. Snipping them off is the only way to keep it from getting worse. Prevention is the best medicine, and once they split, they are doomed. Even if you can temporarily stick the frayed bits back together, the bonds are broken and will eventually split higher and higher up the hair shaft. I say, cut your losses now before they get worse. :scissors:

[stachelbeere]

hmmm... okay. well, I'm trying to grow my hair out longer. And to be honest I don't really have problems with split ends, I rarely have some and when I do they are tiny, like those broken ends. My hair also stopped being super tangly after my last trim in May. When those tiny pieces break off they leave a white dot. and then they stay that way with that white dot. Sooo... I think I'm going to proceed like hoponasu, grow on and ignore them. If by the end of the year my hemline and condition of my hair considerably worsens I'll cut it but so far it's not a reason to cut for me.

I actually forgot to ask if the reason for those broken ends might be mechanical damage from wearing a braid almost daily recently and the tassel being "exposed"...? Would that make sense?

[chen bao jun]

Well, I don't know about the white dots further up, but I was able to save my messed up ends for quite a while with protein treatments plus moisture, very gentle handling and wearing my hair up ALL the time. I just never combed my ends, either, only finger detangled. It was worth it to me to keep them for a while because otherwise my hair would have been too short to do updoes, I would have been starting all over and getting discouraged and just psychologically I was not up for a big chop, I'd had short hair twice and hated how I looked in it.
I gradually cut them, but actually, i never had to cut as much as I first thought I would have to, some of it was damaged, but more of it than I originally thought turned out to be salvageable after being babied.
I used this protein treatment
http://www.amazon.com/Joico-112062-K-pak-Reconstructor-5-1-ounce/product-reviews/B000UYSSB4/ref=dpx_acr_txt?showViewpoints=1
and I did lots and lots of SMTS

[Hrtchoco]

I usually cut a 1-2 mm right above the white dots. Saving super damaged hair is not worth the trouble imo.

[meteor]

Well, I don't know about the white dots further up, but I was able to save my messed up ends for quite a while with protein treatments plus moisture, very gentle handling and wearing my hair up ALL the time. I just never combed my ends, either, only finger detangled. It was worth it to me to keep them for a while because otherwise my hair would have been too short to do updoes, I would have been starting all over and getting discouraged and just psychologically I was not up for a big chop, I'd had short hair twice and hated how I looked in it.
I gradually cut them, but actually, i never had to cut as much as I first thought I would have to, some of it was damaged, but more of it than I originally thought turned out to be salvageable after being babied.
I used this protein treatment
http://www.amazon.com/Joico-112062-K-pak-Reconstructor-5-1-ounce/product-reviews/B000UYSSB4/ref=dpx_acr_txt?showViewpoints=1
and I did lots and lots of SMTS

Excellent advice! I think hair prone to breakage needs hydrolyzed proteins, lots of regular oiling, and updos almost all the time. Also, make sure you sleep on satin silk pillowcases or use satin silk sleep caps. Protection like this makes a huge difference for fragile ends.
I'd try to avoid all brushes for now and maybe do some scalp-only washes instead of full washes to avoid drying out the ends with detergents and hygral fatigue.

[AmyBeth]

When you braid your hair, put it up in hairsticks or spin pins to avoid exacerbating the damage to the ends. If you must use a hair tie, try to use only non-damaging ties, like the tiny little terry cloth ones for little girls. Daily oiling of the ends will also help to slow the damage from migrating up the hair shaft while you (presumably) microtrim the damage off.

[lapushka]

I had a perm a number of years ago. Together with some previous heat damage, it left my hair riddled with white dots. It was shoulder length at the time. I grew it out all the way to hip length with those dots in. Of course I had the occasional breakage, but it remained intact pretty much all the way. It takes a lot for white dots to effectively break off. That means you can take your time doing S&D and you can microtrim at your leasure.

[cathair]

If I get white dots on my ends I have to cut them off. They just make my ends too grabby, then they tangle then they split worse and cause damage to the hairs around them. I really lose very little hair cutting them off just above them. Your mileage may very though, my very ends are very thin and fragile and I know you have trimmed pretty recently.

I don't think braids help, especially not if they are tied off. My ends don't survive them very well. I have found if I am sleeping with a braid I don't need to tie it off at all, it will stay plaited anyway. If I need to wear it out which I rarely do, plaiting in a small ribbon and tying that off seems to be the least damaging so far.

[chen bao jun]

Lapushka, its encouraging to hear that you got to hip.
to some people, its not worth the trouble of babying hair and to some it is. I don't have to do as so much work now, but I did have to do some at first. braids can be protective but it depends on your hairtype and I think buns are generally better, plus try not to twist the hair to put it in a bun.
A Jeterfork holds up a bun very well without you having to keep manipulating the hair, I find.

[kganihanova]

I'm one of those people who hates babying their hair excessively. It is just is much trouble for a very small gain. That said, I also don't s and d, I just trim and save time that way, plus I get to keep my blunt hemline. YMMV

[stachelbeere]

Thank you for all your input, it's greatly appreciated <3 sorry for replying only now, this week has been crazy busy for me.

To be honest i think the problem is mechanical damage here from leaving my ends exposed in a braid tassel. I have a few face framing layers (the shortest ones are around CBL) and I noticed that some of those short, fine hairs are broken as well - and there shouldn't be any dye damage except for some possible pre-LHC heat damage. I also noticed that new growth, which ends in a taper, likes to break off as well. I'm going to try and combat this with more frequent bunning, oiling and I'll try and find Chen Bao Jun's product or an equivalent to that.

Another question I have: Do you think that silicones on the very ends would help me protect the ends as well?

[meteor]

Another question I have: Do you think that silicones on the very ends would help me protect the ends as well?

It depends on whether or not your hair likes silicones.
Personally, I use cones only for slip, but apply oils on braid tassel regularly to keep split ends at bay. I don't usually use cones as leave-ins on the very ends because I'd need to clarify those ends and I like to avoid sulphates on my oldest, most weathered hair. I think something like oils or Panacea is a safer alternative than cones for some people.
If you do apply cones on your ends, check them for dryness or brittleness regularly. You may need to clarify.

[lunalocks]

I have been protecting my ends with catnip tea soaks (see the catnip threads) after washing, a little baby oil (a drop) to the ends when semi dry and then another drop or two on the ends before bunning at night. My hair has grown 5 inches (not including a few mini trims) in the last year and I am now at TB. The year prior, no catnip tea, no mineral oil and having real trims at a salon, resulted in no net growth for a year. I still have some splits but they are far fewer.

A combination of the ends being exposed and the fastening band for the braid could be causing the breakage.

[LauraLongLocks]

You said you've been wearing braids a lot in your hair lately. What have you been using to secure your braid? Maybe the cause of your breakage is in the type of hair tie you are using? Also, braids can rub against clothing which can cause mechanical damage/ends breaking off. Are you sleeping with a satin cap?

[stachelbeere]

Laura, I've been sleeping on silk for the last few years so I've got that covered. I sleep with my hair in a top knot secured with a plastic fork, or a stick or pins, whatever I decide that evening. I think

I really like wearing braids... and it the past, until my hair grew to APL, I was wearing a silk scarf around my neck and down my back to secure the braid tassel (it was falling on the scarf) but lately my hair has become too long to be protected by silk scarves and started wearing side braids more often. I'm thinking that I have more control over the tassel that way.

I like to tie my hair off either with a clear elastic (eeek! but only sometimes), an elastic ribbon (the EmiJay kind) or a tiny terry cloth one (which I have an inexhaustible amount of and it's my go to hair tie).

I think the answer to my problem is wearing silk every day :) but I'm afraid that's not possible. Option 2 is wearing my hair in a bun...

---

Lunalocks, catnip tea sounds like something I'd love to try out - if only it was sold in my country as an herb; I've been trying to find it in herb stores to no avail! It's mainly cultivated as a garden plant and even my grandma used to have it it and then she got rid of it before I knew what I could use it for... aaaaahhh well. No luck here so far.
And I think it's probably my hair rubbing against my clothing that is causing the micro breakage.

---

meteor, thanks for your input, I agree that using sulphates on the ends is probably not a smart move in my case. I've seen people mention panacea her on LHC and I'm wondering if it's this (http://nightbloominggarden.blogspot.com/2010/09/panaceas-hair-salve.html) that every one is referring to?

---

Also, I totally forgot to tell lapushka that it's comforting to know that someone was able to grow their hair super long with white dots. Maybe I can too then.

[meteor]

meteor, thanks for your input, I agree that using sulphates on the ends is probably not a smart move in my case. I've seen people mention panacea her on LHC and I'm wondering if it's this (http://nightbloominggarden.blogspot.com/2010/09/panaceas-hair-salve.html) that every one is referring to?
Yes, that's the one. There were 4 types last time I checked. Nightshade recently changed names. There's a huge ongoing thread going on about Nightblooming's panacea salves: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=50728&page=138
Warning: it's highly enabling! :lol:

[lapushka]

Could it be the previous heat damage that has yet to grow out? It takes a long time for hair to "renew" itself. Damage needs to grow out.

[stachelbeere]

thanks meteor! I shall look into it :)

lapushka - well - yes and no. There is some heat damage in the last few inches of my hair, most definitely. However, it is less likely the reason why the tips of some face framing, shorter hairs (CBL) would be breaking off. Is it possible that the very tips (that are still tapered) are breaking off because they are so thin and fine? I was wondering about that as well.

[lapushka]

lapushka - well - yes and no. There is some heat damage in the last few inches of my hair, most definitely. However, it is less likely the reason why the tips of some face framing, shorter hairs (CBL) would be breaking off. Is it possible that the very tips (that are still tapered) are breaking off because they are so thin and fine? I was wondering about that as well.

If you are sure that it can't possibly be heat damage... well, then I'm puzzled. Are there any white dots in those hairs, split ends? There has to be a reason it's breaking off. There have to be weak spots in those strands for it to do so.

[stachelbeere]

lapushka - I looked at my 'hair history' more throughly [=checked old photos]. And it's most probably heat damage from CBL down (or at least APLish). Back in 2011 (February/March) I bought a curling iron and I was using it until early 2012 (March/April). Funny, I actually thought I used it for half a year or so and then gave it up and so I never took the damage I've done serious. But my hair grew from chin to SL back then. I remember 'microtrimming', as in cutting random 1/2 inch chunks off every month (a girl back then told me about microtrimming but I guess I was hacking all my growth), so I trimmed away some of the damage but it's still there in the lower portion of my hair.
I'm not going to cut it because I don't really notice all that damage unless I do a thorough S&D and I'm just going to trim once in a while if my ends get super tangly. As I mentioned, my hair doesn't split, it's just micro breakage that's going on.

So what I decided to do is get some protein-loaded product, like chen bao jun suggested and slowly trim away as I go.
Sadly I didn't find the exact product in my country though - they only seem to carry the shampoo and conditioner from that line (and they are waaay too expensive for me :( although I loved the reviews! but it's around 40 Euros where I live, that's a bit too much). I'm wondering if to start a new thread and ask about possible products in Europe or if I could get some suggestions here about possible alternatives (stuff with hydrolyzed protein and other beneficial ingredients)?

Thank you so much for all your suggestions and tips, everyone <3

[lapushka]

Europe is a big place. Where exactly are you located. Maybe that will give others a more accurate way to suggest things to you. I have no idea as far as products go... sorry. :flower:

[stachelbeere]

Europe is quiet big but I travel a bit, I'm in England quiet often (le boyfriend) and in Germany but I mainly live in Poland right now.
I might also look into DIY masks. from what I remember there was a gelatin mask. And also that most proteins don't penetrate the hair (like egg yolk).
I'll do a bit of research on that ;)

Thanks lapushka!

[jacqueline101]

I had a problem where my hair would break off at the ends. I found a micro trim to help then I washed it conditioned it and sealed the ends with baby oil. It was a lack of moisture in the winter that caused mine.

[meteor]

I might also look into DIY masks. from what I remember there was a gelatin mask. And also that most proteins don't penetrate the hair (like egg yolk).
I'll do a bit of research on that ;)
If you really want a DIY protein treatment, look into Science-y Hairblog (http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.ca/2014/04/gelatin-protein-treatment-recipe-update.html) and check out gelatin, beer, soy sauce. Proteins need to by hydrolyzed or fermented - broken up to be small enough to penetrate hair. Personally, I recommend gelatin: dilute a packet with water and add to a cup of your usual conditioner.

There are lots of protein treatments on the market, especially in the "damaged", "colour-treated", "curly" label categories. Just look for amino acids and hydrolyzed proteins pretty high up on the ingredients lists. Proteins of different sizes may not match everybody's hair. I find that hydrolyzed keratin and hydrolyzed silk proteins seem to work for a lot of people, possibly because they are small enough (you can find out more about protein sizes on Science-y Hairblog).

[stachelbeere]

gee thanks for this meteor. I actually went ahead to the most popular drugstore over here (Rossman) and bought a conditioner (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yGwdci0oU6Q/UidupAF53-I/AAAAAAAAFOI/9j8MAdUJbQ0/s1600/102_3628.JPG) which was surprisingly cheap (about 1 Euro for 500 ml -it was on special offer as well!) and it was the ONLY condish that had no silicones (and parabens) and contained hydrolized wheat protein. I applied it on the ends of my hair (roughly from chin down), combed with a wide-toother comb to get it in and washed it away after 5 mins. Next time I'll leave it on for a bit longer (maybe 20 mins?) but right now my hair feels a lot silkier, sleeker and seems to behave nicer. I think I'll test this conditioner out a bit more, check the blog for other hydrolized proteins and maybe just buy the proteins from an internet store that I know of and add it to masks and conditioners to up the protein a bit. chen bao jun's product seems a lot better (according to reviews) but it's a bit too expensive for me right now and maybe an unnecessary expense because the damage isn't that bad.

Sounds like a plan to me :)

[meteor]

Great plan, stachelbeere! :D I'm glad it's already working for you. With hydrolyzed proteins, just like with oils, heat and time increase the effect, so 20 minutes will give you a stronger effect. Most people who like proteins don't use heavy protein packs often (maybe once every few weeks) and protein can build up, so if at some point it starts feeling like your hair is getting coated/dry/brittle/hard/wiry/snap-prone/less elastic, it's better to back off proteins for a while and use more oils and humectants until the balance is restored. Generally, it's recommended to pair proteins with oils because hair seems to require a balancing act between "structure" (proteins) and "elasticity" (oils and other emollients).

Best of luck! :):blossom:

[stachelbeere]

Thanks for all the advice on proteins. I'm glad the solution is so simple and I think I can easily continue growing like that :)

[Firefox7275]

Those clear silicone elastics contributed to a lot of breakage in my (colour treated) hair some years back. Maybe wrap the ends with a silk/ satin ribbon so there is no one spot getting comnpressed and no exposed tassel?

Also consider a hydrolysed protein treatment to patch repair and strengthen.

[stachelbeere]

that's what I'm doing now Firefox7275 (glad to see you back here giving great advice!) :) I bought conditioner with hydrolysed wheat protein and also ordered hydrolysed keratin and hydrolysed elastin which I'm waiting for to receive!