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View Full Version : Difference between shampoo bars that have saponified oil and those that dont?



glitterbug
November 9th, 2013, 03:29 PM
Hi all,

I have been looking at a few shampoo bar/soaps and some have 'saponified oils' whearas some done, does this have a particular advantage or downfall? Lastly will any of these oils clog the hair follicles?

soap 1)

COCONUT OIL, CASTOR OIL, OLIVE OIL, PALM OIL, RAPESEED OIL, GRAPESEED OIL,
COCOA BUTTER, SHEA BUTTER, JOJOBA OIL, FRESH COFFEE, MAY CHANG, CINNAMON, CLOVE &

SWEET ORANGE ESSENTIAL OILS

soap2) Ingredients: saponified oils of unrefined shea nut butter; olive; coconut; babassu; castor bean; almond; and jojoba; coffee; rosemary oil extract; and essential oils of lavender; ylang ylang; vanilla and cassia.

sisi33
November 9th, 2013, 03:43 PM
First off, you cannot have cold or hot process soap without lye. Lye combined with oils makes sponification occur. So that first one is actually leaving out the lye, which I dislike on principle. If you're going to put ingredients up, why aren't you putting them all up? Don't worry about the lye though- it all gets used up during the soap-making process. You CANNOT have true soap without lye.

Second, Those both look like pretty heavy mixes, and your hair might have problems with them. Number one seems to be the lighter of the two, but I dislike having palm in soap, for ethical reasons. Other than that, the both look decent enough! But the shea as the second ingredient for the second one is really odd- shea is so heavy, and makes a soft soap in my experience.

glitterbug
November 9th, 2013, 03:49 PM
First off, you cannot have cold or hot process soap without lye. Lye combined with oils makes sponification occur. So that first one is actually leaving out the lye, which I dislike on principle. If you're going to put ingredients up, why aren't you putting them all up? Don't worry about the lye though- it all gets used up during the soap-making process. You CANNOT have true soap without lye.

Second, Those both look like pretty heavy mixes, and your hair might have problems with them. Number one seems to be the lighter of the two, but I dislike having palm in soap, for ethical reasons. Other than that, the both look decent enough! But the shea as the second ingredient for the second one is really odd- shea is so heavy, and makes a soft soap in my experience.

Thanks for the reply, which one would you reccomend then? Does the first one have saponified oil in it too? I live in a hard water area, and I want to give a shot at using these.

Sillage
November 9th, 2013, 08:29 PM
Glitterbug, in order to be soap, the oils must be saponified. So yes, soap #1 has saponified oils-- otherwise you'd be getting a bottle full of oil and coffee!

I thought this thread was going to be about syndet bars vs. soap :o

florenonite
November 10th, 2013, 04:10 AM
First off, you cannot have cold or hot process soap without lye. Lye combined with oils makes sponification occur. So that first one is actually leaving out the lye, which I dislike on principle. If you're going to put ingredients up, why aren't you putting them all up? Don't worry about the lye though- it all gets used up during the soap-making process. You CANNOT have true soap without lye.


I assume they left it out because, as you said, it's used up and not in the finished product. Don't know why they wouldn't list the oils as being saponified, though.

Any kind of soap is going to have something saponified because, well, saponifying is the process of converting a fat/oil into soap :p The only shampoo bars without saponification are the ones like LUSH's, which have sulfates and are no different for hair than liquid shampoos.

Sillage
November 10th, 2013, 04:32 AM
I assume they left it out because, as you said, it's used up and not in the finished product. Don't know why they wouldn't list the oils as being saponified, though.


That's a mystery because if they are going to use that kind of logic for the lye, and leave it out because it's not in the final product, why not do the same for the oils (which should all be saponified into soap unless the bar is superfatted)?

Flor
November 10th, 2013, 05:59 AM
First list of ingredients is either not copied in full or purposely omits lye (some people freak out when they read in the list of soap ingredients). It's either "Oil + Lye" or the product of mixing the two together "Saponified Oil". There's no other way around it.

You have to try several to see which one works best for you. Even in same shop (Etsy, I presume?) soaps vary, depends on proportions used and essencial oils or herbs added.

kdaniels8811
November 10th, 2013, 07:46 AM
IMHO, shampoo bars should be simple, no need for all those oils. Mine contains avocado, castor, olive, and a smidge of shea for conditioning. And lye, of course. It is the only bar that works on my fine thin hair. You will have to experiment to find one that works for you and having hard water makes it more difficult though a vinegar rinse does help. Good luck with your search.

glitterbug
November 10th, 2013, 01:03 PM
That's a mystery because if they are going to use that kind of logic for the lye, and leave it out because it's not in the final product, why not do the same for the oils (which should all be saponified into soap unless the bar is superfatted)?

Thanks for the reply, what should I look for in a shampoo bar? As in ingredients, what oils are not too heavy? Could you give me some advice? Thanks

glitterbug
November 10th, 2013, 01:04 PM
First list of ingredients is either not copied in full or purposely omits lye (some people freak out when they read in the list of soap ingredients). It's either "Oil + Lye" or the product of mixing the two together "Saponified Oil". There's no other way around it.

You have to try several to see which one works best for you. Even in same shop (Etsy, I presume?) soaps vary, depends on proportions used and essencial oils or herbs added.

Thanks, but which ingredients shall I look for?

Tail Feathers
November 10th, 2013, 01:24 PM
I have been using (for a few years now, and with excellent results) syrian 'aleppo soap'-
it is very simple -- with "olea europaea oil, Laurus nobilis extract, Sodium Hydroxide and Sodium Chloride.

but...
I use Very little,
and only once per week

I just ordered, from mehandi, an amla shampoo bar.... more out of curiosity than anything else....

I'm curious to read any advice on this thread. Thanks for starting it and good luck !

Flor
November 10th, 2013, 01:55 PM
Thanks, but which ingredients shall I look for?

When I first got into shampoo bars, I just bought whatever sounded better to me. I ended up trying every shampoo bar from this one shop I liked (they carry 5 varieties) and I settled on one that I liked best for most washes and another that gave me more of a clarified shampoo result to be used occasionally. I didn't need a transition period with shampoo bars, I could tell from one use if it's the right kind for me or not. Some made my hair feel heavier and fuller (in a good way), others made it really soft (too soft, since my hair is already very silky). With some I could go 2 days between washes, with others it's 4. It's all individual, depends on what are your hair qualities, what you're looking to archive and even your water hardness and rinsing method play into it. A lot of shops offer samples, might be the best bet?

Sillage
November 10th, 2013, 02:30 PM
Thanks for the reply, what should I look for in a shampoo bar? As in ingredients, what oils are not too heavy? Could you give me some advice? Thanks

I don't use shampoo soap because I think the pH is too high. But if I were to go with one, I'd probably go with one of the tried and true vendors like Chagrin Vally (http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandsalve.com/products/for-the-hair/shampoo-bars/). People seem to like them and they also offer sample sizes.