Salicylic hair products

[massivecnqstdr]

I'm going more natural with my hair product ingredients, and as I look for something natural to replace my Head and Shoulders (which I use for tight, itchy scalp- no flakes), I've noticed that most of the shampoos have salicylic acid instead of the zinc stuff. I am familiar with what salicylic can do for acne and clogged pores, but I'm curious as to how it affects the scalp.
Is it a good ingredient to try?
Is it acceptable for a dry/tight scalp?
Will it help or hurt growth rate?
Any specific brand recommendations?

[Firefox7275]

What is your medical diagnosis, xerosis (simple dry scalp), seborrhoeic dermatitis (yeast overgrowth leading to dandruff, usually greasy), contact dermatitis or something else? Head & Shoulders is for SD not really xerosis or another form of dermatitis. What works depends entirely on what you are addressing - zinc works by stopping yeast growing and is also soothing (traditional ingredient in diaper creams), salicylic acid is oil soluble so VERY drying, works by loosening scales from the scalp (keratolytic) and is usually used in psoriasis and SD.

[massivecnqstdr]

I don't have a medical diagnosis, unfortunately. Definitely not seborrhoeic dermatitis. I bought the H&S Itchy Scalp because there were reviews on amazon from people with similar scalp symptoms to mine. However, if I use it often, its pretty drying (not surprising, as it has a lot of detergent action).
So salicylic would dry me out further? I use it on my face and get quite dry from that unless I follow with an oil-based moisturizer, in which case it seems really balanced.
All of my body skin and scalp are relieved by use of squalane, so I suspect I have a lipid barrier/fats issue. I try to eat more healthy fats, but I don't digest any fats particularly well. Hopefully that helps narrow down the medical prognosis. I haven't been interested in going to the doctor for it, as I haven't had good luck with doctors for any issue.

[Firefox7275]

I don't have a medical diagnosis, unfortunately. Definitely not seborrhoeic dermatitis. I bought the H&S Itchy Scalp because there were reviews on amazon from people with similar scalp symptoms to mine. However, if I use it often, its pretty drying (not surprising, as it has a lot of detergent action).
So salicylic would dry me out further? I use it on my face and get quite dry from that unless I follow with an oil-based moisturizer, in which case it seems really balanced.
All of my body skin and scalp are relieved by use of squalane, so I suspect I have a lipid barrier/fats issue. I try to eat more healthy fats, but I don't digest any fats particularly well. Hopefully that helps narrow down the medical prognosis. I haven't been interested in going to the doctor for it, as I haven't had good luck with doctors for any issue.

Squalane is a lovely oil which I always forget about, it can be used on hair apparently so potentially useful for the scalp. Do be aware tho part of the reason oils and butter can be effective is that they simply act as a barrier, protecting the skin from other products - using shea butter was how I realised shampoo bubbles were triggering my atopic eczema, shea wasn't miraculously healing or calming inflammation better than my strong prescription steroid cream, it was just a highly effective protective 'waxy' barrier!

How are you with conditioner only washing? Doctors are useful for diagnosing, it's then possible to work on self treating because a lot of published research is available online, abstracts if not the full study or review. Sulphate surfactants are proven to thin and dehydrate the skin so disaster for dry or irritated skin http://www.eczema.org/aqeous

Are you eating oily fish daily and/ or taking a high strength omega-3/ bioavailable vitamin D supplement? The oiliest fish include sardines/ pilchards, herring and mackerel. You can buy triple strength fish body oil capsules fairly cheaply, which means you wouldn't have to pop so many as a single strength product. The omega-6 GLA in borage oil is also anti inflammatory (most omega-6s are pro inflammatory).

For skin urea or lactic acid are nice alternatives to salicylic acid, both hydrate as they gently exfoliate and are naturally found in healthy skin. For what you say your scalp doesn't need exfoliating from salicylic acid, it needs hydrating, the skin barrier strengthening so it can hold water effectively, possibly anti inflammatories - aloe vera inner leaf gel might be worth looking for, it has a lot of research backing it.

Sorry if I am repeating myself, I easily forget names and usernames due to my own heath issues/ medication so only just realised we have been posting on another thread!

[massivecnqstdr]

I just bought fish and fish oils to take. I have not done much of that before because I feel guilty - I am pretty into living minimally and reducing my carbon footprint, so buying fish products in Kansas really goes against my instincts!
I used to co-wash only, but now that I watched that trichologist video someone posted about co-washing, I feel super confused about whether or not its beneficial. I wish I could remember the name of the thread.. but here's the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3n6FSeC34c
Since I have experienced some hair loss, I'm very paranoid about anything inhibiting growth. She scared me by talking about scalp build up and pathogens and whatnot..

[Firefox7275]

I just bought fish and fish oils to take. I have not done much of that before because I feel guilty - I am pretty into living minimally and reducing my carbon footprint, so buying fish products in Kansas really goes against my instincts!
I used to co-wash only, but now that I watched that trichologist video someone posted about co-washing, I feel super confused about whether or not its beneficial. I wish I could remember the name of the thread.. but here's the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3n6FSeC34c
Since I have experienced some hair loss, I'm very paranoid about anything inhibiting growth. She scared me by talking about scalp build up and pathogens and whatnot..

I saw that, also noted she refers to 'natural' women which usually refers to those of Afro-Carribbean heritage who do not relax their hair, I wonder at the ethnic mix of her client base and therefore the applicability of her claims to other ethnic groups and hair types. She's also looking at a subset within a subset, people go to trichologists when they have a dermatological complaint, many of which have a genetic basis. I don't recommend to those diagnosed with psoriasis or seborrhoeic dermatitis conditioner only wash, some choose to successfully but quitting shampoos can have unpredictable results in such conditions.

From curly forums and YouTube I've learned a few things - those with kinky coily hair often have less greasy scalps and wash their hair less often than caucasians, their hair can be very dense and their scalps more difficult to access for effective massage and rinsing. Many wash in sections, shea and other butters which can build up and can feed the malassezia yeast in SD, as is olive oil which contains oleic acid a known irritant in SD and these are even used in cleansers which doesn't make a lot of sense to me, regular scalp oiling or daily conditioning without washing the hair is common. A combination of a couple of these might cause issues with build up, failure to cleanse effectively, 'feeding' harmful bacteria or yeasts in a minority of people. Some long hairs have the same issues and same solutions.

Dermatologists have people with atopic eczema - who are at increased risk of infection and experiencing both dehydration and inflammation - cleanse their face and body with lotions or creams which contain much the same ingredients as a cleansing conditioner - surfactants/ emulsifiers, these are absolutely capable of effective but gentle cleansing! Research also links sulphate shampoos with hair loss in susceptible individuals via irritation/ inflammation, we didn't evolve needing shampoo any more than we evolved conditioner only washing. We did evolve with a protective acid mantle on our skin and were using very mild acidic plant extracts like soapwort since the stone age, we also evolved eating fish and seafood on a daily basis. Diet and lifestyle affects the amount and composition of our sebum and strength of our skin barrier and this interacts with the products we expose our skin and hair to.

[massivecnqstdr]

Well, do you think some of the more minimal styles of hair washing are worth looking into, then? Like plant/powder washes or water only?

[Firefox7275]

Well, do you think some of the more minimal styles of hair washing are worth looking into, then? Like plant/powder washes or water only?

Depends on the diagnosis: some conditions the sebum itself irritates the skin so water only could be a disaster, too much 'wetting'/ soaking flushes out the skin's Natural Moisturising Factors which is a particular problem in some forms of dermatitis, others will be sensitive to the many proteins and other (natural) chemicals in herbs. If it were me I would focus on strengthening the skin's barrier function with an anti inflammatory nutrient dense diet, super gentle ingredients, pH 4.5 to 5.5 only. Anionic surfactants and anything alkaline would not touch my skin. If I did use plant extracts they would the hypoallergenic/ low irritant versions such as standardised aloe vera inner leaf gel.

[massivecnqstdr]

Well, I should mention that my hair gets either shampoo washed or conditioner washed every single day, sometimes more if I go to the gym. I still have very short hair, and slept on hair is just absolutely impossible for me to salvage.

[massivecnqstdr]

Because of the messy look, btw. Not because of oil. My hair never gets oily.. I wish it did!