How long to wait after scalp biopsy to henna hair? Androgenic alopecia blues.

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

Hello all,
I just had a scalp biopsy done last Wednesday on April 30th to confirm a suspected diagnosis of androgenic alopecia. :( having the stitches removed on Friday, May 9th, and supposed to get the actual results two weeks or so after the procedure was done. I would like to henna my hair to see if it helps to thicken my super thin strands to help cover my visible scalp on top of my head. Does anyone know how long to wait after having stitches removed to be able to use it? My dermatologist is of no help to me and basically shoos me out of her office as soon as I try asking questions.
Also, has anyone heard of anyone getting any hair regrowth after using henna? I'm tired of seeing my scalp and tons of hair fall out of my head constantly. I'm really afraid to go on rogaine, as I have very sensitive skin. My dermatologists only advice to me is to just live with the female pattern baldness, try rogaine and cross my fingers that it gives me any regrowth at all. :(
Any feedback is appreciated. Thank you.

[Anje]

I imagine it's good to wait at least until the wounds from the stitches are healed shut, which will probably be a few days after they've been removed. Maybe a week after, if everything looks closed over? You don't want henna mud in an open wound, I'm sure -- it's hard enough to get off without it sticking to something that's healing.

A couple thoughts...
1) I haven't heard of people getting thicker growth from henna. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it isn't a growth treatment generally speaking. It's just hair color. I actually can find it a little irritating to my skin, though mixing it with chamomile tea instead of water or lemon juice (ooo, lemon was awful!) seems to be better.
2) Whatever your color is, henna is going to make it darker. Likely, that means you'll have a stronger contrast between your hair color and scalp. This might actually make it more visible.
3) Henna will probably make you shed a decent amount of hair in the rinsing process.
4) You know henna is orange-red, right? (I have to ask. There are so many people who henna and then freak out because they didn't realize how orange it would be and how bad it would look on them.) If you don't want that color, don't use it because it doesn't come out readily.

If you're just looking for something that'll thicken your hair and add volume, I'd suggest you try senna (aka cassia obovata) first. It's got a yellow dye that doesn't show up much on hair that's not very light colored and which fades in a few weeks. The conditioning is similar to henna, but the lack of intense color makes it a good option for just about anyone who doesn't look good with copper hair.

[ravenreed]

I found that henna made my individual hairs feel a bit thicker but not noticeable to anyone else. I only used it twice because the color did not flatter me at all. I would wait until things complete heal up before application. No sense in risking a skin irritation that waiting a few more days can prevent.

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

Thank you both so much for the replies. :) I think a week or two to wait sounds like a good idea, it's hard enough to wash out as is! I did mostly lemon once before and that definitely was super drying but I thought it was just because I had damaged hair. I have medium to darkish brown hair with a bunch of gray strands coming in, it'd be nice to get more reddish orange :) I did henna once or twice in the past but didn't see much color change at all. Might have to try cassia too! Just ordered some jasmine to start off with from mehandi.com. I'm excited :)
I did thankfully get good news when my results came back early. The doctor saw some very slight increase in miniaturization but she thinks it's just the tail end of telogen effluvium. I might have androgenic alopecia in the future but she's not completely sure so I have to keep an eye on it. Still shedding like crazy though!

[Anje]

Ooh, good news that it might be the end of TE! That's great!

Next time, definitely mix the henna with chamomile tea or warm water (tea drinking temperature is good). Lemon juice is just nasty on many scalps. It gave me such bad itchies and a bumpy start-of-eczema type of rash on my ears when I tried doing henna with lemon juice, so I'm eager to preach it as bad news. You'll probably get a deeper stain with water or tea anyway.

[ravenreed]

My hair is thinning, although it would probably be unnoticeable to anyone else. I see the difference and it worries me enough that I am going to talk to my doctor about it. Anyway, I understand your frustration and concern. I think Rogaine might be worth a try, but apparently if you stop using it any growth from Rogaine will disappear. It seems like an expensive and permanent option.

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

Thanks Anje, I'm happy about it. :) really hoping the miniaturization won't increase more but I will have to wait and see I guess.
Ooh owie, that sounds awfully painful. :( chamomille is probably more soothing, so preach on! No one should have to suffer an itchy and irritated scalp. Have you tried apple juice for mixing before? I just heard that it is a lot less acidic and irritating than the lemon. Probably still could be too irritating though.
I'm sorry to hear Ravenreed. :( usually we are always the first people to notice and not fun to go through. It's worth it to try to get to a dermatologist. It's always best to get to the root of things (no pun intended). If you can, have a biopsy done if they don't find anything off with blood tests first. It really didn't hurt at all and they can see things more closely. If anything, Rogaine would maybe be an ok last resort. It is a shame it's so expensive and permanent. :( I will probably try some castor oil first because it is cheaper and might help with regrowth. Have you tried massaging with castor oil before?

[Anje]

Whatever mehandi.com may say, you don't need acid at all to make henna work. :)

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

I'm going to take your advice. The less irritating and drying, the better. :) plus I have plenty of chamomile tea! I'm trying to see if it has any actual affect on anxiety. Lol

[Jonquil]

Congrats on the good test results! I've been diagnosed with AGA but my dermatologist never did a scalp biopsy to confirm it. I've been thinking of asking for one just to be sure. Was it uncomfortable at any point during or after the procedure? And how much skin did they remove? I'm afraid that it might leave a bald spot...

This is unrelated to your question, but I wanted to suggest you try emu oil for some time to see if it gives you any regrowth or at least reduces your shed. There have been some studies that show that it positively affects hair growth and keeps hair in the growing phase longer. I used to be a member in a hair loss forum (a very depressing place, not surprisingly) and some members reported that it actually gave them regrowth. You can do some research on it and see if it's something you want to try. I've been using it as my oil treatment before washing for a couple weeks now - too early to tell if it's helping, but it feels really nice on the scalp. It also makes my hair reaaaaally soft and silky :)

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

Thanks Jonquil! So far, it's just temporary good news as I probably will most likely have AGA in the future. I would certainly go have a scalp biopsy done! I think it's best to be completely sure that AGA is your final diagnosis. just looking at your hair and scalp quick isn't always very accurate. I was also told I have AGA for sure right this moment just by looking at my thinning hair on my top and front scalp but supposedly the biopsy said it is the end of a TE shed, and there hasn't been tons of miniaturization yet to show that it is also AGA for sure right now. You will be just fine with the procedure, I promise. :) the worst part is probably when they do a little poke with a tiny needle to give the anesthetic but that honestly didn't hurt bad at all. Didn't feel any pain during the procedure, just a bit of pulling. After the anesthetic wears off it will be sore for a few days, but nothing a couple extra strength Tylenol can't help to take the edge off. As for the bald spot, I'm not too sure as I'm only 9 days out now but the derm said that in most people, regrowth may be possible. The section for the biopsy is 4mm and they usually like to do 2 so they can compare horizontal and vertical samples. You will have to keep me updated! Feel free to shoot me a message if you'd like to talk. :)
Emu oil you say? I've heard good things about emu oil for skin. Like if you stretched your ears, people have been able to get them to shrink back down to a more normal size with regular massage. Haven't heard about it helping with regrowth though but anything other than rogaine is worth a try! I was lurking that forum quite a bit too. Seems as though it's easier to almost try to go into denial about thinning hair sometimes. :( that's great that the oil makes your hair feel really soft! Does it make your scalp feel itchy at all? How do you feel about using other oils like olive and coconut? You'll have to let me know about your regrowth too. :) sending positive growing vibes your way! Going to do some research on it!

[Jonquil]

Thanks for the info! For some reason I was under the impression that a bigger section would be taken, 4mm isn't too bad at all. And it is good to know for sure what the diagnosis is. AGA, or at least what appears to be AGA, runs in one side of my family but it may very well be stress and lifestyle related to some extent. Part of me is still in denial :) *fingers crossed*

As for the oils, I've tried only coconut, almond and olive aside from emu oil. Emu oil is an oily texture, of course, but also lighter and much less greasy feeling. A big problem I had when trying the other oils was that I would shed a lot just from getting it evenly spread out over the scalp. Emu oil just on, it's really easy to spread wherever you want it to go without pulling on the hair. That's the main selling point for me. No itchy scalp either. It just feels... nice, haha, I'm not sure how else to describe it.

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

No problem :) just make sure they don't want to do them one right on top of each other in a place that you can't hide it. They did that to me in a spot where I'm very thin right on top at the parting for my bangs which are already taking up half my head and I'm pretty upset about that. You never know so I will be crossing my fingers for you that it's just stress! Or nutritional deficiencies, that would be very fixable :) I also have some hairloss in my family. A lot of the men on my mothers side have male pattern baldness. None of the females have it severely that I know of, but my aunt had no eyelashes and my mother lost all her body hair below her neck after giving birth to me. She's always had a ton of hair until lately when it has been starting to thin at 67.
Maybe a lighter oil is better for us to not weigh the hair down. I have a ton of shedding from coconut and olive oil too! I wasn't sure why though, since I still have a ton of shedding from even just putting the oil on the length only. Do you also get very itchy from olive oil? It's so odd! Emu oil sounds fabulous :) where do you buy yours from? Do you know any reputable sellers who don't charge a small fortune for it?

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

Well it looks like I'm back in the AGA boat. When I had my stitches removed, I asked the nurse to clarify a bit what my results meant. She said that since they did find some miniaturization, I have both AGA and TE. So much for good news... Lol

[Jonquil]

Ahh, welcome back to the dark side! You could try filler powders to cover up that one spot if it really bothers you. Joan Rivers seems to have a popular line... I've never tried them though.

I also get shedding from putting oil on the length of my hair, always figured those are the hairs that were weak and about to fall out anyway :/. None of the oils ever gave me an itchy scalp but coconut oil was definitely too heavy and it never washes out completely, so blahhh. I got my emu oil from a website called Silky's Garden. There are a lot of sellers if you look online. Depending on the manufacturer you can get different consistencies and colours, it all depends on their emus and how they process the oil. I've heard that the oil smells a bit like raw poultry if it's not fully refined but mine doesn't smell like anything.
It's not too expensive but it's not cheap like, say, olive oil either. The 8 oz bottle I got should last 4 months at least with oiling 2-3x a week and using a bit as leave-in after washing. Like I said, it spreads so easily that it doesn't take much.

There was a thread about emu oil here somewhere... I'll see if I can find it!

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

Haha thanks! Does the dark side at least have cookies?? I wonder if that works. Heard toppik is a good line. I was just looking at that area of my scalp and it seems pretty sparse so that sounds like a good idea.
Ooh so you too huh? You don't think it could also be from the stress on the scalp if the oil gets on it too? Coconut is pretty heavy. What do you like to use for washing usually? Silkys Garden sounds familiar for some reason. Are they on ebay? Raw poultry? Sounds delectable! :p lol at least the 8pz bottle seems to last a while. Do you use it before washing the 2-3x a week overnight?
If you can find it, let me know! :) thanks!

[Jonquil]

You'll have to be quick if you want cookies. They go fast. We get hungry doing all sorts of dark activities haha.

Yeah the stress on the scalp probably doesn't help but there's nothing to be done about that, y'know? I've been CO washing with some conditioner from Aussie since I got my emu oil and it gets all the oil out. Not sure if Silky's Garden is on eBay... I ordered mine right off their website and it arrived a week (from FL to Western Canada, that's not bad!). I don't sleep with the oil in my hair but I'm sure that wouldn't hurt. I just put it on and leave it as long as I can on wash days.

And here's the thread: Emu Oil (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=436)

[KaleidoscopeEyz]

But I'm already full of lots of cookies so I move slow! LOL ooh dark activities, count me in!
That's very true. I try to be so gentle, barely even massaging and so much still comes out. Aussie has some good conditioners. Sometimes their shampoos can be a bit drying. They probably have good CO washing conditioners. Good ol' VO5 is also great for that, works almost as good as shampoo! I'm going to take a gander if she is because I am now sure I bought an emu oil conditioner from their a longggg time ago. That's really fast shipping! You're my upstairs neighbor! I'm in Minnesota. Hehe oh yea, sleeping in it isn't bad at all. :)
Gonna check out that thread later, thanks! :D

[jennraq]

I never did a patch test, but I totally should have. Who knows what could have happened otherwise with an allergic reaction. Better to be safe than sorry.