Possible way to protect hair from conventional peroxide damage

**ktani** · June 10th, 2009, 08:47 PM

Interesting Article with references, disagreeing with using a conditioner to protect hair pre-swimming but supporting using coconut oil as a pre-swim method, although again, that can contribute to polluting pool water. It also has some interesting information on the way chlorine damages hair.

I agree, conditioners are water soluble and contain a fair amount of water, from 50 to 90 % (it varies from sources I have read), because of different kinds of conditioners. Some are light and some are heavier, treatment conditioners.

**ktani** · June 11th, 2009, 06:47 AM

This think that this is key information. I have not seen it before.
"It takes 15 minutes for hair to be saturated with water (Robbins, Chemical and Physical Behaviour of Human Hair, Springer). If you apply ordinary tap water to your hair (yes it has chlorine too but generally at a lower level), then keep it wet for at least 15 minutes, then the hair will have soaked up as much water as it can before getting into the pool."

I think that pre-soaking hair with club soda may be an even better choice than using bottled or tap water, if the hair is going to get directly exposed to salt water or chlorine. It may help break up build-up that is already on the hair, that salt water minerals can more easily attach to and make worse, while at the same time saturating the hair, and for pool swimming, saturate the hair, and neutralize chlorine to some extent. I suggest rinsing the hair with club soda after swimming too. The proof of my theory about a club soda pre-soak, one way or the other, will be in reported results.

Swimmers, please report here in this thread, to let me know and to help others, if you try club soda as an after swim rinse, and/or as a pre-soak, keeping the hair wet for with club soda for 15 minutes. If you wear a swim cap that you know allows some water in, this would be before putting it on.

I will keep track of results with a reports post, the same way I do with the the results of experiments with coconut and argan oils as a pre-treatment, before conventional hair colouring and lightening.

**ktani** · June 12th, 2009, 06:50 AM

Updated Swimming Article.

**ktani** · June 12th, 2009, 02:02 PM

A very well done non technical article, by a scientist, on deep conditioning, in easy to understand terms.

**ktani** · June 12th, 2009, 02:12 PM

Chlorine chemicals can be added to a swimming pool in different concentrations to disinfect the water. Lightening hair colour is a side effect. The ability of pool chemicals to bleach and damage hair, no doubt varies with the concentration used and the results IMO, would be much weaker in any case, than applying conventional chemicals for lightening hair at home or in a salon, depending of course, on what is used and how long it is left on the hair.

If, as it has been stated, saturating the hair with water completely for 15 minutes, or my suggestion of club soda, and keeping it wet with either during that time, before getting into a swimming pool, does not allow the hair to absorb more water, it may be that pool chemical damage can be considerably minimized, especially by club soda, compared to if the hair were dry, or not completely saturated. The answers to this will be interesting to see and read, when people report.

**ktani** · June 12th, 2009, 07:50 PM

Resistant (to conventional hair dye) grey hair

Here are reviews for Clairol Nice n Easy Gray Solution, only they are not all nice and it wasn't that easy for everyone who tried it. This hair colour is specifically aimed at grey coverage. It looks like the professional answers to grey hair that is resistant to conventional hair colour are still to come. I think, that there are easier (and possibly more cost effective), more hair friendly ways to deal with such hair to start with, before trying more aggressive methods. Clarify the hair in advance of chemically colouring it, and do not use conditioner afterward except coconut or coconut and argan oils. Do not use a conventional hair colour preconditioner at the time of colouring. Use more coconut oil, or coconut and argan oils as a pretreatment, and see if all of that, makes a difference. The fact that certain types of hair react differently to conventional hair colour and lightening chemicals, IMO, supports trying a different approach first, before trying the conventional methods suggested.

**ktani** · June 12th, 2009, 09:31 PM

I did more research on carbonated water and club soda.

Pure carbonated or seltzer water, which is just water and carbonic acid has a varying pH, that depends in part on the presurizing system used to create it and its pH is not necessarily stable. I looked up the pH of carbonated water and I got varying pH levels given, that included, 4.73, 5.2 and 3.4 but it can be as low a pH 2. (see the table in the link). A pH below 3.5 can be damaging to hair.

Club soda, which is also carbonated, contains a small amount of baking soda as part of a buffering system, that buffers its pH and raises it somewhat but club soda is still acidic. The carbonic acid helps break up and remove mineral deposits, found in sea water, that can coat the hair and make it dry and brittle. I think that it prevents chlorine from crystallizing in the hair the same way.

That may be why this (in bold) was said.
"4. True, the best thing to do if you don’t have a bathing cap is to rinse your hair before going in the pool. Rinse hair immediately after swimming – the best thing to rinse with is club soda. Do not let chlorine dry in your hair."

When I tested Schweppes Club Soda I got a pH of about 5.5 to 6. This website has it at, "Club Soda (Schwepps) 5.1". That would be the variance between the pH papers that I used and a pH meter, which is more exact.

**ktani** · June 13th, 2009, 06:59 AM

Conventional hair colour and lightening chemicals and protective gloves worn during applications

2009
"Skin irritation and contact allergies are .... common to hairdressers. The predominant oxidative hair dye components, such as p-phenylenediamine (PPD) and aminophenol isomers, can cause contact dermatitis. Use of protective gloves can prevent dermal contact with skin irritants. This study investigates the permeation behaviors of p-aminophenol (PAP), m-aminophenol (MAP), o-aminophenol (OAP) and PPD in single and mixed challenge solutions with disposable natural rubber latex (NRL) gloves, disposable polyvinylchloride (PVC) gloves and neoprene (NP) gloves. .... In conclusion, disposable NRL gloves and disposable PVC gloves should not be used repeatedly for handling the hair dye products. Hydrogen peroxide did not accelerate chemical breakthrough. .... compositions of the challenge solutions and physical and chemical properties .... affected permeation behaviors for different gloves."

What this means to home hair colourists and hair stylists alike, is that protective gloves need replacing on a regular basis, even if they still appear to be intact.

**ktani** · June 13th, 2009, 10:29 AM

Reports on club soda, used as a rinse after swimming in either a pool or sea water and/or as a pre-soak, before swimming. Note: Even though club soda has not been reported to be drying to hair, I suggest following up a club soda rinse after swimming, with coconut oil or coconut and argan oils, to chelate out any copper in the hair, and condition the hair.

1. Madame J, club soda rinse, with no shampoo to follow, after swimming, - http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...7&postcount=11, amount used - http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/...47&postcount=3

**Shermie Girl** · June 13th, 2009, 10:32 AM

Ktani, I just want to say thank you for all the hard work and research you do to keep this and the honey thread current. I wish I had had all this info years ago... It would have saved me a lot of trouble and tears. But, I have this info now and can make better decisions for my hair going forward.

You rock.