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summergreen
August 7th, 2013, 12:34 PM
I havent tried this yet - and if it's a disaster I'll be running straight back to the bathroom - but I was thinking of trying pre-oiling followed by shampoo but no conditioner. Does anyone else do this?

I've noticed that when I'm washing my hair, I lose a very few hairs during shampoo/rinse, and then a load during conditioning. Probably it's just that the loosened hairs get untangled at that stage, but it's started me thinking about the time Before Conditioner was invented! Photos and films of people in the sixties and early seventies seem to always show folks with tons of voluminous hair! I certainly had a load of hair myself as a child, when my hair was just shampooed once a week with nothing else - my hair got thinner when I was a teenager, which is when I started using conditioner.

I know there are lots of other reasons why hair (mine and general) might have seemed thicker back then - less additives in food, less hormones in the food chain, more use of backcombing and hairspray and setting lotion! Maybe I will be horrified by the sight of my hair without conditioner! But how did people keep their hair healthy before conditioner?! I'd love to hear other people's thoughts/experiences/knowledge about this :)

Perididdle
August 7th, 2013, 12:47 PM
There's a method based around this idea. I believe it involves adding coconut oil to the shampoo. Your process would basically condition the hair in the same order as if you did it in the shower with traditional methods, just with a very different timeline. Depending on what you want from your conditioner, I see no reason it couldn't work! How long are you letting the oil sit before washing?

meteor
August 7th, 2013, 01:17 PM
Every time I've done a heavy pre-shampoo oiling followed by shampoo and no conditioner, I was pleasantly surprised with the look of my hair - more bounce and shine, more volume but without the frizz.
The only problem is my hair is extremely tangly even with conditioner. However, very few conditioners give any noticeable slip/detangling properties, so I often omit them and use oils instead.

I think oiling hair a few hours before shampooing is superior to oil added to shampoo (a.k.a. oil shampoo), because oil doesn't sink into your hair immediately, it really takes time. Even water takes about 15 minutes to saturate your hair strands to the maximum.
If you oil your hair the night before you wash, you'll often see the oil get absorbed by the morning, which means it won't wash out as easily and will protect hair keratin.

summergreen
August 7th, 2013, 01:54 PM
There's a method based around this idea. I believe it involves adding coconut oil to the shampoo. Your process would basically condition the hair in the same order as if you did it in the shower with traditional methods, just with a very different timeline. Depending on what you want from your conditioner, I see no reason it couldn't work! How long are you letting the oil sit before washing?

Well, I have left oil (wheatgerm) on overnight, and I've left it on for 20-45 mins. I cant remember how much difference the overnight was (that was a while ago) but I get good results from the shorter time - however, so far I've always conditioned afterwards. That was putting the oil on dry hair; Ive also shampooed once, put coconut oil on for 30-60 minutes and then shampooed out followed by conditioner - that gave ok results but weighed my hair down a bit more. I'vew heard of the adding oil to shampoo thing - my hair's fine-ish and thinnish though, and straighter than I'd like it to be, so I'm not sure how that would work out for me - I'm assuming more oil gets left on the hair that way?

Thanks for your input :)

summergreen
August 7th, 2013, 02:02 PM
Every time I've done a heavy pre-shampoo oiling followed by shampoo and no conditioner, I was pleasantly surprised with the look of my hair - more bounce and shine, more volume but without the frizz.
The only problem is my hair is extremely tangly even with conditioner. However, very few conditioners give any noticeable slip/detangling properties, so I often omit them and use oils instead.

I think oiling hair a few hours before shampooing is superior to oil added to shampoo (a.k.a. oil shampoo), because oil doesn't sink into your hair immediately, it really takes time. Even water takes about 15 minutes to saturate your hair strands to the maximum.
If you oil your hair the night before you wash, you'll often see the oil get absorbed by the morning, which means it won't wash out as easily and will protect hair keratin.


Yay that's very encouraging! Volume, bounce and shine are what I need! (as well as hopefully more thickness in the long term!) I have noticed my hair's a lot more shiny after a pre-wash oiling.
Thanks for replying :)

Ashenputtel
August 7th, 2013, 02:09 PM
A lot of people don't use conditionner. I personnaly don't anymore. I use only shampoo on the roots only, heavy oiling only once a month and a rinse. You could try light pre-oiling, shampoo and then a rinse of your choice to start.

Leeloo
August 7th, 2013, 02:44 PM
I’m trying to switch to catnip rinse instead of a conditioner. There is thread here about it (there are a lot of details to it). It said that it would take a couple of months to be able to stop using conditioner.

AmyBeth
August 7th, 2013, 02:48 PM
I always do a pre-shampoo oiling. Whenever I attempt to go without a conditioner, my hair texture resembles cotton candy- way too light and tangle prone.

Emichiee
August 7th, 2013, 03:17 PM
I don't use conditioner most times! I wash with shampoo and thats it. My hair is not always pre-oiled either, I just really go by how my hair feels.
It certainly has not caused me any more splits, I have less splits than a year ago (due to bettering health mostly though).
Conditioner can make my ends really stringy and gunky so I try not to overdo it.

And yes, your thinning is most likely due to other factors. Unless you have been using a chemical and silicone laden conditioner and applied it directly to your scalp! There have been studies that conditioner to the scalp can cause hair thinning due to a process called protein denaturing.

Ravenwind
August 7th, 2013, 03:30 PM
The ends of my hair have a tendency of getting really dry, so I always use conditioner. Even when I'm washing out oil I still use conditioner. I just think it makes my hair look and feel nicer. If I don't use conditioner, it's like washing your clothes without softener. :P

catamonica
August 7th, 2013, 03:54 PM
I have to use conditioner. My hair would be dry. But I put two capfuls of olive oil in my shampoo & conditioner. It really softens your hair.

summergreen
August 7th, 2013, 03:54 PM
Oooh thanks for all the replies :)


A lot of people don't use conditionner. I personnaly don't anymore. I use only shampoo on the roots only, heavy oiling only once a month and a rinse. You could try light pre-oiling, shampoo and then a rinse of your choice to start.

Thats interesting - what do you use as rinse?


I’m trying to switch to catnip rinse instead of a conditioner. There is thread here about it (there are a lot of details to it). It said that it would take a couple of months to be able to stop using conditioner.

I've heard catnip is really good. I can't use it myself - my scalp hates all planty homemade stuff, grrrr! Why would it take time to be able to stop using conditioner, does your hair need to adjust gradually?


I always do a pre-shampoo oiling. Whenever I attempt to go without a conditioner, my hair texture resembles cotton candy- way too light and tangle prone.

I suspect I might be in for the cotton candy look too, I usually use quite a heavy conditioner to bulk the hair up a bit.


I don't use conditioner most times! I wash with shampoo and thats it. My hair is not always pre-oiled either, I just really go by how my hair feels.
It certainly has not caused me any more splits, I have less splits than a year ago (due to bettering health mostly though).
Conditioner can make my ends really stringy and gunky so I try not to overdo it.

And yes, your thinning is most likely due to other factors. Unless you have been using a chemical and silicone laden conditioner and applied it directly to your scalp! There have been studies that conditioner to the scalp can cause hair thinning due to a process called protein denaturing.

Oh that's interesting! No, I don't put conditioner near my scalp or roots.


The ends of my hair have a tendency of getting really dry, so I always use conditioner. Even when I'm washing out oil I still use conditioner. I just think it makes my hair look and feel nicer. If I don't use conditioner, it's like washing your clothes without softener. :P

Funny you should say that as I've just stopped using softener! :) I used to get very dry ends when my hair was coloured and I would put extra conditioner on as a leave in (diluted) - I guess I could try just doing that if no conditioner didn't work out.

summergreen
August 7th, 2013, 04:00 PM
I have to use conditioner. My hair would be dry. But I put two capfuls of olive oil in my shampoo & conditioner. It really softens your hair.

I haven't tried olive oil on my hair yet, it's good for so many things though isn't it! Does it make the roots heavy/limp if you put it in a shampoo?

catamonica
August 7th, 2013, 04:18 PM
The olive oil doesn't make my roots heavy or limp. It's good for dry ends to. And I put a capful in my face cream. It help's wrinkles & makes your skin softer.

summergreen
August 7th, 2013, 04:37 PM
The olive oil doesn't make my roots heavy or limp. It's good for dry ends to. And I put a capful in my face cream. It help's wrinkles & makes your skin softer.

Sounds good, I'll have to try it! :)

AngryVikingGirl
August 7th, 2013, 05:04 PM
I don't use conditioner, but my shampoo is very mild I think. It's herbal and probably works as a condish too. I'm absolutely happy with it.

Carolyn
August 7th, 2013, 06:24 PM
I would never be able to detangle and comb my hair after washing it if I didn't use conditioner. And a boatload of it too! After I've oiled my hair I like to wash it out using the CO method. It seems to get my hair cleaner than S & C.

I should also mention that many people here had disastrous results when they tried the coconut oil shampoo method. If you are thinking of trying it I would advise reading the whole long thread about it. And then proceed cautiously if you decide you want to venture down that road.

Carolyn
August 7th, 2013, 06:25 PM
Oopsie! Double post. Sorry about that.

Calaelen
August 7th, 2013, 08:48 PM
I have only used conditioner about three times in the last few years. Conditioners do serve a purpose in that they sort of fix pH after shampoo. Shampoo is very alkaline, and conditioners are usually acidic so it evens out out a bit. That said, unless the product claims to be pH balancing it likely is still off. I wash with the most natural sulphate free shampoo I can find, or my miracle egg mixture and rinse with ACV. I never lose hair in the the shower and find the acid rinse makes my hair so soft (and not lank or weighed down as conditioner leaves it I have fine hair but a lot of it).
Definitely, different hair types benefit from different routines, but it is worth a try. I would just say experiment with acid rinses if you find your hair seems dry or crunchy sans conditioner.

HintOfMint
August 7th, 2013, 10:38 PM
According to my mother, heavy oiling before a shampoo without conditioner was/is a fairly common way to wash one's hair in India. My mom didn't grow up using conditioner at all, and to this day she's still a little skeptical of the concept, haha. Granted, she's had a bob for coming up on half her life now and kinda gave up on the routine coconut oilings, but she still considers it THE way to treat hair when you have enough of it.

starlamelissa
August 8th, 2013, 07:06 AM
I do find conditioner an important part of hair care. I prefer cones, but i like cone free v05 a lot too. For my hair, conditioner adds more benefits than oil, honestly.

My love of conditioner could be tied to my love of sulphate shampoos. I love a good cheap foamy shampoo.

Ashenputtel
August 8th, 2013, 07:43 AM
Oooh thanks for all the replies :)



Thats interesting - what do you use as rinse?

I've heard catnip is really good. I can't use it myself - my scalp hates all planty homemade stuff, grrrr! Why would it take time to be able to stop using conditioner, does your hair need to adjust gradually?

I also use catnip now. But you can always just dip your ponytail in it and bag it for at least 30 min. I also used a acv, diluted beer (don't want to put too much money in your hair either!) and honey rinse. With the honey I used one teaspoon microwaved for 10 secs to avoid bleaching, and then mix it in water. Bagged for 10 minutes and then a final rinse.

You can also use condish before shampoo, rinse and then shampoo the roots only.

savfairy
August 8th, 2013, 11:42 AM
I have recently stopped conditioning due to the fragrances irritating my scalp (I have sensitive skin and fragrance allergies) and my hair becoming oily very quickly. I don't wash until I feel my scalp is naturally oily enough, then I use a non-sulfate shampoo to wash just the roots. This usually ends up resulting in me washing my hair once or twice a week. I surprisingly have less tangles now and my hair feels a lot better. I also feel I can stretch my washes more without my hair looking weighed down. However I have 1b hair, and it's about medium thickness so this may not work for every hair type, but it works for me. :) Best of luck to you! :blossom:

Panth
August 8th, 2013, 11:57 AM
I have only used conditioner about three times in the last few years. Conditioners do serve a purpose in that they sort of fix pH after shampoo. Shampoo is very alkaline, and conditioners are usually acidic so it evens out out a bit.

I'm fairly sure this is incorrect. Shampoo is acidic. Soap, however, is alkaline. Likewise, baby shampoo is alkaline which is what makes it "no tears".

summergreen
August 8th, 2013, 12:26 PM
Great replies, thanks everyone for your input :)


I don't use conditioner, but my shampoo is very mild I think. It's herbal and probably works as a condish too. I'm absolutely happy with it.

That's encouraging! I have Jason Vitamin E shampoo which I think is pretty gentle, it certainly doesn't seem to strip the hair of oils.


I would never be able to detangle and comb my hair after washing it if I didn't use conditioner. And a boatload of it too! After I've oiled my hair I like to wash it out using the CO method. It seems to get my hair cleaner than S & C.

I should also mention that many people here had disastrous results when they tried the coconut oil shampoo method. If you are thinking of trying it I would advise reading the whole long thread about it. And then proceed cautiously if you decide you want to venture down that road.

Yikes! Thanks for the heads up! I will check out the thread.


I have only used conditioner about three times in the last few years. Conditioners do serve a purpose in that they sort of fix pH after shampoo. Shampoo is very alkaline, and conditioners are usually acidic so it evens out out a bit. That said, unless the product claims to be pH balancing it likely is still off. I wash with the most natural sulphate free shampoo I can find, or my miracle egg mixture and rinse with ACV. I never lose hair in the the shower and find the acid rinse makes my hair so soft (and not lank or weighed down as conditioner leaves it I have fine hair but a lot of it).
Definitely, different hair types benefit from different routines, but it is worth a try. I would just say experiment with acid rinses if you find your hair seems dry or crunchy sans conditioner.

I'm going to have to check out the sulphate free shampoos, I've tried on before (Allergenics) and the results weren't great, but I'm sure there'd be some that would suit my hair. I've been thinking about the Dr Bronners rinses; I know some people use DB soap on their hair, which I might try one day, and the soap always makes my skin feel great, so I have faith in the brand :)


According to my mother, heavy oiling before a shampoo without conditioner was/is a fairly common way to wash one's hair in India. My mom didn't grow up using conditioner at all, and to this day she's still a little skeptical of the concept, haha. Granted, she's had a bob for coming up on half her life now and kinda gave up on the routine coconut oilings, but she still considers it THE way to treat hair when you have enough of it.

That's encouraging too!


I do find conditioner an important part of hair care. I prefer cones, but i like cone free v05 a lot too. For my hair, conditioner adds more benefits than oil, honestly.

My love of conditioner could be tied to my love of sulphate shampoos. I love a good cheap foamy shampoo.

I love sulphate shampoos too *sigh* they're great for root lift! Can always go back to the old way if milder ones don't work for me...


I also use catnip now. But you can always just dip your ponytail in it and bag it for at least 30 min. I also used a acv, diluted beer (don't want to put too much money in your hair either!) and honey rinse. With the honey I used one teaspoon microwaved for 10 secs to avoid bleaching, and then mix it in water. Bagged for 10 minutes and then a final rinse.

You can also use condish before shampoo, rinse and then shampoo the roots only.

That is a brilliant suggestion about dipping ponytail in catnip, thanks! And thanks for reminding me about beer rinsing! I've never tried it but I used Linco Beer shampoo for years and loved it, it did make my hair more bouncy than other shampoos. I remember the ads in the early 70s likening it to a beer rinse! It's been discontinued now; Lush do a beer shampoo though. I might well try a beer rinse!


I have recently stopped conditioning due to the fragrances irritating my scalp (I have sensitive skin and fragrance allergies) and my hair becoming oily very quickly. I don't wash until I feel my scalp is naturally oily enough, then I use a non-sulfate shampoo to wash just the roots. This usually ends up resulting in me washing my hair once or twice a week. I surprisingly have less tangles now and my hair feels a lot better. I also feel I can stretch my washes more without my hair looking weighed down. However I have 1b hair, and it's about medium thickness so this may not work for every hair type, but it works for me. :) Best of luck to you! :blossom:

Thanks :) I hadn't thought about tangles...my hair is 1b or maybe 1c, but it does sometimes get tangly at the nape or the very ends when I'm braiding it for waves.


I'm fairly sure this is incorrect. Shampoo is acidic. Soap, however, is alkaline. Likewise, baby shampoo is alkaline which is what makes it "no tears".

That's interesting...I'm going to look out for ph balanced shampoos!

Sharysa
August 9th, 2013, 09:48 PM
Conditioner is REALLY important for me. My hair is 1c/2a almost wavy, so it tends to dry out easily. If I didn't have conditioner as well as do a post-shower oiling, I shudder to think how frizzy my hair is.

summergreen
August 10th, 2013, 04:27 PM
Conditioner is REALLY important for me. My hair is 1c/2a almost wavy, so it tends to dry out easily. If I didn't have conditioner as well as do a post-shower oiling, I shudder to think how frizzy my hair is.

I washed my hair today with no conditioner, with a heavy oiling before. And yes my hair is frizzy! Maybe it'll calm down in a couple of days?! On the plus side it does feel as strong as a horsey's tail :) - but it did with a pre-oiling and conditioner last time I washed it. I didn't have a rinse for it though, so just gave it a quick blast with cold water at the end; I'd like to try again with a beer rinse.

WilfredAllen
August 10th, 2013, 05:07 PM
I haven't used conditioner for about a month and a half now. I don't used oil either (my hair doesn't like it). I use a *very* diluted SLS-shampoo rinse on my scalp once a week (a couple drops in a 250mL of water maybe?). So far my hair is the nicest that I have ever seen it, but then again, everyone's hair is different. If you can run your fingers easily through your wet hair post-shampoo, I think you should be okay.

lapushka
August 10th, 2013, 05:24 PM
My hair is waist. I have knots when we don't condition, and we even condition twice!