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juliaxena
May 16th, 2013, 08:06 AM
Have you noticed that darker, warmer colored hair looks lighter to people than in fact lighter but cool toned hair? I have an ashy light brownish hair and up till yesterday it was dyed with Elumen beige golden color that actually turned out a tiny bit red on me. It made my color richer for sure but darker. Yesterday I used Return and my hair is almost back to its ashy self and lighter. However, people commented it looks darker. I am pretty sure you can't lighten your hair with Elumen so the onlyexplanation I can think of is that warm equals light to people even if it is not neccessarily true.

dwell_in_safety
May 16th, 2013, 11:50 AM
I think that may be a case of people's not having the language to describe what they really mean. It's kind of like how we can't distinguish between different shades of the same color unless we know the terminology about them, and in languages with fewer words for different colors, no one distinguishes between all the colors that we do in English (pink vs. salmon, red/purple vs. burgundy, etc). It's interesting and yeah, I've noticed it, too.

jacqueline101
May 16th, 2013, 02:53 PM
I've had people think I've dyed mine.

cheetahfast
May 16th, 2013, 05:32 PM
Richer hair color translates to lighter to others, sometimes. I think when the change isn't too crazy people think it must look a bit lighter rather than redder or something.
I think this is similar to people from cultures with darker hair calling hair that is darker lighter.

For example my friend who has very dark brown/almost black hair calls me a blonde/a redhead. I have a red length from henna but my roots really look light brown to me. Technially it's dark blonde, but to me it's brown.

I hope some of that made sense, my brain is jumbled from finals week.
My BF has light brown hair and is german, he says my hair is brown, not blonde at all.

juliaxena
May 17th, 2013, 03:41 AM
I have a feeling that ashy simply translates to something darker. Like ashy blondes are considered dark blondes when they can be medium blondes etc. Ashy, dishwater etc is seen as darker somehow. Probably by myself as well on some people, especially lighter levels.

Springlets
May 17th, 2013, 08:36 AM
Absolutely. Wikipedia says that ash hair has more melanin in it, and golden hair has more pheomelanin in it (I would cite it but I'm too lazy; if you look up 'blonde hair' you'll find it).

Clairol Nice and Easy light ash blonde (http://www.halfpriceperfumes.co.uk/18891-26817-thickbox/clairol-nice-n-easy-permanent-hair-colour-natural-light-ash-blonde.jpg)
Clairol Nice and Easy light golden blonde (http://naturalinstincts.com/cem/images/products/3d/nice_n_easy-base-natural_light_golden_blonde-3d.png)

And yes, as you pointed out, even the medium golden blonde (http://www.amazon.com/Clairol-Natural-Medium-Golden-Blonde/dp/B001E95FUQ) looks lighter than the light ash.

MsBubbles
May 17th, 2013, 08:57 AM
The type of light, for my hair, makes all the difference in the world. Outside in shadows my hair looks very dark. Almost dark ashy brown! And in office-lighting/bathroom lighting, it looks golden blonde.

silverthread
May 17th, 2013, 09:00 AM
That's interesting. Before I started going grey, I had "ashy" or "cool" dark brown hair. Many people remarked that my hair was black, thinking it was darker than it really was.

LaFlor
May 17th, 2013, 09:06 AM
I had a friend with about the same haircolor as mine, but hers was ashy while mine is more golden... and everyone said my hair was "lighter" than hers. My hair reflects the sunlight differently than hers (it becomes lighter and more golden in the sun whereas her hair doesn't really change at all) so that might have something to do with it?

juliaxena
May 17th, 2013, 11:48 PM
The type of light, for my hair, makes all the difference in the world. Outside in shadows my hair looks very dark. Almost dark ashy brown! And in office-lighting/bathroom lighting, it looks golden blonde.

I have noticed the same minus the very dark or dark (ashy bronwn). I wonder why it looks lighter with artificial light. Bright sun light also makes it very golden or sometimes reddish. But the shade - real brown.

juliaxena
May 18th, 2013, 03:22 AM
Absolutely. Wikipedia says that ash hair has more melanin in it, and golden hair has more pheomelanin in it (I would cite it but I'm too lazy; if you look up 'blonde hair' you'll find it).

Clairol Nice and Easy light ash blonde (http://www.halfpriceperfumes.co.uk/18891-26817-thickbox/clairol-nice-n-easy-permanent-hair-colour-natural-light-ash-blonde.jpg)
Clairol Nice and Easy light golden blonde (http://naturalinstincts.com/cem/images/products/3d/nice_n_easy-base-natural_light_golden_blonde-3d.png)


And yes, as you pointed out, even the medium golden blonde (http://www.amazon.com/Clairol-Natural-Medium-Golden-Blonde/dp/B001E95FUQ) looks lighter than the light ash.

Thank you for the links however I must say I fell like those are not very accurate representations of the same levels. I am not sure. But I think the same levels should ultimately look like the same level of darknes, however warmer tone would give the illusion of lighter hair, but if you look closely you WILL see it is the same level. Perhaps this is an aquired ability and it takes some observation rather than a quick glance. It might be a natural "prejudice" our brain has. To me my hair was obviusly darker with Elumen but then I have seen some photos of ashy hair on others and myself so I might have a more trained eye than people around me.

juliaxena
May 18th, 2013, 04:01 AM
I will try to demonstrate the difference, I don't have any good pics but I found these when the light conditions were similar - by the window and outside.

Ashy hair translates to dark to people in my case:
http://i1015.photobucket.com/albums/af272/juliaxena/20130415_165154.jpg

Warmer hair translates to lighter:
http://i1015.photobucket.com/albums/af272/juliaxena/20130502_182044.jpg

Ocelan
May 18th, 2013, 08:49 AM
I think it definitely has something to do with how light is reflected from the hair. Somehow warmer toned hair reflects light more or turns into a lighter glow when it reflects. The ashy tones get a more muted glow. My hair however looks warm toned and ashy and light and dark depending on the light so I don't really even know what it really is like.

I do not know if you meant that the hair is the same darkness level in the above pictures, but to me the ashy one definitely looks lighter than the red one. The ashy looks somewhere from blonette to very light brown and the warmer color looks definitely brown with red added on it. It of course might just be about the lighting conditions.

juliaxena
May 18th, 2013, 10:38 AM
I think it definitely has something to do with how light is reflected from the hair. Somehow warmer toned hair reflects light more or turns into a lighter glow when it reflects. The ashy tones get a more muted glow. My hair however looks warm toned and ashy and light and dark depending on the light so I don't really even know what it really is like.

I do not know if you meant that the hair is the same darkness level in the above pictures, but to me the ashy one definitely looks lighter than the red one. The ashy looks somewhere from blonette to very light brown and the warmer color looks definitely brown with red added on it. It of course might just be about the lighting conditions.


No, it is not the same level, the red one is darker. But people told me the (now back to) ashy is darker. That is what I tried to say. I think both pics are pretty realistic as to what my natural and "elumened" hair are.

ETA: This is also a hint that Elumen dyes are pretty dark and that they can go reddish when you least expect it. That is a level 8 natural ash Elumen shade. I will go with a level 9 ash blonde next (I like to play with Elumen, undamaging and fun).

ETA2: The NA@8 oxidised on me though. At first it didn't seem red, it was a lovely ashy color.

Emichiee
May 18th, 2013, 05:08 PM
My hair is dark brown and can look very dark in some light. But I also have a golden shimmer and red undertones and reflexes, that can make my hair seem lighter in certain light, and people have said that my hair is blonde! :lol: :shrug: