Blog Article: Women, Don't Cut YOur *** Hair

[1953Diygal]

I found this blog entry this morning and would like to submit it for your consideration: http:// alphagameplan.blogspot.com/2011/04/women-dont-cut-your-damn-hair.html

I encourage you to not only read the article but the 200+ comments below. Some of the discussion is rather heated. I agreed with many comments. Some of them I found validating. Some of them I found superficial and annoying. There was one comment where the poster said, roughly, "If you have small breasts and short hair, you should probably get used to being called 'sir'" which reminded me of being at the La Brea Tar Pits in 1983 at age 13. I was a skinny little waif with horrid, short, '80s hair and had a woman call me a boy. That residual memory has factored in with my decision to keep my hair long.

I'm very interested to read some of your comments. The sheer number of replies are a bit daunting and some of the text-heavy replies made my head spin. So, with that in mind, let the commenting begin!

ETA: I searched to see if this article had already been posted. If I missed it, I apologize.

[1953Diygal]

http://marriedmansexlife.com/2011/04/girl-game-have-long-hair/

This appears to be the original article that spawned the blog post.

[Bene]

All the wrong reasons for keeping long hair consolidated in to one thingy. Fascinating.

[Lady Mary]

Judging women for their hair length, yeaaaaah. Guess I'm not attractive to some random idiot on the internet, on noes.

[Angebalina]

My reaction - strongly against all the men involved in that post and the comments! No! That is long hair for the wrong reasons. I think a lot of ladies here would agree that they do not grow their hair out because it is what men find most attractive. It's OUR bodies, and we will do what makes us happiest. Sometimes we need to get rid of damaged hair, or just need a change. A lot of women here have grown out pixie cuts, so I'm guessing there was a point in their lives where they needed that change and even if they prefer longer hair now, perhaps the process was meaningful to them. Should we have diminished self confidence because of shorter hair? We value our hair or we wouldn't be on this site, but it has to be for our own benefit or it is meaningless. And just because I'm annoyed by the dudefest I'm gonna throw in the fact that any man that speaks about what a woman should and shouldn't do...well, sir, I am WAY out of your league, with or without a pixie cut.

[sabrinaclrke]

I found that article completely disgusting. The comments as well... Very disturbing

[rosey4exclaim]

I don't think I'll comment on the actual blog post until I calm down a little. I found this man's post extremely offensive. Warning: Long, feminist, liberal rant ahead. (a) While some women change their appearance to impress men and other women, many do it to please themselves. They wear their hair short because they like it, and they shouldn't be stopped because "most" men think long hair is attractive. Who cares what men think is attractive?! We dress and primp and look our best for ourselves, not them. (b) I have a major problem with our culture's fear of being mistaken as the opposite gender. I know that as a kid, it can be horrifying (and so I feel for you, Diygal), but by perpetuating this fear, it's saying that there's something wrong with being the opposite gender. There's nothing wrong with being a man or a woman, so there should be nothing wrong with being mistaken for either one. The person made a mistake, and while it can be slightly awkward, I really don't think it's that big of a deal if you handle it well. (c) Who says women should look "female"?! And for that matter, who says what "female" looks like? You look however the heck you want to look, and if that means you accentuate your straight hips and square jaw, it's no one else's business. If you identify as a woman, it doesn't matter how other people perceive you; you're a woman no matter what. (d) Who does this guy think he is telling women what to do with their bodies?!

[neko_kawaii]

My reaction - strongly against all the men involved in that post and the comments! No! That is long hair for the wrong reasons. I think a lot of ladies here would agree that they do not grow their hair out because it is what men find most attractive. It's OUR bodies, and we will do what makes us happiest. Sometimes we need to get rid of damaged hair, or just need a change. A lot of women here have grown out pixie cuts, so I'm guessing there was a point in their lives where they needed that change and even if they prefer longer hair now, perhaps the process was meaningful to them. Should we have diminished self confidence because of shorter hair? We value our hair or we wouldn't be on this site, but it has to be for our own benefit or it is meaningless. And just because I'm annoyed by the dudefest I'm gonna throw in the fact that any man that speaks about what a woman should and shouldn't do...well, sir, I am WAY out of your league, with or without a pixie cut.

*applauds the bold bit*

[massivecnqstdr]

The fact that this man feels he can speak for all men is hilarious! I have been sexualized for having SHORT hair a number of times because its a guy's "thing." If men like this guy are attracted to long hair, I'm tempted to pass on this whole growth thing! :lol:

Also, both the author and the commenters are really overthinking WHY women cut their hair. Uh, maybe it's because they think it looks good? I mean, is my man or prospective man's potential opinion of my haircut really going to be the determining factor?

[1953Diygal]

I did find it interesting that so many people assume that long hair takes much more time to style and maintain than short hair does. You can't exactly put a short haircut into a bun or a snood. All of my short hair recollections are of standing in the bathroom with my curling iron and styling products *praying* that I'd be able to make it look halfway decent. This isn't a dig at people with short hair---just my personal experience. It's HARD to make your hair look like John Taylor from Duran Duran! LOL!*

ETA: *Wow..so much for my displeasure about being mistaken for a male. :p Being a Durannie was different.

[Shizuku]

That article is absolutely terrible and sexist. I personally prefer long hair, and that is my choice. Just as it is any woman's choice to cut her hair short and any man's choice to grow his long. It's fine for everyone to have their preferences, but they have no right to impose them on others.

[YamaMaya]

I find this whole article incredibly insulting. Women are not just decoration to be appraised by our appearence, and I find his analysis of female social interactions beyond asinine. Because us girls clearly are out to outdo each other in attractiveness, and we apparently cut our hair for stupid reasons. He also thinks long damaged hair is preferrable to short hair, which again, I can't overstate this man's piggish and ignorant attitude enough.

[massivecnqstdr]

I don't think I'll comment on the actual blog post until I calm down a little. I found this man's post extremely offensive. Warning: Long, feminist, liberal rant ahead. (a) While some women change their appearance to impress men and other women, many do it to please themselves. They wear their hair short because they like it, and they shouldn't be stopped because "most" men think long hair is attractive. Who cares what men think is attractive?! We dress and primp and look our best for ourselves, not them. (b) I have a major problem with our culture's fear of being mistaken as the opposite gender. I know that as a kid, it can be horrifying (and so I feel for you, Diygal), but by perpetuating this fear, it's saying that there's something wrong with being the opposite gender. There's nothing wrong with being a man or a woman, so there should be nothing wrong with being mistaken for either one. The person made a mistake, and while it can be slightly awkward, I really don't think it's that big of a deal if you handle it well. (c) Who says women should look "female"?! And for that matter, who says what "female" looks like? You look however the heck you want to look, and if that means you accentuate your straight hips and square jaw, it's no one else's business. If you identify as a woman, it doesn't matter how other people perceive you; you're a woman no matter what. (d) Who does this guy think he is telling women what to do with their bodies?!

I love all of this except the warning. No warning needed. We should not apologize for retaliating against this kind of crap.

[rosey4exclaim]

I mean, is my man or prospective man's potential opinion of my haircut really going to be the determining factor?

Seriously! My partner's kept me from cutting my hair a couple times, but did I listen to him because I want to make sure he's still attracted to me? No. I listened because I knew I would regret it in the end, and the reason he stopped me is because he knew that and didn't want me to cry over my lost hair. Does he think my hair is beautiful? Of course! Would he be sad if I cut it? Yes, but he also knows he'd get used to it and if I really liked it he'd be happy that I was happy.

[clioariane]

I've read this article before and don't know why anyone would give this guy the light of day. Pompous, objectifying women, making assumptions and generalizations; I'll pass on this moron.

[woodswanderer]

I am all for people having the hair style they personally find beautiful, but I can't help but wonder about the point made in the article that women tend to encourage women to cut their hair to lessen competition. This is very true in my non-LHC life. I never hear any woman in my work place encouraging another woman to keep her hair long, or avoid damaging it. So...it does make you wonder about the reason behind it. I have to also wonder if those women who are competitive tend to compete more for mens' attention or for other womens' admiration.

[1953Diygal]

I totally agree with you but just acting as devil's advocate, doesn't the Mane Forum get at least one post daily talking about how women are jealous of our hair?

[rosey4exclaim]

I love all of this except the warning. No warning needed. We should not apologize for retaliating against this kind of crap.

This is too true. Thanks for the reminder.

[lapushka]

I found this blog entry this morning and would like to submit it for your consideration: http://alphagameplan.blogspot.com/2011/04/women-dont-cut-your-damn-hair.html

Oh God no, another idiot on the internet.

[rosey4exclaim]

I am all for people having the hair style they personally find beautiful, but I can't help but wonder about the point made in the article that women tend to encourage women to cut their hair to lessen competition. This is very true in my non-LHC life. I never hear any woman in my work place encouraging another woman to keep her hair long, or avoid damaging it. So...it does make you wonder about the reason behind it. I have to also wonder if those women who are competitive tend to compete more for mens' attention or for other womens' admiration.

Women can definitely be ... terrible toward each other. High school and college girls can be the worst. I think it stems from the (false) idea that putting other people down will somehow help them rise up. At least men are obvious when they hate one another. Women stab each other in the back. That said, not all women are like that, and I usually tend to avoid the ones that are. Only trial and error can tell us who are real friends are, and those are the only women whose advice I truly trust.

[woodswanderer]

Oh God no, another idiot on the internet.


Hoping this refers to the author of the article and not the member of the forum who thought the article was of interest.

[millyaulait]

Oh my gosh.

This entire website is a TRAINWRECK.

Disgusting, all of it.

[1953Diygal]

Women can definitely be ... terrible toward each other. High school and college girls can be the worst. I think it stems from the (false) idea that putting other people down will somehow help them rise up. At least men are obvious when they hate one another. Women stab each other in the back. That said, not all women are like that, and I usually tend to avoid the ones that are. Only trial and error can tell us who are real friends are, and those are the only women whose advice I truly trust.

Absoluely! It doesn't just stop there either! Female/female backstabbing is one of the big reasons why I'm not a teacher any longer. Again, like you said, I have a support system of wonderful women who would never do anything like taking delight in urging someone to cut off their hair to lessen the dating pool competition. (although I'm semi-acquainted with a few who just might.....)

[faellen]

Oh my god, some of those comments just boggle the mind. What a bunch of idiots!

[HylianGirl]

So all women must have long hair because one guy thinks that's the best ¬¬ Goos advice there.....not.

[Magalo]

Wow. The article and the comments... so misogysnistic and homophobic. Probably just a bunch of middle-aged conservative *******s that thinks everything women does is to please them... sorry, you're wrong. :rolleyes:

edit: omfg this whole site is making me so angry
here's a comment


Eve ate the fruit because it looked good, despite the fact that she knew it would bring about her death. Which demonstrates that a woman will swallow anything if wrapped in a pretty enough lie.

OH YEAH WHAT A GOOD DEMONSTRATION I'M SO CONVINCED aaaaaah I'm boiling!!!!

[faellen]

Hoping this refers to the author of the article and not the member of the forum who thought the article was of interest.

Pretty sure lapushka was referring to the author of the article :p


Did anyone see the comment from that woman, who thinks that people that lose their hair from chemo should cover their baldness, because showing it is just seeking sympathy?? I mean, what the hell?!

[lapushka]

Hoping this refers to the author of the article and not the member of the forum who thought the article was of interest.

Of course! Who else would I be referring to. You can't possibly think the OP!

[stachelbeere]

okay. I have ALWAYS had short hair until now (touching APL now - never ever had it that long!). Before discovering LHC and no-poo I was trying to grow it out, then always gave up at an awkward stage around 'mid-neck' and when it was wispy, damaged from blowdrying and everything else ruining fine hair, I just went to a hairdresser and got it cut, always feeling sad about yet another failed attempt at having long hair.

It's irrelevant to mention that I never had 'problems' with the opposite sex despite having short hair (I must be ultra-hot like Victoria Beckham, right?), I wasn't going to make that point. But I feel like it needs to be added as an opposition to that blog post - that I don't look less attractive with short hair. My current boyfriend met me with short hair and for the longest time he was hinting how much he liked it that way while I was growing it out (probably because of that awkward mid-neck stage :P). To be honest, I'm not too sure my particular face shape looks good with long hair, at some point I'll probably need some face framing layers or a fringe. Anyway, that wasn't the point I wanted to make.

I just wanted to say that before I started being interested in hair I had NO IDEA that long hair is considered sexy, female and all that - what the article says - funny, huh? Maybe it's that nobody told me, maybe I was never really interested in the kind of guys who are into girls 'the shallow way', I don't know, maybe I was never interested in that kind of topic, of 'how to be desirable for men'. But I certainly didn't have less attention from men than my long-haired friends back when I was blissfully unaware of my 'disadvantage' as a short-haired girl. It's laughable (and rude) to diminish a woman just to the length of her hair - or anything for that matter (like her breasts and butt).

Probably the two only (but strong) reasons why I am growing out my hair is that with long hair you have so many more possibilities of braids, updos, curls etc and all that just wasn't doable for me because of short hair. The 2nd one is that I just never had long hair, so I don't know what it's like.

Ugh... I hate reading texts like these that diminish people to body parts.

[woodswanderer]

Well, I did think it was possibly referring to the OP. Sometimes I find it hard to interpret a tone from text. Glad it isn't. I guess I'm feeling a little disillusioned with the forum recently from seeing some comments on various relationship threads lately. Sorry for the confusion, and no offense intended.

[ositarosita]

I couldn't even get threw all the comments... just the sheer stupidity of it. To be honest I think that is a very badly damaged man, he speaks for himself and himself only. As for everyone else who felt the need to comment on what a woman SHOULD look like.. I wonder if they've looked themselves in the mirror. If long hair and long hair only make a woman feminine the height, huge muscles are the only thing that define masculinity. I bet he's a scrawny little know it all with nothing but little man syndrome.

[spidermom]

Let me say this about that: men - don't cut your da*n hair!

[leslissocool]

Let me say this about that: men - don't cut your da*n hair!


LOL

Anyways, read the tittle: Aplha game. Yeah, that explains it all.:rolleyes:

[Wavelength]

Best response to this piece of misogynistic crap is one I've seen many times on this forum:

We're not here to decorate your world!!!

[FuzzyBlackWaves]

Why do people insist on judging other's worth by their physical appearance?

Also, it makes me laugh about the comment the OP included in her post. I don't care if someone calls me 'Sir' - it's only right they should recognize their superiors :cool: (That is, of course, a joke. But really, I feel sorry for that person, their eye sight must be horrid if they can't see faces, waists and hips well enough to disconcern gender...!)

[Nedertane]

Oh wow, an entitled male who gets upset when women do something with their appearance other than to suit his desires and then tries to use desk chair psychology and evolutionary biology arguments pulled right from thin air to attempt to justify his point that women shouldn't even attempt anything that might make them look less attractive in the eyes of a man. I'm so freaking shocked.

I like how both articles still had limits on the hair length, suggesting that shoulder should be the minimum length, mid-back the maximum length, and after that is too much like Rapuzel. If longer was better, why shouldn't Rapunzel hair be the ideal, eh? Sounds like it's just cultural compliance with typical mainstream women's fashion. Again, shocker.

I can't recall which article it was on, but I think one comment said it all with "some women look good with short hair, but for the most part, I just want to see long, sexy, porn star hair!"

I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly persuaded to cut my hair short. But I won't though, because it's mine, I love it, and I'd feel a lot less metal without it, haha.


Aye, me. It's a good thing I have classes now, this would otherwise be too much stupid for me to handle. :)

[Wavelength]

And now for a relevant comic interlude... :p

Gender Programming (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=4520)
Hello Patriarchy! (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=4538)

(Language warning on the last one.)

Also, something to restore our faith that not all men are misogynistic dudebros. (http://whatever.scalzi.com/2013/08/26/to-the-dudebro-who-thinks-hes-insulting-me-by-calling-me-a-feminist/)

[embee]

We all have preferences. And it's ok to express them. This link/article/post/comments seemed rather more like a rant. Ok. I've read rants before. The guy didn't write it to one of us, so it was not personally directed - just his opinion.

The whole thing made me laugh. It's perfectly ok (in my opinion) for someone to prefer long (or short) hair - on themselves or their SO. It's perfectly ok for someone to find long (or short) hair sexy. But all this cr*p seems just over the top and an excuse to make other people behave as you yourself prefer. The comments were hilariously absurd.

I'm not here to decorate anybody's world, though for sure if I had a SO who had a strong preference for long (or short) hair I'd take that into consideration. Gee whiz! :D

[cathair]

Did anyone see the comment from that woman, who thinks that people that lose their hair from chemo should cover their baldness, because showing it is just seeking sympathy?? I mean, what the hell?!

That is the most disgusting comment of the lot imho. The woman who said that clearly has never met anyone who has had that treatment. For a woman to go out with a bald or part bald head and not give a **** takes more strength and courage that she will ever know. Seeking sympathy? Quite the ****ing opposite. I don't think anyone would want to have that commented on, at all. They would rather just go about their business as they always have, without fear of being judged. Takes a really confident person to do that, not a pity seeker.

[Robot Ninja]

LOL Anyways, read the tittle: Aplha game. Yeah, that explains it all.:rolleyes:

Yep. In my experience, anybody who seriously uses the term "alpha male" is an entitled dudebro who is cheesed off that he can't get a date and deals with his frustration by informing the internet that all these women who have rejected him aren't hot enough for him anyway, he can score any 20-year-old model he wants so there. (Said 20-year-old models will occasionally show up in comments to agree with him, often making the same SPAG mistakes as the blog owner.)

[RedNymph]

Disgusting, especially some of the comments. He's probably one of those MRA white boys who wear fedoras, who say they are the "nice guy" and complain and judge women because they can't get a date. When really they are "nice" just so they can get some and women are actually put off by his disgusting personality. It's why I don't trust guys who say they're a "nice guy" because they make a point of advertising it. I like guys who are naturally decent.

The guy probably thinks he is hilarious. Which is really, really sad if he considers opinions noteworthy.

[neko_kawaii]

And now for a relevant comic interlude... :p

Gender Programming (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=4520)
Hello Patriarchy! (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=4538)

(Language warning on the last one.)

Also, something to restore our faith that not all men are misogynistic dudebros. (http://whatever.scalzi.com/2013/08/26/to-the-dudebro-who-thinks-hes-insulting-me-by-calling-me-a-feminist/)

Fabulous! All of them.

[Ms_Havisham]

[QUOTE=Nedertane;2502288]

I can't recall which article it was on, but I think one comment said it all with "some women look good with short hair, but for the most part, I just want to see long, sexy, porn star hair!"


Hmmm, I'm so tired of the objectification of women and the "Erotic Capital" thing at the moment, and the fact that most people seem to be totally uninformed about it and therefore happily perpetuate it (Like most of the comments under the piece). Is it me, or is it getting particularly bad at the moment?

Such a relief to get back here and read the replies. Sanity!

[RavennaNight]

:yawn: the dregs of the Internet are at it again. Move along, nothing to waste energy on there...

[BlondeWavyGal]

With a good short cut, a pretty face can look alot better. Seriously, I know a girl with waist length hair, she had a stylist side bun it and fake a short cut with the cutest side bang thing using some of her long hair, and it looked really good. Showed off her face better than just having a blanket of hair. But I agree, I wish someone had warned me before I cut all my hair off, it was beautiful, baby fine and blonde. But, those days are past. Women can do what they want with their hair without being called out for it.

[teddygirl]

*sigh* it makes me so sad. People like that really disgust me.

[HintOfMint]

That article is so misogynistic it makes me want to vomit. Of course, what do I expect from a blogger of gems such as, "The Socio-Sexual Hierarchy." I looked at the other blogs he's linked to, and I see that he runs in the Game/PUA circle. They're basically modern eugenicists in a new sexist incarnation.

[Wavelength]

Fabulous! All of them.

Thanks! I totally lost it at the "jewel tones" meme in the last link. :rollin:

[kiezel]

If I sit on him, will he be quiet?

[Wavelength]

If I sit on him, will he be quiet?

Of course not, he'll just tell you that you're not sitting on him right. Because we have to have the alpha menz explain things to us since our poor little ladybrains can't figure it out.

[jeanniet]

I actually thought it was kind of funny, it was so stupid. He doesn't seem to have much of a clue.

[Yozhik]

And now for a relevant comic interlude... :p

Gender Programming (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=4520)
Hello Patriarchy! (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=4538)

(Language warning on the last one.)

Also, something to restore our faith that not all men are misogynistic dudebros. (http://whatever.scalzi.com/2013/08/26/to-the-dudebro-who-thinks-hes-insulting-me-by-calling-me-a-feminist/)

This is just so full of awesome! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

The guy is clearly a Pickup Artist - I looked at a related blog post about how to judge your attractiveness to the opposite sex, and it said something along the lines of "I didn't even include sections about annual income for the female version, because I know that no woman will tell the truth about this." :rolleyes:

[EdG]

I would gladly tell the guy "We're not here to decorate your world!"

That would likely blow all of his fuses. :lol:
Ed

[Kyla]

This is all so disturbing. Women do not exist for men's viewing pleasure.

[Leeloo]

Well.... not sure what was the point of the article, but it sure made me angry. If the author was trying to convince more women to have longer hair, then he sure missed the mark by a long shot (1950 mentality).

[juliaxena]

This article almost made me cut my hair off right there. A bunch of misogynists, a few women who call them on it and an occasional "good woman" who wants to be liked by those men (it sure us difficult to please huh) and will put those women down, wow, really impressed (not).

[kiezel]

Of course not, he'll just tell you that you're not sitting on him right. Because we have to have the alpha menz explain things to us since our poor little ladybrains can't figure it out.

Made me laugh SO hard

[juliaxena]

Disgusting, especially some of the comments. He's probably one of those MRA white boys who wear fedoras, who say they are the "nice guy" and complain and judge women because they can't get a date. When really they are "nice" just so they can get some and women are actually put off by his disgusting personality. It's why I don't trust guys who say they're a "nice guy" because they make a point of advertising it. I like guys who are naturally decent.

The guy probably thinks he is hilarious. Which is really, really sad if he considers opinions noteworthy.

I met a "nice" guy last year. He kept saying how nice he is and kept moaning how no woman wants him (by then I started avoiding convos, didn't answer his calls very often...). Then he started talking about "nature" of women as opposed to "nature" of men which led into some fights (he apologised a few times). Finally he said how women secretly fantasise to be raped.(!?!?wtf). Extreme case but yes, just beware of nice guys who just can't get a girl for some unfair reason.

[Sharysa]

I have to admit, I commented on the original article and my comment is awaiting moderation.

That doesn't mean I can't copy/paste it here, though. *NINJA*


As a young woman who’s had a pixie cut and is growing out her hair to waist-length:

1) I liked the pixie cut itself. It looked great on me. The REAL problem was having to straighten it all the time and being forced to ride out my frequent bad hair days from bad weather, straightening damage, or my hair just not cooperating because it’s that weird “almost wavy” texture. Another problem was having it grow out to the awkward stage every two months, so I just went “**** this noise, I’m letting it grow out.”

2) Women don’t grow or cut our hair for men, at least not the secure ones. We do it for ourselves, and men are a bonus.

3) Long hair is a lot funner for me than short hair. I can braid it, wear it down, try out Game of Thrones styles, do beach-waves–all sorts of stuff. Plus, now that my hair’s long enough to be properly wavy, I love it and it’s awesome. And if I have a bad hair day, I can just braid it and nobody will notice.

4) If anything far past mid-back length is “Rapunzel length” to you, then my nearly-waist-length hair is probably a deal-breaker for most guys. And to be honest, I don’t want to date a guy who’d go “HERE ARE THE EXACT LENGTHS YOUR HAIR CAN BE.”

[leslissocool]

Yep. In my experience, anybody who seriously uses the term "alpha male" is an entitled dudebro who is cheesed off that he can't get a date and deals with his frustration by informing the internet that all these women who have rejected him aren't hot enough for him anyway, he can score any 20-year-old model he wants so there. (Said 20-year-old models will occasionally show up in comments to agree with him, often making the same SPAG mistakes as the blog owner.)

Yup, when I use the term alpha male, people who know me well know exactly what I mean: obnoxious misoginistic guy who needs to get laid :lol:.

I noticed the attitude too. I agree, beware of the self claimed nice guys.

But then again my husband is scary looking and dominant, the type you run from In a dark alley, who had terrible digging up corpses rumors in high school. And he's the sweetest, nicest man I have ever known ;).

[lapushka]

Well, I did think it was possibly referring to the OP. Sometimes I find it hard to interpret a tone from text. Glad it isn't. I guess I'm feeling a little disillusioned with the forum recently from seeing some comments on various relationship threads lately. Sorry for the confusion, and no offense intended.

That's fine, woodswanderer, and I'm seeing where it would have been a little confusing. I was quite short with words. :lol:

[Silver Sister]

Hmmm, this could be fun. Anyone care to write a tongue-in-cheek rant about men? It could be: "Men cut their glory when they shave their beards" or "a man without a mustache is just a young boy in disguise". ;)

[juliaxena]

I would gladly tell the guy "We're not here to decorate your world!"

That would likely blow all of his fuses. :lol:
Ed

Pleaseeee, do it!!!

[woolyleprechaun]

What a moron. It was mainly the comments that narked me, but I was very pleased to see some intelligent, articulate women speak up. Practically everyone I know prefer my hair short, but IT ISN'T THEIR HAIR. :D

[jacqueline101]

Hair is a personal thing so his opinion doesn't phase me any.

[NuclearApple]

This is awful,the man who wrote is even more awful.
A person can have preferences,i prefer short hair on guys but i would never tell things like he wrote to guys with long hair.
What the hell thinks him about women?that women are toys for men?jesus how disgusting.

[Crabbyco]

Well that's ok. I really don't care for knuckle draggers anyway. So I'm really not crushed that I'm not the porn star type that you are looking for.

My husband has told me so many times that he really doesn't care how I wear my hair. He loved it when it was in a pixie and he loves it at BSL. He's not ready for grey but he won't make me color it if I decide to stop. I have never done anything to my hair with the thought of pleasing a man. As I will never do anything to my body to please a man. It has always been about pleasing myself.

[Fairlight63]

I don't know about men preferring long hair. My DH prefers short hair. I think that it just depends on the man.

[peepopowitz]

I found that article completely disgusting. The comments as well... Very disturbing

It's not the worst thing I've read on the internet lately, but the worst things could have easily been written by the same guy. What else should I expect on a blog called Alpha Game, really? That Red Pill nonsense is really ruining my internet these days. And you're right, the article was gross, but the comments... ugh. I couldnt get past more than a handful but what I saw: no one calling out the op, no one questioning the insulting premise, and some homophobia sprinkled on top of a perfect poop sundae. I feel icky.

[angelshair]

I find it pretty insulting to hear some of you people say that growing your hair long to attract a man is the "wrong reason". I don't think there is a wrong reason to grow ones' hair out. Statistically, most men prefer long hair, and if people want to up their chances, so what? Its their choice. Attraction is a physical thing that I can understand. Long hair is an indicator of health to me. Sick people have trouble growing their hair out. I love long, healthy hair on men because it looks healthy to me. I have a physical attraction to it. And even if I am not saying that I would never be with a man that doesn't have long hair, it simple hasn't happened because I'm not as attracted to them. Hair is an important attraction switch to me, and when I talk to many of my male friends, it is important to them too. And these are quality guys, long hair just happens to be one of the things that turns them on. It doesn't make them bad people, it's just personal preference.

Personally, I think women with short hair can look super cute and sexy, but then again, I'm not sexually attracted to women so I guess I'm not the demographic. Most of my male friends prefer long hair, a few prefer short hair and some don't mind either way. I think the article is attempting to give some kind of twisted, misguided dating advice, which was offensive and poorly worded, and I certainly don't agree with many of the comments. I'm simply saying that taking a boyfriends'/husbands' or potential suitors' opinion into consideration does not make you a less intelligent or confident woman. It's just hair, but it is also a potent signal of health and beauty that the many men appreciate in its own right. So, if you don't have a strong desire to have short hair, why not factor that in the equation.

[XcaliburGirl]

:yawn: the dregs of the Internet are at it again. Move along, nothing to waste energy on there...
My thought exactly. I've resisted clicking. Let's not contribute more traffic (and potential income) to these types of blogs.

[littlemonster]

Oh, I found it quite amusing. I like reading idiot's ravings now and then :)

[RitaCeleste]

Well, my SO wants me to cut my hair up to mid-back or bra-strap. Not for hair health or any other reason other than he thinks I blend in better in a crowd that way. He is extremely tall so when we go out, eyes always drift over to him. He feels if he and the people he is with look "average" enough, people's eyes will move on with a positive impression of him and those around him. He doesn't like me in a low-cut blouse, he doesn't like me in a colorful girly blouse, he likes me in jeans and attractive t-shirts. The All -American outfit, the least likely to attract attention in Wal-mart outfit. I finally have hair past my waist and growing. Its staying. Not because I'm man hunting, but because I like it.
Yes it is a silly article. But silly stuff will get tons of posts around here. Like the thread about long haired people being selfish cause its not on some cancer persons head already. That one got how many posts??? Just saying, silly stuff is what people love to talk about.

[Neneka]

Well. People who are ugly inside will remain ugly no matter what we tell them.

[Skade]

Oh, I found it quite amusing. I like reading idiot's ravings now and then :)

It would be amusing, if there wasn´t so many men agreeing with him. That´s what makes it seem sad to me..

I like men but sometimes I feel like they are so simple in their taste in women, like with hair length. They want it long, but not too long. I have had it really short and really long. I hope most guys aren't as simple as this guy though.

"Shoulder lenght is just fine, anything past your mid-back starts seeming to be a little long. No need to go Rapuzel on us."

Well, I don´t care, I want to go Rapunzel on you so if you don't appreciate it, f*** off!

[RitaCeleste]

I want to go Rapunzel! Also, any hair cut I get and like requires I blow dry it and style it. I just wash my hair and let it air dry, brush it, maybe oil it a little. When I'm at the grill or working, I sometimes just stick it in my shirt to keep it out of the way if I can't even find a thing to tie it up with. I don't spend spend much more time with a brush. Long hair is very convenient. I do my own color and henna treatments. I cut my own hair, it just some thin fringe and or a trim. I never cry after a cut and wonder if the hairdresser just hates me and what I will do for next eon until that cut grows out. I am happier with long hair. I rarely look at my hair and say I'm having a bad hair day. Once in awhile its time for an oiling or some deep conditioning but I never have to leave the house ashamed of my hair. (Except for that one time the lawn man put a hole in the pool while I had henna in and I went out with my hair in a plastic cap and dripping to get a repair kit). Long hair is lower maintenance than any cut I've ever had. I think it just suits me more to have a plain look to my hair than some trendy cut that doesn't match my plain face. So yeah, I'm not cutting it for a man, and I'm not growing it for a man either. Its what I like. Besides that whole article is just someone wanting to control what other people do with their own bodies. Pushy? Boundaries anyone? You see that everywhere where people want to force their ideas and ideals onto others in all manner of ways. Its never a pretty sight.

[Blond On Blond]

Hair is a personal thing so his opinion doesn't phase me any.

Glad to see one sensible reply in this thread.

[thankyousir74]

I found that article completely disgusting. The comments as well... Very disturbing

Yeah, Uhm, I just sorta don't want the sexual attention. Especially not at work. Bunning forever.

[lunalocks]

Ick. Some men (women too) can be so stupid. and superficial.

[rileykathleen]

This article bothers me. :/ Why do men think they get any say in our hair choices? No one can tell me what to do with my hair, or anything that's personal for that matter. They can have an opinion. I know some people were really against me cutting my hair short and then some liked it short and didn't want me to start growing it out again. That's all fine and dandy; have your own opinions. I'm still going to do what I want.

[roboeyes]

I actually got really offended reading this. Not only is this man extremely pompous in his approach to the matter, but he generalizes about every topic he addresses. He generalizes that all men hate short hair on women, all women look bad with short hair, all women want other women to cut their hair short because they know it looks bad, and all older women look more dignified with long hair.

I disagree with him on so many levels. I think that hairstyle is an individual choice, and nothing more. I know that my boyfriend has told me that he prefers long hair, but I also prefer my hair to be long, so it works out fine. As for all women "overrating their attractiveness", that is a load of BS... Scientific studies have shown that MEN judge themselves a few points higher, while women will usually underrate themselves. It's so hard to address his whole post because I think I have a response for just about every sentence he wrote, but I don't see why it's his business what other people do with their hair. I'm sure his opinion is taken into consideration by his SO, but what do I care if he likes my hair or not?

Also, as a side note, I often find myself thinking that older women do look nicer with short hair, simply because I don't find long, stringy gray hair very attractive (my aunt sports that look). Also, once women get REALLY old, their hair often gets thin, and it would look really sad and limp if it was kept long. So I prefer the short curly 'dos that the little old ladies have. It's low maintenance for them, and probably suits them better than long hair hanging everywhere. Again, this is all a personal choice! We all have opinions, but I don't go around writing extremely rude, judgmental blog posts about mine.

[juliaxena]

http://i1015.photobucket.com/albums/af272/juliaxena/noname.jpg

Agreed about overrating and underrating :D

[Sharysa]

Pretty much what Juliaxena and roboeyes said. Also, the comic Juliaxena posted is hilarious!

[Upside Down]

Couldn't read all of the comments.
People spend way too much time worrying about other people's business.

I will grow my hair inappropriately long for as long as I want.

[Wavelength]

Rofl!!! Love the comic, juliaxena!

:rollin:

[prettyinpink]

This guy is really shallow. Why should women care so much about pleasing men?

[Night_Kitten]

WOW, reading that blog post all I could think was WTF?!?!? WHERE did that dude get all that BS? That's just.... I don't even know what to say really....
Whenever I considered a cut or growing it longer, the question "would the boys/men around me like it?" was not even IN the list of questions I asked myself, as if the potential date can't get past the appearance to get to know me, I don't want to hang out with him anyway...

Haven't read all the comments yet, can't go past the absurdity of the first one: "There is another reason women cut their hair - they have decided they are lesbians. Nothing signifies that better than chopping great long hair down to what could pass for a man's conservative haircut or to practically bald."
Um, yeah, when I pixied my waist length hair in high-school I TOTALLY did it because I suddenly realized I was a lesbian... And when I started growing it back out a couple of years later, that was because I suddenly realized I went straight again... SERIOUSLY? I mean, damn, how stupid can people get?

[chen bao jun]

I find it pretty insulting to hear some of you people say that growing your hair long to attract a man is the "wrong reason". I don't think there is a wrong reason to grow ones' hair out. Statistically, most men prefer long hair, and if people want to up their chances, so what? Its their choice. Attraction is a physical thing that I can understand. Long hair is an indicator of health to me. Sick people have trouble growing their hair out. I love long, healthy hair on men because it looks healthy to me. I have a physical attraction to it. And even if I am not saying that I would never be with a man that doesn't have long hair, it simple hasn't happened because I'm not as attracted to them. Hair is an important attraction switch to me, and when I talk to many of my male friends, it is important to them too. And these are quality guys, long hair just happens to be one of the things that turns them on. It doesn't make them bad people, it's just personal preference.

Personally, I think women with short hair can look super cute and sexy, but then again, I'm not sexually attracted to women so I guess I'm not the demographic. Most of my male friends prefer long hair, a few prefer short hair and some don't mind either way. I think the article is attempting to give some kind of twisted, misguided dating advice, which was offensive and poorly worded, and I certainly don't agree with many of the comments. I'm simply saying that taking a boyfriends'/husbands' or potential suitors' opinion into consideration does not make you a less intelligent or confident woman. It's just hair, but it is also a potent signal of health and beauty that the many men appreciate in its own right. So, if you don't have a strong desire to have short hair, why not factor that in the equation.

Yes. I agree 100%. I don't care about the article writer voicing his opinion. I don't think I was his intended audience--the blog is obviously written for other men, none of whom can make anybody wear their hair any particular way, not even their own wives and girlfriends, they can just say what they would like in their fantasy world. Which doesn't mean anything in reality. But in reality, I don't see a problem with wanting to be attractive to men, especially not THE man (in my case, my husband). Yes, I do consider what my husband likes when I choose how I dress and appear--I consider it a LOT. What's wrong with that? He also considers what I like. He has worn a beard for the past 30 years just becasue I like men with beards (he likes to be clean-shaven).
As an older woman (56 years old) I work hard at staying slim and shapely because it is more attractive to my husband and I also dress a lot of the time in clothes that he likes (including many clothes that he bought me, I think it is a compliment that he buys me clothes and that he is proud of my appearance).I don't think that this makes me any less intelligent or less of a thoughtful person or that I do it because I have low self-esteem. It's a choice I make. It takes a certain amount of trouble to look good at my age, and I think I do it because I take pride in myself.

I am a college professor part time, by the way and therefore among many, many feminists who consider it is a duty of some kind to look what I would could consider to be unkempt and ungroomed, which is their right. But then, they also spend a ton of time, frankly, wailing about how men are so shallow as to be not attracted to their deliberately unattractive selves. Seems odd to me.

My husband, by the way, does not care about my hair length. I met him when I had very short hair. My father also married my mother as a woman with very short hair and thought she was gorgeous with it. There's personal taste, and then there's the fact that some women look feminine with very short hair (but a lot of us don't) and then there's just biology, which means that men are going to be attracted to women who look feminine until the end of time, just as women are attracted to men who look masculine and all the social engineering in the world is not going to change to fact that most people like the sexes to look, you know, differentiated from each other in some kind of way, even if all the ways are not the same as our current Western one. Makes it easier, you know, to tell who you can actually procreate with, which is what makes the human race continue to exist....

[getoffmyskittle]

Warning: that blog post contains some links that are blocked by my work... super awkward, I hope it wasn't classified as a porn site or anything. :(

[Alun]

Say what you want, most men prefer long hair on women. That doesn't necessarily mean long by LHC definitions, but those are warped IMHO anyway. Feel free to hack it off, but don't complain because we are (mostly) hard wired to find short haired women unattractive. There are exceptions to all this, but very few. Sinead O'Connor looked beautiful with short hair before she put on weight, but now not so much, and I say that as a guy who's overweight himself.

[ETA: Meaning the round face/short hair thing doesn't work, she could fix that by growing her hair WITHOUT losing weight, although I don't think she will]

And I realise some women find long haired men unattractive, and no I'm not going to cut it OR complain about their preference, which is very much the point.

Judging worth? No. Just attractiveness, which is a whole other thing.

[Alun]

I once dated a girl with a pixie, which looked good on her, but wouldn't on most.

It didn't work out for other reasons. She was living with another guy! Her parents hated this other guy so much that they encouraged her to date other people. I actually met her for our date at her parents' house, and she arrived there after me. That should have been the tipoff. Half way though the evening she admitted the truth.

[stachelbeere]

Haven't read all the comments yet, can't go past the absurdity of the first one: "There is another reason women cut their hair - they have decided they are lesbians. Nothing signifies that better than chopping great long hair down to what could pass for a man's conservative haircut or to practically bald."
Um, yeah, when I pixied my waist length hair in high-school I TOTALLY did it because I suddenly realized I was a lesbian... And when I started growing it back out a couple of years later, that was because I suddenly realized I went straight again... SERIOUSLY? I mean, damn, how stupid can people get?

I was actually convinced that person was being ironic; and thought how clever that comment was... until I realised that s/he wasn't.
WTF person who wrote that comment!?!?!????!? SERIOUSLY?!

[massivecnqstdr]

Yes. I agree 100%. I don't care about the article writer voicing his opinion. I don't think I was his intended audience--the blog is obviously written for other men, none of whom can make anybody wear their hair any particular way, not even their own wives and girlfriends, they can just say what they would like in their fantasy world. Which doesn't mean anything in reality. But in reality, I don't see a problem with wanting to be attractive to men, especially not THE man (in my case, my husband). Yes, I do consider what my husband likes when I choose how I dress and appear--I consider it a LOT. What's wrong with that? He also considers what I like. He has worn a beard for the past 30 years just becasue I like men with beards (he likes to be clean-shaven).
As an older woman (56 years old) I work hard at staying slim and shapely because it is more attractive to my husband and I also dress a lot of the time in clothes that he likes (including many clothes that he bought me, I think it is a compliment that he buys me clothes and that he is proud of my appearance).I don't think that this makes me any less intelligent or less of a thoughtful person or that I do it because I have low self-esteem. It's a choice I make. It takes a certain amount of trouble to look good at my age, and I think I do it because I take pride in myself.

I am a college professor part time, by the way and therefore among many, many feminists who consider it is a duty of some kind to look what I would could consider to be unkempt and ungroomed, which is their right. But then, they also spend a ton of time, frankly, wailing about how men are so shallow as to be not attracted to their deliberately unattractive selves. Seems odd to me.

My husband, by the way, does not care about my hair length. I met him when I had very short hair. My father also married my mother as a woman with very short hair and thought she was gorgeous with it. There's personal taste, and then there's the fact that some women look feminine with very short hair (but a lot of us don't) and then there's just biology, which means that men are going to be attracted to women who look feminine until the end of time, just as women are attracted to men who look masculine and all the social engineering in the world is not going to change to fact that most people like the sexes to look, you know, differentiated from each other in some kind of way, even if all the ways are not the same as our current Western one. Makes it easier, you know, to tell who you can actually procreate with, which is what makes the human race continue to exist....

I understand both you and angelshair's perspective on some of this, but please remember that CONTEXT IS IMPORTANT. In the context of an "Alpha Male" blog, this "advice" for women is clearly not only about pleasing your man, it is about total control. I highly doubt the author or anyone in the comments would grow their hair long for their female mate! I don't think anyone here on this board is attacking women who consider the opinions of men, they are saying it's presumptuous of the author to ASSUME that women are considering the opinions of men. We obviously don't have to.

Also, I'm not fond of your description of feminists you know who are unkept or ungroomed. It doesn't really seem relevant, as people who cut their hair short are often MORE groomed on a daily basis than someone who is sporting long hair. By that, I mean short hair requires more frequent cutting, washing, and styling. There are plenty of examples of women like the ones you described, but there are way more who don't fit that description at all. I don't like the idea of creating a false dichotomy of the ugly feminist and the beautiful woman who takes her advice from men. There are plenty of beautiful, clean, stylish feminists on this board alone! Many of them seem to have no trouble finding mates, either! :cool:

[Yozhik]

I consider myself to be one of the fairly (or should I say hairy?:p) well-groomed feminists on this board. :)

But to address more recent comments on this thread - of course it's fine for people to have whatever hair length preference they want, but at least the vibe I got from that blog post and the comments was that males were reducing women to their separate body parts (length of hair, waist-hip ratio, breast size, etc - these are from other posts on the blog), with little, if any attention paid to their personalities. This sticks in my craw, because it seems to indicate that there is some quantifiable objective way of measuring attractiveness of any one individual to any second individual and using it to play a game with the goal of 'winning' the most desirable women. :eek:

Bottom line: I'm not here to decorate anyone's world! :cheese:

[Stagecoach]

Honestly I don't understand how some folks can say "of course he can hav an opinion, but how dare he post this..." Seriously, this is the Internet. The author was writing in *his* blog, sharing *his* view of women's hair....he was not forcing anyone to grow their hair long. And the vast majority of guys I know, do prefer women with hair past their shoulders.

I happen to grow my hair because I like it. But I admit there are times I have used it to impress a guy I liked...and I will not apologies or feel guilty for that.

[Yozhik]

To clarify, I'm not saying I'm horrifically offended by some guy's blog on the internet - I'm saying that it irritates/saddens me that this seems to reflect a general tendency among some males to reduce women to body parts.

And since he posted his blog on the internet, he's inviting people to have opinions on his opinions. :shrug:

I prefer longer hair on myself and on most of my (female) friends, but if they cut their hair, I'm tell them it looks good, because to say otherwise would be unkind. I wonder how this fits into his argument of "all of your girlfriends will tell you it looks good, but that's just because they're catty and want to look better than you and get more male attention as a result of you having dropped your attractiveness score by 2 points." :hmm:

[jeanniet]

I didn't think it was stupid because the guy prefers long hair on women; I just thought some of his assumptions were pretty silly. I mean, I attend church with a whole slew of post-menopausal women with short hair, and very few (if any) look like short, squatty men. For the most part, they look like what they are--very nicely coiffed elderly ladies who are very clearly feminine.

[juliaxena]

If long hair was requirede to look feminine, what do men with long hair look like then? Feminine? I don't think so.

[Flor]

I find it hilarious, really. Dude (and many like him) seems to think that he's doing all women a favor by clearly stating his (and men in general) preferences. Because we women are dying to hear what men want us to look like and are eager to oblige. Give me a break.

I'm yet to come across one article where a woman writes same generalized BS about men's appearance.

[sakuraemily]

I once dated a girl with a pixie, which looked good on her, but wouldn't on most.

It didn't work out for other reasons. She was living with another guy! Her parents hated this other guy so much that they encouraged her to date other people. I actually met her for our date at her parents' house, and she arrived there after me. That should have been the tipoff. Half way though the evening she admitted the truth.

Sometimes parents completely forget about the other person when forcing their kids to their POV....

[Stagecoach]

Well, it's an undeniable fact that many women DO care deeply about what men in general think if their appearance, perhaps it's a flawed concern, but it's one that consumes our society.

The answer is not to deride and mock those who are fulfilling that demand, but to try and educate people on the damaging desire that has created the demand.

[Indigostreams]

I must think like a man, because I agree with everything that this guy wrote in the blog. I have wondered the same things, and have come to the same conclusions myself about women and hair.

[Crabbyco]

Well, it's an undeniable fact that many women DO care deeply about what men in general think if their appearance, perhaps it's a flawed concern, but it's one that consumes our society.

The answer is not to deride and mock those who are fulfilling that demand, but to try and educate people on the damaging desire that has created the demand.

It is sad that we live in a culture that values the surface appearances of people more than their values or morals. Example would be that competing headlines over the last few days are about Miley Cyrus and Syria. It baffles me that Miley grinding on stage at the MTV awards is even front page news.
The blog IMHO, is distasteful, but not completely wrong. Women do compete for men and are shallow enough to tell someone to cut gorgeous hair just to make themselves feel better. I choose to not have those kinds of people around me. I've quit a job because I couldn't handle the cat fights. One of the fights was two best friends fighting over an unemployed drunk. :rolleyes: I now work with mostly men, who don't care what I look like and go out of their way to treat me like a lady. That is saying a lot about their values because we work in a metal shop and shops are normally very unfriendly to a lady.
The women I choose as friends would tell me the truth if I got a bad hair cut. And why not, I have eyes, I can see and they just confirm what I'm already thinking. It usually goes something like; Oh, you cut your hair. Is that what you were going for? Hummm.... Not my favorite style on you, but I have always loved your color.
A real friend will tell the truth and find something nice to say.

[Night_Kitten]

Yes. I agree 100%. I don't care about the article writer voicing his opinion. I don't think I was his intended audience--the blog is obviously written for other men, none of whom can make anybody wear their hair any particular way, not even their own wives and girlfriends, they can just say what they would like in their fantasy world. Which doesn't mean anything in reality. But in reality, I don't see a problem with wanting to be attractive to men, especially not THE man (in my case, my husband). Yes, I do consider what my husband likes when I choose how I dress and appear--I consider it a LOT. What's wrong with that? He also considers what I like. He has worn a beard for the past 30 years just becasue I like men with beards (he likes to be clean-shaven).
As an older woman (56 years old) I work hard at staying slim and shapely because it is more attractive to my husband and I also dress a lot of the time in clothes that he likes (including many clothes that he bought me, I think it is a compliment that he buys me clothes and that he is proud of my appearance).I don't think that this makes me any less intelligent or less of a thoughtful person or that I do it because I have low self-esteem. It's a choice I make. It takes a certain amount of trouble to look good at my age, and I think I do it because I take pride in myself.

I am a college professor part time, by the way and therefore among many, many feminists who consider it is a duty of some kind to look what I would could consider to be unkempt and ungroomed, which is their right. But then, they also spend a ton of time, frankly, wailing about how men are so shallow as to be not attracted to their deliberately unattractive selves. Seems odd to me.

My husband, by the way, does not care about my hair length. I met him when I had very short hair. My father also married my mother as a woman with very short hair and thought she was gorgeous with it. There's personal taste, and then there's the fact that some women look feminine with very short hair (but a lot of us don't) and then there's just biology, which means that men are going to be attracted to women who look feminine until the end of time, just as women are attracted to men who look masculine and all the social engineering in the world is not going to change to fact that most people like the sexes to look, you know, differentiated from each other in some kind of way, even if all the ways are not the same as our current Western one. Makes it easier, you know, to tell who you can actually procreate with, which is what makes the human race continue to exist....

I agree with you that there's nothing wrong in taking your husband's / boyfriend's opinion into account, and making an effort to be more attractive in their eyes, I think that is actually a good thing to do.
And I agree that a majority of men prefer long hair and consider it more attractive, so if a woman wants to "improve" her chances, growing her hair longer is one of the ways to do so - there's nothing wrong with that either, to each his/her own.

What irked me in that blog post was that the writer seems to claim that ALL women NEED to grow their hair long, and do it SOLELY because it's what the majority of men prefer, disregarding their own personal preferences and considerations, and taking into consideration only how attractive they would look in the eyes of the men around them - that I REALLY disagree with. I found his writing to be condescending, and his attitude that of stating a fact rather than sharing his personal preference, opinion or observation.

[KittyBird]

Say what you want, most men prefer long hair on women. That doesn't necessarily mean long by LHC definitions, but those are warped IMHO anyway.
Haha, every time I read "most men prefer long hair on women", I immediately think long hair = mid-thigh or longer! I personally feel that my hair is rather short at BCL :cool:

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Some like it long, others don't. My ex preferred long hair. I went out with a guy a few times when I was growing out my pixie, and he preferred short hair.

[alexis917]

The same way you'd react if your husband shortened his....what?
Oh, I didn't realize the length of my hair determined my fertility.
And it sounds more like this was written based upon very specific criteria for what one man (the author) found attractive.
No longer than midback, but longer than shoulder. One length doesn't suit all women. Some of us look better at different lengths.
In addition to that, I'm jealous of women who can pull off pixies and still look great! I know it wouldn't look good on me!

[chen bao jun]

Also, I'm not fond of your description of feminists you know who are unkept or ungroomed. It doesn't really seem relevant, as people who cut their hair short are often MORE groomed on a daily basis than someone who is sporting long hair. By that, I mean short hair requires more frequent cutting, washing, and styling. There are plenty of examples of women like the ones you described, but there are way more who don't fit that description at all. I don't like the idea of creating a false dichotomy of the ugly feminist and the beautiful woman who takes her advice from men. There are plenty of beautiful, clean, stylish feminists on this board alone! Many of them seem to have no trouble finding mates, either! :cool:

I didn't say 'feminist I know'. I said 'female college professors I know, many many of whom are feminists'. These particular ladies, (sorry 'womyn' is the term they prefer) at the college where I teach are unkempt, proud of it, vocal about being proud of it and also very vocal about women who dress attractively (including most students, you should hear the remarks I hear in the professor's lounge).

They, not I, have made a dichotomy between women who dress attractively and behave traditionally ('unelightened' 'brainwashed' etc etc) and their intelligent and superior selves.

I did not say that these women were ugly. I did not say whether they had short or long hair. I did not say that they represent a majority of feminists. also I did not say that they don't have men. Some of them do. But they still spend a lot of time complaining that men's eyes tend to wander towards women who are what they themselves 'conventionally attractive' (something that takes work to manage) and they tend to behave very viciously towards such women.

to the point that (this is a true story), one of our students was inappropriately propositioned by a male professor and came to her female professor, who was one of this set, in tears. The prof told us proudly later in the lounge how she told the girl that her clothing choices caused the inappropriate behavior, and the set of them spent a long time discussing together how horribly the students dress and how inappropriately sexy they are, etc. etc. I heard of no help or suggestions for the young woman in question (though there is help available on campus).

Our students are Catholic by the way, and conservative and in no way are they dressed to inappropriately attact male attention, not that I think you should blame the woman for how she is dressed when some guy does something like this--in fact I thought that that was part of true feminism...

The feminism that is taught on my campus by the way has nothing to do with men and women having the same opportunities and equal pay for equal work and everything to do with nonsense such as that gender is a social construct and that men and women are exactly the same, and that men have been responsible for all the ills of the world for forever and are always in the wrong--but I won't go on with this, I'm at the point where I think its a threadjack.

[door72067]

~snip~
The same way you'd react if your husband shortened his....what?
~/snip~


I got hung up on that notion myself

and just couldn't find words

[Wavelength]

to the point that (this is a true story), one of our students was inappropriately propositioned by a male professor and came to her female professor, who was one of this set, in tears. The prof told us proudly later in the lounge how she told the girl that her clothing choices caused the inappropriate behavior, and the set of them spent a long time discussing together how horribly the students dress and how inappropriately sexy they are, etc. etc. I heard of no help or suggestions for the young woman in question (though there is help available on campus).



Argh, seriously? They call themselves feminists and they're blaming the victim?!

That's the kind of thing that would have me gibbering in rage. I think they need to get their heads out of their asses, and I don't blame you for being fed up with that kind of BS.

Also, I can't help but notice the cognitive dissonance with "men are always in the wrong", but yet they're blaming a young woman for being hit on. Because yeah, that's logical. :rolleyes:

[neko_kawaii]

The same way you'd react if your husband shortened his....what?



~snip~~/snip~


I got hung up on that notion myself

and just couldn't find words

I find the, um, shorter ones, to be more, uh, pleasant. But then I'm notoriously ungroomed and unfashionable so I suppose that preference must be a subconscious reflection of my man-hating-feminism and has nothing to do with personal experience.

[HintOfMint]

I found this blogger's article to be abhorrent but not for the underlying notion that many (most?) women desire to look attractive to men. I personally have my hair long to look attractive. I understand attraction and the role physical looks play and I don't resent it. I agree in many respects with Chen Bao Jun about the counter-productive way some feminists have tackled the role of attractiveness.

HOWEVER, this particular blogger seems to be involved in Pick-up Artistry, Game, and a very rudimentary popularized notion of evolutionary psychology (clearly a little knowledge is a dangerous thing) which provides a perfect storm of some pretty atrocious sexism. Particular key words and concepts of just the article stick out to me: alpha male and game being the two obvious ones, along with women overrating themselves, and of course then there's the assertion that women who disagree with them are a bunch of backstabbing broads who are clawing other women down on the attractiveness totem pole in order to look more attractive by comparison.

In the left column, one of his top posts is about the "Socio-Sexual Hierarchy," and another post (which I read), actually debates whether women respond to logic. He's linked to another notorious game blogger that seriously posited that women enjoy being beaten by their SOs.

Am I making an ad hominem attack? Absolutely. I admit it. But I do not want to be told to keep my hair long by someone who doesn't actually think women are people. And I sure as hell don't want to argue with his views as if they are from a legitimate source. Let me put it this way, we can talk about vegetarianism without going to Hitler's views on not killing animals for meat, so why can't we talk about the role of wanting attraction from men in considering personal appearance without giving legitimacy to this chauvinist pig?

[Wavelength]

I found this blogger's article to be abhorrent but not for the underlying notion that many (most?) women desire to look attractive to men. I personally have my hair long to look attractive. I understand attraction and the role physical looks play and I don't resent it. I agree in many respects with Chen Bao Jun about the counter-productive way some feminists have tackled the role of attractiveness.

HOWEVER, this particular blogger seems to be involved in Pick-up Artistry, Game, and a very rudimentary popularized notion of evolutionary psychology (clearly a little knowledge is a dangerous thing) which provides a perfect storm of some pretty atrocious sexism. Particular key words and concepts of just the article stick out to me: alpha male and game being the two obvious ones, along with women overrating themselves, and of course then there's the assertion that women who disagree with them are a bunch of backstabbing broads who are clawing other women down on the attractiveness totem pole in order to look more attractive by comparison.

In the left column, one of his top posts is about the "Socio-Sexual Hierarchy," and another post (which I read), actually debates whether women respond to logic. He's linked to another notorious game blogger that seriously posited that women enjoy being beaten by their SOs.

Am I making an ad hominem attack? Absolutely. I admit it. But I do not want to be told to keep my hair long by someone who doesn't actually think women are people. And I sure as hell don't want to argue with his views as if they are from a legitimate source. Let me put it this way, we can talk about vegetarianism without going to Hitler's views on not killing animals for meat, so why can't we talk about the role of wanting attraction from men in considering personal appearance without giving legitimacy to this chauvinist pig?

Very well expressed, and yep, this is exactly why I feel this blog post was offensive and disrespectful to women.

The dudebro comments were just the extra sexist icing on the entire misogynistic cake.

[Unofficial_Rose]

I found this blogger's article to be abhorrent but not for the underlying notion that many (most?) women desire to look attractive to men. I personally have my hair long to look attractive. I understand attraction and the role physical looks play and I don't resent it. I agree in many respects with Chen Bao Jun about the counter-productive way some feminists have tackled the role of attractiveness.

HOWEVER, this particular blogger seems to be involved in Pick-up Artistry, Game, and a very rudimentary popularized notion of evolutionary psychology (clearly a little knowledge is a dangerous thing) which provides a perfect storm of some pretty atrocious sexism. Particular key words and concepts of just the article stick out to me: alpha male and game being the two obvious ones, along with women overrating themselves, and of course then there's the assertion that women who disagree with them are a bunch of backstabbing broads who are clawing other women down on the attractiveness totem pole in order to look more attractive by comparison.

In the left column, one of his top posts is about the "Socio-Sexual Hierarchy," and another post (which I read), actually debates whether women respond to logic. He's linked to another notorious game blogger that seriously posited that women enjoy being beaten by their SOs.



How interesting, I didn't get that far and I was getting a PUA-type vibe off the writing style. Probably he is too scared of women. I daresay he just sits by his computer with his mickey in his hands.

As for the commentators, it's always entertaining when stupid people try to appear intelligent. The creepy one who made faux-biblical references was priceless.

[peepopowitz]

I found this blogger's article to be abhorrent but not for the underlying notion that many (most?) women desire to look attractive to men. I personally have my hair long to look attractive. I understand attraction and the role physical looks play and I don't resent it. I agree in many respects with Chen Bao Jun about the counter-productive way some feminists have tackled the role of attractiveness.

HOWEVER, this particular blogger seems to be involved in Pick-up Artistry, Game, and a very rudimentary popularized notion of evolutionary psychology (clearly a little knowledge is a dangerous thing) which provides a perfect storm of some pretty atrocious sexism. Particular key words and concepts of just the article stick out to me: alpha male and game being the two obvious ones, along with women overrating themselves, and of course then there's the assertion that women who disagree with them are a bunch of backstabbing broads who are clawing other women down on the attractiveness totem pole in order to look more attractive by comparison.

In the left column, one of his top posts is about the "Socio-Sexual Hierarchy," and another post (which I read), actually debates whether women respond to logic. He's linked to another notorious game blogger that seriously posited that women enjoy being beaten by their SOs.

Am I making an ad hominem attack? Absolutely. I admit it. But I do not want to be told to keep my hair long by someone who doesn't actually think women are people. And I sure as hell don't want to argue with his views as if they are from a legitimate source. Let me put it this way, we can talk about vegetarianism without going to Hitler's views on not killing animals for meat, so why can't we talk about the role of wanting attraction from men in considering personal appearance without giving legitimacy to this chauvinist pig?

This is exactly what I picked up on, thus my reference to The Red Pill. PUA culture is really bumming out my favorite internet spaces, to the point where I can't even log onto a hair care forum without being reminded that there's a thriving subculture out there of men, as you so rightly put, who don't actually think women are people. Dating advice for misogynists, by misogynists. Gag me. Can we talk about braids again?

[Othala]

My response to the blogger guy: You like long haired women? Check out the bearded woman thread. LOL.

Seriously, the guy is not thinking with his brain but letting another part of his anatomy (much lower down) dictate what he writes. As such, I do not think this guy is going to be able to form a long term meaningful and loving relationship with a woman, but I guess that is not what he is after at the moment. He just wants to get laid.

With the attitude he displays, I can't see that he will attract many women - long haired or otherwise. I wonder what he thinks of his mother, grandmothers, sisters, etc. Does he rate their worth in the same way as he appears to (de)value other women?

Loser.

[blondzai]

i actually prefer long hair on guys..an ex of mine used to have long hair minus facial hair and even though he is 6'4 he still had people asking him if he was a girl...just ignorance. BUT to be honest there have been a good amount of long haired guys i thought were very attractive until they cut off their beautiful hair :/ so i can sorta understand the thought.

[Wavelength]

So I thought I was done posting comics to this thread, but this was just put up today and it was the most relevant of all. :p

The Dudebro Whisperer (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=4742)

[ebullience]

"So why do women do it when so many men actively hate long hair?"

Call me crazy, but maybe women don't make every decision based on what men think?

(And I haven't even got to the comments section yet!)

[Crumpet]

I've dated people who preferred short hair, although mine has always been BSL or longer. Whenever I thought of cutting it, they wanted me to keep my hair. I think they just didn't want for me to change and wanted to encourage me to keep something I loved, which is sweet. I think most guys are like that. They may have a slight preference but if they actually care about you, they want you to be who you are. The guy who wrote that (and some of the commentors) are not the sort of guys I would give the time of day.

[chen bao jun]

I've dated people who preferred short hair, although mine has always been BSL or longer. Whenever I thought of cutting it, they wanted me to keep my hair. I think they just didn't want for me to change and wanted to encourage me to keep something I loved, which is sweet. I think most guys are like that. They may have a slight preference but if they actually care about you, they want you to be who you are. The guy who wrote that (and some of the commentors) are not the sort of guys I would give the time of day.
Exactly. I suspect a guy who lives in his mom's basement eating chips and playing video games all day and fantasizing about Lara Croft, who makes pronouncements about what women 'should' do because women don't give him the time of day.
I was interested to read the comments about there being a subculture out there of these misogynists and grateful for the information so thoughtfully put.
But I'm not worried that these are some majority of men or something, yet.
Also, I stopped reading internet comments on any article a long, long time ago. It's a good way to get myself upset and I do thinks its needless since 'my name is anonymous and I'm an internet troll because I have no life and a vulgar mind' seems to be the person who has time to post most comments.

[chen bao jun]

I find the, um, shorter ones, to be more, uh, pleasant. But then I'm notoriously ungroomed and unfashionable so I suppose that preference must be a subconscious reflection of my man-hating-feminism and has nothing to do with personal experience.
Neko-Kawaii, just from seeing your siggy, you are totally NOT what I'm talking about. 'Ungroomed" and 'unfashionable' is not the same thing. Some like fashion and some do not, that's not the point. I am talking deliberately messy here. And I dont' even care about that, since it's a choice, so much as that they are continually bashing others for making different choices.
Your posts do not show the mindset I was discussing.
Please do not take offense and take me as 'feminist-bashing'--I think we can all agree that we want equal pay for equal work; education and the right not be beat up on or otherwise abused by the men in our lives and/or strange men. That is the true feminism. But there are people who define feminism as a lot more than that and who are about power and control through feminism and forcing opinions which may be against others' lifestyle or religion down everyone's throat, which many of us find distasteful. Just as there are people who are definitely anti-woman in the world still.
Let's agree to disagree and please do not take personal offense.

[massivecnqstdr]

I didn't say 'feminist I know'. I said 'female college professors I know, many many of whom are feminists'. These particular ladies, (sorry 'womyn' is the term they prefer) at the college where I teach are unkempt, proud of it, vocal about being proud of it and also very vocal about women who dress attractively (including most students, you should hear the remarks I hear in the professor's lounge).

They, not I, have made a dichotomy between women who dress attractively and behave traditionally ('unelightened' 'brainwashed' etc etc) and their intelligent and superior selves.

I did not say that these women were ugly. I did not say whether they had short or long hair. I did not say that they represent a majority of feminists. also I did not say that they don't have men. Some of them do. But they still spend a lot of time complaining that men's eyes tend to wander towards women who are what they themselves 'conventionally attractive' (something that takes work to manage) and they tend to behave very viciously towards such women.

to the point that (this is a true story), one of our students was inappropriately propositioned by a male professor and came to her female professor, who was one of this set, in tears. The prof told us proudly later in the lounge how she told the girl that her clothing choices caused the inappropriate behavior, and the set of them spent a long time discussing together how horribly the students dress and how inappropriately sexy they are, etc. etc. I heard of no help or suggestions for the young woman in question (though there is help available on campus).

Our students are Catholic by the way, and conservative and in no way are they dressed to inappropriately attact male attention, not that I think you should blame the woman for how she is dressed when some guy does something like this--in fact I thought that that was part of true feminism...

The feminism that is taught on my campus by the way has nothing to do with men and women having the same opportunities and equal pay for equal work and everything to do with nonsense such as that gender is a social construct and that men and women are exactly the same, and that men have been responsible for all the ills of the world for forever and are always in the wrong--but I won't go on with this, I'm at the point where I think its a threadjack.

Well, I'm really sorry the feminist base at your university is so crappy. That's really unfortunate, but it sounds like you are aware that they are not representative of feminism in general. People who go beyond equal rights and into the territory of hate give us all a bad name.

[neko_kawaii]

Neko-Kawaii, just from seeing your siggy, you are totally NOT what I'm talking about. 'Ungroomed" and 'unfashionable' is not the same thing. Some like fashion and some do not, that's not the point. I am talking deliberately messy here. And I dont' even care about that, since it's a choice, so much as that they are continually bashing others for making different choices.
Your posts do not show the mindset I was discussing.
Please do not take offense and take me as 'feminist-bashing'--I think we can all agree that we want equal pay for equal work; education and the right not be beat up on or otherwise abused by the men in our lives and/or strange men. That is the true feminism. But there are people who define feminism as a lot more than that and who are about power and control through feminism and forcing opinions which may be against others' lifestyle or religion down everyone's throat, which many of us find distasteful. Just as there are people who are definitely anti-woman in the world still.
Let's agree to disagree and please do not take personal offense.

Sorry, chen bao jun, I was poking fun at the bloggers, trying to see myself through their eyes while laughing at the absurdity of it. And I am ungroomed by many standards: I don't shave, pluck, thread or wax. The most I have to offer is a washed face and combed hair. My finger nails are clean only because I wash the dishes and have fewer opportunities to play in the dirt.

[WilfredAllen]

It sounds like he has a hair ******... and a sense of entitlement to having that ****** fulfilled!! I think that it's hilarious when men assume that all of women's behaviour is (or should be) constructed to make the woman more attractive to men.


People are funny. What a strange pocket of people

[FuzzyBlackWaves]

Disgusting, especially some of the comments. He's probably one of those MRA white boys who wear fedoras, who say they are the "nice guy" and complain and judge women because they can't get a date. When really they are "nice" just so they can get some and women are actually put off by his disgusting personality. It's why I don't trust guys who say they're a "nice guy" because they make a point of advertising it. I like guys who are naturally decent.

The guy probably thinks he is hilarious. Which is really, really sad if he considers opinions noteworthy.

Agreed on the nice guy thing. Every self proclaimed nice guy I've ever met has gone off on rants about what idiots women are for not picking them. Generally, if someone has to try hard to be something then 1) They're not that thing in the first place and 2) The mask is going to slip eventually.

[catamonica]

I read the article. He has a new article out. He like's long haired women. You are the one to decide how to wear your hair. But some opinion's just make me laugh.

[AnnaB]

The type of man who wrote that is the controlling, abusive bully of a boyfriend/husband/father we all try to avoid.

Some men think women are their property and what they think is how we should be. NO NO NO...I know there isn't much we can do about those disrespectful men but we are all going to have a judgment day in front the Lord, they will have to answer for their words and actions eventually. But that's just my way of thinking about it, otherwise I get too annoyed there are people like that and there isn't much I can do.

and for that guy's information, we can grow hair or cut it...but if he has a small manhood then...well he is stuck with it forever!! who's laughing now?

[Blond On Blond]

and for that guy's information, we can grow hair or cut it...but if he has a small manhood then...well he is stuck with it forever!! who's laughing now?

Seriously? :(

[vindo]

I had a good laugh :lol:.

Not taking this article too seriously.

This amused me too:


Athol is correct to point out the ulterior motive women have for praising women who chop their hair off, as it makes them look more attractive in comparison.
I do get that feeling sometimes. When women contemplate on cutting they are very much encouraged to do so!! "You will look ah-mah-zzzing!!" ;)

[hanyo]

Articles like this make me sad because I do not want men to be interested in me and my having and liking long hair may make them interested.

If I was doing my hair for men I'd just chop it all off or shave my head. I don't because I like my long hair and grew it out for me.

[PF Graham]

I'll dip my toe in to this boiling pond (but just my toe, nothing more).

Agreed, his article can be VERY off-putting (not to mention some of the truly insane / insulting comments).

Here's the question:
What's the difference, in context of this thread, of men only going out with women with large or augmented breasts AND what seems like women (generalization - off course) considering that (large breasts - real or otherwise) to be a normal male sexual desire VS men that only want to be with a partner with long hair and seeming to believe it's okay to ask them to keep it long?

I DON'T have an opinion about this one way or another but thought I would ask considering how upset some people are about the original post (link).

DISCLAIMER: I like long hair (why else would I be on this or the other site) but it's not the end of the world one way or another AND, I would never and have never asked a women to consider breast augmentation (one way or another).

[Bene]

I'll dip my toe in to this boiling pond (but just my toe, nothing more).

Agreed, his article can be VERY off-putting (not to mention some of the truly insane / insulting comments).

Here's the question:
What's the difference, in context of this thread, of men only going out with women with large or augmented breasts AND what seems like women (generalization - off course) considering that (large breasts - real or otherwise) to be a normal male sexual desire VS men that only want to be with a partner with long hair and seeming to believe it's okay to ask them to keep it long?

I DON'T have an opinion about this one way or another but thought I would ask considering how upset some people are about the original post (link).

DISCLAIMER: I like long hair (why else would I be on this or the other site) but it's not the end of the world one way or another AND, I would never and have never asked a women to consider breast augmentation (one way or another).



One is men who prefer to be with woman who have implants. It's a personal preference, cool. But that blog was telling women that they SHOULD grow out their hair and then using some questionable and demeaning justification for their demand. Because it wasn't just about liking long hair in women, it was about why women really shouldn't have a choice in the matter based on male opinion. In context of this thread, the equivalent would be if it were a blog post telling women they should have breast implants and why.


So, the difference is preference vs. prescriptive. One is easily about like and dislike, which doesn't matter in the long run. A man is free to choose who he dates, and it really isn't an issue because it's about his own choices. The other is the audacity to remove autonomous decisions about what they should do with their own bodies.

[PF Graham]

One is men who prefer to be with woman who have implants. It's a personal preference, cool. But that blog was telling women that they SHOULD grow out their hair and then using some questionable and demeaning justification for their demand. Because it wasn't just about liking long hair in women, it was about why women really shouldn't have a choice in the matter based on male opinion. In context of this thread, the equivalent would be if it were a blog post telling women they should have breast implants and why.


So, the difference is preference vs. prescriptive. One is easily about like and dislike, which doesn't matter in the long run. A man is free to choose who he dates, and it really isn't an issue because it's about his own choices. The other is the audacity to remove autonomous decisions about what they should do with their own bodies.

No, see, I get that. Actually, that's my exact point.

My question was all about equivalencies - why is one inappropriate and the other rooted in a social norm?

[Mesmerise]

Gah... well no comment. And I couldn't read all the comments either, didn't want to. I'm a current short hair, and it messes with my self image enough as it is right now!! Yes, I feel more attractive with long hair, and I think I look more attractive with long hair. Fortunately, my husband doesn't seem to care all that much that my hair is temporarily short. I did it to remove hair colour, because henna with gray/brown roots looks awful! Short gray/brown doesn't look awesome, but it also doesn't look like I've forgotten to colour for several months ;).

I shouldn't really care less what men think of my hair, but I find it sort of offensive that a guy who fancies a woman could just STOP cold because she cuts her hair short. Geez. I mean, what if she was his wife? Would he end his marriage over it? Or would he suddenly just go completely cold on her? I couldn't handle a man like that! It's based on something totally superficial... and I'd think a man who responded that badly to a hair cut, probably wouldn't appreciate stuff like, I dunno, weight gain? Wrinkles??

[Night_Kitten]

No, see, I get that. Actually, that's my exact point.

My question was all about equivalencies - why is one inappropriate and the other rooted in a social norm?

From my point of view, both are inappropriate. I have no idea why the other is rooted in social norm, but I think it shouldn't be, and am saddened it is and is considered acceptable... In my opinion any attempt to claim a person or a group of people have to look or behave a certain way and should have no personal choice about it because another person or group like/prefer it is fundamentally wrong...

[Wildcat Diva]

...
It's HARD to make your hair look like John Taylor from Duran Duran! LOL!*

ETA: *Wow..so much for my displeasure about being mistaken for a male. :p Being a Durannie was different.


Aw, I was a Durannie too!

[PF Graham]

From my point of view, both are inappropriate. I have no idea why the other is rooted in social norm, but I think it shouldn't be, and am saddened it is and is considered acceptable... In my opinion any attempt to claim a person or a group of people have to look or behave a certain way and should have no personal choice about it because another person or group like/prefer it is fundamentally wrong...

I couldn't agree more Night_Kitten but that doesn't negate the overarching issue, does it.

So be it.

[spirals]

I found the article and comments tongue-in-cheek hilarious. I can't take it seriously enough to be offended. Why can't I take it seriously? Because I don't care whether men find me hot or not, and I don't care what anyone, male or female, thinks of my hair (not that I don't appreciate compliments; I appreciate the hearts behind them :flowers: ). I'm ok with my appearance.

[henné]

Too much ado about nothing ... Try not to go out of your way to find things offensive, ladies.

[gus]

PF Graham, I read your question a few times and I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at? Which preference - for implants or for long hair - do you think society considers "normal"? And what do you believe should be considered normal?

[verylittlecarro]

Having clicked on the link I'm mostly annoyed at having unwittingly provided traffic to a mysogynistic MRA "game" website. The fact that such perturbing imbeciles exist is sad enough.
Seriously, anyone unaware of the underlying ethos behind sites like these would find it enlightening to google PUA (pick up artists) and their views on women if you have the stomach for it. Or spend a minute or two browsing his blog to get a feel for what he and his pals stand for. They don't try to hide it, it's immediately apparent what they believe.
Their opinions are not really worth a millisecond of my headspace.
Moving on...

[verylittlecarro]

Actually, I'm furious to have found myself on a game website from a lhc link, everything such sites stand for is repellent, vile, and offensive to me and I really want to report this thread to the mods to get it removed.

Can anyone help me out? I can't see a report thread button.

[PF Graham]

PF Graham, I read your question a few times and I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at? Which preference - for implants or for long hair - do you think society considers "normal"? And what do you believe should be considered normal?

Neither really - it's not my hair and it's not my breasts.

But to answer your question - society (today) thinks it's normal for men (almost exclusively) to apply some level of pressure for women to undergo breast augmentation.

Pressure comes in so many forms - magazine advertisements, television and films that seem to have a very specific 'type' of female that is usually cast, most (if not all) commercials, and, 10 gazillion websites promoting it.

[gus]

Ah, I see. Well, anthropologically, neither has been universally touted as beauty ideals throughout all of history - in different societies and at different times, pressure has existed for short hair to floor-length hair, from flat-chested to double-Ds.

I think what this all boils down to is, sadly, certain men who simply wish to control every aspect of a woman's life, including their appearance. It has very little to do with beauty standards and is much more about testing the limits of what a woman will do for her boyfriend/brother in order to please him.

[verylittlecarro]

I've reported this thread. I can see no reason for a thread which links to a male supremacist/ white supremacist website to remain. The author has plenty of other articles on his site expressing his opinion on how women are inferior, how some races are inferior, how to rape and otherwise abuse women.
Opinions such as his are not worthy of debate on a forum such as this.

[Nedertane]

I've reported this thread. I can see no reason for a thread which links to a male supremacist/ white supremacist website to remain. The author has plenty of other articles on his site expressing his opinion on how women are inferior, how some races are inferior, how to rape and otherwise abuse women.
Opinions such as his are not worthy of debate on a forum such as this.


Wait, what white supremacism? I mean, both of these bloggers are total wads, but they don't seem to comment on race, as far as I can see.

[RavennaNight]

Wait, what white supremacism? I mean, both of these bloggers are total wads, but they don't seem to comment on race, as far as I can see.

I think I know what she means. Is it the reference to "saving western civilization?" Because saying those three words, together, has recently come to also mean racism/nationalism and against immigration. I have seen this terminology used before in reference to European nationalism. Other than that, all I see is douchebaggy relationship advice.

Im surprised this thread is still so popular, at this point isn't it kinda

:horse:

[Cowgirl16]

Wow. The article and the comments... so misogysnistic and homophobic. Probably just a bunch of middle-aged conservative *******s that thinks everything women does is to please them... sorry, you're wrong. :rolleyes:

edit: omfg this whole site is making me so angry
here's a comment



OH YEAH WHAT A GOOD DEMONSTRATION I'M SO CONVINCED aaaaaah I'm boiling!!!!

I'm sure you didn't mean to say that; your comment was a tad offensive. There are conservative members on this site :)

[verylittlecarro]

Nedertane, search his site for the word race. He is of the opinion that races differ so much biologically that any under-representation or lack of success in society is down to innate inferiority of some races, rather than prejudice and disadvantage.
He doesn't believe in marital rape.
He doesn't believe women should vote.
He believes a viable approach to having sex with a woman is for a man to threaten violence enough that she submits to being raped rather than be beaten.
He considers himself a Christian, interestingly.

His views on women's hair are an indication of his wider views that women are inferior, virtueless sluts who should submit to alphamales such as himself. This isn't a thought provoking article about hair styles.

I mentioned his views on race, but he is far more verbose on the subject of his hatred and disdain for women. It's all there on his site. Seriously, how is this thread not deleted yet?

[massivecnqstdr]

@verylittlecarro, you do realize you've posted 4 times on this page..? We get it, you find this offensive. Clearly, almost every single person here did, too. But the OP was clearly not here to offend us. It's important to talk about this stuff. Misogyny is a cancer, and you can't just press "delete" to get rid of it. I am really happy we are all here talking about this subject. I feel better armed to deal with people like the blogger in real life.

[verylittlecarro]

At the risk of being told I've posted 5 times, (do I have a quota?) I'll answer you.
I don't believe the OP intended to offend. I'm not annoyed with the OP.
My last post was in answer to a question directed to me about whether the author was as racist as he is mysogynistic.
I agree that mysogyny is vile, should be discussed, and can't be deleted. I'm ready and prepared to do this when I'm posting on discussions about misogyny. I don't expect to encounter it in a thread about hair length.
I disagree that a thread linking to a woman hating, rape espousing blog with the intention of discussing the author's opinions on women's hair is appropriate here.
My understanding is that tlhc is a safe supportive space. I don't expect to click on links to vile racist, sexist, pornographic, disablist websites and then be asked "do they have a valid point, do we think?"

[massivecnqstdr]

The original link doesn't link you to the blog in it's entirety, it's a link to a specific blog post about hair. I hadn't even noted any racist comments on the website, because I wasn't linked to any. I'm not angry with your posts, I'm just always frustrated with flagging of posts in general. I think there are very few instances where it's necessary. I was definitely disturbed by the website, but I'm honestly GLAD I was linked to that article because it informed me of this whole "alpha" movement online that I was previously unaware of. It also got me to think a little bit about reasons why I'm growing out my hair. I will say that I wish the OP had more of a warning about what you'd be getting into by clicking the link. However, I don't think the link being here is inherently problematic. I understand your feeling of TLHC being a "safe space," but I DO feel safe when we are discussing problematic things from the other side of the fence, you know? I'm sorry we see it differently.

[PraiseCheeses]

Since this thread is still going, I'll chime in on a few of the issues that have come up:

1. I'm not offended the author expresses his opinion about being attracted to a certain aesthetic, and one that yes, happens to be mainstream.

2. I am, however, offended at the rest of his blog, which yes, I did poke through. In the context of phrases like "You notice how your hopes and dreams don't matter?" (the dateability score "article") and (paraphrasing here) "...only when we understand this will we be able to control female behavior" from some other entry - yes, I become offended, and that's really, really difficult to accomplish. :lol: I'm so grateful to have known and dated men who don't operate this way and hope and pray that all of you are as lucky.

3. The appropriateness of linking to the article: Awareness is good. I'd heard of "game" before and a bit about PUA and "negging", but this is the most in-depth look I've gotten. The more I know, the more I'll be able to recognize it and call it out. That's good. I'm informed, and informed is prepared.

However, I am concerned that most websites and blogs have a function that allows the owner to see what search terms led a reader to their site, and also exactly where they were linked from. We could have potentially led this creep directly to LHC... shudder:

[Yozhik]

^^ :agree:

Yes for everything you said, PraiseCheeses.

Also, since you mentioned negging, I thought this would be an appropriate place to link one of my all-time favorite xkcd comic (http://xkcd.com/1027/)s. :D

[maborosi]

So, just an FYI since I haven't seen it mentioned, the blog author can and possibly will be able to track the referrals back to this forum.

I honestly think if the link is going to be left up in the OP at all, it should be rerouted through another/proxy site, if that's possible.

Though I think the damage has probably been done already.

I think that it's pretty obvious that this guy and his views are vile and gross, so I don't really feel like re-iterating that.

~maborosi~

[Toadstool]

I'd never heard of any of this stuff- PUA, Game, negging. The internet can be a disturbing place.

[zombiedoll]

I've had very very short hair and long past my waist hair (and I always loved it either way). I certainly did not give a damn about any one else's opinion on it and I would not start to do that now.

That post and comments following it aggravated me to no end. Let people do what they want and if you do not have anything nice to say shut your cake hole!!!

[HairFaerie]

This actually happened to me in real life. I was married to someone when I had hair that was between BSL and waist. I decided to cut it to to shoulder. He literally stopped having sex with me and after a month, I asked him what the problem was. His response: "I am not attracted to short hair, I like long hair." My response: "Here's the divorce papers." End of that story!

I find it exceptionally shallow when someone bases their entire attraction on someone based on an attribute that can change (hair length, weight, etc.) Ummmm...if you don't love that person for EVERYTHING that they are (or vice versa) - you shouldn't be with them. The one judging based on hair length only is very shallow and will probably never know the meaning of love.

i can understand if someone has a preference (likes long hair or short hair, likes beard or no beards, tattoos or no tattoos, etc.) but to base your whole entire relationship around that physical attribute is very wrong, in my opinion. And unfortunately, it happens.

[Unofficial_Rose]

A comical (in my opinion) take on this subject is on the Daily Mash: "Mum hair actually designed to ward off men": http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/mum-hair-actually-designed-to-ward-off-men-2013030862130

[lapushka]

A comical (in my opinion) take on this subject is on the Daily Mash: "Mum hair actually designed to ward off men": http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/mum-hair-actually-designed-to-ward-off-men-2013030862130

LOL! :lol:

[chen bao jun]

Wow, so surprised this thread is still going on.
Dude lives in his mom's basement, can't get a date so fantasizes about what characteristics a woman would have that he would buy if women were still for sale at auction in the New Orleans market as they used to be pre-1865.
Feels sense of power writing about his fantasies online and sharing with group of losers just like him.
this is not threatening to me, dude is just pure and simply a loser. I doubt there are millions like him waiting to take over and turn the world into a misogynistic paradise. There are a few hundred out there and the internet makes it seem like they are more.
since the only women they ever dare to talk to are on the video games they play day and night, who cares, really?
Calling these idiots 'conservatives'--yes, that's offensive.

[TiaKitty]

Wait... you mean the world *isn't* a misogynistic paradise already?!?

[ChristineB]

I just like how guys think they can just say "Ladies, do this!" or "Don't do that, we don't like it", and expect all women to just fall down and worship the idea.

I have seen GORGEOUS women with short hair. And calling someone with long hair "plain"? Please. How ridiculous.