Hair Ties Damaging? How they cause damage in reality?

[RavenBaby]

How damaging is me using my metal free thin hair tie daily, I wrap it around my hair twice at the nape of my neck so it's loose but tight enough to hold my short layers unless I run. If I feel my scalp is tight I shake it a little and pull the hair tie lower until my scalp is less tight. Is wearing these hair ties pretty loose damaging in reality? (I wear everday but not when I sleep). and what kind of damage? what alternatives is there to keep my hair out of my face?

[jacqueline101]

They cause mechanical damage to the hair. Where the hair tie sets in the hair.

[ZenaZoo]

If its tight I can see it causing damage, but just about holding it together should be fine,

[MegaMystery]

The only damage I can see happening to your hair right now is that some of your hair might start breaking off right where the elastic is because you wear your hair in a ponytail at the same height every single day. If you really want to keep wearing a ponytail a good idea would be to switch up the position every day, and maybe try an even less damaging hair elastic, such as a ring cut out of a pantyhose or a scrunchy :)
Also, I'm not sure how long your hair is, but maybe bunning it is an option for you? either with a small stick or a flexi8?
You could also try french braiding, I've seen some pretty good braids by people on here with just about any length of hair (of course with shorter hair you wouldn't have much of a tail but at least it'll be out of your face).

[torrilin]

For pretty much any material, if you bend it in the same place repeatedly, it will eventually break. Some materials are super stiff and inflexible like glass, so it's hard to get them to bend at all, and if they do bend they'll just snap. Others are a lot more pliable like steel and they can be bent and rebent a lot before they break. Hair is pretty flexible and holds up better than a lot of materials to repeated bending... but it's also pretty small and easy to break in general. So while a big tube of keratin would hold up pretty well to bending, a single hair doesn't necessarily.

That's the primary way that elastics and other styling aids cause damage. Too much bending and rebending stress at the same spot.

Working with a loose elastic the way you're doing will help. But ideally you'd vary your hairstyles at least a bit so that you're not applying the exact same stresses in the exact same spot every day. My hair is pretty fine and fragile, and alternating between a ponytail, a braid, and a cinnamon bun has always been enough variation to prevent breakage, even tho none of those three styles are ideal for preventing damage.

If you're feeling horribly hairstyle impaired, it's usually easier to learn to do twin braids rather than one single braid. And a lot of posters here find that the peacock twist, french twist, pencil bun, nautilus bun or lazy wrap bun are a lot easier to manage than a cinnamon bun, especially with relatively short or thick hair.

[goldloli]

For pretty much any material, if you bend it in the same place repeatedly, it will eventually break. Some materials are super stiff and inflexible like glass, so it's hard to get them to bend at all, and if they do bend they'll just snap. Others are a lot more pliable like steel and they can be bent and rebent a lot before they break. Hair is pretty flexible and holds up better than a lot of materials to repeated bending... but it's also pretty small and easy to break in general. So while a big tube of keratin would hold up pretty well to bending, a single hair doesn't necessarily.

That's the primary way that elastics and other styling aids cause damage. Too much bending and rebending stress at the same spot.

Working with a loose elastic the way you're doing will help. But ideally you'd vary your hairstyles at least a bit so that you're not applying the exact same stresses in the exact same spot every day. My hair is pretty fine and fragile, and alternating between a ponytail, a braid, and a cinnamon bun has always been enough variation to prevent breakage, even tho none of those three styles are ideal for preventing damage.

If you're feeling horribly hairstyle impaired, it's usually easier to learn to do twin braids rather than one single braid. And a lot of posters here find that the peacock twist, french twist, pencil bun, nautilus bun or lazy wrap bun are a lot easier to manage than a cinnamon bun, especially with relatively short or thick hair.

but her hair is growing, so it wouldnt be the same place repeated being bent.

[furnival]

but her hair is growing, so it wouldnt be the same place repeated being bent.
Hair grows approximately an inch every two months. That's plenty of time for an elastic to do damage in that inch.

[melusine963]

I second (third? fourth?) what other people have said about mechanical damage. I gave up wearing hair elastics (even metal-free ones) at my nape years ago, but all I have to do is look at the halo of split ends at my sister's nape to know I made the right choice.

Even braiding doesn't solve this problem. When I started taking better care of my hair, I thought wearing it in an English braid would be enough to keep the mechanical damage at bay. Sadly, I just got a horrible ring of broken hair at the place where the braid would rub against my collar. I learned my lesson and have been wearing proper updos for over a year now, but it will be at least another two or three years before those broken hairs catch up with the rest of my length. Meanwhile I have to live with the taper. :shrug:

[torrilin]

Hair grows approximately an inch every two months. That's plenty of time for an elastic to do damage in that inch.

Also, an elastic is causing strain on roughly 1/4-1/2" of hair, depending on material constraints and how you're doing your elastics. Between that and how thin each individual hair is (20-70 microns give or take on humans), it doesn't take a whole lot of bending stress to cause breakage of a single hair.

Even someone with super duper coarse and sturdy hair has hairs fine enough that it's pretty easy to snap one with your bare hands.

So yeah, total agreement that even with a very fast growth rate, it's important to avoid excessive stress on the individual hairs. What exactly is excessive is of course going to vary, and someone whose hair is not as fine and fragile as mine is usually way less paranoid than me. OTOH, I think I'm one of the few finies who thinks the exact updo matters way less than how often you do it in the same way... we've got a lot of folks who are just terrified of ponytail breakage.

[WaitingSoLong]

Even braiding doesn't solve this problem. When I started taking better care of my hair, I thought wearing it in an English braid would be enough to keep the mechanical damage at bay. Sadly, I just got a horrible ring of broken hair at the place where the braid would rub against my collar.

I have this issue which is why I don't sleep with my hair braided anymore. Have you heard of braid tubes (http://www.etsy.com/listing/43175375/try-our-tail-bag-alternative-fleece)? Sort of a pain to get started in the hair but eliminates collar friction. Similar to tailbags (http://www.tackroominc.com/tail-bags-for-horses-c-147_560.html). Both made for horses but they can be used on people, too! I have it on my list to try to make some. I am concerned about the bulkiness and doubt I could sleep in it for that reason. For now I use parandi, which help but don't completely eliminate the friction/fuzz. But again, I don't sleep in it. I sleep in my sleep stocking I made from pajamas, though my hair has outgrown it now.
http://i393.photobucket.com/albums/pp17/Poetry4me75/P1030516.jpg

[lunalocks]

I have pony damage I am growing out. The hairs are actually shredded with a series of splits along the hair. I also lost many hairs since they just broke off. I did not recognize this until a year later. The hairs that were inside the pony (not exposed to the elastic, and I even used a soft scrunchie) are long and strong with NO splits and almost no tapir. The difference is striking. I took a year break from ponys and now do one no more often that once a week. I also stopped all buns that need elastic, or modified them. Spin pins are a miracle for keeping hair up. Please try them. Please heed our warnings. There is lots of great advise on this thread.

[RavenBaby]

where can I get a spin pin? My hair is layered longest shoulder length past collar bone with some layers at chin length

[torrilin]

where can I get a spin pin? My hair is layered longest shoulder length past collar bone with some layers at chin length

Goody is an American brand that makes hair accessories, and their stuff is sold in darn near every American drugstore. Spin pin is their trademark name for a kind of corkscrew shaped hair pin that a lot of us find helpful. They're not the only maker of such pins, and I'm a benighted American, so I'm not sure how widely available their products are elsewhere. But I know that under the name "hair scroos" or "hair screws" it's easier to find that sort of pin.

[Shoga]

I am totally guilty of using elastics in my hair for buns in the same spot almost every single day
.____.
Thanks guys, as of today I quit elastics.

[Ocelan]

I used to do a ponytail most of the days using metal-free hairties, for years. I stopped about a year back and a couple of months back I snapped this photo where the old damage I'm growing out still shows quite well. You can see the hair above the arrow is smooth but there's tiny hairs pointing out around the head at the point where I used to have the ponytail tied at. There is obviously even older damage below that line from so many years of ponytails. The damage has moved down a lot since I stopped doing ponytails, but it will take a long time for it all to be gone.

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk102/Ocelan/ponybreakage.jpg

[melusine963]

where can I get a spin pin? My hair is layered longest shoulder length past collar bone with some layers at chin length

I got mine for £5 in Morrison's supermarket (UK). Not sure if you have those in Ireland.

[MegaMystery]

I saw spin pins at claire's here, don't know if you live near one though :)

[dollyfish]

How damaging is me using my metal free thin hair tie daily, I wrap it around my hair twice at the nape of my neck so it's loose but tight enough to hold my short layers unless I run. If I feel my scalp is tight I shake it a little and pull the hair tie lower until my scalp is less tight. Is wearing these hair ties pretty loose damaging in reality? (I wear everday but not when I sleep). and what kind of damage? what alternatives is there to keep my hair out of my face?

I do this kind of pony pretty often. When I can, I use a scrunchie instead of an elastic because they distribute the pressure better and don't snag as often (hair can get wrapped around the elastic). Basically, it is the mechanical damage of pinching and rubbing that you have to look out for. But assuming you don't wear your hair in a ponytail for too long or too often you should be fine. Don't wear ponytails every day!

[PrincessIdril]

where can I get a spin pin? My hair is layered longest shoulder length past collar bone with some layers at chin length

Spin pins are available in most shops that sell hair stuff. I've seen them in Claire's and Boots.

[lunalocks]

Goody spin pins come in 2 sizes (one size is shorter) and 2 colors - blond and brown. They come in packages of 3. I need at least 2 for a bun and usually 3 but sometimes 4 or 5 so get 2 packages. I buy a lot of them and keep extras in purses. I also end of giving a lot of them away.

Using forks or sticks are another way of safely keeping hair up. I've been using 2 bamboo knitting needles. I could never figure out how to make them stay, but finally discovered that the buns that start with a loop that, at the end, is pulled down over the wrapped hair and then the stick goes inside that and out of that circle work for me. I started with tight buns but learned how to adjust the tension so that the bun is looser (and bigger) but still holds. I also rotate the bun so the stick is vertical or diagonal since horizontal sticks freak out DH. UTube has so many bun ideas, many of them posted by LHC members. Take some time to experiment. There are so many alternatives to a pony. Good luck.

[pocketsmall]

I just picked up some spin pins this week and I'm hoping they will help me completely kick my pony habit! I seriously am the worst and styling hair and I was able to "master" spin pins in about 5 minutes! :D