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LauraLongLocks
April 20th, 2014, 03:41 PM
My mother has 1b, F, i hair and it is neck length right now. She was saying today how she would love to grow her hair long, but it just looks awful because it is so thin and her braids are embarrassingly skinny. What can I do to help her?

She asked me about a detangling conditioner, so I gave her a bottle of mine. Then she proceeded to spray it on and rip through her tangles, and I stopped her, "Whoa, Mom, don't rip through them like that because you don't have much hair to begin with. If you break your hairs off, there will be even less. Here, Mom, try my Tangle Teezer." She liked the way it felt on her scalp and how it didn't rip through the tangles. She has always used shampoo and sometimes conditioner, everyday, because she gets greasy and feels the only way she can get any volume or body at all is to shampoo it so it fluffs up a little. I gave her my CO-wash conditioner and told her to try this instead. She said she would.

Anything else I can tell her? She wants more volume at her shorter length and doesn't want to sleep in foam curlers. She sometimes uses a curling iron to give it a little body. I reminded her that heat will destroy her hair. She knows, but she wants to look like she has some hair. Fineys, help my dear mother!

ETA: I suggested CO-washing because she was complaining of tangles and her hair looks really dry. It doesn't make my hair look lanky and limp, so I hope hers will respond well to it.

ETA 2: Also, if you have any (i) thickness shots of long hair in updos, or down, that you would be okay with me sending a link to my mom, please share the link. I think she could use some inspiration.

Vanilla
April 20th, 2014, 04:10 PM
I'm a F/M and co-washing made my hair super limp and greasy looking unfortunately. Maybe coconut oil as a pre-poo treatment would help get her hair a bit healthier?

Your mom can also do rag curls for additional volume at the roots.

Agnes Hannah
April 20th, 2014, 04:19 PM
Hello LauraLongLocks, I understand your Moms situation as mine is also fine 1a/b Fi circ 2 - 2.25" on a good day. I use a silk sleep cap every night to protect it and it makes me feel a bit special too! plus silk pillow for extra protection. Again it makes me feel special, and I read somewhere it is good for wrinkles too, so an added bonus for me ha ha. I try not to be too heavy handed with it and use a hand made comb (Kent) and Ihave a few of these, one for smoothing and dressing as I get a lot of scalp cleavage when putting it up, another for detangling etc. I had a tangle teaser but am not a fan although they make good scritchers! I wash every couple of days, I have been trying to extend washes to twice weekly with a CO in between if needed. When Washing, I use gentle shampoo so no SLS, and try more natural types if I can get them. When washing, I smooth the shampoo carefully through the top part of my scalp only and let the bottom get cleaned by the shampoo running down so cut out as much manipulation as possible. Conditioning is important for me as my hair is getting longer now to MBL and I colour it (semi), but have done so for a long time as I am in the process of blending in my grey. Final purpose is to go colour free. Anyway, I condition it twice, firstly a cone free and secondly usually a little coney, but this bit is concentrated on the bottom as it may weigh my hair down.
The Body Shop has its own conditioner without any parabens cones etc in it which gives a little body for our hair types, it has shampoo that goes with it too which may be good for your mum.
I use a tubie to dry my hair and finger dry when damp. In between washing, I smooth a little serum or oil on my ends to protect before putting on my cap.
Finally, I wear it up 99% of the time and the results are beginning to show.
It is a long process, but if you and your Mom can get a routine going that she is happy with and her hair is too, she should be able to grow as long as she wants to.
I have been with LHC for six months now, regular reads of the boards are also useful as others have the same or similar experiences as your Mom. And of course there is shopping for all those gorgeous hairtoys!
Finally finally or I won't shut up, your Mom has got you and I have seen your progress and how gorgeous your hair is.
PS I forgot, there is also dry shampoo although I have not tried this, and scalp only washing.
good luck LauraLongLocks Mom, keep us posted on your progress

Aderyn
April 20th, 2014, 05:08 PM
A note about CO-washing on fine, thin hair, if you haven't already suggested it, she could also try diluting the conditioner prior to washing if it does leave her hair limp and greasy. If that doesn't work, she would try a CWC or WCC method instead.

The tips on generally being gentle with hair are good, and I think that will make a huge difference. Protecting that hair is vital for it to grow long.

animetor7
April 20th, 2014, 05:19 PM
I would also suggest using dry shampoo as a way to keep her hair from looking limp while stretching out washes. I am a finey, and I know dry shampoo has made it possible for me to stretch washes when I wasn't able to before. I would also suggest that she talk to her hairdresser the next time she goes in for a trim. I only ever get my hair trimmed, but the shaping my hairdresser does to my hair has helped a LOT with making my hair look thicker and more voluminous and not lie flat on my head. I also agree with all of the general comments about being gentle with fine hair and not using heat styling, but finding other ways to create volume. I wish your mom the best of luck on her hair journey to whatever lengths it takes her. :)

lapushka
April 25th, 2014, 06:59 AM
My mom's hair is 1bFi/ii and it's almost APL. She used to have BSL to waist length in her 40s that she always twisted up into a bun. Long hair is do-able, certainly, even if she's i! Unfortunately, I have no pictures of my mom with her hair like that, but it looked nice. I often wonder if she's not a i instead of a ii, because she's on that line between the two, I feel.

A good detangler for i hair might be the Suave kids version detangler.

Good on you for recommending the Tangle Teezer, I feel she's going to be doing great with that.

No other recs, but wishing you luck with getting your mom "on track"! :thumbsup:

browneyedsusan
April 25th, 2014, 07:47 AM
My hair isn't super thick, either. (Henna helps, but if Mom has never been a redhead, don't go there. You know how permanent it is!)

She can get a sleep cap (Walmart $3), stocking cap, or tie a scarf over her hair at night to help with the tangles.
Pin curls are do-able, and last for a couple of days. I use bobby-pins, they lay flat against your head and are only mildly irritating in bed!, and they come out fine. Video tutorial (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elKVFr-NtIM)--she talks a lot, but it's good information.

If Mom tries a different shampoo/conditioner routine, she needs to stick with it about a month to see if it works because it takes our scalps a while to adjust. I'd dilute the shampoo and/or conditioner to see if she can get the same results without stripping her hair.

Mom can PM me if she wants--or you can help her PM me. I'm probably closer to her age, and would be happy to share what I've learned. (I had super short hair for a LOT of years, and it's never been longer than shoulder length in my adulthood. I'm almost 48, and holey-moley! My siggy is surreal! That isn't me, is it?)
Good luck and keep us updated.
Love to Mom :flowers:

LongHairLesbian
April 25th, 2014, 08:10 AM
Our mothers are very similar. My mum has the smallest ponytail I've ever seen, and she washes and heat styles every day, bleaches her roots every 6-8 weeks, and rips through her tangles. I think her especially thin hair comes down to diet, though. She eats bird like quantities of food, because being skinny is the most important thing to her. I've told her not to wash and heat style every day, that she can use dry shampoo, which she may implement. I'll never get her to eat more, though, because if she isn't a size 4, she's "getting fat". She's the only one in my family that's like this, all my other older relatives eat fairly normal quantities of food, and have average hair thickness. I don't believe that any special kind of diet will help hair growth, but getting a good amount of food and nutrients is important.

Castor oil is said to reduce hair loss and promote regrowth. I think it was chen bao jun that said her 80+ year old mother was able to regrow her hair using Jamaican black castor oil as a scalp treatment.

Savvyhorsez
April 25th, 2014, 08:26 AM
From one very fine thin haired person to another, I say don't give up on the growing! Sure there are plenty of cons with having fine and thin hair, but so is every other hair type. I have a few photos, not as many on here yet, but you are welcome to show them to your Mother. :) Good luck!

Barnet Girl
April 25th, 2014, 08:49 AM
I would suggest taking MSM, although this is a longer term solution. Also, (don't know what you call them) but those braided bands can look lovely and get you through that awkward length where there's not much length to play with.

http://slodive.com/inspiration/edwardian-hairstyles/

Theobroma
April 25th, 2014, 09:12 AM
If she's going to try CO washing (and especially if she has thin hair to begin with), please make sure she's alert for possible extra shedding. CO is fantastic for some but can cause severe shedding for others, and the shedding doesn't always manifest itself immediately. In my case it increased by such gradual increments that I didn't realise anything was wrong until I'd lost 40% of my thickness.

One good thing to try for extra volume is shampoo bars. (I just use ordinary bar soap, as a matter of fact.) Follow up with an acidic rinse and it creates soft, shiny, fluffy hair with plenty of body, and it's an insanely simple and convenient routine to follow, which may be an argument for people who don't like to spend too much time fussing with their hair.

LauraLongLocks
April 25th, 2014, 09:30 AM
Great advice everyone. Thank you. I passed along the suggestions to my mom. She got herself a TT and loves it. She's also happy so far with the CO-wash and detangler I gave her. Savvyhorsez, your photo albums are empty. And my mom, not being a member here wouldn't be able to see them. They would have to be uploaded to a public photo hosting site.

She isn't very sure yet how it will be growing it out. She's at that awkward stage where her hair isn't long enough to pull back, and needs to be styled to look good. She owns a bakery, and wants/needs to look good for the general public. Her hair looks about like mine did at this length, but she isn't doing the moussed, flipped out thing that I was doing at this length:

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b270/Bestbirth/Hair%20Gallery/Hair%20length%20shots/c48066d4-95cb-4dc9-8080-ccd37c1035c7.jpg (http://s21.photobucket.com/user/Bestbirth/media/Hair%20Gallery/Hair%20length%20shots/c48066d4-95cb-4dc9-8080-ccd37c1035c7.jpg.html)

Her hair is between the length in the picture above and the one below, the same color as mine, and a little more than half my volume:

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b270/Bestbirth/Hair%20Gallery/Hair%20length%20shots/LauraPrego016.jpg (http://s21.photobucket.com/user/Bestbirth/media/Hair%20Gallery/Hair%20length%20shots/LauraPrego016.jpg.html)

AmyBeth
April 25th, 2014, 11:47 AM
Another 1b/F/I piping up! I'm 50+ also, and when I began to seriously grow my hair, it was already almost BSL, so I could put it up to disguise the stretching washes transition greasiness, and any awkward layer grow out. I think if she wants to get past those issues, about the only thing she can do is tough it out for a few months, perhaps with the help of barrettes and headbands. She has to keep her hair out of the way at the bakery anyway, I imagine. They will help to camouflage layers and oiliness. It is going to be really hard to grow when you keep doing damaging things to such fragile hair! All of the things that have already been mentioned will help, certainly. Hendigo was a huge, I mean huge boost to the thickness of my hair, as it often is to the very finest hair. If she doesn't want to go anywhere near it, she might try cassia, sometimes referred to as neutral henna. It is said that it gives lots of the benefits that henna does, without the color or the permanence, because it will wash out and probably not interfere with any other coloring process she might use. Or perhaps a colorless gloss? That might be something to try. Another thing that hasn't been mentioned yet, I don't think, is scalp massage. I can't stress enough how much I believe massage has helped my hair, boosting my growth rate, stimulating all those follicles to produce at their top performance. Just a few minutes a day, until she feels the tingle of increased circulation. Remind her of the old advice to treat her hair like antique lace at all times. If she wants long hair, since hair can't be repaired, only trimmed, it's doubly important for fineys to take advantage of and protect what they have, and not let it be damaged or needlessly ripped out! Even though her hair may be short now, if she wants it to be long, the short hair that is touching her shoulders now, will someday be BSL or longer and if she wants it to be healthy, take loving care of it now! I truly think the best advice for anyone who wants to grow any type hair, is to join or at least lurk LHC!:) Of course we all wish her happy growing!

Savvyhorsez
April 25th, 2014, 04:32 PM
LadyLongLocks I thought the site fixed my photo albums. :( How about if they are posted here?

LauraLongLocks
April 25th, 2014, 11:45 PM
If you want to email them to me, my email address is Laura@bestbirth.com .

Sarahlabyrinth
April 26th, 2014, 01:10 AM
You are welcome to show your mother my hair photos. If you wish I could email some to you, though I am a iii and F. Tell her many fineys grow long hair!

ErinLeigh
April 26th, 2014, 05:58 AM
My attempts at suggestions would be..
Try some large heatless rollers to give volume at the roots. I wear them for 15min before going out and notice a good difference.
Maybe let her try a sample of your EDEN. The hydrolyzed protein in that one always makes my hair feel more substantial also.
Teach her to dutch braid or twist the bangs and sides so it looks like she is wearing an updo.
Dry shampoo may give some texture at roots.
A cassia treatment to see if it makes hair appear thicker.

restless
April 26th, 2014, 06:14 AM
I know you wrote her hair is pretty short as of today, but I have a volume- tips worth giving a go for when its a little longer. My F/ii hair lies very flat against my scalp too if I dont do anything to it after a wash, but if I do an upside down french braid in newly washed hair, IŽll wake up with some great volume the next day. If sheŽs not into braidwaves, a bun on top of the head would do too.

torrilin
April 26th, 2014, 07:58 AM
If your mom is used to heat, ripping through tangles, and so on, her apparent volume is probably not the same as her full potential. My mom has always thought that her hair needed perms and a short cut and and and to look good. And well, I got my hair from her. It's ridiculously fine, and very fragile and it splits very easily. But it's a very solid ii thickness, it grows fast and it's a pretty brownish blondish reddish color that picks up all kinds of highlights from sun and looks fantastic in French braids. My mom has been trying growing hers out, and it looks pretty much the same as mine.

Mom's hair has the same potential as mine. Her maximum volume might be less than mine since she's in her 60s and not in the best health, but it's not like she's anywhere close to bald.

Chances are your mom's hair is not as thin as she thinks. We're always our own worst critics.

LauraLongLocks
April 26th, 2014, 10:10 AM
You are welcome to show your mother my hair photos. If you wish I could email some to you, though I am a iii and F. Tell her many fineys grow long hair! Thank you for sending me the pics. I hope it'll give her some inspiration.


My attempts at suggestions would be..
Try some large heatless rollers to give volume at the roots. I wear them for 15min before going out and notice a good difference.
Maybe let her try a sample of your EDEN. The hydrolyzed protein in that one always makes my hair feel more substantial also.
Teach her to dutch braid or twist the bangs and sides so it looks like she is wearing an updo.
Dry shampoo may give some texture at roots.
A cassia treatment to see if it makes hair appear thicker. Great suggestions, Erin. Thank you. I'll pass them along to her.


I know you wrote her hair is pretty short as of today, but I have a volume- tips worth giving a go for when its a little longer. My F/ii hair lies very flat against my scalp too if I dont do anything to it after a wash, but if I do an upside down french braid in newly washed hair, IŽll wake up with some great volume the next day. If sheŽs not into braidwaves, a bun on top of the head would do too. Another really great idea when her hair gets a little longer. Thanks!


If your mom is used to heat, ripping through tangles, and so on, her apparent volume is probably not the same as her full potential. My mom has always thought that her hair needed perms and a short cut and and and to look good. And well, I got my hair from her. It's ridiculously fine, and very fragile and it splits very easily. But it's a very solid ii thickness, it grows fast and it's a pretty brownish blondish reddish color that picks up all kinds of highlights from sun and looks fantastic in French braids. My mom has been trying growing hers out, and it looks pretty much the same as mine.

Mom's hair has the same potential as mine. Her maximum volume might be less than mine since she's in her 60s and not in the best health, but it's not like she's anywhere close to bald.

Chances are your mom's hair is not as thin as she thinks. We're always our own worst critics. I agree. I always thought mine was as thin as my mom's and it was really close, but since I learned more gentle detangling methods and care for it better, I now have a 9-9.5 cm ponytail circumference and only a little taper in my braid where the last of my layers thin it out.

LauraLongLocks
April 27th, 2014, 07:36 PM
Message from my mom...

Laura,

Please sincerely thank all your hair friends for their kind words and suggestions. And thanks to you too for all your help and kind words. I'll be referring back to these messages from time to time. Hope your day is filled with love.

MoM

browneyedsusan
April 28th, 2014, 06:39 AM
Aww!

@ Laura's mom: You're welcome! :crush:

lapushka
April 28th, 2014, 06:57 AM
Aw, that's so sweet of her!

Rosa Harris
April 28th, 2014, 08:03 AM
My hair - I have two finger sized braids when I put in pigtails. Its very fine. It's thin.
I only finger comb to prevent damage - fine hair is super-fragile stuff. Never use rubber bands of put any tight traction on the hair.
I agree with the sleep cap idea. I think if it falls off - my problem - sewing some soft elastic as a chin strap is great and sleeping with it over the eyes and ears.
This is where I have gotten to now - if I can I know she can :) It looks thicker fluffed up curly girl, I know.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7317/13990452172_2842a87503_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/njhJ1C)damflintriver 015 copy (https://flic.kr/p/njhJ1C) by rosarl13 (https://www.flickr.com/people/121893704@N04/), on Flickr

rags
April 28th, 2014, 08:23 AM
I'm a 1c/2a/F/i thickness. My pony is 1.75". At her length, one thing she can do for volume if she air dries is to get some of those teeny tiny jaw clips and clip them at the roots. Make sure to move them. Around a time or two if you can (mine dried so very fast at that length).

My hair before the hairdresser debacle: http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv18/raggsj38/hair%20photos/023381x500.jpg (http://s665.photobucket.com/user/raggsj38/media/hair%20photos/023381x500.jpg.html)

Updo (a tip- wider forks make your bun look much bigger! )


http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv18/raggsj38/hair%20photos/014500x3752.jpg (http://s665.photobucket.com/user/raggsj38/media/hair%20photos/014500x3752.jpg.html)

Henna Girl
April 28th, 2014, 08:26 AM
I have fine slippery hair, that even with all its thickness has the tendency to stick to my head if I use coney conditioners and sls shampoos. Using shampoo bars instead of regular shampoo helped tame the flyaway hairs and stopped my hair being super slippery and flat. Now it has much more texture and can hold itself up in an updo. I also suggest that she takes some vitamins for hair health and hair growth. Good luck and happy growing :)

Savvyhorsez
April 28th, 2014, 07:19 PM
:) Hair up: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9630&d=1394243638
Hair down: http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9249&d=1392599098

LauraLongLocks
April 28th, 2014, 08:01 PM
Thank you for all the photographs. I emailed them to my mom. I think she will be amazed at how great long thin/fine hair can be.