Should I do a protein treatment?

[spookyghost]

Whenver I did my protein/moisture strand test on my hair I did it on dry hair. So my hair snapped of course and I assumed that it needed moisture and not protein. Well when I was very carefully detangling my damp hair with a wide tooth comb my hair stretched! I couldnt believe it. That has never happened to me before so it actually startled me. So now I have no idea if my hair has a normal amount of stretch or if its lack of protein stretch.

And it gets worse. Heres another misdiagnosis on my part. I have been going through a horrible shed or so I thought. My longest layer of hair is bsl with my bangs sl. Oh and I have another layer in back thats about neck length. So my hair that falls out is pretty long. About two weeks ago I noticed that some of my shed hair was long but not as long as usual. I looked at it closer and there is no bulb at either end of hair. That means thats breakage hair!:cry: So all this time I thought I was shedding my hair is breaking! And since its the hair is long that means the breakage is way up my head! Is there any way it can still be shed hair and just have the bulb missing? And yes I am grasping at straws! Im having a hard time comprehending that its all breakage. I have been doing black tea rinses and using Mira hair oil and my shed/breakage has lessened alot. I tea rinse two times a week and one time I was one day late and I shedded alot more. I did the tea rinse and it lessened again. My hair sounds like breakage but can the tea rinse help that? I thought it only helped regular shedding.

So this is where I get even more confused-as if thats possible! About 3 months ago I did a protein pack from Sallys. It wasnt a really strong one and its popular but I cant remember the name. My hair didnt seem to like it. The dryness got worse and it kinda felt stiff and just looked bad. So I figured my hair hates protein and needs moisture. My hair seemed to react better with moisture. But now I think my hair is breaking and stretching ( but I cant tell if its a good stretch or a bad stretch) and I dont know if I should try a protein treatment again. You would think my hair would just devour the protein. I have chemically damaged hair with splits-possibly up my whole head! Im actually a perfect canidate for a protein treatment.

What would you all do? Should I try a protein treatment again and of course use a moisturizning condtioner afterwards. I cant remember if I used a conditioner after the first one I did. Or is everyone thinking-NO dont! Your hair didnt like it the first time and it probably wont this time and Ill just make everything worse. The black tea rinses have stopped the amount of hair loss after each wash. So maybe I should just continue those. If the amount of hair coming off my head, whether its breakage or shed, is alot less and thats all that matters. And I always use a moisturizing conditioner after. So my hair is getting the moisture too.

I have stopped all heat and chemicals. I am currently using Hair one for color treated hair with jojoba (its the When knock off) and the only product I put in my hair after washing is a tiny bit of Mira hair oil or sweet almond oil. I dont use any clips or brets or anything with metal. I do use a soft hair band when I work out because my hair is in my face and eyes.

I curse the day I ever used the flat iron and bleach!

[Roscata]

I suggest you read this: Whats wrong with my hair? Hair Diagnostic Tips (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=44).

Wet hair will stretch more than dry hair, that's why you should never comb or brush your hair when it is wet, it makes it more vulnerable to damage. Having too much protein in your hair will make it snap right away causing breakage (Protein Disaster & Recovery Center (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=17%20)), I speak from experience I recently had a protein overload and had to deal with that disaster which took months to fully fix (you read that correctly MONTHS). But you did say you have previously chemically dyed hair so I'm not sure if protein overload is what is happening to you. However here is a video that will help you figure out what is really happening: 3 Healthy Hair Tests (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f50S_4RPutA).

Yes, if there is no bulb it is breakage. I see you have fine hair, fine hair tends to be very easily damaged, you have to treat your hair as if it has already been damaged (extra carefully) even if you have never done anything damaging to it (it's THAT sensitive) and get regular trims if you don't already do that. I suggest you read these articles: Damaged Hair: Understanding, Preventing & Rehabilitating (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=79) and Keeping Split Ends At Bay: Secrets of Gently Handling Your Hair (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=8).

I'm glad you stopped all the heat and chemicals but you can't reverse damage, your hair is damaged and will break and split. I'm going to suggest reading the damaged hair article again, it will help you deal with that. I hope you're using the jojoba oil on wet hair because it is a sealing oil and you want to seal in the moisture. If you like tea rinses I think Catnip tea (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=118) is for you.

My last thought on this is: the damage is done, take it as a learning experience (of what NOT to do) and grow beautiful, healthy hair from now on. But, arm yourself with patience, it is your strongest and most necessary weapon at this point. Good luck in your hair journey! :)

[lilliemer]

Agree with all of the above. The tea rinses may be drying your hair out a lot. Tea is acidic and contains tannins which are drying. I see that it is stopping your shed but if it's causing breakage then you may need to do them less frequently or add more moisture to your routine.

It is easy to panic and try a bunch of different things all at once but you may be better cutting back to a minimalist routine and moisturizing, moisturizing, moisturizing. The moisture won't damage your hair and if you intensely add moisture for a few weeks and still don't see a difference then you can think about proteins or other stuff. Also as far as articles go, Ursula has one called 'Standard newbie advice'. I have seen your posts for a while and i know you are probably no more of a newbie than I am but she has some good suggestions as to methodical ways to test new treatments, techniques, etc.

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=39

[spookyghost]

Roscata-Thanks so much for all those wonderful links! I read them and plan on re-reading them many times-and taking notes!

Oh this has definately been a learning experience. No doubt. The flat iron is what really did me in. The chemicals did too, dont get me wrong, but that flat iron on top of the bleach and color was just ridiculously damaging.

Im going to read thru the cat nip thread but I was wondering if you already knew if I could just add the cat nip to my black tea rinse? I could be wrong but I have a feeling that may not be covered in the thread. The black tea seems to be helping so I dont really want to stop it and the catnip can help prevent new splits from occuring. I would like to get the best of both worlds!

Well hopefully, from the links you posted, I can diagnose my hair problem pretty close to what is actually wrong with it. My gut feeling tells me my hair isnt too fond of protein its just hard to get over the fact that my hair should need it!

Lilliemer-Hi and thanks for your link! You said that you have seen my posts for a while-hope thats a good thing!:p So far the black tea rinses seem to be working really good for me. They are drying but I use a deep moisturizing conditioner afterwards which makes all the difference in the world! The tea rinse isnt causing my breakage its helping it-Im assuming. My shed/breakage got real bad about six months ago and has only lessened since I started the tea. Its about 90% less than last month at this time. So Im very pumped about this.

When I realized that what I thought were shed hairs seem to actually be breakage-I paniced:shocked: I immediately got the I have to do something NOW mentality. But the one good thing about me is that I will come on LHC and search the net for answers before I actually do anything to my hair. My current routing is using Hair one for a shampoo, although its not a shampoo, using black tea rinses and using Mira hair oil.

I was confused as to whether I should use a protein treatment or just continue with the black tea. My gut tells me to continue with the black tea for now. What makes this hard and confusing is that you would think my hair would love protein considering the condition its in but it seems to dislike it. Well we'll see. I have read up on these links again. I dont want to miss anything!

[Roscata]

I did black tea to reduce my shedding and what I did is put it in a spray bottle and spray my roots with it, I did this on already washed and dry hair, every day. So you can do that with the black tea and use the catnip tea to condition your length and prevent split ends and breakage, or you could combine the two. I'm really not sure that it would be a bad idea to combine two teas. I wish Ktani was here to answer that, she's really into catnip tea, maybe you could send her an email on her website. (http://ktanihairsense.blogspot.com/)

I don't know if you considered Conditioner Only (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=18) washes, but they really help with dry hair, like previously chemically colored hair. Just a random thought.

I'm glad you found the information I gave you useful and you're very welcome. :)
If you ever have any other questions always feel free to message me personally or add me. :D

[spookyghost]

Roscata-Thank you so much. You are so sweet!:)

I was just thinking that if I could only ask Ktani-the catnip expert! I had no idea she had a website so thanks for that info! I will email her and hopefully she will have the time to answer back.

I tried the CO method and it didnt really work out for me. My hair had awesome waves, I loved that part. But it also had a little greasy and limp texture to it. I tried different conditioners but it didnt seem to help. And I rinsed super good because I have always been a little paranoid about leaving products in my hair and having it dry or damage my hair even more than it already is. One thing I did not do is give it a long enough time to see if it would work. I did hear that some people have a transition period but I just didnt like it to give it any more time. The Hair One that I am using right now gives me the feeling of CO. It feels, has the same thickness, and goes on just like conditioner. From the first time I used it I never got the impression that it felt like shampoo. Also no lather. So far I love it.

Thank you so much for your kindness!

[Roscata]

Aww you're so sweet. You're very welcome. :D

[fairview]

First, evaluations on hair condition can not be done when wet.

There are three issues hair condition is judged on: porosity, elasticity, and texture. The first 2 determine much of the condition of your hair which is what I'll deal with.

Porosity is created when there are missing chunks out of your hair strand. Since hair is nearly all protein, any missing chunks is missing protein. To determine porosity, take a strand of hair pinch it between your thumb and index finger and with the other thumb and index finger run it up the strand to the scalp. Most of the porosity if you have it will or should be located near the ends since this is your oldest hair. Everyone has porosity on their ends, some more, some less. You'll know if you have a lot as it will feel very rough.

To determine elasticity, take a strand of hair and pretend it is a piece of Xmas ribbon you are curling. The hair should stretch out considerably and then curl up just as a Xmas ribbon. If it snaps, there is a problem.

Conditioners, even the best salon protein treatment is a temporary fix to replace those missing chunks of hair, increase quality, sheen, volume and or manageability. The best protein treatment will only last 6-8 weeks. The only permanent cure for porosity is the scissors. Also, the protein treatments from the retail shelf are not the same quality as the professional ones used in the salon. The professional treatments are more expensive, but well worth it.

Lifting your hair to unreasonable levels will damage your hair. With enough time, lightener and toners anything is possible. I always inform my guests if I think they have unreasonable expectations and for the insistent ones I do a strand test just to let them see how much damage they will have. Using a smoothing iron responsibly does not damage your hair. Using it at the temperatures of the after-burn blast of an F-4 without a thermal protector does. If your smoothing iron isn't controlled by a thermostat, chunk it. If it has one don't trust it. Take a piece of toilet paper, separate it into one ply and place it in the smoothing iron and count for say ten seconds. If it is really crispy turn it down, if it is toasted, turn it way down. ALWAYS test your smoothing iron before each use. It doesn't mater if it has a thermostat; never trust it! Also, use a thermal protector prior to blow drying. Thermal protectors designed for wet hair typically are in spray pump bottles while protectors for smoothing irons(dry hair) are always in aerosol. At least the quality ones.

As far as answering your question, yes your hair as all hair would benefit from a salon intensive protein infusing treatment but it also sounds as though it may be time for a significant trim to eliminate damaged hair beyond saving.

[spookyghost]

First, evaluations on hair condition can not be done when wet.

There are three issues hair condition is judged on: porosity, elasticity, and texture. The first 2 determine much of the condition of your hair which is what I'll deal with.

Porosity is created when there are missing chunks out of your hair strand. Since hair is nearly all protein, any missing chunks is missing protein. To determine porosity, take a strand of hair pinch it between your thumb and index finger and with the other thumb and index finger run it up the strand to the scalp. Most of the porosity if you have it will or should be located near the ends since this is your oldest hair. Everyone has porosity on their ends, some more, some less. You'll know if you have a lot as it will feel very rough.

To determine elasticity, take a strand of hair and pretend it is a piece of Xmas ribbon you are curling. The hair should stretch out considerably and then curl up just as a Xmas ribbon. If it snaps, there is a problem.

Conditioners, even the best salon protein treatment is a temporary fix to replace those missing chunks of hair, increase quality, sheen, volume and or manageability. The best protein treatment will only last 6-8 weeks. The only permanent cure for porosity is the scissors. Also, the protein treatments from the retail shelf are not the same quality as the professional ones used in the salon. The professional treatments are more expensive, but well worth it.

Lifting your hair to unreasonable levels will damage your hair. With enough time, lightener and toners anything is possible. I always inform my guests if I think they have unreasonable expectations and for the insistent ones I do a strand test just to let them see how much damage they will have. Using a smoothing iron responsibly does not damage your hair. Using it at the temperatures of the after-burn blast of an F-4 without a thermal protector does. If your smoothing iron isn't controlled by a thermostat, chunk it. If it has one don't trust it. Take a piece of toilet paper, separate it into one ply and place it in the smoothing iron and count for say ten seconds. If it is really crispy turn it down, if it is toasted, turn it way down. ALWAYS test your smoothing iron before each use. It doesn't mater if it has a thermostat; never trust it! Also, use a thermal protector prior to blow drying. Thermal protectors designed for wet hair typically are in spray pump bottles while protectors for smoothing irons(dry hair) are always in aerosol. At least the quality ones.

As far as answering your question, yes your hair as all hair would benefit from a salon intensive protein infusing treatment but it also sounds as though it may be time for a significant trim to eliminate damaged hair beyond saving.

Hi and thank you for all your info! I understand everything you said except Im a little confused on the porosity. I took a strand of hair put it between my fingers and went up the hair shaft to my part. I did not feel andy roughness it was just really smooth feeling. What does that mean? Is that good? It feeling smooth sounds like it would mean something good.:p So do I want my hair to be porous? Probably not if that means my hair has missing chunks.

Im doing small trims right now. I had a four inch cut about a year ago and then about 1/4 inch about every two months since then. Im trimming as much as I can for now. Im not willing to do a big trim because I rather have my pathetic damaged hair then pathetic damaged short hair. Cutting my hair to chin length would still not get rid of my damage. And because of this I will never use the flat iron again. Never. Not even if it was on its lowest setting. I curse the day I ever used it.

[lapushka]

If there's breakage, that means that somewhere in your hair you've probably got white dots. I'd try doing S&D sessions as often as you can.

[UltraBella]

My hair absolutely loves protein, but I only use it in conditioner form. I've been using Joico K-Pak with impressive results. I have tried that little pack from Sally's as well and my hair didn't like it one bit.
Have you clarified lately ? A good clarifying shampoo and my protein conditioner gives me WOW hair.

[spookyghost]

My hair absolutely loves protein, but I only use it in conditioner form. I've been using Joico K-Pak with impressive results. I have tried that little pack from Sally's as well and my hair didn't like it one bit.
Have you clarified lately ? A good clarifying shampoo and my protein conditioner gives me WOW hair.

Hi! I clarified about a month ago and I had a pretty good hair day that day! Wish I could clarify every day.:p If I do decide to use any protein I could use it in conditioner form too. Thats a good idea. When my hair stretched I just about fell over! Just when I thought I kinda had my hair figured out that happens! Thing is-it could be a reasonable stretch. It might not be a bad thing.:pray:

Now if my hair looked like yours-I'd be in heaven!;)

[palaeoqueen]

I'm not sure tbh. From what you've said about your hair previously it sounds a lot like you have/had protein overload so I would tread carefully. You could do Ultrabella's suggestion of using a protein conditioner then pay very close attention to how your hair behaves afterwards. If the snapping gets worse stop using it immediately. If your hair improves then you have your answer!