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View Full Version : Fuzzy/Undefined curls?



Saryn Jumail
January 22nd, 2014, 02:54 PM
So I've noticed that while my curls are nice, they are usually very fuzzy/undefined. I don't have much clumping at all.

http://i.imgur.com/LWSiBo9.jpg (http://imgur.com/LWSiBo9)
http://i.imgur.com/SkjgDBB.jpg (http://imgur.com/SkjgDBB)
http://i.imgur.com/NuK8F5Q.jpg (http://imgur.com/NuK8F5Q)


I wash my hair with a Suave conditioner and then use Shea Moisture Shea Butter Moisture Retention Shampoo (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0038TVHGG/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=B0038TVHGG&linkCode=as2&tag=dormroomcurly-20), and then I use a leave in (As I Am leave in conditioner), a small amount of olive oil, and then Shea Moisture Curl Enhancing Smoothie as a gel.

Is there something I should be doing to encourage my curls to clump together more?

molljo
January 22nd, 2014, 03:13 PM
What's your drying routine like? That is, when you're applying your products (which look good), is your hair damp or sopping? I've found that the wetter my hair is, the better the clump (I'm a wavy, but I'm thinking this should also apply to curlies). Have you experimented with plopping at all?

For what it's worth, I think your hair is lovely as it is!

ejking2
January 22nd, 2014, 04:00 PM
Is there a reason why you use shampoo after conditioner? Have you tried switching the order of your products or omitting the shampoo completely? Perhaps you first need to clarify with a sulfate shampoo.

MissHoney
January 22nd, 2014, 04:43 PM
My hair does exactly that. This is why I have such a hard time styling it curly. It's like they clump nothing but clump all together at the same time. I very rarely get my hair to clump naturally from root to tip. I even make sure my hair is very wet and avoid combing before I let it dry. :confused:

walterSCAN
January 22nd, 2014, 05:22 PM
You didn't say what your 'styling'/ detangling routine is-- are you detangling in the shower, etc? What do you do with, and when? Have you tried plopping? I have zero curl-care experience, but I tend to read all the curly threads because I wish I did, and I see plopping recommended frequently to help curly hair clump.

Your hair is quite gorgeous, by the way! :crush:

Firefox7275
January 22nd, 2014, 05:45 PM
Way more of a true leave in conditioner - by which I mean rich in the major emollients (fatty alcohols and/ or cationic surfactants). These along with plenty of water aid clumping and frizz control, oils cause stringiness not clumping for many. Then a styling cream known for its clumping and frizz control properties.

Your routine sounds heavy on oils and butters. Oftentimes people use these type of products too sparingly to avoid weighing the hair down or causing the greasies, instead of liberally as recommended in both the Curly Girl and Tightly Curly methods.

jeanniet
January 22nd, 2014, 06:05 PM
More information on exactly how you apply product would be helpful, but in general I'd say:

1) detangle in shower before applying leave in
2) skip the shampoo unless you need it for some reason
3) apply product to sopping wet hair
4) use plenty of leave in (for your hair, I'd guess a good tablespoon if not more)
5) I'd skip the oil, since the smoothie will act as a sealer
6) possibly consider using a little hard hold gel over the smoothie
7) definitely trying plopping

My curl pattern isn't as tight as yours, but I get very good clumps from conditioner-only styling (leave in). They tend to frizz out without the addition of a very small amount of the smoothie (like 1/4 tsp.) and then an equal amount of a hard-hold gel on top. If I was washing daily or every other day I could probably get away with just the leave in or maybe a little smoothie added, but since I try to go three days I need the gel on top to keep things together a little longer. My curls actually tend to get clumpier as the days go by, but on the surface they get fuzzy.

Saryn Jumail
January 23rd, 2014, 06:31 PM
What's your drying routine like? That is, when you're applying your products (which look good), is your hair damp or sopping? I've found that the wetter my hair is, the better the clump (I'm a wavy, but I'm thinking this should also apply to curlies). Have you experimented with plopping at all?

For what it's worth, I think your hair is lovely as it is!

Thank you so much! I try to leave my hair as wet as I can when I apply products (I put in the leave in before I get out of the shower). I also do plopping when I have time, but I haven't noticed too much of a difference with the results.

Saryn Jumail
January 23rd, 2014, 06:32 PM
Is there a reason why you use shampoo after conditioner? Have you tried switching the order of your products or omitting the shampoo completely? Perhaps you first need to clarify with a sulfate shampoo.

My mistake - The shampoo that I linked is not actually what I use - I use the conditioner of that brand. I just for some reason linked the shampoo instead.
I clarified with a sulfate shampoo about a month ago, and since then I've been using a sulfate-free shampoo to clarify about once a week.

Saryn Jumail
January 23rd, 2014, 06:34 PM
You didn't say what your 'styling'/ detangling routine is-- are you detangling in the shower, etc? What do you do with, and when? Have you tried plopping? I have zero curl-care experience, but I tend to read all the curly threads because I wish I did, and I see plopping recommended frequently to help curly hair clump.

Your hair is quite gorgeous, by the way! :crush:

I only ever detangle in the shower, when my hair is covered in conditioner, and I only ever use my fingers. I don't see much of a difference with plopping.
Thanks! You're lucky - while I love my curls, I always feel like it would be much easier to deal with straight hair! Of course, that's only because I don't have it. I'm sure if I did I would love to have curly hair!

walterSCAN
January 23rd, 2014, 06:52 PM
I only ever detangle in the shower, when my hair is covered in conditioner, and I only ever use my fingers. I don't see much of a difference with plopping.
Thanks! You're lucky - while I love my curls, I always feel like it would be much easier to deal with straight hair! Of course, that's only because I don't have it. I'm sure if I did I would love to have curly hair!

3a/3b hair is my dream-hair. I feel like curls look nicer on me than straight hair, but they are SO much work! I think we should be able to trade for a couple years... :hmm: Then we could trade back if we wanted! ;)

lapushka
January 24th, 2014, 05:25 AM
You could try the LOC method for styling, if you don't already:
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=118167&highlight=method

CurlyCap
January 24th, 2014, 08:20 PM
My routine is in my blog. Based on your number of posts, you should be able to read it. It's far more eloquent than anything I can write here and may give you ideas to play around with.

But general thoughts:
1. TOO MUCH SHAMPOOING. Lol. I hate shampoo and many curlies do too. Only shampoo when you've tried everything else and there is no way around it. Then first try an SLS-free shampoo. If that doesn't work...then go for the clarifying shampoo. I shampoo like once every 3-4 months. Really. Shampoo is super dryiing and it takes like a week to recover from it.

2. Skip the oil. Trade the Shea Moisturizing Gel for a leave-in conditioner.
Oil is fantastic for curly hair, but I find that it doesn't add much in terms of improving the daily style. Rather, when used regularly (either a little bit every day or a treatment every week(s)), it adds a flexibility to the hair. I think of oily my hair like oiling a wood table. It just keeps things in good shape over the long term. And the gel...sigh. I like Shea Moisture products but they just have never matched a true conditioner or leave-in conditioner for me. They are too expensive to use tons of (which you may need to do) and don't have a high enough water content/fatty alcohol content to make the curls truly bouncy happy.

So here's what I propose as an experiment:
1. Co-wash your hair with Suave.
2. Rinse out conditioner.
3. While hair is soaking wet, add more Suave conditioner. Like the same amount you use to co-wash but avoiding the scalp.
4. Comb the conditioner through your hair with a wide-toothed comb. This will promote clumping.
5. Get out of shower. Don't touch hair until it's 100% dry. Don't curse too loudly as you make a soaking mess of all your clothes. Warning: This part may take HOURS.

This won't be the sexiest thing ever, and it won't be a long-term hair routine....but I think it will tell you how much curl definition you can get out of your hair. Then the trick will be to figure out 1)How little leave-in you can get away with 2)How much touching and drying you can get away with after you get out of the shower and 3)Whether adding oils to your daily routine actually helps with styling.

Hope that helps.

Post pictures of your experiments! We LOVE pictures!

night owl
January 24th, 2014, 08:35 PM
My hair is pretty similar, so I'm going to lurk on your thread if you don't mind. :)

Right now I'm figuring things out again after having used too-alkaline shampoo bars for a long time. I love the Shea Moisture styling milk! Just got it, though, so haven't reached a conclusion. I used to use super-hard gel and get mega curls, but I washed daily then, too. Can't co-wash because conditioner on my scalp is a disaster. I sorta do plopping with a t-shirt. If you wrap your hair for drying, maybe try using a t-shirt to see if your towel is a culprit?

Covet
January 25th, 2014, 04:05 AM
I agree with CurlyCap and jeanniet. I only shampoo when I need it and apply products to sopping hair (tresemme naturals as a leave in and flax seed gel over that). I then apply a small amount of shea butter, coconut oil and jojoba but my hair is extremely dry and can tolerate frequent oilings. Do you comb the product through your hair? I find that soaked hair provides sufficient clumps for me and I just smooth the products on. Maybe raking them through your hair (if you do) isn't helping.
Do you condition first to detangle so shampooing will be easier? Maybe try CWC. Otherwise you should really be following the shampoo with a heavy conditioner and not a light leave in, in my opinion.

Lovely hair by the way, what's your goal length?

Saryn Jumail
January 26th, 2014, 12:06 AM
Thanks so much for all your advice! I'll definitely try some different things out, and see where that gets me.

Saryn Jumail
January 26th, 2014, 12:08 AM
Lovely hair by the way, what's your goal length?

Thank you so much! I really love your hair; I wish my curls were as tight as yours!
I'm not sure about a goal length. I'm going to take it in steps - right now I'm just trying to get past APL unstretched! It's taking forever, haha, mainly because I usually give up and go back to straightening :/

Covet
January 26th, 2014, 03:09 PM
Thank you so much! I really love your hair; I wish my curls were as tight as yours!
I'm not sure about a goal length. I'm going to take it in steps - right now I'm just trying to get past APL unstretched! It's taking forever, haha, mainly because I usually give up and go back to straightening :/

Thank you, sometimes I wish my hair was fully wavy (as opposed to maybe the 30% wave that I've got going on) because I bet it would be a walk in the park to care for!

I suppose straightening isn't going to help the growth because your hair will end up damaged from the heat with a higher chance of breakage. Try to hold out! :) maybe straightening it is what's causing the lack of clumps. My friend has lost almost all her curls due to straightening.

Saryn Jumail
January 26th, 2014, 09:29 PM
Thank you, sometimes I wish my hair was fully wavy (as opposed to maybe the 30% wave that I've got going on) because I bet it would be a walk in the park to care for!

I suppose straightening isn't going to help the growth because your hair will end up damaged from the heat with a higher chance of breakage. Try to hold out! :) maybe straightening it is what's causing the lack of clumps. My friend has lost almost all her curls due to straightening.

I think I've only straightened it about four times in the last two years, so I've been doing pretty good. But I haven't been taking very good care of it - I used to just leave it in a weird ponytail on the top of my head for days on end, and then untangle the crap out of it in the shower every few days. But I'm trying now, and hopefully it'll start to like me again! I was at a conference and didn't shower yesterday and I got some nice dreadlocks going on near the nape of my neck, haha.