Hair care of movie stars from the past - oil-shampoo

[Carolyn]

Thank you for starting this thread, Ktani. Such interesting information. I adore Veronica Lake. I'm a fan of old movies. I watched them after school every day for years.

[ktani]

Thank you for starting this thread, Ktani. Such interesting information. I adore Veronica Lake. I'm a fan of old movies. I watched them after school every day for years.

My pleasure!

I am pleased that I was able to find out as much as I did.

[Carolyn]

Is there a coconut oil shampoo available in the US? I've had horrible luck in the past with soap based shampoos but that was before we got a filter and soft water.

[silverjen]

I don't know about regular shampoos, but several Chagrin Valley shampoo bars are coconut oil based. And a vinegar rinse is recommended after using them...

My goodness, I think I need to go watch Gilda tonight!

[ktani]

Is there a coconut oil shampoo available in the US? I've had horrible luck in the past with soap based shampoos but that was before we got a filter and soft water.

I think that you could make your own by adding coconut oil to a basic shampoo for normal hair. For a castile soap version, I would add a very small bit of undiluted vinegar, undiluted lemon juice, or a small amount of citric acid to it, to raise the pH, and follow the shampoo with a diluted vinegar or diluted lemon juice rinse. The coconut oil is absorbed into the hair when it swells because of water. The shampoo base does not need to be alkaline.

Coconut oil shampoo article, http://www.healthy-oil-planet.com/co...l-shampoo.html.
"If you want an all-in-one product, you can use a shampoo with coconut oil added in for daily moisturizing and cleansing treatments. These products contain the coconut oil in the shampoo and it's convenient to have a natural oil moisturizer built right into your shampoo. These are similar to using combination shampoo/conditioner products on your hair."

Modified from an earlier post of mine.
Coconut oil is also absorbed into the hair during the shampoo process. Coating the hair, it helps prevent damage during wet combing, and being absorbed into the hair to the cortex level, it helps reduce the amount of water absorbed by the hair, further reducing hair swelling. This would also help reduce hair drying time. Very clever hair stylist(s) long before the following study was done to confirm what the hair stylist(s) knew (from results) and the public could see on screen in the movies of that time.

This study, posted and referred to on these boards previously was done regarding the traditional use of oils in India and other countries, http://journal.scconline.org/pdf/cc2...175-p00192.pdf.
"Application of coconut oil as a pre-wash conditioner coats the hair and inhibits the penetration of water into the hair. A small part of it is also absorbed into the hair during the wash when the fiber is swollen. Introduction of this hydrophobic component reduces the swelling propensity of the cuticle, which limits the upward curving of the surface cuticle. This reduces the chipping away of the cuticle cells, which reduces protein loss, as observed in this work. ... It not only has a protective effect on undamaged hair but also on chemically treated hair, UV-treated hair ... The ability of coconut oil to penetrate into hair cuticle and cortex seems to be responsible for this effect." See Page 17 of the pdf.

hydrophobic definition, http://www.answers.com/topic/hydrophobic "1. Repelling, tending not to combine with, or incapable of dissolving in water."

I don't know about regular shampoos, but several Chagrin Valley shampoo bars are coconut oil based. And a vinegar rinse is recommended after using them...

My goodness, I think I need to go watch Gilda tonight!

CV shampoo bars are castor oil based, http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandcraft...oapvsshamp.htm, although they have other oils in them too.

I love that movie!

[Titian]

"If you want an all-in-one product, you can use a shampoo with coconut oil added in for daily moisturizing and cleansing treatments. These products contain the coconut oil in the shampoo and it's convenient to have a natural oil moisturizer built right into your shampoo. These are similar to using combination shampoo/conditioner products on your hair."

I tried a little experiment based on this today. I normally CO since I started lurking over here, but unfortunately it tends to leave my baby-fine hair a little flat, so the description of Carole Lombard's hair piqued my interest.

In the name of SCIENCE, I mixed 4 parts mild shampoo, 2 parts coconut oil, 1 part honey, and 2 parts conefree conditioner in an empty 16 oz conditioner bottle. It took a little work to get it to mix, and the final result was thinner than I expected, but I tried gently shampooing with it and following with an ACV rinse (I also used some leave-in conditioner because my hair tangles like crazy.) So far I'm pleased. It feels soft, not at all greasy, smells like honey, and I've actually got some volume. I may start adding this to my rotation if my hair keeps reacting like this.

This is a fun thread. I've always loved vintage hair and I hang around at the Fedora Lounge on and off, but the heated curlers I was using were killing my hair so I gave it up. It's great to learn some hair-friendly vintage techniques.

[Clytemnestra]

Funny you mention the fedora lounge, because I ended up cutting my waist length hair back to shoulders in order to better do vintage wet sets. But I missed my ballerina buns and I am now growing it back.

My hair loves coconut oil and ACV rinses, so I'm going to give this oil/shampoo method a try, but I read on LHC that an ACV rinse every day is not good for hair though, any thoughts on if it dries out the hair with daily use? Maybe the oil shampoo would counteract that problem.

I remember my mom giving my long hair a vinegar rinse often, she said that she learned it from her mother. I have fine, wavy hair so this might be what I am looking for, thanks for posting!

[ktani]

I tried a little experiment based on this today. I normally CO since I started lurking over here, but unfortunately it tends to leave my baby-fine hair a little flat, so the description of Carole Lombard's hair piqued my interest.

In the name of SCIENCE, I mixed 4 parts mild shampoo, 2 parts coconut oil, 1 part honey, and 2 parts conefree conditioner in an empty 16 oz conditioner bottle. It took a little work to get it to mix, and the final result was thinner than I expected, but I tried gently shampooing with it and following with an ACV rinse (I also used some leave-in conditioner because my hair tangles like crazy.) So far I'm pleased. It feels soft, not at all greasy, smells like honey, and I've actually got some volume. I may start adding this to my rotation if my hair keeps reacting like this.

This is a fun thread. I've always loved vintage hair and I hang around at the Fedora Lounge on and off, but the heated curlers I was using were killing my hair so I gave it up. It's great to learn some hair-friendly vintage techniques.

Welcome to LHC!

I was very plesantly surprised to learn how hair friendly the information was on how the hair was actually treated back then. Modern day techniques, recommended to replicate the vintage styles, like heated rollers and curling irons can be damaging, depending on how they are used and whether a heat protectant is used to help minimize hair damage. Blow dryers can be used on low to cool heat settings to make their use hair friendly.

In the name of SCIENCE lol, I am glad to hear that your results so far are so good! Please update.

Funny you mention the fedora lounge, because I ended up cutting my waist length hair back to shoulders in order to better do vintage wet sets. But I missed my ballerina buns and I am now growing it back.

My hair loves coconut oil and ACV rinses, so I'm going to give this oil/shampoo method a try, but I read on LHC that an ACV rinse every day is not good for hair though, any thoughts on if it dries out the hair with daily use? Maybe the oil shampoo would counteract that problem.

I remember my mom giving my long hair a vinegar rinse often, she said that she learned it from her mother. I have fine, wavy hair so this might be what I am looking for, thanks for posting!

You are most welcome!

A diluted lemon juice rinse can be used too. This one, http://ktanihairsense.blogspot.com/2...vation-by.html, has reported to give great results for most who have tried it. The link to the thread is in my blog post.

My blog post on vinegar rinses, http://ktanihairsense.blogspot.com/2...ar-rinses.html.

[Carolyn]

Last night I mixed up 1t coconut oil, 2t Bronners peppermint soap, 2T white vinegar, 1t reconstituted lemon juice and 8T distilled water. I melted to coconut oil in the micro first and then mixed in the rest. By morning the coconut oil had risen to the top and was semi solid. A quick stir took care of that. This morning I wet my hair and applied to my hair. I wish I would have had at least another 1/4C of liquid. I massage it in to my scalp well. My hair hadn't been washed for 2 days so it was on the greasy side. Then I rinsed very well and did a rinse with white vinegar and water. Rinsed well again.

That was over 3 hours ago and my hair still feel dampish. Normally it would have been drier by now. It feels like I did an oiling and got carried away. So I'm guessing that 1t coconut oil was too much for me. I'd cut that in half next time. I also think another teaspoon or so of the shampoo would be good and another 3-6 T water.

I'm not going to wash again today but I think I will tomorrow. This is just too much oil for me. On the plus side I didn't have any more tangles than if I had CO washed. It's very shiny and slightly wavier than usual. I'll slick it up in a bun today.

My new filter and water softener must be doing the trick because I wasn't sitting in a tub full of soap scum when I was done with my bath. I used a LUSH soap to bathe with.

My Dr Bronners might be old as it was very thick and I had a heck of a time squeezing out enough product to use.

[ktani]

Last night I mixed up 1t coconut oil, 2t Bronners peppermint soap, 2T white vinegar, 1t reconstituted lemon juice and 8T distilled water. I melted to coconut oil in the micro first and then mixed in the rest. By morning the coconut oil had risen to the top and was semi solid. A quick stir took care of that. This morning I wet my hair and applied to my hair. I wish I would have had at least another 1/4C of liquid. I massage it in to my scalp well. My hair hadn't been washed for 2 days so it was on the greasy side. Then I rinsed very well and did a rinse with white vinegar and water. Rinsed well again.

That was over 3 hours ago and my hair still feel dampish. Normally it would have been drier by now. It feels like I did an oiling and got carried away. So I'm guessing that 1t coconut oil was too much for me. I'd cut that in half next time. I also think another teaspoon or so of the shampoo would be good and another 3-6 T water.

I'm not going to wash again today but I think I will tomorrow. This is just too much oil for me. On the plus side I didn't have any more tangles than if I had CO washed. It's very shiny and slightly wavier than usual. I'll slick it up in a bun today.

My new filter and water softener must be doing the trick because I wasn't sitting in a tub full of soap scum when I was done with my bath. I used a LUSH soap to bathe with.

My Dr Bronners might be old as it was very thick and I had a heck of a time squeezing out enough product to use.

It is going to take some experimentation to find the right recipe for individual needs with this. Very interesting results so far for the 2 of you who have tried this. Wavier and shinier hair than usual, plus no soap scum or more tangles than usual, are 3 very good plusses to me. Those go with the hair having body, lots of shine and being manageable, for the stars of that era.

If one is going to use a castile or other soap base for the shampoo, I recommend buying pH paper stips, if one does not have a pH meter available, to test the final pH of the shampoo before using it, although following such a shampoo with a well diluted vinegar or lemon juice rinse should take care of any alkalinity.