Honey thread - from TBB and bits from old LHC

**ktani** · July 25th, 2009, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by klcqtee

I don't need it lightened (it's basically the same tone, just from brown to red, no darker or lighter) I'm just really looking for the dye to come out.

The reason I ask is because it seemed that when I honey lightened over my henna (a while back) it seemed to leech out a lot of the red, and left me back at my natural mousy brown/blonde instead of auburn. May not be true, but it did seem that way.

Its been a while, so I will try to remember (and check) on the order hair colour lightens in general.

Black and dark brown to brown to red/gold to gold to yellow.

Henna leaching can be unbound henna but honey lightening can lighten hennaed hair.

**klcqtee** · July 25th, 2009, 11:25 AM

I was not using BAQ henna, I was using box stuff from my local whole foods market. This could explain why the Henna came out.

Thank you for your help, by the way.

**ktani** · July 25th, 2009, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by klcqtee

I was not using BAQ henna, I was using box stuff from my local whole foods market. This could explain why the Henna came out.

Thank you for your help, by the way.

Could be. And you are most welcome!

**bakertwins2004** · July 25th, 2009, 11:33 AM

I did my first Honey treatment last night and I am in love. I am gonna do another in a week or so. Is that to soon? Should I spread them out to avoid damage?

**ktani** · July 25th, 2009, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by bakertwins2004

I did my first Honey treatment last night and I am in love. I am gonna do another in a week or so. Is that to soon? Should I spread them out to avoid damage?

No need. You can honey lighten? as often as you like. Not sure if you mean lighten but it is the same for conditioning and lightening in any case.

**ktani** · July 26th, 2009, 03:41 AM

Pictures of honey lightening with the new dilution (4 x the amount of water (distilled recommended), to honey by weight). You can also use tablespoons. 1 tablespoon honey requires 6 tablespoons distilled water.

Jan in ID - on mid-brown virgin hair - with the new dilution and distilled water - after 3 more treatments - with ground cinnamon and only 1/2 tblsp EVOO, no conditioner and the condition of her hair, after 5 treaments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1721

HalcyonDays - on dark mid-brown virgin hair - with the new dilution using tap water - after 1 treatment - left on the hair for 2 hours - just water and honey. The lighting is dark in the before picture, so I requested a replacement picture.
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1633

HalcyonDays - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening and a replacement before picture
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1635

soleluna - on hennaed hair (baq Egyptian henna) - the new dilution - after 1 treatment - with distilled water and only 1 tsp ground cinnamon - no conditioner
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1375

soleluna - recipe details and the condition of her hair following honey lightening Note: the correct amount of honey used was 2 tablespoons - there was an error made in transcribing the recipe
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1377

Alley Cat - on chemically dyed, almost black, previously hennaed hair (which shows as red) - after 9 treatments - 8 with no conditioner - 3 with ground cinnamon - the last 5 with just water and honey, the 3 most recent with distilled water and the new dilution
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1492

Aley Cat - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1495

LadyPolaris - on hennaed hair - after 4 treatments - the new dilution with distilled water, ground cinnamon and EVOO - no conditioner and the condition of her hair following 4 honey lightening treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=1651

melikai - on previously hi-lighted hair - the new dilution, with distilled water and 1 tablespoon ground cardamom, after 2 treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2055

melikai - recipe and the condition of her hair after 2 treatments
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2060

gallows gallery - on the condition of her hair after 6 honey lightening treatments, the new dilution
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2637

gallows gallery earlier pics, dyed black hair over henna, the new dilution
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2638

gallows gallery new pics, dyed black hair over henna, the new dilution
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2780

nayver - on the condition of her hair following honey lightening this time (she had done it previously)
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2861

nayver pictures on dark dyed hair, with the new dilution, after 1 treatment, with distilled water
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2868

nayver pictures, after 2 treatments, with the new dilution, using distilled water
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=2878

Fethenwen, after 2 treatments, using cardamom essential oil , 1 tsp powdered cinnamon and distilled water, on 2 years of hennaed hair (the last 6 months, doing roots only)
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3528, another picture of the new hair colour, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3553

recipe details
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3538

method details
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3540

Sokudo Ningyou, after 1 treatment of honey, distilled water and 1 teaspoon ground (powdered) cinnamon, on 3 year old henna, grown out for 6 months, and on the condition of her hair, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3851, - after her 3rd treatment, http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3877.

lundmir, after 1 treatment, of honey, distilled water and ground cinnamon, on previously dyed and henned hair
http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3989, method and washing out details, - http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...postcount=3991

Some tap waters have a very low mineral content and a pH of 7, making them perfect for honey lightening. IMO, such tap water is exceptional, rather than common. I recommend using distilled or deionized water only for honey lightening. Of the two, I recommend distilled, if both are available.

**ktani** · July 26th, 2009, 12:42 PM

The optimal pH for honey to produce peroxide is 6. Most honeys on the market are more acidic than this. The honey lightening spices, ground or powdered cinnamon and cardamom are too.

The peroxide in a honey lightening recipe can be depleted by; minerals, Vitamin C, heat and UV.

That is why distilled water (pH7), and the new dilution work so well, IMO. Together, they raise the pH level of the recipe and allow the honey to produce more peroxide than it can at lower concentrations (dilutions) and without minerals.

Less of the spices, used with the new dilution and distilled water, have been reported to yield better results, than more of the spices, at lower dilutions, with distilled water.

The exception to distilled or deionized water (both should work well), is tap water that has a pH of 7 and a very low to no mineral content.

**ktani** · July 26th, 2009, 01:40 PM

The colours of honey

Note: Not all darker honeys have higher peroxide values, e.g. chestnut honey and not all honeys are represented here.
Avoid using Anzer, buckwheat, chestnut, linden flower, locust flower, mint and thyme honeys.
Honey, regardless of its colour, has not been reported to add colour to hair when used in a honey lightening recipe.

**ktani** · July 26th, 2009, 07:09 PM

A natural antibiotic in human sweat! In a lab, anyways.

**ktani** · July 27th, 2009, 06:09 AM

Methods of application and covering a honey lightening treatment

The hair needs to be very wet both before being covered and while a treatment is on the hair for the recommended 1 hour.

A treatment can be applied with; a pastry, basting, tint, or blush brush, spray, or applicator bottle. The brushes allow more control, the bottles faster application. When spices are used, a bottle needs a wider opening.

I have recommended that extra treatment be withheld, until the end of application (especially when doing roots only), to make sure that any hair that has dried during the process, gets rewet, beore covering.

Covering a treatment can be with a secure plastic bag (I use freezer bags and stretch the opening, for my catnip treatments), a secured shower cap (this has been reported to be problematic), plastic wrap, (combinations can also be done) or a swim cap, which IMO, is the best choice. Also recommened, is to use saran wrap under a lycra swim cap. It does not squeeze out too much water and the treatment does not drip as much with this method.

Here is some information on swim caps.

A towel or any absorbant material, is not recommended for covering the hair, because it will absorb the needed moisture from a treatment, drying the hair and making the treatment useless in those areas, most likely the very top layers of the hair. If a honey lightening treatment dries on the hair, lightenig will stop or not happen at all.

Misting can also be done with the hair uncovered but the hair needs constant misting IMO, to stay very wet.

The hair once covered, should not need rewetting, but if the hair starts to dry because the plastic has slipped, or a shower cap is not secured, it will need to be done. Ideally, with the right covering secured, rewetting will not be necessary.

While 1 hour is the recommended time that a treatment needs to left on the hair, it can be left on the hair longer than that with no worries.

If a treatment is left to sit for 1 hour at room temperature, to produce peroxide, 1 hour should be more than enough time on the hair per treatment. It has also been reported, that using a treatment without letting it sit out in advance of application, and only leaving it on the hair for 1 hour, is sufficient to get the results wanted.