Please diagnose my hair problem

[Arwenlily]

Hello everyone! :waving:

I need some help. I have been having major hair problems ever since I attempted to begin a healthier "hair life style". I started out by trying to do the curly girl method and had my try at cone-free co-washing. Which only made my hair over-conditioned and overly soft. I did like the fact that my frizz level was down but I knew there was something wrong when my hair wasn't curling like it used to. This is when I tried to used more protein-based conditioners which only made my hair sticky and dirty looking. Then I attempted to shampoo with a sulfate-free, oil based shampoo and condition with a cone-free conditioner ... hair is still too soft and lacking in volume. I even tried to clarify followed by minimal conditioning but hair was still too soft though the curl did come back.

Please diagnose these problems:


increased hair breakage (never happened before recently)
slightly more shed hair
hair feels less thick than it used to
hair is almost instantly dry out of the shower (dry in the sense that it is no longer wet and touchably dry in texture) but then becomes overly soft once completely dry
overly soft hair
less curl


Important background info:
Last dyed hair in April of 2013, Last trimmed hair in July of 2013, hard shower water


Thank for any help

[Firefox7275]

When did you last clarify (remove product build up) and chelate (remove mineral build up)?

Silicones are not the only thing that can build up: so can waxes including cetyl esters, butters, some polyquats, hydrolysed protein, minerals from hard water. Protein is not the solution to conditioner build up, that's like putting make up on a dirty face. Remove build up and start from a clean base.

Your hair properties (coarseness, porosity, elasticity) are relevant in choosing ingredients and products. You likely have two different hair types: higher porosity/ lower elasticity dyed hair and low to normal porosity/ high to normal elasticity virgin hair. Low porosity hair easily suffers build up and often doesn't do well with co-washing or oils/ butters. Coarse hair tends not to like much or any hydrolysed protein.

Dew points/ humidity is relevant: some parts of the US has been negative this winter, many have lost curl. In low dews humectants can dehydrate hair: glycerin, propylene glycol, honey, and to a lesser extent aloe, hydrolysed protein, panthenol. Many report hair likes less or no protein in winter even without polar vortex and negative dews.

Without knowing all the ingredients of all the products you have used recently its impossible to be more specific but HTH.

[walterSCAN]

Hello everyone! :waving:

I need some help. I have been having major hair problems ever since I attempted to begin a healthier "hair life style". I started out by trying to do the curly girl method and had my try at cone-free co-washing. Which only made my hair over-conditioned and overly soft. I did like the fact that my frizz level was down but I knew there was something wrong when my hair wasn't curling like it used to. This is when I tried to used more protein-based conditioners which only made my hair sticky and dirty looking. Then I attempted to shampoo with a sulfate-free, oil based shampoo and condition with a cone-free conditioner ... hair is still too soft and lacking in volume. I even tried to clarify followed by minimal conditioning but hair was still too soft though the curl did come back.

Please diagnose these problems:


increased hair breakage (never happened before recently)
slightly more shed hair
hair feels less thick than it used to
hair is almost instantly dry out of the shower (dry in the sense that it is no longer wet and touchably dry in texture) but then becomes overly soft once completely dry
overly soft hair
less curl


Important background info:
Last dyed hair in April of 2013, Last trimmed hair in July of 2013, hard shower water


Thank for any help

Others will have to help you with a more thorough diagnosis, though Firefox brings up good points, but the bullet point I bolded above sounds like really high porosity to me, as does the increased breakage. Sorry, I don't have any advice for that issue, as it isn't something I've dealt with, but I do want to wish you luck in figuring out your hair problems! :flower:

Oh, I had another thought-- I think I know what you mean when you say 'overly soft' hair, but it might help if you could elaborate on that a little. Do you mean it feels sort of 'mushy' or too elastic? That it feels super fragile, like cobwebs? Or do you mean something else?

[Arwenlily]

When did you last clarify (remove product build up) and chelate (remove mineral build up)?

Silicones are not the only thing that can build up: so can waxes including cetyl esters, butters, some polyquats, hydrolysed protein, minerals from hard water. Protein is not the solution to conditioner build up, that's like putting make up on a dirty face. Remove build up and start from a clean base.

Your hair properties (coarseness, porosity, elasticity) are relevant in choosing ingredients and products. You likely have two different hair ytypes: higher porosity/ lower elasticity dyed hair and low to normal porosity/ high to normal elasticity virgin hair. Low porosity hair easily suffers build up and often doesn't do well with co-washing or oils/ butters. Coarse hair tends not to like much or any hydrolysed protein.

Dew points/ humidity is relevant: some parts of the US has been negative this winter, many have lost curl. In low dews humectants can dehydrate hair: glycerin, propylene glycol, honey, and to a lesser extent aloe, hydrolysed protein, panthenol. Many report hair likes less or no protein in winter even without polar vortex and negative dews.

Without knowing all the ingredients of all the products you have used recently its impossible to be more specific but HTH.

The last time I clarified my hair was last week so I don't think I have build up but I could be wrong.

[Arwenlily]

Others will have to help you with a more thorough diagnosis, though Firefox brings up good points, but the bullet point I bolded above sounds like really high porosity to me, as does the increased breakage. Sorry, I don't have any advice for that issue, as it isn't something I've dealt with, but I do want to wish you luck in figuring out your hair problems! :flower:

Oh, I had another thought-- I think I know what you mean when you say 'overly soft' hair, but it might help if you could elaborate on that a little. Do you mean it feels sort of 'mushy' or too elastic? That it feels super fragile, like cobwebs? Or do you mean something else?

I never thought of my hair as high porosity ... maybe my ends but my hair has grown out a pretty decent amount so most of my hair is likely virgin. Is it possible for virgin had to be highly porous? Also, when I rub my finger up and down a strand of hair it feels very smooth, not lifted. And it usually takes a while to absorb anything so that made me think low porosity.

To clarify, when I say overly soft I don't mean mushy. I also don't think my hair has low elasticity or high elasticity because when my hair is wet it slightly stretches but them bounces back. But when my hair dries it is touchably very soft.

[Kherome]

Clarifying is not chelating. When did you last chelate?

[Arwenlily]

Clarifying is not chelating. When did you last chelate?
About 3 weeks ago. But after that my elasticity was really high so I've been afraid to try again. Does chelating cause elasticity problems?

[Firefox7275]

Those DIY tests for porosity are junk science, consider hair behaviour or have an analysis (Goosefootprints on Etsy). Most conditioner ingredients don't penetrate hair anyway.

I still don't really understand 'overly soft', maybe you are just getting used to feeling healthy, well conditioned virgin hair? Are you sure your hair is medium/ coarse? People sometimes mistake damage or build up for coarseness.

Unless you get into product ingredients we are just stabbing in the dark here not 'diagnosing' anything. We are already guessing at properties and your weather conditions.

[Arwenlily]

Those DIY tests for porosity are junk science, consider hair behaviour or have an analysis (Goosefootprints on Etsy). Most conditioner ingredients don't penetrate hair anyway.

I still don't really understand 'overly soft', maybe you are just getting used to feeling healthy, well conditioned virgin hair? Are you sure your hair is medium/ coarse? People sometimes mistake damage or build up for coarseness.

Unless you get into product ingredients we are just stabbing in the dark here not 'diagnosing' anything. We are already guessing at properties and your weather conditions.

I've been planning on getting a hair analysis for some time now ... I really just need to do it already. I will help with all of this guessing. I could definitely be wrong about the coarseness of my hair. It may very well be medium .... I'm not sure :( I have to have that analysis done.

Here are the products I've used this past week:

Neutrogena Anti-Residue shampoo:
Water, Sodium Laureth Sulfate, Sodium Chloride, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Glycerin, PEG-40 Hydrogenated Castor Oil, Citric Acid, DMDM Hydantoin, Fragrance

Suave Naturals Tropical Coconut:
Water (Aqua), Cetyl Alcohol, Stearamidopropyl Diethylamine, Lactic Acid, Potassium Chloride, Fragrance (Parfum), Disodium EDTA, PeG-150 Distearate, 2-Bromo-2-Nitropropane-1,3-Diol, Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Methylisothiazolinone, Propylene Gylcol, Tocopheryl Acetate [Vitamin E Acetate], Silk Amino Acids, Honey, Nettle (Urtica Dioica) Extract, Rosemary (Rosemarinus Officinalis) Extract, Coconut (Cocos Nucifera) Fruit Extract.

Sevi Vegan Pumpkin Seed Shampoo:
Aloe Vera Leaf Juice, Infusions of *Nettle, *Yucca, *Marshmallow Root, *Burdock Root, *Rosemary, *Horsetail and *Flaxseed, Decyl Glucoside, *Pumpkin Seed Oil, *Avocado Oil, *Babassu Oil, Guar Hyroxypropyltrimonium Chloride, *Sage Extract, *(f)Nilotica Shea Butter, *Sea Buckthorn Berry CO2, Pure Essential Oils (*Patchouli, *Cedarwood, *Lavender, *Rosemary **Myrrh), Gluconolactone, Sodium Benzoate.

[ErinLeigh]

Which of these sound like your hair?

Low Porosity
Low porosity hair has a tightly-bound cuticle that does not easily absorb foreign materials. An advantage to low porosity hair is that it is usually glossy, particularly if the hair is dark. Low porosity hair is also known to be strong and healthy. A disadvantage of low porosity hair is that it is difficult to process -- the hair's shaft is not as receptive to hair dyes and straightening chemicals, for example. If low porosity becomes dry or damaged for any reason, it will be more difficult for it to absorb deep conditioning products.

High Porosity
Highly porous hair is a result of chemical damage from coloring, straightening and perms. Hair of this type absorbs much more water than hair of average porosity -- up to over 50 percent of water by weight. This can be beneficial for absorption of conditioning products, but it also has disadvantages. Hair with high porosity easily takes in water from the atmosphere, which can lead to excessive frizziness, especially on humid days.

And by soft, do you mean stretchy?, Or just extra bunny fur soft to the touch where a curl slides right out?

The shampoo has shea, oils, and aloe all which may sit on the hair if you are low porosity. Maybe that is why when you used protein it felt sticky and dirty, or did you try the protein right after the clarify wash? If so I am stumped unless the clarify wash didn't remove everything and needs done again, or if there is mineral buildup you could try a clarify/chelate combo shampoo. For a Drugstore one I find Ultra swim works good enough. It does have sulfates though. There is also Joico, Redken, Itely or many other combo chelate/clarify ones. The Itely is sulfate free, not sure about the others.

Hope you get some help figuring this out. I don't know much about science of hair. I just tend to switch products when my hair starts to react strangely. I know enough to know when I need protein, moisture, or when something is building up but aside from that for me unfortunately it is guesswork and experimenting. Knowing why would go much further as then you can figure out what ingredients in products you should buy/avoid so hopefully you get pointed in the right direction thru research or assistance here.

[Arwenlily]

Which of these sound like your hair?

Low Porosity
Low porosity hair has a tightly-bound cuticle that does not easily absorb foreign materials. An advantage to low porosity hair is that it is usually glossy, particularly if the hair is dark. Low porosity hair is also known to be strong and healthy. A disadvantage of low porosity hair is that it is difficult to process -- the hair's shaft is not as receptive to hair dyes and straightening chemicals, for example. If low porosity becomes dry or damaged for any reason, it will be more difficult for it to absorb deep conditioning products.

High Porosity
Highly porous hair is a result of chemical damage from coloring, straightening and perms. Hair of this type absorbs much more water than hair of average porosity -- up to over 50 percent of water by weight. This can be beneficial for absorption of conditioning products, but it also has disadvantages. Hair with high porosity easily takes in water from the atmosphere, which can lead to excessive frizziness, especially on humid days.

And by soft, do you mean stretchy?, Or just extra bunny fur soft to the touch where a curl slides right out?

The shampoo has shea, oils, and aloe all which may sit on the hair if you are low porosity. Maybe that is why when you used protein it felt sticky and dirty, or did you try the protein right after the clarify wash? If so I am stumped unless the clarify wash didn't remove everything and needs done again, or if there is mineral buildup you could try a clarify/chelate combo shampoo. For a Drugstore one I find Ultra swim works good enough. It does have sulfates though. There is also Joico, Redken, Itely or many other combo chelate/clarify ones. The Itely is sulfate free, not sure about the others.

Hope you get some help figuring this out. I don't know much about science of hair. I just tend to switch products when my hair starts to react strangely. I know enough to know when I need protein, moisture, or when something is building up but aside from that for me unfortunately it is guesswork and experimenting. Knowing why would go much further as then you can figure out what ingredients in products you should buy/avoid so hopefully you get pointed in the right direction thru research or assistance here.

My hair "sounds" like low porosity but like Firefox said, I'm really just going to have to get a hair analysis done to find out. It just seems like everything just sits on the top of my hair. By overly soft I don't mean mushy, I guess like bunny soft like you said.

[Stormynights]

Where are you going to have your hair analysis done?

[Arwenlily]

Where are you going to have your hair analysis done?

I'm thinking Goosefootprints from Etsy. I've heard really great things about it. Now for the fun part ... collecting the hair