Troubleshooting? Dry, tangly hair/ends. It never stops!

[battles]

I just wanted to see if I could get any outside opinions on what may be causing my tangly, dry hair. I've tried quite a few things, but nothing ever seems to get rid of them and the gross build up feeling has just gotten worse. My ends are extremely crunchy and they get stuck together easily.

I have dry, low porosity hair. Old henna that is growing out. Hair type is 2a/2b and F/M. Our water is soft but has high iron.

Routine:

Wash every other day with GFTN shampoo and conditioner.
Clarify every 3 weeks or so.
Deep treatment with Shea Moisture Deep Treatment Masque every week or two, leave on for at least an hour under a shower cap.

I try to stick to amodimethicone-y products, or cone free.


Stuff I've tried on the side:

Protein treatment with egg yolk. NEVER trying this again. I know my hair hates protein more than anything, but I figured it was worth a try.
I tried a shampoo that had been mentioned for chelating. I didn't like it and didn't feel it helped much.
Vinegar rinses help, but only for that wash.


Any thoughts would be so appreciated! :flower:

[Madora]

See if you can:

Shampoo once a week and dilute both the shampoo and conditioner

Drop the weekly masque

Try clarifying your hair, then lightly condition it afterwards.

You might want to investigate using mineral oil (aka baby shampoo) to help with the dryness. The MO is used very sparingly..one or two drops rubbed into your palms, then your palms applied through your hair. Be sure to do it on DAMP (not dripping hair).

Johnson and Johnson makes an ideal baby shampoo that contains only MO plus a fragrance (beware of additives as they can cause breakouts).

The baby oil washes out in your next shampoo and leaves your hair soft, shiny and supple. It also is a great detangler and helps tame frizzies.

Bottom line: I would try and limit what you put on your hair. Keep it at a minimum.
I just wanted to see if I could get any outside opinions on what may be causing my tangly, dry hair. I've tried quite a few things, but nothing ever seems to get rid of them and the gross build up feeling has just gotten worse. My ends are extremely crunchy and they get stuck together easily.

I have dry, low porosity hair. Old henna that is growing out. Hair type is 2a/2b and F/M. Our water is soft but has high iron.

Routine:

Wash every other day with GFTN shampoo and conditioner.
Clarify every 3 weeks or so.
Deep treatment with Shea Moisture Deep Treatment Masque every week or two, leave on for at least an hour under a shower cap.

I try to stick to amodimethicone-y products, or cone free.


Stuff I've tried on the side:

Protein treatment with egg yolk. NEVER trying this again. I know my hair hates protein more than anything, but I figured it was worth a try.
I tried a shampoo that had been mentioned for chelating. I didn't like it and didn't feel it helped much.
Vinegar rinses help, but only for that wash.


Any thoughts would be so appreciated! :flower:

[torrilin]

I find some detergents cause more tangling for me than others. Good old sodium lauryl or laureth sulfate is one of the least tangle inducing for me. A lot of the "sulfate free" detergents cause more tangling. I also find that it takes a *really* small amount of detergent to clean my scalp. Even if my hair is really filthy, we're talking maybe as much as 2mL of regular SLS shampoo to clean the whole thing. I dilute it with water and massage the lather in a bit at a time to loosen up goop and get things properly clean. (there are SLS-free detergents that don't give me problems, but generally they're pretty expensive stuff like decyl glucoside) Everyone's different, and it seems like most people don't notice a big difference in whether a shampoo causes tangles or not. But it's definitely something to check out.

The other thing I do for tangles is conditioner. Not all conditioners are equally good at detangling. I find that ones high in behentrimonium methosulfate or behentrimonium chloride are really good at reducing tangles in my hair. The other ingredients for me don't matter much, just so long as that is the first or second ingredient in the product after water.

[battles]

See if you can:

Shampoo once a week and dilute both the shampoo and conditioner

Drop the weekly masque

Try clarifying your hair, then lightly condition it afterwards.

You might want to investigate using mineral oil (aka baby shampoo) to help with the dryness. The MO is used very sparingly..one or two drops rubbed into your palms, then your palms applied through your hair. Be sure to do it on DAMP (not dripping hair).

Johnson and Johnson makes an ideal baby shampoo that contains only MO plus a fragrance (beware of additives as they can cause breakouts).

The baby oil washes out in your next shampoo and leaves your hair soft, shiny and supple. It also is a great detangler and helps tame frizzies.

Bottom line: I would try and limit what you put on your hair. Keep it at a minimum.

I definitely need to cut back on washing. :( As soon as the cold weather hit, I got really oily and my wash frequency increased. I'll try a milder shampoo and a lighter conditioner diluted.

It is totally possible that I am overdoing the deep treatments. I'll try cutting back on that as well.

Thank you, Madora!

[lapushka]

I'd try and clarify a little more than you're doing now. Does it feel any better after you've clarified? Maybe doing this more might help.

[Long_hair_bear]

This may or may not help you, but I found that Nightblooming's herbal fairy dust and forest glade tea have really helped my tangle prone hair. No, I'm not a paid spokesperson (though I wish I was.... pay me in product!) but I did absolutely love the conditioning effect of these two products. Helped my TT slide right through. :)

Another idea is to go back to cones. I know this makes many people on here cringe, but when I tried going cone free, my hair hissed and howled. I had a hard time brushing it and it was angry.... Not a pretty sight. Cones really helped me with tangles and the like.

[battles]

I find some detergents cause more tangling for me than others. Good old sodium lauryl or laureth sulfate is one of the least tangle inducing for me. A lot of the "sulfate free" detergents cause more tangling. I also find that it takes a *really* small amount of detergent to clean my scalp. Even if my hair is really filthy, we're talking maybe as much as 2mL of regular SLS shampoo to clean the whole thing. I dilute it with water and massage the lather in a bit at a time to loosen up goop and get things properly clean. (there are SLS-free detergents that don't give me problems, but generally they're pretty expensive stuff like decyl glucoside) Everyone's different, and it seems like most people don't notice a big difference in whether a shampoo causes tangles or not. But it's definitely something to check out.

The other thing I do for tangles is conditioner. Not all conditioners are equally good at detangling. I find that ones high in behentrimonium methosulfate or behentrimonium chloride are really good at reducing tangles in my hair. The other ingredients for me don't matter much, just so long as that is the first or second ingredient in the product after water.

This is very helpful! Putting it together now, I have noticed that conditioners with behentrimonium methosulfate or chloride have made my hair very slippy. The one I've kept I don't use very often because it has too many cones for my liking, but I found one that would be great to replace it, or so I hope.

I probably do use a bit too much shampoo, I really shouldn't do that. :lol:

[Vivalagina]

I have found that leave in conditioner works much better for my tangles than rinse out or deep treatments. I use a gentle shampoo diluted and wash twice and then when the water has been squeezed from my hair I apply a very tiny bit of panacea to my ends, then about 2 quarters worth of my toadstool leave-in conditioner. Then I don't touch my hair until it's more dry then wet, then gently detangle with my fingers. My ends stay quite soft and pretty tangle-free, especially since I wear my hair up most days. When I use a rinse out it feels GREAT in the shower when wet, but then feels rough and tangly as soon as it's dry.

[battles]

I'd try and clarify a little more than you're doing now. Does it feel any better after you've clarified? Maybe doing this more might help.

It helps slightly, but I find that vinegar rinses help more than clarifying. I might have to make it part of my regular routine. :( I didn't really want to, but whatever works I suppose! Thank you. :)


This may or may not help you, but I found that Nightblooming's herbal fairy dust and forest glade tea have really helped my tangle prone hair. No, I'm not a paid spokesperson (though I wish I was.... pay me in product!) but I did absolutely love the conditioning effect of these two products. Helped my TT slide right through. :)

Another idea is to go back to cones. I know this makes many people on here cringe, but when I tried going cone free, my hair hissed and howled. I had a hard time brushing it and it was angry.... Not a pretty sight. Cones really helped me with tangles and the like.

:lol: Mine was quite upset when I went sulfate free and cone free as well. Definitely not for everyone!

The tea and fairy dust sound interesting! I've also wanted to try her panacea for quite awhile. I just looked and ohhhh maaaaan I am loving those LOTR hairsticks. :D

[battles]

I have found that leave in conditioner works much better for my tangles than rinse out or deep treatments. I use a gentle shampoo diluted and wash twice and then when the water has been squeezed from my hair I apply a very tiny bit of panacea to my ends, then about 2 quarters worth of my toadstool leave-in conditioner. Then I don't touch my hair until it's more dry then wet, then gently detangle with my fingers. My ends stay quite soft and pretty tangle-free, especially since I wear my hair up most days. When I use a rinse out it feels GREAT in the shower when wet, but then feels rough and tangly as soon as it's dry.

I wish a leave in worked for me! :( Anything just sits on top of my hair and looks gross, then I have to wash again. Or put it up and sulk about how icky my hair looks for a few days.

Thank you for the suggestion, though! I'm definitely wanting to try the panacea even more now..

[jeanniet]

We have well water with an iron filter, but our water still has some iron content in it. That may be part of the problem. Vinegar rinses won't do anything for that, but you could try citric acid rinses, which act as chelators. I use 1/4 tsp. per gallon of water as a final rinse. This seems to work better for me on a regular basis than using a chelating shampoo--I do that sometimes, but probably no more than once a year.

[patienceneeded]

If you use cones, check what kind of cone you're using. I have found that plain old dimethicone is horrible for my hair. It gets dry and tangled and crunchy. However, products with bis-aminopropyl dimethicone or amodimethicone work just fine. So, now I read labels and check that the cone is the "right" kind of cone for me. I try to stay away from sulfates (they make me itchy!) but need the cones so those work well as they pretty much wash out. Diluting your shampoo might help too. I go back and forth on that.

I also use the mineral oil (baby oil) that Madora mentioned on my ends, it really helps! I find very few or no split ends now and I use to find splits constantly. The MO really is wonderful. I use more than most people I think, but my hair is REALLY thick and 1-2 drops won't cut it on my hair.

If you want a leave-in, Giovanni makes a very nice weightless leave-in that is cone free. I use it on occasion and it's quite nice. I use cones in my regular conditioner, but don't want to overload on coney stuff so this makes a nice addition to my haircare stuff. I use a dime sized amount and run it through the last 3-4 inches of my hair while wet if I feel like it is needed.

Remember not to try every suggestion at once! Too much change all at once and you won't know what really works for you and what does not. Have fun!

[natt i nord]

I'd reduce the deep treatments or 'd even leave them completely for a while. Sounds for me as if your hair could simply be over-treated. So I second the 'Keep it to a minimum'-thing. :)

[battles]

We have well water with an iron filter, but our water still has some iron content in it. That may be part of the problem. Vinegar rinses won't do anything for that, but you could try citric acid rinses, which act as chelators. I use 1/4 tsp. per gallon of water as a final rinse. This seems to work better for me on a regular basis than using a chelating shampoo--I do that sometimes, but probably no more than once a year.

I hadn't thought of citric acid! Yikes, so many things to try. I'll have to go look for some. I think this would be much better than the shampoo. Thanks. :)


If you use cones, check what kind of cone you're using. I have found that plain old dimethicone is horrible for my hair. It gets dry and tangled and crunchy. However, products with bis-aminopropyl dimethicone or amodimethicone work just fine. So, now I read labels and check that the cone is the "right" kind of cone for me. I try to stay away from sulfates (they make me itchy!) but need the cones so those work well as they pretty much wash out. Diluting your shampoo might help too. I go back and forth on that.

I also use the mineral oil (baby oil) that Madora mentioned on my ends, it really helps! I find very few or no split ends now and I use to find splits constantly. The MO really is wonderful. I use more than most people I think, but my hair is REALLY thick and 1-2 drops won't cut it on my hair.

If you want a leave-in, Giovanni makes a very nice weightless leave-in that is cone free. I use it on occasion and it's quite nice. I use cones in my regular conditioner, but don't want to overload on coney stuff so this makes a nice addition to my haircare stuff. I use a dime sized amount and run it through the last 3-4 inches of my hair while wet if I feel like it is needed.

Remember not to try every suggestion at once! Too much change all at once and you won't know what really works for you and what does not. Have fun!

I had tried the mineral oil and it didn't turn out very well. But I do go a little overboard on amounts.. You should have seen my first attempt at a heavy oiling. shudder:

I'll definitely try things one at a time, but I'm so glad I have new ideas!

Thank you everyone. :)

[battles]

I'd reduce the deep treatments or 'd even leave them completely for a while. Sounds for me as if your hair could simply be over-treated. So I second the 'Keep it to a minimum'-thing. :)

It definitely could be. I think it was at about the right point when I took my avatar picture, which was last month.. but I hadn't really quit deep treatments since then. Time to back off. :p

[jacqueline101]

I'd try a leave in conditioner for your ends. Definitely stop shampooing a lot.

[torrilin]

This is very helpful! Putting it together now, I have noticed that conditioners with behentrimonium methosulfate or chloride have made my hair very slippy. The one I've kept I don't use very often because it has too many cones for my liking, but I found one that would be great to replace it, or so I hope.

I probably do use a bit too much shampoo, I really shouldn't do that. :lol:

Too much is kind of a matter of taste. Not entirely, since obviously there's a point where you really didn't get clean, and there's a point where you used enough to wash a dozen people. But I definitely think that use less is a good route with cleansers. Even for someone with oily skin, it can be pretty easy to overdo things. If your skin is dry like mine... it can be even easier.

The conditioner I use for detangling is marketed as a leave in... it's Alba Botanica's leave in conditioner. It meets the US FDA's fragrance free rules, and the ingredients list is pretty simple. Good stuff, and relatively inexpensive for the amount needed. If I use a dilute acid rinse on my hair, I can get away with a dime sized blob on roughly waist length hair. Since our area has pretty mineral heavy water, the acid rinse helps chelate. If I skip the rinse, I need more like a quarter sized blob for waist length hair. So it's a quite concentrated product. My 3a sister in law uses the same stuff, tho for her it's not *as* important to use teensy amounts. For both of us, it works equally well as a leave in or rinse out conditioner. If you're sure leave ins are absolutely lethal tho, I'd just use it as a rinse out. I recommend it a lot since it's one of the few conditioners I'm aware of that has scads of behentrimonium sulfate and a really simple ingredients list.

The one thing to watch is the behentrimonium methosulfate is not just a detangler and a moisturizing ingredient... it's also a very mild detergent. For most of us, that winds up being a good thing since it lets one product do a ton of different things that all work well together, but if your hair or skin fuss about being overly clean, I can imagine it could be a problem.

[mariazelie]

I have to remove all tangles (and there are plenty) each day. If I skip even one day it is a nightmare. I wash every four days, and by the end I have that crunchy, dry feeling others are talking about. Lately I have found that the None of Your Frizziness Anti-Frizz shampoo and conditioner made by Herbal Essence makes the after wash comb out much easier, as far as tangles and I do not have frizzy hair. I like how it makes my hair after it dries. I tried it thinking perhaps it would work on tangles and it did. At times, my hair will literally be matted after I wash and condition. I never know for sure what will happen. At one point I read that over clarifying can cause trouble and and so now I don't know how oftrn to do that. So much guess work!, I am still not on to anything that works every time and it does get discouraging as it seems winter problems are different than summer problems. I like the baby oil, as mentioned in other posts ot get out the tangles, but then in a couple days it seems my hair is even more dry and brittle after I use that. The same thing seems to happen with leave in conditioner. Not much help, I know, but misery loves company! I do learn so much on this forum.

[Long_hair_bear]

It helps slightly, but I find that vinegar rinses help more than clarifying. I might have to make it part of my regular routine. :( I didn't really want to, but whatever works I suppose! Thank you. :)



:lol: Mine was quite upset when I went sulfate free and cone free as well. Definitely not for everyone!

The tea and fairy dust sound interesting! I've also wanted to try her panacea for quite awhile. I just looked and ohhhh maaaaan I am loving those LOTR hairsticks. :D

Ya definitely do give them a go. Just buy the cheap samples first and give them a try. The panacea really helps with crunchy hair! I love the smell of the winter panacea! Just as an FYI, I used the fairy dust/conditioner mix stated on the listing, not with henna. I don't think I've ever seen my hair love something so much! Wow, just wow! If you try it, let me know how it goes.