faster way to Henna?

[Ohio Sky]

I absolutely love the idea of being able to keep my black locks without chemical dyes.
The problem is, I recently took on a second (or 3rd) job... an extension of my first job, lets put it that way... where Im on call. And if I get called, I have to go, NOW. No time to wash out henna mess. I want to continue to henna, but the chances of me getting a call in any 8-hour period (I two-step) are very high. I just dont know what to do.
Does anyone have any suggestions? Maybe if I could speed up the process, it would at least minimize the risk of me getting called in the middle. :confused:

[Nightshade]

Hopefully one of our henndigo heads will be along shortly, but a few ideas:

you could prepare the henna paste in advance so you're not waiting for that to dye release, then take it out and thaw it when you're ready
you could henna in one session, and henndigo in another a day apart, and from what I've read it should take just as well.

[prosperina]

You're on call seven days a week? Eww... that's no fun. Do you get any color out of the Lush caca Noir? That would be at least a one step application. And, can you sleep in your henna/indigo? 8 hours is about how long you should sleep ;)

I dunnoh. I'm just throwing ideas around.

[Ohio Sky]

I havent used caca noir, or any Lush hennas. Ive only ever used BAQ from Catherine. From what Ive heard of Lush, it may not be enough color for my mousy brown hair to turn black.
Cant do henna overnight, as theres more chance of me getting called at 2 in the morning than during the day.
If I do two step on seperate days, it would be a week apart as I work 9-5 monday through Friday. How well would that work?
Huff.
Thanks for the ideas, guys ;)

[mellie]

They aren't as strong a color as henna, but you could do tea rinses (some you can just leave in, too). I started doing red raspberry leaf leave-in rinses as an alternative to henna when I'm pressed for time too. Of course, it's not as strong, but it's something!

[akurah]

Caca noir is a PAIN IN THE ASS and you're better off going to Catherine's Henna For Hair website and looking up a one-step henndigo recipe.

[spidermom]

How about as soon as you get home from work?

[wintersun99]

I think that pre-making the henna and freezing amts. ahead of time, then using at night while you sleep - would be the most convenient, I assume you don't have to be on call then? unfortunately, you can't freeze indigo though as it will demise.

[tiny_teesha]

I have an excellent idea! Sleep with it in! Are you on night shift? If not just make sure there is a towel in case some leaks out and when you wake up to the mermaid soak and CO which helps get it out pretty fast, and then if you haven't been called indigo- or if you want wake up that bit early (say they can never call you at 6am) and make sure it is all done by then, then sleep again if you haven't been called?
Just an idea! Or you can do the indigo the night after?

[iris]

You can use heat to speed up the process, both for henna and for indigo. The hotter you can get the mud (without burning yourself of course), the better. You can get these drying cap things that work pretty well. Make sure to rinse the mud out with cold/cool water, especially the indigo.

Iris

[khyricat]

another option- I made a hat that I wear over my henna. it looks funky, but decent, and I have gone out even to restaurants wearing it and never had a comment. it keeps my head warmer (its polarfleece) and thus speeds up and intensifies the henna color process for me anyway when I am in a cool house... could you do soemthing like this at work?

[Kirin]

not clear if your doing a one step hendigo or henna then indigo application, but heres my two cents:

Make up the henna, dye release then freeze it in a tupperware, thats what i do. i never know when a time slot will open up to henna, so i always have it ready. To defrost, float the tupperware in another bowl filled with hot water (you may have to refill teh hot water as it gets cold), and it usually takes about 15 to 20 minutes to totally defrost to room temperature. if you hendigo, you can then mix your indigo, add it and slap it on, wrap it, and apply heat by warming towels in a microwave, you can probably get results in 1-2 hours.

if you do a two step, you can henna one day, and indigo the next, from what i understand indigo will take over henna'd hair wether its an hour or a week after application.

[Anje]

It doesn't work for indigo, but I make henna cubes, which are great for doing roots. I just freeze the henna paste (after dye release) in ice cube trays, then transfer to a bag when they're frozen. Pop a few in the microwave when you want to use them.

[Ohio Sky]

Thanks for all the suggestions!

Yes, I am on call at night, 24/7.

No, I cannot wear a hat to work, Im expected to be wearing slacks and some kind of proffessional updo (even at 2 am :mad:).

I guess I will just have to do it on weekends, maybe in the middle of the day, and just not leave it on as long as usual, and apply heat. Maybe a strong indigo mix will do the trick and keep away the orange.

Thanks everyone! :)

[Nightshade]

Just a thought, and I wish I had pics, but they're all on the old LHC and I can't access my photobucket account at work.

http://www.mehandi.com/shop/skinindigo/

The blue indigo they use for this is crystalized indigo and it is VERY VERY potent and dark. It's also horribly runny. You can get a sample for $1 or so, what about mixing up henna mud, then freezing it, and then mix up the crystal indigo and add that. The stuff was BLACK when I tested it, almost like raven feathers with shifting colors of green and blue in it. But that was on it's on on white mohair. I know it dyes amazingly fast, and seemed quite colorfast on the mohair.

I don't know of anyone that's done it on human hair (yet), but perhaps with some rigorous strand testing this could be the answer to your problems?

[Ohio Sky]

I have wondered about the ancient blue! On the hennaforhair forums, everyone seems to be seeking the blue sheen that indigo sometimes give (which I think is beautiful) but no one has tried this that I know of. I assumed there was a reason no one used it on hair, but perhaps I will ask at the forums there. Thanks for the idea! :flowers:

[Nightshade]

I have wondered about the ancient blue! On the hennaforhair forums, everyone seems to be seeking the blue sheen that indigo sometimes give (which I think is beautiful) but no one has tried this that I know of. I assumed there was a reason no one used it on hair, but perhaps I will ask at the forums there. Thanks for the idea! :flowers:

No problem :) I tested it on mohair, and it worked like a dream, and the hair still felt nice and soft. I didn't have enough to try mixing it with henna to see what the result would be. If you do some strand testing I would be fascinated to read the results.

[Ohio Sky]

Hm I looked at the forums and this question has already been asked over there. Cathjerines answer was "NO, NO, NO" she sayd itll "smurf"you an your entire bathroom and it way too akaline for hair.
Seems like that should still be feasable, if you dont care about the bathroom lol.

[Nightshade]

Hm I looked at the forums and this question has already been asked over there. Cathjerines answer was "NO, NO, NO" she sayd itll "smurf"you an your entire bathroom and it way too akaline for hair.
Seems like that should still be feasable, if you dont care about the bathroom lol.


It seems that Catherine is more concerned that it's messy, which it is in its current state. I think if a small batch were made (lets say like the 2TB or whatever you get in a sample) and then added to a normal dose of henna (say 100g) you'd get a thicker mixture that may stain darker really well (and won't be as alkaline due to dilution).

The smurf thing is true, to an extent. It's VERY liquidy when mixed up, but I have yet to see it blended straight in with henna powder to thicken it up. I imagine you may have a blue scalp for a day or two, but that's no different than blueblack chemical dyes.

ETA: Not trying to slam on Catherine at all, she's a great lady, however, I've found more than one thing she's claimed on her site to be wrong after testing it and seeing the test results of other members. It's a good place to start, but none of it is gospel.

[khyricat]

heh- if you are careful you can protect the bathroom!

and hrm- if you don't want a hairdryer type heat cap- well sealled and a polarfleece cap will create a good hot head for you anyway to at least help.. but good luck..

[Ohio Sky]

I think I may experiment with the blue... I just got 400g of regular indigo, too! lol I think I will place another order and see what I can do with it. Would adding lemon juice or something to it be ok to maybe cancel out some of the alkaline?

[Nightshade]

I think I may experiment with the blue... I just got 400g of regular indigo, too! lol I think I will place another order and see what I can do with it. Would adding lemon juice or something to it be ok to maybe cancel out some of the alkaline?

I would strand test in small batches. Indigo needs an alkaline enviroment to stain well, and well henna supposedly likes acid, we've found that acid inhibits henna dye release. So since you're going to be putting this on your head...strand test a few small batches of hairballs first just to check the color and quality.

Obviously if the crystalized indigo is being sold for skin, it's safe to use as far a toxicity, the only issue is what it does to hair. Alkaline substances uplift the cuticle of the hair a bit, which is why alkaline shampoos like baby shampoo are recommended to get dye out of hair. Opens the shaft a bit to let dye out. Perhaps after you're done a nice cool ACV rinse would help restore PH to the hair and close the cuticle, sealing more dye in?

[Ohio Sky]

There are a million ways to fix acidity problems, I dont think thats enough to stop me from trying this :p
I posted an inquiry at the hannaforhair forum as well and if there are no other warnings from anyone I think I will try this. I will definitely keep you all posted!

[Girltron]

The other thing is your henna doesn't need to be left in as long as normal if you're just doing roots for a 2-step. I bet with heat you could cut it down to a single hour.

Catherine's latest indigo is incredibly staining, do give it a try with short dye times and see if you find it's good enough. I have to be careful not to go totally black when I use it.

So if you henna for 1 hour with heat, then next time your schedule allows you indigo for 30 minutes with heat, I bet that'd be fine for time. Peoples' ideas about preparing and freezing your henna would definitely speed everything up. Maybe to be safe, since you're cutting down on your indigo time as well, you should mix a bit of indigo in your henna too-just to prevent washout. So a 2-step henndigo/indigo with the time frames listed above. That really ought to do the trick. And with roots only, it's pretty fast to wash out if you do get called. A whole head of henna's another matter.

[Celebrian]

I second Girltron on this one. I only Henna my grey roots for about one hour and then do Indigo for 30-60 minutes (depending on my mood!) and get a dark brown.

So, you'd probably be fine with these shorter times yourself...

Oh and I might do a refresher inbetween times of just the Indigo (I do all my Indigo's as glosses by the way. They last just as well as full strength for me. You'll always get some run-off on subsequent shampoo's with the indigo. After a few goes, it becomes permanent).

[Ohio Sky]

I second Girltron on this one. I only Henna my grey roots for about one hour and then do Indigo for 30-60 minutes (depending on my mood!) and get a dark brown.

So, you'd probably be fine with these shorter times yourself...

Oh and I might do a refresher inbetween times of just the Indigo (I do all my Indigo's as glosses by the way. They last just as well as full strength for me. You'll always get some run-off on subsequent shampoo's with the indigo. After a few goes, it becomes permanent).

Id love details on how you do your indigo gloss :) Do you just use conditioner?

[Mahars]

You could also turn it into a one-step process if you're willing to sacrifice some darkness. I use two parts indigo to one part henna and it turns my hair a very very dark brown. If you use even less henna, you may be able to achieve a soft black.

[wintersun99]

I think I may experiment with the blue... I just got 400g of regular indigo, too! lol I think I will place another order and see what I can do with it. Would adding lemon juice or something to it be ok to maybe cancel out some of the alkaline?

take a look at Catherine's response before you do this, it's on H4H. Actually, I'll paste it here for everyone...see below.

C_Cartwright_Jones
Site Admin

Re: Ancient Blue
Posted on: 03/19/2008 07:58 PM
DO NOT put Ancient Blue in your hair!
NO.
NO.
Absolutely not.
It will ruin your hair.

We got a frantic phone call from a woman who mixed up Ancient Blue and henna and left it on her daughters hair for three hours.

I remembered the order. I had emailed her and asked "are you sure Ancient Blue is what you want? Ancient Blue is only for brief (few minute) applications on skin and never for hair". No reply.

We shipped the package.

Package arrived. the Ancient Blue is packed with a CD of instructions, a paper of instructions, clearly stating that it is only for body art. She did not read the enclosed instructions.

She never read the webpage she ordered from where it clearly states that Ancient Blue is only for brief application on skin. She never read the enclosed instructions. She never read my email warning her that Ancient Blue should never be used in hair.

Daughter had totally fried black crispy hair and was refusing to ever come out of her bedroom again in her whole life.

Advice is ... DO NOT DO THIS.
end quote.

[mellie]

Yikes! That's scary!

Touching on my tea rinse idea again, since they are so convenient and quick: apparently Meadowsweet Root will give a black dye with a copper mordant. I wonder if it might give a black stain on its own?

Here is some info on it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meadowsweet

http://www.pfaf.org/database/plants.php?Filipendula+ulmaria

Next time I place an herb order, maybe I'll get some and try! :-)

[Celebrian]

Id love details on how you do your indigo gloss :) Do you just use conditioner?

Yes, I put a flat Tablespoon Indigo straight into enough cheap no'cone cond. to cover roots. If I'm doing full head, I put a heaped Tablespoon in yet more cheap no'cone conditioner.

Sometimes I mix the Indigo with just a little warmish water first prior to adding to the conditioner - but usually add it straight in, to be honest. I don't find a difference, and water first can make it too runny for me.

[Nightshade]

Yikes! That's scary!

Indeed, hence my advice to strand test. I know its anecdotal, but the mohair I tested was just for a few minutes and it was black as black can be and the texture was very soft.

Not to discredit Catherine, but it IS still anecdotal evidence, and we have no way of knowing what was in the henna it was mixed with (of course the lady on the phone will swear it's pure BAQ).

While I would obviously warn discretion and testing, I'm still interested to see/test myself on some test locks before making an assertion. I just dislike emotional claims without one shred of physical evidence.

[Mishka_84]

You could leave the henna in for a shorter amount of time... I've been hennaing my hair (no indigo) for almost two years, and have never left it in for more than 2 hours but get a great coppery/burgandy (lol, copper in the sunlight, burgandy indoors). When I only henna for an hour the color is not quite as bright, but still definately red.

You could do this one day right after your regular shift, and the next day indigo.

Good luck!

[tiny_teesha]

um, if you want black roots fast i think red rasberry leaves steeped in a mister dyes them brunette. Hibiscus dyes them dark red.
I tried it on my mum today. But it is temporary.
what do you recon? That would be good if you were in a hurry. yeh?
there is a thread started by mellie on non henna ways to dye grey hair.

[Ohio Sky]

take a look at Catherine's response before you do this, it's on H4H. Actually, I'll paste it here for everyone...see below.

C_Cartwright_Jones
Site Admin

Re: Ancient Blue
Posted on: 03/19/2008 07:58 PM
DO NOT put Ancient Blue in your hair!
NO.
NO.
Absolutely not.
It will ruin your hair.

We got a frantic phone call from a woman who mixed up Ancient Blue and henna and left it on her daughters hair for three hours.

I remembered the order. I had emailed her and asked "are you sure Ancient Blue is what you want? Ancient Blue is only for brief (few minute) applications on skin and never for hair". No reply.

We shipped the package.

Package arrived. the Ancient Blue is packed with a CD of instructions, a paper of instructions, clearly stating that it is only for body art. She did not read the enclosed instructions.

She never read the webpage she ordered from where it clearly states that Ancient Blue is only for brief application on skin. She never read the enclosed instructions. She never read my email warning her that Ancient Blue should never be used in hair.

Daughter had totally fried black crispy hair and was refusing to ever come out of her bedroom again in her whole life.

Advice is ... DO NOT DO THIS.
end quote.

Thanks for posting this. I searched the forums and everything and didnt find this, only a post by Catherine saying that the ph is very alkaline.

Im still interested in experimenting with this, but I will definitely proceed with caution. I was thinking a small amount of this added to a henna gloss may not be strong enough to fry hair, and that would lower the ph factor. If its really as strong as everyone says, that would be enough for a dark stain still. I may still order a sample to play with.

Thanks Tiny Teesha and Mellie for you tea rinse ideas. Where can you get hibiscus? I would probably have to order it online, but it may be worth a try too.

Thanks!:)

[mellie]

Ohio Sky - Re: hibiscus; I found some hibiscus flower in bulk at my local co-op grocery. If you do have to order it online, perhaps you might want to also pick up some meadowsweet, since it's supposedly a black dye. I am very eager to try it myself! :-)

Nightshade - I agree with you, I always want real evidence too! :-)

[khyricat]

I get my hisbiscus from mountainroseherbs in bulk, its less expensive even with shipping than buying it locally since I like the dried variety for teas..

Then again I buy a lot of tea herbs and do bulk lots less frequently, so that helps- 5 pounds=a discount on each pound, and I rarely order less than that at a time, I also get some of my kitchen spices/herbs from them (sage, onion powder, etc)..

[Ohio Sky]

Pssst.... I ordered a sample of the Ancient Blue.... Dont tell Catherine! o_0

I figure Ill start by using it on a hairball out of my brush, then if the hair doesnt fall into a million pieces Ill do a small strand on some obscure spot on my head in a henna gloss, not leave it in for too long, and wait a few days for true results. Ill definitely post results! Hopefully I will get this soon and I can do it in the next week. Wish me luck!

[wintersun99]

ooooo, very intriguing, can't wait for secret experiment results!

[Nightshade]

Pssst.... I ordered a sample of the Ancient Blue.... Dont tell Catherine! o_0

I figure Ill start by using it on a hairball out of my brush, then if the hair doesnt fall into a million pieces Ill do a small strand on some obscure spot on my head in a henna gloss, not leave it in for too long, and wait a few days for true results. Ill definitely post results! Hopefully I will get this soon and I can do it in the next week. Wish me luck!

Take pictures :D Can't wait to see some tested results!

[squiggyflop]

prepare henna in advance freeze it... thaw out when ready... obtain vinyl pillowcase cover and thick winter hat... mush henna on head and wrap with saran wrap.. go to sleep on vinyl pillowcase... i used to do this because i had no time to henna... it works well and my couch didnt get any henna on it...


do indigo annother day to acheive black hair?

wait are you even on call at night?? i know manic panic has dyes that work fast and never damaged my hair... oh but i bet they have chemicals huh?

[Ohio Sky]

Umm yes Im on call at night :p

To further explain my scenario, Ill just tell you all exactly why Im on call. I work in a mortuary, and I am now the after hours person on call, which means if someone passes away, they call me to go pick them up, which could be at a hospital or at their home.

So, it would be very innapropriate for me to go to work with henna on under a hat, its extremely unpredictable, its 24/7, and once I get called, I have to go quickly, especially if its at a residence, so no time to wash out henna goop.
Basically I work Monday through Friday, 9-5, and am on call every minute from when I leave work to when I get back.

Its an interesting job, to say the least... and boy am I tired :undecided

[Celebrian]

Have you told us what color you are naturally, and so what color the root regrowth will be?

Looking in Catherine's E-Book for a very dark brown in a Onestep, she suggests one part henna to four parts indigo. So, I'm thinking that if you tilted it further still, you might hit black. I was thinking that about 10-15 % henna to 80-85% indigo may work for you - and perhaps leaving that on for only 1 1/2 - 2 hours MAX. may work, particularly if you do it weekly for several rounds, and thereafter every 3-4 weeks. You'll have built up the color by then.

I'm also thinking that this may be the ratio used by Lush for their Caca Noir - but your mix would be stronger because of adding your henna and indigo powders together at source, without any extras to dilute the coloring power (aside from lengthening it in a conditioner - if you go the gloss route).

As I've said, you could do it 'gloss-style' which would go over the hair more quickly and be easier to rinse out (thinking speedy mortician here!). Also, more economical. As I've said before, my experience is that indigo, whether 'glossed' or otherwise, tends to become permanent after a few applications anyway.

Hope this is of some help. :cheese:

[Celebrian]

My apologies. I'm moving this to the henna thread. I forgot where I was... !

[Shell]

Thanks for posting this. I searched the forums and everything and didnt find this, only a post by Catherine saying that the ph is very alkaline.

Im still interested in experimenting with this, but I will definitely proceed with caution. I was thinking a small amount of this added to a henna gloss may not be strong enough to fry hair, and that would lower the ph factor. If its really as strong as everyone says, that would be enough for a dark stain still. I may still order a sample to play with.

Thanks Tiny Teesha and Mellie for you tea rinse ideas. Where can you get hibiscus? I would probably have to order it online, but it may be worth a try too.

Thanks!:)

You live in California--just go to a Mexican market and buy whole Jamaica flowers--it's hibiscus. Don't buy the instant drink mix--it'll have sugar and other stuff in it. Just buy the dried flowers; they're usually with the canela (cinnamon) and stuff!

[Ohio Sky]

Celebrian, I laugh at your "speedy mortician" comment :D
I know some people claim they get just as much color out of glosses, but have never done one myself so I dont know. Let us know how it goes!

Shell, the hibiscus flowers are probably a good idea, but the "California" I live in is not the same "California" that contains these, what you call, "stores," especially of the ethnic or specialty type. I would probably have to drive 3 hours to find something like this.