stuck at a plateau - ends are always damaged

[happybear]

Ok, some info about my hair

so for the past few years I have been trying to get my hair healthy again. 2 years ago i stopped using hair dryers, harsh styling techniques. My hair was dry and frazzled, and the curls didn't curl right anymore.
It is very very fine and wispy and fragile. My hair has slowly thinned for over a decade due to an undiagnosed thyroid issue and chronic anemia. Both of these issues are being addressed now, and i have notice lots of new hair growth over the past year. My part is not as wide looking, and the bald-ish spot on my scalp is totally filled in. I have also been using castor oil, though i have not used it regulary in a few months.

during this 2 year period, my hair has never been longer than shoulder lenght. I dyed it with henna, so that as the henna grew out, I would be able to tell where the new growth started, so I could track its health. The henna grew out completely about a year ago and the new hair was really healthy, but i have this issue with my ends, the last inch or so of my hair is always really dry. I have to keep trimming it at my shoulder because the ends are gross!

I really want to start growing is past my shoulder but the ends are crap, and i am unsure what to do. I have to wash everyday, i use a mild non sls shampoo and alternate with soapnut liquid. I use tresemme natural non cone condish, I only wash the scalp, I let it air dry and then twist it up and leave it like that until bed time. I brush it gently.

The only think i can think that might be causing the damage is that i tend to wash my scalp in the shower and i use hotter water, (not scalding, but not luke warm either). could that really be causing my ends to be gross?

A year ago, i washed in a wash basin every day with warm water but i still had damaged ends then too, soo...

Should i maybe just use a shower cap in the shower to protect my hair, and then take it off right at the end to shampoo, that way my hair won't be exposed to the hot water as long?

are their any other tips that might help me protect my ends?

[Firefox7275]

Do you literally use a basic shampoo and basic rinse out conditioner, no other products or treatments? Beneficial ingredients for patching and strengthening damaged, porous or fine hair include hydrolysed proteins, coconut oil, ceramides and panthenol. How long since the last of the henna went? Have you considered henna glosses for strength without intense colour?

How often are you washing or wetting your hair? Is your up do loose, your tools gentle, do you change up the style regularly or is it the same stresses day in and day out? Could you comb instead of brushing given your hair is naturally curly? Are you conscientiously protecting your hair from sunlight and using a satin pillowcase? I'm not saying the problem is as simple as something you are doing 'wrong' but your hair is naturally fragile due to your health issues so even 'normal' stresses could be too much.

Are you sure you are trimming off ALL the damage each time? If you don't the damage can travel up the hair, or the ends can snarl on healthy growth higher up damaging that. Depending on your budget you might have a detailed hair analysis http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=626329

[Magalo]

I think you should stop trimming and let it gain length. Wear it up so you don't see the ends. Wait for it to be APL, BSL, whatever: then trim an inch or two. It's what I would try.

[happybear]

Do you literally use a basic shampoo and basic rinse out conditioner, no other products or treatments? Beneficial ingredients for patching and strengthening damaged, porous or fine hair include hydrolysed proteins, coconut oil, ceramides and panthenol. How long since the last of the henna went? Have you considered henna glosses for strength without intense colour?

How often are you washing or wetting your hair? Is your up do loose, your tools gentle, do you change up the style regularly or is it the same stresses day in and day out? Could you comb instead of brushing given your hair is naturally curly? Are you conscientiously protecting your hair from sunlight and using a satin pillowcase? I'm not saying the problem is as simple as something you are doing 'wrong' but your hair is naturally fragile due to your health issues so even 'normal' stresses could be too much.

Are you sure you are trimming off ALL the damage each time? If you don't the damage can travel up the hair, or the ends can snarl on healthy growth higher up damaging that. Depending on your budget you might have a detailed hair analysis http://www.longhaircareforum.com/sho...d.php?t=626329

for about a year, i did SMT's and protein treatments (gelatine) frequently, but for the last year it has mostly been beneign neglect. I still had end damage with the above two treatments. For awhile i was COing, but i foun my hair would get too moisturized, so i would have to counteract it with gelatine treatments, after awhile i got tired of doing this, and i felt my scalp was getting weird from the CO, so i switched back to mild shampoo. I tried coconut oil a few times but the crunchy feeling creeped me out. so then switched to gelatine, i should probably do it more regularly.

The henna ended a year ago, and for awhile i was doing cassia/amla treaments periodically, then i ran out and didn't order any for months. I got some last week again but haven't had a chance to do a treatment yet. I tried henna gloss once and it was weird. The henna didn't mix right with the CO, it was super drippy and it seemed like the henna and CO would seperate....so i never did it again, maybe i should try a diff CO?

I wash/wet once a day for about 10 min. I wear it up with a plastic clip thing (I don't know what it's called but there are no teeth or metal parts on it), the same everyday, I part it the same everyday too. It is up loosely, but I do use a bobby pin on either side of each ear to keep my sides from slipping out of the clip...my hair is really slippery.

It gets 30-60 minutes of sun a day. roughly, some days it isn't sunny. I comb it when wet, and brush gently with BBB before washing. I don't comb or brush after it is dry until i wash it.

when i trimm, it is usually after a few months and i trim a lot of it off, so that it is above the shoulder, i get all that damage off. That's why it is so frustrating that within 2-3 months, the ends are all crappy again

I don't use a satin pillow case cause im a drooler, maybe i should get a sleep cap.

Ok, so i'm gonna try a sleep cap, more frequent protein and cassia treatments, and wear a shower cap and back to washing in the wash basin with cooler water.


I think you should stop trimming and let it gain length. Wear it up so you don't see the ends. Wait for it to be APL, BSL, whatever: then trim an inch or two. It's what I would try.

Ya, that is probably worth a try

[winship2]

Could your ends be dry and tangled from protein? Have you given clarifying followed by moisturizing a try? I had bad ends for a while and they cleared up with avoiding protein, gently washing only the scalp (allowing the liquid to drain through the rest of my hair), and oiling my ends with a drop of 100% argan oil followed by bunning while just a little damp. I really hope you find a solution!

[The-Young-Maid]

I second winsip2, I think your hair might be sensitive to protein. My ends became dry and velcro like when I tried coconut oil and other protein-rich products. I think clarifying followed by moisturizing would be beneficial for your ends.

[10000days]

I think you should stop trimming and let it gain length. Wear it up so you don't see the ends. Wait for it to be APL, BSL, whatever: then trim an inch or two. It's what I would try.
I also have dryness issues (I used to bleach my hair). I agree with letting it grow; let the ends be dry and damaged for a while because the ends always get a little ruined from daily wear and tear. If you keep trimming, the newly-trimmed perfect ends will also get damaged by daily wear and tear; so maybe sacrifice the ends you have now, let them suffer for a bit, then when your hair is longer chop them off. I also agree with not using protein, and using argan oil on damp hair.

I also use a spray bottle with a tablespoon of aloe vera gel, a teaspoon of a leave-in conditioner or a few drops of EVOO or argan oil. Spray that in to damp and dry hair throughout the day; it really help to keep it moisturised.

[Silverbrumby]

Protein does that to my ends as well. I'd get some shea butter and apply the smallest tiny bit to the ends. Bun or braid it and push through the urge to cut it for another two months. Then trim.

[DancingQueen]

How often do you trim your hair? Maybe I missed it, but depending on your hairtype, you may need to trim a little more. Personally, I need to take 1 cm every 3 months. You may need to go even less than that. Wearing it up is also a good idea; maybe some protective updos will help. :)

[Firefox7275]

for about a year, i did SMT's and protein treatments (gelatine) frequently, but for the last year it has mostly been beneign neglect. I still had end damage with the above two treatments. For awhile i was COing, but i foun my hair would get too moisturized, so i would have to counteract it with gelatine treatments, after awhile i got tired of doing this, and i felt my scalp was getting weird from the CO, so i switched back to mild shampoo. I tried coconut oil a few times but the crunchy feeling creeped me out. so then switched to gelatine, i should probably do it more regularly.

The henna ended a year ago, and for awhile i was doing cassia/amla treaments periodically, then i ran out and didn't order any for months. I got some last week again but haven't had a chance to do a treatment yet. I tried henna gloss once and it was weird. The henna didn't mix right with the CO, it was super drippy and it seemed like the henna and CO would seperate....so i never did it again, maybe i should try a diff CO?

I wash/wet once a day for about 10 min. I wear it up with a plastic clip thing (I don't know what it's called but there are no teeth or metal parts on it), the same everyday, I part it the same everyday too. It is up loosely, but I do use a bobby pin on either side of each ear to keep my sides from slipping out of the clip...my hair is really slippery.

It gets 30-60 minutes of sun a day. roughly, some days it isn't sunny. I comb it when wet, and brush gently with BBB before washing. I don't comb or brush after it is dry until i wash it.

when i trimm, it is usually after a few months and i trim a lot of it off, so that it is above the shoulder, i get all that damage off. That's why it is so frustrating that within 2-3 months, the ends are all crappy again

I don't use a satin pillow case cause im a drooler, maybe i should get a sleep cap.

Ok, so i'm gonna try a sleep cap, more frequent protein and cassia treatments, and wear a shower cap and back to washing in the wash basin with cooler water.



Ya, that is probably worth a try

Nothing will permanently repair your ends since hair is dead, what you can do is patch repair the damage protecting it from further damage but it's best to be consistent with that not all or nothing. So you were using neat protein and neat coconut oil? That does not suit many people maybe try them as ingredients, they are highly beneficial in moderation and balanced out with emollients and humectants. SMTs are hydrating but won't patch repair or protect damaged ends.

Can you protect your hair from the sun with a UV bandana? One hour of sunlight a day is a lot, UV light blows holes in the cortex, increasing porosity and breaks down the lipid glue holding the cuticle together. The ingredients I listed can either help protect from UV damage or patch repair afterwards.

Daily washing is also damaging particularly in hair that is already damaged or porous (hygral fatigue), could you stretch washes to alternate days?

[NymphSpirit]

Only one piece of advice: stop trimming back to shoulder!!! Your ends will ALWAYS be damaged otherwise because it's the length itself that causes the damage, I know because that's exactly what happened to me! Once I stopped trimming the ends, in 6 months my hair was past shoulder and the damage ceased, if you keep pushing your ends back to where your shoulders are, which is the most damaging length of all for fine hair imo, you're never going to be able to grow it any longer, you need to ignore the damage for some time, then you could trim every month for some time to get rid of the SL induced damage, but once you're past it (and by past it I mean longish APL)

[spirals]

^ I agree. My ends are always damaged because of previous dye, but the damage has stayed to the last 2 inches or so. I don't really trim, only 3 times in the last year, at a grand total of 1/2". I do S&D and totally baby my ends. One thing I do after putting in twin braids for the night is to dab some coconut or grapeseed oil on the tassels and then carefully comb through with a fine-toothed comb to make sure they get saturated. Another thing that was helping was to use catnip tea in a spray bottle to detangle. I haven't done it in a couple of weeks because I gave my bottle away, so I've been using an oiled comb, and that works, too. But the catnip stopped the breakage, so I need to get a new spray bottle and start again.

[battles]

My ends always feel slightly crunchy and damaged (even after being trimmed), but they feel much better when I keep up with shampoo bars and diluted vinegar rinses for a wash method. Have you given vinegar rinses a try?

I'd agree with giving sleep caps a try. :) If you're near a Walmart, they have inexpensive ones in the ethnic haircare section.

[missfaroe]

My ends does always feels crunchie, even after a trim. I hated it when i went to the hairdressers and she looked at my ends and said "look at these dead ends! They need to be trimmed of". But I always knew I would have Nice and soft ends for less than a week before the "new" ends would become dry and crunchy like before the trim. :rolleyes:

My advice is the same as some of the others have already Said; stop trimming all your growth, maybe start microtrimming instead. :o

[Quahatundightu]

Another recommendation for microtrims. You can read my whole saga in the thread linked in my signature if you want. Basically my hair seemed to stop growing and the ends were more damaged than I had realised. Cutting a little at a time helped a lot compared to chopping off more at once.

I also think you might have dry hair due to too much protein. When you take an individual hair and try to stretch it, does it snap quickly rather than stretching a long way? This can be a sign of lack of moisture or too much protein.

Catnip tea is great for dry ends as well.

Good luck!

[jacqueline101]

I'd let it grow and see what happends.

[spidermom]

1) Wash every other day.
2) Use a bit of coney serum on damp ends to protect them.

[Magalo]

I agree that shoulder is such a damaging length! Once it's past shoulder it's a lot easier.

[UP Lisa]

For me, wearing it up, and not using shampoo every day really helps. Try to always be gentle with your hair. Only condition the ends if the rest gets oily. Use corn starch or dry shampoo on the days you don't wash.

[Anje]

Echoing most everyone else here... start with letting your hair grow past shoulder. Don't lean on it and don't let it get caught under the straps of purses, seatbelts, backpacks, whatever.

I get bad ends if I use products with any protein at all with any regularity. They get rough, velcroy, and start sticking to each other. I also happen to get that from at least some silicones. Not everyone does, but it's worth ruling out.

Try clarifying, if it's been a while. Try a different conditioner -- I know my hair was quite unhappy with the one you're using. Try showering by first washing your hair and putting the conditioner in, then put it in a shower cap to prevent the conditioner from rinsing out while your wash your body. That'll also keep your soap out of your hair and away from your ends, and it'll give your hair a longer time to soak in conditioner.

[Firefox7275]

The OP said "I have to wash everyday, i use a mild non sls shampoo and alternate with soapnut liquid. I use tresemme natural non cone condish, I only wash the scalp, I let it air dry and then twist it up and leave it like that until bed time. I brush it gently."

And also "I wear it up with a plastic clip thing (I don't know what it's called but there are no teeth or metal parts on it), the same everyday, I part it the same everyday too. It is up loosely, but I do use a bobby pin on either side of each ear to keep my sides from slipping out of the clip...my hair is really slippery."

I can see how shoulder length might be high risk if you wear rougher clothing, are not cautious with purase straps or seatbelt or leave your hair loose, but how is the length relevant when the OP practices protective styling (in theory, IME it's not wise to do the same thing day in and day out) most of the time?

[dulce]

Hair dye of any sort started to damage my hair,once I stopped all dyes and my damaged dyed hair grew out and was cut off,I was astounded to see how much thicker my hair was getting,just a thought.

[leslissocool]

Could your ends be dry and tangled from protein? Have you given clarifying followed by moisturizing a try? I had bad ends for a while and they cleared up with avoiding protein, gently washing only the scalp (allowing the liquid to drain through the rest of my hair), and oiling my ends with a drop of 100% argan oil followed by bunning while just a little damp. I really hope you find a solution!

I'd clarify and deep condition.


I would braid my hair until I could put it up protectively.

[Silverbrumby]

Your hair is subjected to over 30 washes a month. If it's 10 inches long then by the time it gets to 10 inches its been wet (the most vulnerable time for hair) over 600 times. That's a lot of exposure to water which makes your hair more prone to wear and tear.

Compare that to someone who washes hair 3 x a week for a total of 12 washes a month. Over 20 months that's only 120 times it got wet and was vulnerable.

[nobeltonya]

What I found out, which is against what is generally suggested, is that my hair actually likes cones and sulfates.. if I try anything w/o them, my ends get all tangly and straw-like. And I wash every morning. I also noticed a significant increase in the manageability and thickness of my hair when I started oiling regularly at night [every other now that it's hot]. Maybe you should experiment with other products and see if your hair likes them. Don't just discount cones and sulfates. Try everything. And I would also suggest a leave-in [I've been using GF sleek & shine for at least 2 years now and I love it]. :disco:

[The-Young-Maid]

What I found out, which is against what is generally suggested, is that my hair actually likes cones and sulfates.. - Maybe you should experiment with other products and see if your hair likes them. Don't just discount cones and sulfates. Try everything. :disco: I totally agree with this. Lots of people just sort of assume cones and sulfates are bad without giving them a try. My hair also needs cones because without them it would tangle horribly. Everyones hair is unique and it's by trial and error(and recommendations) that you find out what really works for you.:)

[happybear]

Thanks everyone for the advice, there is much here for me to consider and experiment with.

I do wash everyday, out of necessity. i have painfully thin hair, and an oily scalp. Also a job where i client-face. Soo i cannot go to work with greasy hair. and even with it pulled back, it looks greasy. I have tried dry shampoos before and my scalp protested. this is why i try to avoid harsh things like sulfites (even though i find that they clean my hair better than anything and give my hair a lot of height) just because i want to use mild stuff if i hafta wash everyday. i find that the shampoos i use are mild but not as cleaning and sometimes i get that "scalpy" smell, so i try to clarify once every two weeks.

I will def oil my ends a bit in the mornign before i put up my hair. and will try avoiding protein for awhile. The only protein it gets is from the gelatine treatments, as their are no proteins in my shampoo or co. i used to use a co with hydrolyzed wheat protein (this stuff was meant for repairing damage) and i found it left my hair (and especially) my ends really straw-like after washing it out, so i stopped using the co everyday. So maybe i am protein sensitive.

and i will let it grow out a bit more.

[Sister13]

I share your problem. I totally agree with stretching washes.

I SMT every weekly wash with VO5 clarifying conditioner (protein-lite, perhaps even no protein), fresh aloe, honey, glycerin and an overripe banana or avocado. Overnight if possible.

Experiment with a drop of different oils to see which you like best. (Neem oil smells awful, coconut smells good, all seem to strip out indigo, etc).

We're rooting for your hair journey! :o

[prettyhairisred]

I have the same problem! Only my plateau is 3 inches above bsl in the front. Like where the hair feathers off the boob. I hope to fix my probable too!

[ravenreed]

I wash every other day. When I use SLS shampoos, I usually only apply them from the ears down because my scalp also dislikes them. However, SLS-free shampoos dry out my hair and make it more damaged. So I mostly CO, with great success.


Thanks everyone for the advice, there is much here for me to consider and experiment with.

I do wash everyday, out of necessity. i have painfully thin hair, and an oily scalp. Also a job where i client-face. Soo i cannot go to work with greasy hair. and even with it pulled back, it looks greasy. I have tried dry shampoos before and my scalp protested. this is why i try to avoid harsh things like sulfites (even though i find that they clean my hair better than anything and give my hair a lot of height) just because i want to use mild stuff if i hafta wash everyday. i find that the shampoos i use are mild but not as cleaning and sometimes i get that "scalpy" smell, so i try to clarify once every two weeks.

I will def oil my ends a bit in the mornign before i put up my hair. and will try avoiding protein for awhile. The only protein it gets is from the gelatine treatments, as their are no proteins in my shampoo or co. i used to use a co with hydrolyzed wheat protein (this stuff was meant for repairing damage) and i found it left my hair (and especially) my ends really straw-like after washing it out, so i stopped using the co everyday. So maybe i am protein sensitive.

and i will let it grow out a bit more.

[starlamelissa]

I don't think your routine sounds too bad. There are plenty of daily washers with super long hair. i personally need cones, and full strength sulphate shampoo, and baby oil on my wet post shower hair.

Anyways, I'd vote health issues. I bet now that your iron and thyroid are sorted, your hair will grow.

[ravenreed]

Cones build up on me pretty quickly, as do most other things including herbal treatments and oils, probably because of the impossibly hard water where I live. I am mostly cone-free at the moment. I do notice that full strength SLS-shampoos now and then on the ends improves the condition of my hair because my hair gets really tangly and prone to breakage when it has build up. I pretty much reverse the standard LHC advice and instead of only using shampoo from the ears up, I only use it ears down.

OP- have you tried catnip rinses? Those have done wonders for my hair. Also, prior to your illness, was there a routine that worked well for you, or have you always had these issues?


I don't think your routine sounds too bad. There are plenty of daily washers with super long hair. i personally need cones, and full strength sulphate shampoo, and baby oil on my wet post shower hair.

Anyways, I'd vote health issues. I bet now that your iron and thyroid are sorted, your hair will grow.

[kidari]

I also wash daily out of necessity... what works for me are coney leave-ins. I wash daily with a shampoo and conditioner like Pantene Beautiful Lengths and then use a leave in, right now my favorite is Agadir argan oil spray (basically argan oil with cones) and this simple routine works awesome for my hair. I read somewhere that when you use a shampoo it's best to avoid a clear one since they are stronger and the creamy ones contain moisturizing ingredients.

[starlamelissa]

Raven reed, I also had issues with buildup when I had hard water, but now that my house has a water softener, everything works better.

However I do wash my length and scalp, which isn't very lhc of me. Hair is still growing though!

[SunlightShines]

I had the same problem and mine was from protein. As soon as I eliminated protein and clarified, my hair was so much better!