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Kimberly
April 9th, 2009, 01:33 PM
I was wondering, am I the only one to have a horribly gunky brush when I wash with shampoo bars? What am I doing wrong?

I get a lot of gunk in my comb when I don't use a vinegar rinse or if it isn't strong enough. The gunk is buildup from hard water, at least in my case.

kwaniesiam
April 9th, 2009, 01:36 PM
So does anyone here have hard water but no issues with the CV bars? I use the neem and tea tree bar, (my favorite ever) and don't really even bother with vinegar rinses or anything anymore. Sometimes conditioner, but that rarely too. Maybe my hair is just really taken with the poo bars, but I tried them before and was gunky :shrug: I'm not complaining but wondering why. I guess I shouldn't question too much though as long as it continues to make my hair this nice :cloud9:

ratgirldjh
April 9th, 2009, 01:45 PM
We have medium hard water. The CV bars (at least Summer Sunshine) did not work well for me. For some reason it made my hair very straight and it looked coated - which BTW has never happened to me with natural soap bars i've tried - But I do have good luck with J. R. Liggett's Herbal Shampoo Bar - which most people don't have good luck with.

Also I always do a diluted ACV rinse - 1 teaspoon to 32 ounces water - because i hate the idea of leaving my cuticles open.

I also tried the original J. R. Liggett's Shampoo Bar and it seemed to leave a coating on my hair. Not too bad, but my hair is much shinier with the herbal formula.

Out of everything I've tried soap and poo bar wise, I really liked the way Chandrika soap cleaned my hair. It did not leave a waxy film; and it felt like it left my cuticles closed - because my hair was very smooth and shiny. However, it does dry my ends more than the others - AND since they have so many different formulas of the same soap bar floating around - SOME of which contain paraffin or beeswax, I choose NOT to use it.

Neoma
April 9th, 2009, 06:07 PM
I was wondering, am I the only one to have a horribly gunky brush when I wash with shampoo bars? What am I doing wrong?Isa-belle, no, you're not alone. My BBB gets really "linty" looking when I shampoo with poo bars. There was a long thread about this on the old LHC. I don't know if we ever came to a conclusion as to why it happens.

I just wash my BBB more frequently.

:flower:

healingsolitude
April 9th, 2009, 07:55 PM
I gave in to the urge to look at this thread again the other week and saw Neoma's raves about the Sweet Creek Herbs shampoo bars. Guess who gave into the $9 sampler pack of 4 bars? I need to learn self-control since I was 100% sure I had completely given up on shampoo bars a few months ago.

Anyway, I had a lovely chat with Kathleen from SCH after I ordered from her. She is total sweetheart and very generous. She also really knows what she is doing and is constantly doing more research to make sure she is releasing the best product. I am very impressed by how interested she is in making sure everyone gets the best results with her bars. I couldn't recommend her enough. Plus, you can get four 1.5 to 2 oz sample sized bars of your choice for only $9 with free shipping if you live in the U.S. (discounted shipping if you live elsewhere). That is an amazing bargain if you are new to shampoo bars or simply want a variety of new ones to try that won't cost you too much. These are the four I purchased:

Rosemary Green Tea - a true rosemary scent
Green Herbal - an earthy tea tree/rosemary scent
Chamomile Ylang Ylang - the amazing and feminine scent of ylang ylang, but not the too strong scent I usually get with ylang ylang scented soap. My fav bar based on scent alone since I haven't tried it yet.
Goat Milk Lavender, Chamomile and Comfrey (regular body soap) - Beautiful blend of lavender and chamomile essential oils

I tried the Rosemary Green Tea tonight like Kathleen suggested for my oily scalp. I also followed Neoma's suggestions for a rinse since I'm hoping to avoid the build up issues this time around. For this, I added warm water almost to the top of a 40 oz cup, then added only 1 teaspoon of ACV (I just prefer that over WV) and a little bit of my usual Suave clarifying conditioner. I never tried conditioner before with shampoo bars because every one I had tried would make my scalp oily and weigh down my hair. The Suave Clarifying is something I discovered later and now love. I lathered my hair twice with the Rosemary Green Tea since my oily scalp eats up the first lather of anything I use, then I slowly poured the rinse on my clean hair to make sure I got it all. Worked it into my hair, left it sit for a few minutes, rinsed it out, then did two cold water rinses. I'm obviously being very cautious during my first time using a shampoo bar again. lol. My hair is only partly dry at the moment, but it appears to be a success so far. I noticed that the lather in my hair felt more silky when compared to the lather I remember from the CV bars, which made me worry a bit that they might actually be more moisturizing. My hair after rinsing felt the same as it did with the CV bars, which was squeaky clean with the tendency to stick to my fingers. It felt soft and more normal after the rinse. Combing was a breeze and very easy to do, as long as I worked my way from the bottom. My hair tends to be molded to my head and slicked back after I use a shampoo bar, so I have to be very gentle about working the bottom free from tangles before I try to rearrange the top or there will be a lot of pulling. My hair now feels soft and light so far. There is visible lift around my hairline where it is completely dry. It doesn't feel as coated as it did with other shampoo bars, but I'm sure there must be some on there due to the slicked back feeling my wet hair had. The ends don't feel dry at all, though my ends never feel dry with any natural shampoo or bars. I'll have to examine the results more once it is fully dry. I also want to see how they work long-term since that is when I tend to run into problems with shampoo bars.

So, which bars have others tried from this seller? I only remember reading about the Marshmallow bar so far. Which ones are the most moisturizing following the Marshmallow bars? Those seem to be the most moisturizing so far from what I've read. The Chamomile Ylang Ylang seems like it would be the most moisturizing out of the ones I purchased, so I think I'll try that one last and add a teaspoon of baking soda to the second lather.

Oh, I also found a gentle clarifying method that is actually my favorite shampoo method now. It does involve a shampoo bar, but this is not a natural one. I bought two Lush shampoo bars with a Christmas gift card to try them out after the natural shampoo bars didn't work out. Both have mostly natural and/or organic ingredients without SLS. The two I bought (NEW! and Jumping Juniper) have the Sodium Coco-Sulfate that seems to be more gentle on my hair. However, I still find them too harsh to use alone on my fine hair. I've been using the NEW! bar by itself as a first lather, rinse, swipe the bar down my hair three times again, add a handful of the Suave Clarifying conditioner on top, then lather them up together as I work them both into my hair. I add more conditioner wherever it doesn't feel slick enough, let it sit for a few minutes, then I rinse it out thoroughly before finishing with a cold water rinse. My nearly BSL hair comes out feeling very clean, amazingly soft, light and volumized when using this method. The clarifying conditioner is conditioning enough for my normal hair without being too much for my oily scalp to handle when it is mixed with a little bit of the shampoo lather. This way I feel like I get the same results as a shampoo bar or CO on my entire length of hair while still being cleansing enough for my scalp to handle everytime I shampoo. I just thought this info might be useful for anyone with oily hair or scalp who is struggling with the natural shampoo bars like I was since I tend to need detergents to keep my scalp clean and happy.


I was wondering, am I the only one to have a horribly gunky brush when I wash with shampoo bars? What am I doing wrong?

You are definitely not the only one. There was talk about this a good bit back on the thread. I was using shampoo bars from CV and a local seller when I used bars before and had a good amount of gunky stuff on my plastic comb. It helped to get a cheap tooth brush to use for the sole purpose of cleaning my comb. One thing I did notice is that I would get more gunk with the more moisturizing shampoo bars. Chamomile & Citrus and Nettle from CV would keep me gunk free for a few washes at least. The others would start right back up with the gunk either by the end of the first wash or after the second one. I'm not entirely sure what causes it, but there was talk of it maybe being the castor oil. I suppose it could also be due to the amount of each oil put into the bars since the cleansing ones didn't cause the gunk as quickly for me.

I'd suggest clarifying your hair with your clarifying treatment of choice if it bugs you. Or even just to make sure it doesn't build up too much since I can't imagine that is healthy for the scalp if it builds up there.


So I've been using my CV poo bars for maybe about 3 months now, and I thought I got the routine down pat... but now I'm confused. My hair still feels MUCH softer and has more body, but has basically lost all the shine that I associated with using these bars (honey beer and chamomile citrus, if anyone's curious). They both used to leave my hair SUPER shiny, and now... nothing really. Wouldn't say my hair is dull, but it's as shiny as dull Asian hair can get.
I'm still doing the same vinegar rinse, and it still feels slippery, so I don't think it's that.
What should I try? Different rinses, different bars (Nettle didn't do anything, but it never made my hair shiny period), maybe clarify?

You have been using the CV shampoo bars exclusively for 3 months? To me, I found that using only the CV bars just didn't work for me. There was info on the CV website about switching to another shampoo method and then going back to the CV bars if you suddenly have issues with them. They definitely left something coated on my hair, which I think builds up over time and needs something stronger to wash it off. That coating could be what is making your hair lose its shine now. Perhaps try a clarifying treatment or a stronger shampoo method for a wash or two, then switch back to the CV bars to see if the great results from before come back again.

Also, I never tried the Honey Beer soap on my hair, but I did find that the Chamomile & Citrus didn't leave as much of a coating on my hair as the more moisturizing bars. Maybe switch back and forth between the two and use the C&C more often the first week to see if perhaps the HB is leaving a coating on your hair. Good luck!

Neoma
April 9th, 2009, 08:11 PM
healingsolitude, I really enjoyed reading your post. I'm very curious to hear how your hair looks and feels now that it's dry.
:flowers:

I couldn't agree with you more about Kathleen's amazing customer service and what a great value her sample-sized shampoo bars are.

Please keep us posted!

healingsolitude
April 9th, 2009, 09:18 PM
Thanks, Neoma! :flower: So far I am very pleased with the one bar I have tried. The hair around my length is now dry and more volumized like I would expect from a shampoo bar. It is soft and healthy feeling right now. I don't think it is as shiny as it was following my last few shampoos, but I don't think that has to do with this bar since those results came from conditioner soaks. The only thing that is close to negative is that this bar didn't give me as much lift around my scalp as I had hoped. That probably also isn't through the fault of the bar since it is extremely hard for a shampoo bar to give my fine hair volume on top instead of just along the length. I only had one do that and it was the Nettle bar from CV. But then both the Chamomile Ylang Ylang and the Green Herbal bars have good reviews about those adding volume, so I think I will try one of those the next time. CYY even has a little bit of nettle in it. Kathleen was also a dear and sent me a sample of nettle bar that is still curing. I can't wait to try them all!

Her sample sized bars really are a great value. I don't have any full-size samples from CV left to compare them to, but it does seem like Kathleen's samples run even larger than CV samples, and I thought the CV samples were huge when I received them!

ljkforu
April 10th, 2009, 12:00 AM
I've found a fun new soap for shampoo source.

Oregon Soap Company

It says, "Handcrafted by Soapman and the Soapelves' in Portland, Oregon."

I bought and have been using the Patchouli for a couple of months now. It is awesome then my New Season's store started carrying their cut your own and now I'm in heaven. I got the Aniseed next and have used it for a couple of months too.

The ingredients are: Saponified Palm, Coconut, Olive, essential oils, and coco butter. (All certified Organic by Oregon Tilth)

WWW. oregonsoapcompany.com 800-549-0299

I have no interest in this company, I just read the stuff off the side of the box (he he -- made with 100% post consumer waste).

Post note: these are cleansing bars they are not as fatted as CV or any of the other bars that use castor.

I like to mix it up and use some castor bars (CV) and some non (Various).

Moonstruck
April 10th, 2009, 10:58 AM
Healingsolitude, your post is so super informative, thanks! Definitely tempting to try SCH next, though I sorta adore all the different varieties that CV offers - I love one stop shopping, basically.

Speaking of the gunk issue - I got gunk when I first tried shampoo bars, especially with my first bar (one of the burts bees ones, highly not recommended haha), and it gradually went away. For me, it seems to be related to the waxies - I only get it now when I try to wash without an acid rinse. The lint has completely gone away now.

firenze
April 10th, 2009, 02:56 PM
I just wanted to stop by and say thanks for all your information and advice. I'm not sure I gave my shampoo bars the best trial period, but after a week my hair was just feeling waxier and gunkier and actually started looking darker and dull. My ends felt great, but everything else was a complete mess.

I decided to grab some Suave Naturals Coconut and try a CO wash to see if that would help. I've done it two days now and my hair loves it. It's soft, moisturized, really shiny, not greasy, touchable, and the ends feel just as great as they did with the 'poo bars. I think my hair really loves being 'cone free. I never would have thought that but before trying the bars and CO, I used so so so many 'cone products because my hair was so dry. The ends were always crunchy no matter how much "extra super dry/damaged" shampoo, conditioners, serums, and leave-ins I piled on my hair. I can't believe that taking the 'cones away would actually make my hair feel better. :cheese:

I'm sad that I didn't really get great results with the CV bars right away, but I might go back to them and try them again in the future. I just really love the idea of using natural hair care stuff. I'm glad I gave it a try, though.

Anyway, I just wanted to pop in and say thanks for your help! Maybe I can get the poo bars to work one day when I'm in an area with softer water!

Suldrun
April 10th, 2009, 06:30 PM
Healingsolitude Hi its so nice to hear from you :) Thanks for the update.

ljkforu
April 10th, 2009, 10:24 PM
Thanks, Neoma! :flower: So far I am very pleased with the one bar I have tried. The hair around my length is now dry and more volumized like I would expect from a shampoo bar. It is soft and healthy feeling right now. I don't think it is as shiny as it was following my last few shampoos, but I don't think that has to do with this bar since those results came from conditioner soaks. The only thing that is close to negative is that this bar didn't give me as much lift around my scalp as I had hoped. That probably also isn't through the fault of the bar since it is extremely hard for a shampoo bar to give my fine hair volume on top instead of just along the length. I only had one do that and it was the Nettle bar from CV. But then both the Chamomile Ylang Ylang and the Green Herbal bars have good reviews about those adding volume, so I think I will try one of those the next time. CYY even has a little bit of nettle in it. Kathleen was also a dear and sent me a sample of nettle bar that is still curing. I can't wait to try them all!

Her sample sized bars really are a great value. I don't have any full-size samples from CV left to compare them to, but it does seem like Kathleen's samples run even larger than CV samples, and I thought the CV samples were huge when I received them!
It is so good to see you again, Healingsolitude.

I've been using CV soap bars for a couple of months and have had great results and no gunk.

I'm curious to try the Liggett's herbal to see what it does.

FUNK2LOPEZ
April 10th, 2009, 11:32 PM
I've been using a cheap bar I bought at the store and it's been working for me. I want to try some of the bars everyone keeps posting about. I think I need to stick with what I'm using for now until I can afford to order some of those really good bars. I might be able to get some sooner if my friend, ljkforu, goes in with me to order some. The hope is we'll split the shipping cost and maybe share some of the bars to try out. We'll see. :hifive:

ljkforu
April 11th, 2009, 02:05 AM
I've been using a cheap bar I bought at the store and it's been working for me. I want to try some of the bars everyone keeps posting about. I think I need to stick with what I'm using for now until I can afford to order some of those really good bars. I might be able to get some sooner if my friend, ljkforu, goes in with me to order some. The hope is we'll split the shipping cost and maybe share some of the bars to try out. We'll see. :hifive:
Specifically, she has been using almond Sappo Hills soap from Ashland, Oregon. It is a pure homecrafted style soap that doesn't over strip. At a 1.99 at Kroger's it is hard to go wrong. I have CV bars but I'm really enthusiastic about the SCH bars and the price. Wow! http://www.sappohill.com/ (I just love them all)

I'll give funk2lopez a CV chocolate almond sample so she can compare.

Lordy do I love to enable :D


( quote from healing) That is an amazing bargain if you are new to shampoo bars or simply want a variety of new ones to try that won't cost you too much. These are the four I purchased:

Rosemary Green Tea - a true rosemary scent
Green Herbal - an earthy tea tree/rosemary scent
Chamomile Ylang Ylang - the amazing and feminine scent of ylang ylang, but not the too strong scent I usually get with ylang ylang scented soap. My fav bar based on scent alone since I haven't tried it yet.
Goat Milk Lavender, Chamomile and Comfrey (regular body soap) - Beautiful blend of lavender and chamomile essential oils

I really want to get some from Sweet Creek. http://sweetcreekherbalsoaps.com/

healingsolitude
April 11th, 2009, 10:19 PM
Moonstruck - You're welcome! I also like the varieties at CV, though the SCH bars intrigued me with the use of tea in most of the shampoo bars. It made me wonder if maybe those bars might not really need a vinegar rinse since I had read on here or another board where some used tea rinses instead of vinegar rinses.

Unfortunately, my gunk issue with the CV bars and another local set of shampoo bars never went away. It just ended up getting worse until I gave them up completely. I kind of wonder now if maybe the build-up was due to the fact that I gave up using any sort of acidic rinse after the first few weeks of using them since the water here is not terribly hard. I might give the Nettle or Citrus & Chamomile CV bars another chance if my experiment with SCH works well. Many seem to have much better luck with CV the second time around. Either way, I do find it to be a good excuse to have fun experimenting. :)

firenze - Congrats on finding a good hair wash method with the CO type of wash! It does leave the hair feeling incredible. Perhaps you'll even be able to have better luck with the shampoo bars after awhile of only using the CO method.

I didn't get the chance to be strictly CO due to my oily scalp, but I do think a clarifying treatment is needed every so often? Or just a switch to another method once or twice if the hair begins to look weighted down? I think I read about that somewhere here, though it might only be certain hair/scalp types that need to do that. If you do find that you need to switch every now and then, perhaps the shampoo bars will be a good alternative one of those times. And you might have better luck if you do a vinegar rinse mixed with conditioner like others do here with great results since it sounds like your hair and/or scalp loves conditioner. Good luck!

Suldrun - Hi back! :waving: How have you been?

ljkforu - It is good to see you, too! I keep meaning to try the CV soap bars, but it seems like one of the ones I want to try is always out of stock, then another will go out of stock when that one is available. I think I'll wait until I see how this experiment goes with the SCH shampoo bars and some goat's milk soap bars before I try to see about making another order. So far I've only tried the Rhassoul Clay & Yogurt soap bar from CV on my hair, which led to a lot of build-up and another wash the next day. I also still have about half a bar each of the Honey Beer (probably far too moisturizing for me), the Cornmeal & Honey (also probably far too moisturizing and that bar is quite rough), the Juniper Comfrey Mint (not sure how that would be), a full sample of the Scarborough Fair, and a small half sample of the Orange Creamsicle. The Liggett's herbal bar also sounds nice.

FUNK2LOPEZ - I think one of the cheapest ways to try out shampoo bars is to just focus on sample sized portions. That way you don't have to worry about a bar going to waste if you buy the full bar only to realize it doesn't work for your hair and isn't moisturizing enough to use as a body soap. However, I've found it is kind of good to get the full bar and cut it into three sections. That way you can always give the unused portions as a gift to someone who is interested in trying out shampoo bars if that particular bar doesn't work for you. I like to enable family and friends. ;)

Also, I just noticed that SCH has a special when you buy three full-sized bars from this page (http://www.etsy.com/view_listing.php?listing_id=20473487) (under the Gift Items section of her store in case that page gets sold before you view the link). It says you can order 3 bars of your choice for $13 using that special, which saves you $2.00 off of the total for the bars if you had purchased them individually, and it saves you 70 cents off of the shipping total (S&H $4.95). Then there is also the $9 four pack of samples with free shipping or the $20 ten pack of samples with free shipping (under Samplers & Less 2 Ship). Hopefully that helps to give you an option if you'd like to purchase them yourself or if you and ljkforu would like to share the purchase cost. Even splitting the samples in half to share with a friend should allow for plenty of time to know if they work for you. My samples were quite large at almost 2 ounces each, but the page says that the samples can vary between 1-2 ounces. You can also get samples from CV for around $2 each (plus $5.70 S&H), but the full-sized bars cost a little bit more than the SCH ones. It doesn't look like CV has any specials, although I've heard Ida is very generous if you get in touch with her about any questions that you have. I hope this helps! :)

---

No new progress on the natural shampoo bar experiment. I had to go out of town, so I went back to my conditioner and Lush bar mixture during my last wash. I think I'm going to try the Chamomile Ylang Ylang SCH sample next since I just bought some ylang ylang & myrrh body essence from the B&BW Outlet store that will pair nicely with that. :D

Canarygirl
April 11th, 2009, 11:33 PM
Hi folks just wanted to post that my husband and I both really like the CV "citrus and camomile" shampoo bar. I asked him if he would like to try it, and he hesitated...."Do you want me to try it?" lol :rolleyes: I packed it for a weekend trip so it was easy enough to have him try it.

After we returned home he said, "Feel my hair. It's the second day and it feels so good." He asked me if I could share my shampoo bar with him. Lucky thing I had an extra one! :D

ljkforu
April 13th, 2009, 05:18 AM
FUNK2LOPEZ will probably like every bar she gets because her water is as good as mine. So she will probably end up like me with 22 bars that she loves. I have yet to find any bar that was truly disgusting in our water supply. It is so nice to be able to not have to use detergent on my head anymore (I'm allergic).

I do have to say though that skeptical as I was, I'm hooked on the honey complexion soap bar from CV. So much so that I'm too greedy to share and will buy a whole bar when I run out. I can't really tell you why I'm so hooked it has just a slight smell of honey, it lathers well but not off the chart, hair feels just right. It is the perfect middle of the road bar. Not to much or too little of anything. I love it on my face too, but am to stingy to use it on my body the sample is too small.

Suzie22
April 13th, 2009, 09:21 AM
I never knew there was such a thing. I just saw the website chagrinvalley and I am going to place an order of bars... I am also looking at the lotion bars. I have a lot to learn! :)

ljkforu
April 13th, 2009, 04:54 PM
I never knew there was such a thing. I just saw the website chagrinvalley and I am going to place an order of bars... I am also looking at the lotion bars. I have a lot to learn! :)
Soft water buy what ever you want from Chagrin Valley. Hard water buy the soap bars. There is very little difference but you'll get less build up with the soap than the poo.

longhairedfairy
April 13th, 2009, 05:41 PM
Does anyone use ready-made soap and add stuff (oils, herbs, etc.) to make it into a shampoo bar? Can this be done or would it be a disaster?

Sammybunny711
April 15th, 2009, 03:02 PM
Okay...so everytime I say I am going to stop doing poo bars, I go back to them because I LOVE them. However, I think my hair DEFINITELY misses my vinegar rinses. I have been using citric acid rinses with a bit of lavender oil mixed in. Do you think my hair would be less tangly and more soft if I added some aloe or honey into the rinse? I just ADORE my poo bars and do not want to have to leave them, especially since my hair has been crap lately and I know they are chocked full of hair-goodies. Any ideas? Vinegar rinses are unfortunately not cool for me.

hennared
April 15th, 2009, 07:22 PM
Hi guys.. ok. I have tried Prairieland and CV bars so far. I really liked the CV nettle one. I recently bought a Sweet Creek herbs bar; and then moved to an area with *very* hard water (Arizona). I've read some advice against using shampoo bars on thinning hair. Between the water here and the warnings, now I'm tentative about using my Sweet Creek Herb bar.

So... is there anyone else here with thin hair that needs volume, easily sheds, And has to deal with hard water, that has successfully used the Sweet Creek Herb bars (or another type?) Also, I have to really watch it with vinegar rinses; they seem to really weigh my hair down. I don't mind rinsing with citric acid, and I do a final rinse with filtered water (to cancel out some of the hard water effect here where I live now)

Any of my thin haired sisters have some advice?

Moonstruck
April 16th, 2009, 04:48 PM
Healing Solitude -
Though tea instead of water seems like it would make the bar less basic, I don't know if that is why acid rinses aren't really needed. In theory at least, the saponification reaction that is used to make soap needs to be fatty acids (oils) + base (lye). Water is there to help catalyze and speed up the reaction. The water part of tea would do the same thing, but the acidity would be neutralized. The extra goodies from the tea (infused plant whatever) would still be around though. I'm not quite sure what at all makes a bar more neutral, but I really wuld love to find out!
Also, not to compare SCH and CV too much, but... in a way, it's SCH that is the more expensive ones, strictly by what they say on their pages. CV is ~6.75 per bar, but for a bar that is around 6.5-7.2 ounces, roughly a dollar per ounce. SCH is 5 for 4+, which at minimum weight, is 1.25 $/ounce.

I'm totally buying a sample of SCH though - REALLY awesomely nice seller indeed! She's absolutely amazing!

Canarygirl
April 16th, 2009, 05:21 PM
I think all soap/shampoo bars are high-ph by nature. If you want to lower the ph, you need to switch away from soap cleansing bars to detergent-based bars. There are some milder detergents; an example is a product called "Gentle Clean" (sold by Skin Biology, either in liquid or in a bar). Or use a ph-balanced liquid castille. (There are a couple of those available from DiannaYvonne.com, the wheatgerm cleanser and the rosehip seed cleanser. They both have enough citric acid/grapefruit seed extract to bring the ph down to ~5.5 or 6). Any of these would be a lot lower in ph than the shampoo bars. What I don't know about is the effect that the glycerin content would have on hair.

It may be safest to try to find a ph-balanced regular liquid shampoo. Be aware that lots of products say they are ph balanced but are not really in the ph zone of human skin. I think that Ktani uses a lower ph shampoo, but it has cones in it. It's all a trade-off! :)

healingsolitude
April 16th, 2009, 08:00 PM
longhairedfairy - You might want to try sending ljk4u a message if she doesn't see the question here. She experiments a lot with soap-making. I think she has made her own soap with different oils, but I'm not sure if she has tried herbs. She is also open to any questions you have about soap-making. :)

Sammybunny711 - I don't remember reading about anyone adding aloe to the rinse on here, though I have heard that adding honey can give good results. The ratio is what I am not sure about with the honey. Maybe just try a teaspoon the first time? You might also want to search the board for catnip rinses. Many on here say that catnip rinses leave them with soft hair.

I believe you didn't like the vinegar rinses before because of the smell it left in your hair? Did you try adding conditioner or the lavender oil to the vinegar rinse from before? I've found that adding conditioner to my ACV rinse cancels out the vinegar smell. I haven't tried it with white vinegar. I've also read on here where soaking whole herbs in the vinegar for a few days can help greatly with the smell.

hennared - How much vinegar do you use? I get much better results with extremely diluted ACV. I've been using a 40 oz cup filled two inches from the top and add only one teaspoon of ACV, along with a shot of conditioner. However, I don't know how well that works in very hard water. You might not be able to dilute your vinegar rinse quite that much. Maybe just gradually use less and less? That seems the easiest way to go about it in order to find your perfect dilution. The citric acid is another good option for a rinse. Have you given that a try yet?

I'm still trying the SCH bars, so I'm not sure which one causes me to shed more so far. Which one did you get? My hair is fine and very flat, though I do have a lot of hair. All of the CV bars gave me the same amount of hair loss as every other shampoo bar I've tried (including the SCH Chamomile Ylang Ylang & the Rosemary Green Tea samples I've tried), except for the Cafe Moreno bar. For some reason I lost much less hair with that bar than I did with any of the shampoo bars I tried. Unfortunately, it was too moisturizing for me to use on my oily scalp after awhile. I still have the Herbal sample from SCH to try, as well as a new one. I've also found that the amount of hair you shed isn't quite as big of a deal as it seems. It is kind of like a balancing act. Most on here talk about losing more hair while they shampoo with a shampoo bar, then find that they barely lose any hair while combing. However, when I use regular shampoo I find that I shed even more while shampooing and I still shed a lot while combing my dry hair. It probably differs from person-to-person, but it is something to look out for. Some might just notice the amount of hair they lose while shampooing with the bars, then forget to notice the fact that they lose less while combing. Hopefully that made sense! I need some more coffee. :D

Moonstruck - Ah, I think I was too busy babbling in that entry and wasn't as clear as I could have been. lol. I was referring to the cheaper prices at SCH based solely on the sampler packs. You get four samples for $9 or 10 samples for $20, both with free shipping. Those deals impressed me since I think it is an excellent idea for shampoo/soap bar sellers to offer a free shipping deal with their sample sized bars. The $9 total deal for four generously sized samples makes it an excellent choice for someone who has never tried shampoo bars and wants to try them at a cheap price. I also kind of consider the sampler pack deals to make the entire store seem like a better value since I'm not worried about paying full price + S&H for a full-sized bar that I possibly won't like. I'm a bit embarrassed by the amount of full-sized bars I have purchased that made me regret that purchase due to not liking the smell or not liking how my skin reacted. :o Her sampler deals allow for you to test the bars you are interested in at an affordable cost, then you can later make a full order with the S&H cost for the full-sized bars that you already know you like. Then her three pack of full-sized bars makes the cost about even with other sellers who would cost more with the bigger bars. It is like a no risk/no worries type of deal for me since I'm a worrier who always questions whether or not I should have purchased a full-size of something that I may or may not like. Anyway, I obviously like a good deal and have thought about this way too much. lol.

I'm not sure why a vinegar rinse might not be needed with the SCH bars. It could possibly have something to do with the tea since I remember reading somewhere on here that someone used tea rinses instead of vinegar rinses. Then again, it could be something as simple as the amount of each oil that goes into the product. I'd like to test whether or not a vinegar rinse isn't needed with these bars, but my troublesome scalp makes me wary of trying that just yet. I think cutting out the rinse was what messed me up the last time I tried shampoo bars. Which SCH sample or samples did you purchase, btw?

Canarygirl - You almost had me sold on another bar until I read about the high glycerin part. ;) I'm thinking it would be best for me to avoid that since I tend to get a lot of build-up from bars. I should probably stop experimenting altogether, anyway. At least one of my shampoo methods works amazingly well. I'll stick with what already works if this shampoo and soap bar experiment doesn't work out. I still have plenty left from my SCH samples and some goat's milk soaps that I wanted to try on my hair this time around.

masterofmidgets
April 17th, 2009, 03:41 AM
Wow, I think I finally made it all the way through this thread! Worth reading, though - I don't think there's anything about shampoo bars this board doesn't know by now!

I've been using CV bars since February, and I've got pretty good results so far. I've tried...camomile&citrus, cafe mereno, summer sunshine, extra honey beer and egg, lavendar aloe, carrot milk and honey, and lavendar spice (you people are enabling), and none of them have gone really badly at all, although the beer and egg made my hair a bit flat. No build-up, no scalp problems, no adjustment period - I think I got off easy. And I love how thick and healthy my hair feels lately!

Definitely glad I read up enough to know to use a vinegar rinse before I started; the first time I used a bar, my hair felt so waxy at first I couldn't even run my hand down it. But the AVC rinse worked wonders. After awhile, I didn't even notice the smell; I guess I've gotten used to it. I do still use conditioner, but then I have curly hair that tangles at the drop of a hat XD

Does anyone else find that shampoo bars make their hair more curly? With the camomile and citrus, especially, I'm well into 3a territory, it's kind of fabulous. (another reason to love these bars aside from the smell and the lack of chemicals and the healthy, non-dry hair and the small business supporting and the...everything!)

Glad to finally de-lurk long enough to say hi!

Canarygirl
April 17th, 2009, 11:06 AM
Hi master,

Yes, I agree about the shampoo bars making my hair more curly.

Today I tried a different rinse for post shampoo bar use. It's Dr. Bonner's hair rinse and it has citric acid in it to close the cuticle...it also has shikakai in it. You dilute it in water, then use. The directions on the bottle don't say to rinse it out, but I did anyway. It took away the too-squeeky clean feel from the shampoo bar. My hair was easy to comb through, and it looks pretty nice today. :)

hennared
April 17th, 2009, 03:21 PM
Well, I tried my SCH bar, yesterday (the bar I bought is the almond/marshmallow/silk bar). I used a load of bottled water to rinse with (though not to wash) since my water is so hard, and a final rinse with 1/4 tsp citric acid in 4 cups of water... and no conditioner; but I had done a catnip soak on my ends earlier the same day. *I like it*!! my hair felt crunchy while drying, which worried me, but once it was dry it was alright, and, my hair had more volume to it than it has in weeks.

My experience in the past has been that shampoo bars work for me for a while, and then mysteriously stop working (I get the waxies). I might stick to using the SCh bars every third or so wash, and see how that goes...

By the way, I am a bit obsessive over counting my shed hairs, and the shampoo bars don't seem to aggravate my shedding, but I apply them by shaving off bits of soap into solution and using the soap as a liquid once it dissolves... less mechanical soap scrubbing damage to my scalp that way :)

Neoma
April 17th, 2009, 06:26 PM
I just placed an order for some more shampoo bars from Sweet Creek Herbs. Kathleen and I have been corresponding via email about why her shampoo bars work better for me than any other brand that I've tried. I thought it was interesting, and Kathleen gave me permission to share it.


...someone brought up what makes soap work in hard water or soft water...is it the water the soap maker uses in making the soap? And, this had been worrying (as they say in this neck of the woods) me for some time. I think I have an acceptable answer if you would care to read on...

Well, it isn't the water we soap makers use that differentiate our soaps' performance in hard and soft water. Almost all of us use distilled or rain water. We are looking for that water free of minerals, because minerals decrease the amount of lather in a soap. And, today, we have to filter out the first few minutes of rainwater before collecting mineral free water (1st rain grabs free floating minerals in the air). When we make herbal teas for our soaps, we also use this same water. So, I think it is not the water with which we make the soap.

But, I think...would it have something to do with our own tap water. In other words, how do we rate our own soaps? We can only test them in our own water. And, that led me to think that the performance of our soaps in our own water determines how we think the oils act in a soap with regard to type and ratio.

If a soap maker had soft water as tap water, for instance, and bathed with a bar made of palm oil, rice bran oil, and olive oil. This bar lathers fine, rinses fine and leave the skin feeling soft. Now, bring that same bar to my hard limestone water. That bar will not lather near as much here. Because, we already know minerals eat up the lather in a soap.

I like to tell my customers at every opportunity that soap molecules (George calls them worms :) have a head and a tail. The tail grabs the dirt (mineral), while the head grabs the water - and whoosh down the drain the dirt and soap go. Detergents, on the other hand, have two tails!

Well, it would take a lot more of that soap to make lather in hard water just because it would take a lot more soap to combat the minerals in the water. When you live in a place with hard water, you seek the oils and ratios that make that soap lather more easily in hard water. So, in my thinking, my tests are more rigorous for soaps because it is FILLED with limestone...some of the hardest water I've had to live with.

And, the vinegar is not to do with the soap in the hair - it is to do with easing the minerals off the hair the rinse water set in - I think. This would be my hypothesis, anyway. So, my shampoo bars should not require vinegar as a rinse IF the water used to rinse the soap out is not full of minerals, oil or dirt.

swirlytresses
April 17th, 2009, 06:37 PM
Neoma- very interesting and thank you for sharing. Do you have a link for these soaps. Our water is hard here and I would like to give these soaps a shot. I currently use CV bars, Dairy whip, and some bars I bought from someone on naturally curly.com. Thanks again.

ETA: nevermind, I found the link. Thanks.

Neoma
April 17th, 2009, 08:35 PM
Neoma- very interesting and thank you for sharing. Do you have a link for these soaps. Our water is hard here and I would like to give these soaps a shot. I currently use CV bars, Dairy whip, and some bars I bought from someone on naturally curly.com. Thanks again.

ETA: nevermind, I found the link. Thanks.
You're very welcome, swirlytresses. Please let us know how they work for you. :flower:

In case anyone else wants the link to Sweet Creek Herbs (http://www.etsy.com/shop.php?user_id=6293890)...

Moonstruck
April 17th, 2009, 09:03 PM
I just placed an order with SCH for shampoo bars Rosemary Green Tea, Green Herbal, Rosemary & Honey, and a Chocolate Mint soap bar. I was talking with her for a bit, and mentioned that I have typical Asian hair - coarser strands and dark. She suggested the Rosemary for that reason to me. Because it's also getting into summer, I've been getting more active... which also leads to oilier hair, and she mentioned that she has a new one waiting to be tested, sitting on the racks! It's called Nettle Lime and I'm getting a sample, super excited! No castor or olive oil, so it'll be interesting to see, especially since I'm used to CV bars.

Just one question to you all. When you refer to "Oily" hair, what does that mean? Does that mean that the scalp produces oil faster? Does that mean that the hair appears oily after say, one day? (cause for instance, coarser hairs probably stand up to a heavier oiling more easily because it absorbs/hides more of it). Or can that also apply to when you've been outside running around all day and you naturally produced a lot of sweat, not oil? The Nettle Lime was produced specifically for oily heads in mind, and I was wondering what you guys thought.

Neoma
April 17th, 2009, 09:11 PM
I just placed an order with SCH for shampoo bars Rosemary Green Tea, Green Herbal, Rosemary & Honey, and a Chocolate Mint soap bar. I was talking with her for a bit, and mentioned that I have typical Asian hair - coarser strands and dark. She suggested the Rosemary for that reason to me. Because it's also getting into summer, I've been getting more active... which also leads to oilier hair, and she mentioned that she has a new one waiting to be tested, sitting on the racks! It's called Nettle Lime and I'm getting a sample, super excited! No castor or olive oil, so it'll be interesting to see, especially since I'm used to CV bars.

Just one question to you all. When you refer to "Oily" hair, what does that mean? Does that mean that the scalp produces oil faster? Does that mean that the hair appears oily after say, one day? (cause for instance, coarser hairs probably stand up to a heavier oiling more easily because it absorbs/hides more of it). Or can that also apply to when you've been outside running around all day and you naturally produced a lot of sweat, not oil? The Nettle Lime was produced specifically for oily heads in mind, and I was wondering what you guys thought.
Hi Moonstruck. :waving:

I'm sorry I can't answer your questions about oily hair. I'm sure that someone who can will come along. Your shampoo bar order sounds wonderful. You reminded me that I forgot to order the Rosemary Green Tea. That one and the Nettle Lime sound delightful. Please let us know what you think after you've given them a test drive. :flower:

Velouria
April 18th, 2009, 10:52 PM
I received my SCH sample order last week. I ordered the following: chamomile ylang, rosemary green tea, marshmallow honey almond, and green herbal.

I've tried the first 2 listed, and am very happy with them. MUCH better results than with any of the bars I've tried in the past, also better results than my shampoos (Mill Creek and Burt's Bees).

My hair gets cleaner with these than with other bars, but also seems much more moisturized (than other bars *or* shampoo). The CV bars I tried tended to make my hair simultaneously coated, waxy, oily, dull and frizzy. Soap Lady of Oregon bars dried the h*ll out of my hair, while leaving a waxy, dull coating.

I did use an ACV rinse and conditioner after these....with my hard water and frizz prone hair I don't dare to go without either.

I really hope these continue to work so well.

Neoma
April 19th, 2009, 01:33 PM
I received my SCH sample order last week. I ordered the following: chamomile ylang, rosemary green tea, marshmallow honey almond, and green herbal.

I've tried the first 2 listed, and am very happy with them. MUCH better results than with any of the bars I've tried in the past, also better results than my shampoos (Mill Creek and Burt's Bees).

My hair gets cleaner with these than with other bars, but also seems much more moisturized (than other bars *or* shampoo). The CV bars I tried tended to make my hair simultaneously coated, waxy, oily, dull and frizzy. Soap Lady of Oregon bars dried the h*ll out of my hair, while leaving a waxy, dull coating.

I did use an ACV rinse and conditioner after these....with my hard water and frizz prone hair I don't dare to go without either.

I really hope these continue to work so well.Velouria, it sounds like you got really good results with SCH. That's great news.

For the record, SLO bars also dried the h*ll out of my hair.

healingsolitude
April 19th, 2009, 06:45 PM
I'm glad to see both hennared and Velouria had good results with the SCH bars!

Thank you for the helpful information, as always, Neoma! :flower:


Does anyone else find that shampoo bars make their hair more curly? With the camomile and citrus, especially, I'm well into 3a territory, it's kind of fabulous. (another reason to love these bars aside from the smell and the lack of chemicals and the healthy, non-dry hair and the small business supporting and the...everything!)

Welcome to the board! :)
My hair is stick straight, so I'm afraid I can't recommend which bars from CV work better with curly hair. However, there has been much talk on this thread about it in the past. You could try searching through the thread to read through the various results. From what I remember, I don't think there was really one bar in particular that worked for those who did get more curls while using CV bars. In fact, some even said using any shampoo bar actually made their hair straighter. I think it just depends on many factors since the results vary greatly from person to person. Your best bet might be to just order a bunch of different samples to try in order to see what would work better with your hair type and water. I think the more moisturizing bars actually produced better curls than the clarifying bars. You might want to give those a try if the more clarifying C&C is working so well for you.


I just placed an order with SCH for shampoo bars Rosemary Green Tea, Green Herbal, Rosemary & Honey, and a Chocolate Mint soap bar. I was talking with her for a bit, and mentioned that I have typical Asian hair - coarser strands and dark. She suggested the Rosemary for that reason to me. Because it's also getting into summer, I've been getting more active... which also leads to oilier hair, and she mentioned that she has a new one waiting to be tested, sitting on the racks! It's called Nettle Lime and I'm getting a sample, super excited! No castor or olive oil, so it'll be interesting to see, especially since I'm used to CV bars.

Just one question to you all. When you refer to "Oily" hair, what does that mean? Does that mean that the scalp produces oil faster? Does that mean that the hair appears oily after say, one day? (cause for instance, coarser hairs probably stand up to a heavier oiling more easily because it absorbs/hides more of it). Or can that also apply to when you've been outside running around all day and you naturally produced a lot of sweat, not oil? The Nettle Lime was produced specifically for oily heads in mind, and I was wondering what you guys thought.

I also received the new Nettle Lime sample as my free sample from SCH. I'm hoping to try it next week when it is finished curing.

My scalp produces a lot of extra oil that can make my normal hair look very oily if it isn't controlled. Oily hair and scalp just needs extra care like dry hair and scalp. Some find that they can regulate the amount of oil their scalp produces by gradually decreasing the amount that they shampoo. I'm one of those that just didn't find that method worked at all for me. I can go up to three days without doing an all over shampoo as long as I do a "refresh" shampoo in the sink around only the very top of my head on the days when I don't do a full shampoo. My hair is on the fine side, so I really need to keep my scalp free from the extra oil it produces. Not doing the "refresh" shampoo every day will leave my hair looking very oily by the end of the day. Physical activity also produces even more oil on top of the extra oil someone with oily scalp or hair produces. I have to shampoo my hair with something gentle on the days I sweat a lot or my hair feels like a greasy mess. Using any kind of styling products in my hair is also a big no-no. This is just my own personal experience, though. My oily scalp probably wouldn't be as an extreme of an issue if it wasn't for my fine hair. I hope this helps to answer your question! :)

Neoma
April 20th, 2009, 06:44 PM
Thank you for the helpful information, as always, Neoma! :flower:You're very welcome, healingsolitude. :flowers:

swirlytresses
April 21st, 2009, 11:00 AM
I don't know if this has already been mentioned but I have found that shampoo/soap bars bring more of my natural curl out. They are also excellent for traveling. I find that I don't have to do a vinegar rinse very often.....only when I remember.

Suldrun
April 22nd, 2009, 07:19 AM
I notice that my hair is straighter with CV poo bars. They are the only bars I have ever tried so I can't speak about other brands. My hair is lightly wavy. I can braid it and get waves so it doesnt bother me too much.

I am not good at sticking to one bar for weeks on end so I could not tell you if one specifically helps. I tend to change the bars each time depending on the feel of my hair at wash time.

Chromis
April 22nd, 2009, 12:35 PM
Well, I got reminder of how magical my ACV/citric acid rinse was today! I forgot to do it after I washed my hair and man does my hair feel icky! It feels gummy and tacky and was sooo tangled! It was already almost completely dried when I realized and I didn't feel like having sopping wet hair twice in one day, so I'll have to wash it again tomorrow. Put it in a braid so I won't have to handle it until then, yuck!

I've been using shampoo bars for almost three years now thanks to LHC. My favourite are the CV bars, though I'm thinking I might give these new Etsy bars you guys are raving about a try pretty soon since I'm running low :D

ratgirldjh
April 27th, 2009, 04:58 PM
I notice that my hair is straighter with CV poo bars. They are the only bars I have ever tried so I can't speak about other brands. My hair is lightly wavy. I can braid it and get waves so it doesnt bother me too much.

I am not good at sticking to one bar for weeks on end so I could not tell you if one specifically helps. I tend to change the bars each time depending on the feel of my hair at wash time.

My hair was also straighter with the CV bar that I tried Summer Sunshine.
My normal poo bar J. R. Liggett's makes it wavier; so does Grandpa's Pine Tar Soap.

wild_horses
April 27th, 2009, 05:06 PM
I love shampoo bars. I found the Chagrin Valley site and ordered smaples and fell in love. My favrite is the Babassu & Marsh Mallow Shampoo Bar. My hair has transformed and is so soft and I have noticed that my scalp does not get very oily anymore.

ljkforu
April 28th, 2009, 12:38 AM
Wildhorses, I'm glad they are working for you.

Congratulations on your 25th post! :flower: :cake:

Merewen
April 28th, 2009, 10:11 AM
I just ordered the Mud and Clay and the Rosemary Mint sample bars from CV. I can't wait to try them!

Moonstruck
April 28th, 2009, 01:14 PM
Oooh, my hair perked right back up. I had hit a little 'poo bar slump - not getting shiny anymore, and was getting slightly tangly and just overall not pleasing. Nothing truly wrong, per se, but just not it's best.
Swapped to normal liquid detergent shampoo twice, started SCH bars, and it looks great again! I guess I'll find out in around another 3 months if this causes buildup too. Haha. I'm using the Rosemary Honey bar and it's really great - somewhere between the shine of Citrus Chamomile and Rosemary Lav Aloe from CV, but a little more body, more like Nettle. It's really sleek looking too! I haven't been able to leave the acid rinse behind though, unfortunately. Maybe someday.
I'll switch back to CV after my 2 week trial of this bar is up, and see how my hair reacts. Hehe.

On the topic of straight/curlyness with bars...It's sort of weird, I feel like my hair seems straighter, but with an overall body wave which gives it much more body. A more natural looking straightness. I'm not really sure. I wish we could figure out how they work, haha.

Velouria
April 29th, 2009, 04:45 PM
CV and Soap Lady of Oregon bars made my hair straighter. The Sweet Creek Herbs bars don't, but I don't think they add curl either. The washing method that brings out my curl best is any herb wash (I use a tea form, rather than a paste) containing Shikakai.

I've done 4 washes now with the SCH bars, and I'm still very happy with them.

I've tried 3 out of the 4 samples I have: Rosemary Green Tea, Green Herbal, and Chamomile Ylang. I haven't really noticed any differences in their results, which is fine as they all work wonderfully.

One lather is enough for me, no matter how oily and/or oiled my hair is. As I wrote before, they seem both more cleansing and more moisturizing than other bars I've tried. They're the only bars I've tried that don't dull what little shine I have, in fact I think they bring out my shine better than shampoo. I'm still using an acidic rinse, but I've discovered that I can skip a rinse-out conditioner with these, as long as I use Giovanni Direct Leave-in....which is pretty astounding for my hair type. I think my hair probably looks a little better when I use both rinse-out co, leave-in and oil though, lol, which has been my routine for years. It's still amazing that I can skip rinse-out co with these bars and still have decent hair.

They all have pleasant scents; though much milder than CV.

Did I mention they've made my hair thicker, without any apparent coating? I really can't recommend them highly enough. I'm still alternating with herb washes, but I'm not sure that I'll buy more herbs when I run out...though the herb washes have been the 2nd best wash method I've tried.

Neoma
April 29th, 2009, 06:25 PM
I've done 4 washes now with the SCH bars, and I'm still very happy with them.
**************
One lather is enough for me, no matter how oily and/or oiled my hair is. As I wrote before, they seem both more cleansing and more moisturizing than other bars I've tried. They're the only bars I've tried that don't dull what little shine I have, in fact I think they bring out my shine better than shampoo. I'm still using an acidic rinse, but I've discovered that I can skip a rinse-out conditioner with these, as long as I use Giovanni Direct Leave-in....which is pretty astounding for my hair type. I think my hair probably looks a little better when I use both rinse-out co, leave-in and oil though, lol, which has been my routine for years. It's still amazing that I can skip rinse-out co with these bars and still have decent hair.
*************
They all have pleasant scents; though much milder than CV.

Velouria, I am still having much the same experience with SCH as you. I would never have believed that I could get away with a single lather, but most days I can.

I haven't noticed any difference in the performance of the SCH "flavors," either. The three that I have tried so far work equally well for me. I am in love with the fragrance of the scented marshmallow bar, and will probably make that my staple shampoo bar in the future.

I have a variety of shampoo bar routines, but the ones that I've been using most are:

Shampoo bar only, lather once, no rinse
Shampoo bar followed by a bottled conditioner, no vinegar rinseOn occassion, I mix a shot of conditioner with a WV/EO rinse and apply that after shampooing once with a SCH bar. I really don't think that an acid rinse is necessary for me after these bars. But I actually like the fragrance of my vinegar rinse, which includes a lot of EO's, so I use it anyway.

inty
May 3rd, 2009, 06:07 AM
My first experiences with CV shampoo bars which I bought from a member here. First of all, I loved it :cheese:

I liked everything: smell, the texture of my hair, and the volume, in a nice 'big hair' way, hair was very soft and manageable and curly. And, last but not least, I stretched my wash one more day, most of the time, to once in 5 days now! Apparently shampoo bars make my scalp produce less oils.

I simply lather and rinse once, and used weak ACV rinse afterwards. However now I have noticed that every time ACV is not necessary. In fact without ACV my hair is curlier and ends are less dry and are softer. I'll probably alternate ACV/no ACV. All in all I am very pleased with the results and will keep using the shampoo bars and will try different ones.
Results so far:

Summer Sunshine - very nice and cleansing, maybe even a bit too cleansing. I'd use it in wet weather when there is enough moisture in the air to compensate.

Carrot Milk and Honey - cleansing and moisturizing, but not consistent, sometimes one more than the other. Liked it tho.

Nettle - this seems to be a favorite so far. Cleansing and moisturizing in a good balance.

Babassu and Marshmallow - used only once, can't make up my mind yet.

And I liked all the smells very-very much! :)

Neoma
May 3rd, 2009, 08:56 AM
inty, I'm glad to hear that you're having such great results with CV bars. And it's awesome that you're already able to determine the specifics -- which bars work for you better and why. :flower:

Rapunzal2Be
May 3rd, 2009, 12:35 PM
Ladies, this thread is a bit daunting. I'm trying to read through, but I hope you don't mind if I just ask the question I've got.

Do any of you successfully use shampoo bars alternating with regular shampoo, and do any of you successfully use shampoo bars followed by a 'coney conditioner?

My old standbys make my hair look sleek and shiny, but have SLS, parabens, 'cones, you name it. So I'd like to add shampoo bars into the mix to give my scalp a nice break, but I'm not sure I'm ready to go cold turkey. Can I mix and match? Or will that be a no-go?

Also, I've been trying to do ACV rinses just after my CO lately since everyone says it leaves you shiny. All it does for me is dry out my scalp and ends?? Go figure. So I'd rather stick with conditioner.

Neoma
May 3rd, 2009, 01:07 PM
Do any of you successfully use shampoo bars alternating with regular shampoo, and do any of you successfully use shampoo bars followed by a 'coney conditioner?

My old standbys make my hair look sleek and shiny, but have SLS, parabens, 'cones, you name it. So I'd like to add shampoo bars into the mix to give my scalp a nice break, but I'm not sure I'm ready to go cold turkey. Can I mix and match? Or will that be a no-go?

Also, I've been trying to do ACV rinses just after my CO lately since everyone says it leaves you shiny. All it does for me is dry out my scalp and ends?? Go figure. So I'd rather stick with conditioner.
Daunting? This little ol' thread? Ha! :D

Kidding, Rapunzal2Be.

I have alternated between shampoo bars and bottled shampoo in the past, and I think that some of our other members still do.

As to using cones with shampoo bars, conventional wisdom would have you believe that was a "no no." But I have done it from time to time without a problem.

I find that vinegar rinses by themselves don't work well for me anymore; I find them to be very drying and not very useful. What does work is a mild vinegar rinse mixed with a shot of cone-free conditioner. I dunk the length into the mixture after washing with a shampoo bar, and my hair is transformed into silk. Then I dump the mixture over my scalp and the length and finger comb it through. The end result is super shiny, tangle-free hair.

I hope this helps. :flower:

Rapunzal2Be
May 3rd, 2009, 01:23 PM
Daunting? This little ol' thread? Ha! :D

Kidding, Rapunzal2Be.

I have alternated between shampoo bars and bottled shampoo in the past, and I think that some of our other members still do.

As to using cones with shampoo bars, conventional wisdom would have you believe that was a "no no." But I have done it from time to time without a problem.

I find that vinegar rinses by themselves don't work well for me anymore; I find them to be very drying and not very useful. What does work is a mild vinegar rinse mixed with a shot of cone-free conditioner. I dunk the length into the mixture after washing with a shampoo bar, and my hair is transformed into silk. Then I dump the mixture over my scalp and the length and finger comb it through. The end result is super shiny, tangle-free hair.

I hope this helps. :flower:

Thank you, that was a big help!! :)

I'm sure I"ll be back a few more times for help once my order from CV arrives!!:cheese:

Neoma
May 3rd, 2009, 02:24 PM
Thank you, that was a big help!! :)

I'm sure I"ll be back a few more times for help once my order from CV arrives!!:cheese:You're welcome, Rapunzal2Be.

I look forward to hearing how CV bars work for you. Please keep us posted. :flower:

Moonstruck
May 3rd, 2009, 05:16 PM
Rapunzel2Be, I occasionally use normal shampoo after I get really really grimy, like when I fall off of a horse and get covered in sand/mud, haha. I get a little grossed out and want all the yuck OFF, and my hair doesn't mind getting a little bit stripped every so often. I do also use the bottled shampoo once every 2-3 weeks also just because I feel bad letting it go to waste, you know? Otherwise it's poo bars.

Ever since I've been using poo bars, my hair has gotten extremely crackly and funky when I used conditioner with cones. I'm not sure why this is, but it got dry and practically snapped off at the ends (and this is coarse Asian hairs that rarely ever do that), so I've stopped trying that. That was my personal experience, at least. I would say that the bars probably can't remove the cones too easily though, if I had to guess. Nothing in them would dissolve/solvate cones.

Rapunzal2Be
May 4th, 2009, 01:44 AM
Do any of you ladies have fine straight hair and experience shiny, sleek hair using poo bars?

I've heard a lot of words like 'body' and 'softness' which are great, but my hair just looks fluffy and blah if it isn't kind of 'coated' or weighed down.

I'm really excited to try poo bars, but I don't want to give up my sleek hair and smooth ends.

ljkforu
May 4th, 2009, 04:29 AM
Do any of you ladies have fine straight hair and experience shiny, sleek hair using poo bars?

I've heard a lot of words like 'body' and 'softness' which are great, but my hair just looks fluffy and blah if it isn't kind of 'coated' or weighed down.

I'm really excited to try poo bars, but I don't want to give up my sleek hair and smooth ends.
CV poo bars definately add weight and a leave in conditioner with cones finishes the job. I personally like a vitamin c rinse after I poo, condition, then rinse with vit c then rinse. Follow with a towel dry and a dab of leave in.

Chromis
May 4th, 2009, 05:16 AM
Do any of you ladies have fine straight hair and experience shiny, sleek hair using poo bars?

I've heard a lot of words like 'body' and 'softness' which are great, but my hair just looks fluffy and blah if it isn't kind of 'coated' or weighed down.

I'm really excited to try poo bars, but I don't want to give up my sleek hair and smooth ends.

Yup! Mine can't make up its mind on how straight it is, but I do indeed get very shiny results with certain bars including a couple of the CV bars containing rosemary.

Madame J
May 4th, 2009, 12:51 PM
I used a JR Liggett Tea Tree and Hemp Oil bar this morning (after not washing for a few days, and having total icky greaseball hair) with an ACV rinse (2Tbsp to a cup of water), and my hair feels so wonderful! I've been using clay mud shampoo for over a month now, and I hadn't realized just how much I missed that "clean with actual soap" feeling of dry, freshly-washed hair. And I can feel better about the 'poo bar than I did about even my Giovanni shampoo because it's so minimally processed.

Oh yeah, I did a light post-oiling with coconut oil while it was still damp. No crunchies or dri-ies, or greasies, or anything besides silky, clean hair from root to tip!

UncommonTart
May 4th, 2009, 07:53 PM
I've been using the Chagrin Valley Honey, Beer, and Egg bar for a few weeks, now and I must say I'm quite impressed. On the last wash day before starting the bar I clarified because I like to start with "a clean slate" when trying new products of techniques. It just seems to give me a better idea how well it's going to work with less wait time. So, during my first CV wash, I was pleasantly suprised right off with how nicely the bar lathered in my hair. Admittedly, it took more work than with a liquid, but it still soaped up and bubbled much more than bars I've tried in the past. I lathered twice and then did an ACV rinse. After the ACV rinse, my hair was much less difficult to comb than I'd expected, as well. I usually need a conditioner with a lot of "slip" just to get the comb through after a shampoo and I anticipated that it would be next to impossible without any conditioner. It did take a little more time than usual, but not so much as to turn me off of the bar on that account. I did run into some small bit of trouble post-shower. I alwasy do a light oiling of my ends after a wash, to help keep down the frizz and keep my ends in order. Apparently that was just too much and when it dried, I had oily ends. I've alwasy had somewhat dry hair, and since I've been growing out damage from years of chemical coloring and other abuses, it just drinks up moisture and can't ever seem to get too much. (Ask me about going from fire-engine red to golden blonde! In a week! With hair that also used to be black-cherry purple!) I can't recall ever having had oily ends before, unless I'd just done a heavy oiling on purpose. The second time I used the bar, I used a little bit of the honey butter soap on my ends during the wash instead and skipped the oil afterward. Nice ends! Soft, smooth, and not even a little bit crunchy! I've never, ever had non-crunchy ends on the day of a wash without oiling. I think I'm in love.

Neoma
May 4th, 2009, 08:00 PM
Wow, UncommonTart, that second shampoo bar experience sounds fabulous. I'm glad to hear that you're getting such good results. :flower:

Moonstruck
May 4th, 2009, 09:13 PM
Rapunzal2Be - my hair is super sleek and straight, almost overly so, when I use citrus chamomile. The first time I used it I was briefly terrified because my black hair was reflecting the light SO much that I thought I had a white ring on my head, essentially, but it moved when I leaned in to check it... and then I realized my hair was just really shiny.
That bar in particular gives me no body at all, just sleek and shine.

Uncommontart - that must be SO exciting! I remember how that feels, haha. I feel like I've really hit the jackpot, finding shampoo bars.

masterofmidgets
May 4th, 2009, 11:33 PM
Do any of you ladies have fine straight hair and experience shiny, sleek hair using poo bars?

I've heard a lot of words like 'body' and 'softness' which are great, but my hair just looks fluffy and blah if it isn't kind of 'coated' or weighed down.

I'm really excited to try poo bars, but I don't want to give up my sleek hair and smooth ends.

I don't have fine straight hair, but when I used the CV Carrot, Milk, and Honey bar my hair was ridiculously shiny. It looked like I polished it!

Velouria
May 5th, 2009, 12:36 AM
I posted previously that Soap Lady of Oregon's bars were drying for me, and so they were...the shampoo bars.

But at least one of the soap bars, the calendula lavender, is very conditioning. When I ordered shampoo bar samples from her, she very generously sent a bunch (like 4, I think) soap samples as well. All of them are, on skin, probably the most moisturizing soaps I've ever used.

I decided to try the calendula lavender on my hair; I did 2 lathers, scalp and roots only. I'd oiled moderately a few hrs. before, from the ears down, like I always do before a wash. I didn't use conditioner.

The results? My hair is a bit too oily, but without the dull waxy limpness that other bars that weren't cleansing enough gave me. It looks quite shiny and feels nice. Combing was very easy, and frizz is minimal (that's saying a lot, with my hair-type)

I'm thinking that it would make a great conditioner bar after a more cleansing bar, or a good light wash on un-oiled, un-greasy hair.

Next I'm going to try it for a 2nd lather after 1 lather with a SCH bar. I'll report back with the results.

I know some people do this with CV soap bars (I've tried this with a sample of the honey butter soap...it did nothing for frizz-reduction or combability, and left a waxy, dulling film), but haven't heard anything about the SLO soaps on hair.

zombi
May 5th, 2009, 01:20 AM
I just ordered samples from CV -- Nettle, Herb Garden, and the Honey Butter soap since the article I read says she uses the soap as condish. I'm excited! While I like the sulfate-free pureology I'm using, I've noticed it has other ingredients I DON'T like, and it's way too pricey to re-purchase, anyhow!

Fractalsofhair
May 5th, 2009, 06:00 PM
I'm interested in trying shampoo bars. When I was little, I often used just a bar of Doc Bronner's soap on my hair, but that seems to leave it with a weird feeling despite conditioner and apple cider vinegar rinses. My hair is wayyy more damaged now than it was when I was little. I'm thinking of trying Chagrin Valley to help my hair grow out, but I'm a little worried since I've emailed Ida a few times in the last few weeks and she hasn't responded to any of them. I'm not sure if she's not getting them or if she's not a legitimate business anymore. I emailed her at the info email. Any advice on shampoo bar types from her? I have very fine, shoulder length hair, light blonde that's been bleached from about 2 inches down, but is very light above it. It's all very damaged from heat and bleach, though I'm working on cutting back on the heat and I've quit the bleach. My hair has a ton of split ends, and breakage. It looks fine other than that though, very shiny, but just not what I want it to be healthwise. Liquid African black soap(alaffia brand with shea butter and honey.) works well, as does Burts Bees shiny formula, however, the BB is very drying and the Alaffia is a wee bit pricey, for what the shampoo does. I also have very hard water and don't mind it. All of those are natural soaps though.

healingsolitude
May 5th, 2009, 09:55 PM
Rapunzal2Be - Citrus & Chamomile, Nettle, and Cafe Moreno all gave me sleek and shiny results for my stick straight and fine hair. I can't say for sure whether or not it was due completely to the bars or due to my rinse. My hair seems to be shiny with most shampoo methods I use lately, which could be due to the cold rinse I always use as my final rinse. A cold rinse seals the hair cuticle and adds shine to the hair. As for sleekness, I think the shampoo bars are responsible for that. My hair is very sleek when I use natural shampoo bars. They tend to leave a coating on the hair. I'm sure your fine hair wouldn't get fluffy with a shampoo bar since it doesn't take much to wear down our fine hair.

Fractalsofhair - My hair has always been virgin hair while experimenting with shampoo bars, so I can't really give any advice based on my own personal experience. However, I do recall a discussion on this thread many months ago regarding how shampoo bars seemed to work best on virgin or hennaed hair. Posters had issues with their damaged or chemically dyed hair not responding well to the shampoo bars. I just can't remember if a solution was found or if they gave up on the bars. For that reason, I'm kind of hesitant to recommend you starting with a more cleansing bar like most are recommended to do. It is usually recommended that you start with a cleansing bar and work your way up to the more moisturizing ones, but your hair sounds like it might need the extra moisture. Maybe start with the Herb Garden one as a slightly cleansing one? Chamomile & Citrus and Summer Sunshine seem like they would be far too cleansing for your hair. Herb Garden seems to have a nice balance. Cafe Moreno also has a nice balance but you probably don't want to try that one since your hair is light. I found Lavender & Spice to be more on the moisturizing side. It is very heavy on the spice scent, though. Mud & Clay sounds like another that would be too clarifying for your hair. The Neem bar might work, though it has a very strong scent that you might find unpleasant. It reminded both my mother and myself of Bengay. Even though I absolutely loved Nettle, I'm hesitant to recommend that for you since it was rather cleansing on my oily scalp, although some have found it to be a good balance. Rosemary Lavender Aloe sounds like a bar with a good balance for you to start off with. Extra Honey Beer & Egg seems to be the more moisturing of the beer bars, though the results vary with that one. It may or may not be a good option as a balanced bar for your hair. Olive Babassu, Coconut Milk, Babassu & Marsh Mallow, and Carrot Milk & Honey (unfortunately out of stock) could all be good moisturizing options for you to lead up to. That list is in the order of OB being the most moisturizing to CM&H being the least moisturizing of the moisturizing bars from what I've read on here. I guess my advice would be to focus more on the moisturizing bars and get two or more of the balanced bars to start off with. Maybe Herb Garden, Lavender & Spice, Rosemary Lavender Aloe, or Extra Honey Beer & Egg. I'd definitely recommend getting the most moisturizing shampoo bar for your hair type (Olive Babassu). Maybe even a few soap samples in case you want to test those on your hair. Just stick with the sample sized versions so that you can get a good variety to test out on your hair. You should be able to get 6+ shampoos out of just one sample. Plenty enough for your hair to decide whether or not it likes that particular bar. Other then that, I guess I'd recommend you not to get too many similar bars. My hair reacted badly to every one of the coconut milk bars. I think that ingredient is too heavy on my fine and thin hair. You might have better luck since your hair sounds a bit thicker.

Soap bars that I've read as being good on the hair that are in stock now or in a few days: Carrot & Honey Complexion (big raves and your hair loves honey), Chamomile & Calendula (also has honey), Citrus Woods Green Tea (has shea butter and aloe), Cucumber Lime Yogurt (it might sound interesting to you), Honey Beer (another honey soap), Honey Butter (honey soap that some rave about using as a conditioner), Shea Rose Clay (shea soap). Some of the others also have shea butter and honey, but I didn't list those since I can't recall hearing about those being used on the hair. Check out this page for some more tips: link (http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandcraft.com/enjoyshamp.htm)

I'm not sure why Ida hasn't responded to your emails. She always responded to mine within a few days of sending them. I also just checked to make sure she isn't on vacation right now. Her store is listed as being closed on May 15 thru May 25. I guess anyone thinking about making an order should make one quickly before that date since no one will be running the store during that time.

Also, I noticed you mentioned about the Dr. Bronner's soaps not reacting well to your damaged hair before. I don't know if that is completely due to the bar reacting badly to your damaged hair or to the bar reacting badly to your water. I don't think anyone here with hard water has responded well to the Dr. Bronner's soap bars that I have read. The one that I do recall that had good results had soft water. It doesn't sound like those bars react well to hard water, even when you use an acidic rinse.

~~~~

Enabling Alert! I just saw a brand new soap bar from Ida that is due to be released on June 13th. It is called Aloe, Aloe, Aloe! for all of the aloe lovers out there. It looks like another good candidate for use as a shampoo bar, too. I can't wait for this one to be released! :D

plainjanegirl
May 6th, 2009, 07:45 AM
Since I was told that some people's hair feels thicker from using shampoo bars I am debating trying one ( I have never ever used a shampoo or soap bar ). But I am worried cause according to the map my water is probably quite hard water and I am not crazy about doing a vinegar rinse. I tried a vinegar rinse before for shine and I didn't notice a difference with it and the smell lingered in my hair. So are there any alternatives to a vinegar rinse?

swirlytresses
May 6th, 2009, 08:20 AM
Since I was told that some people's hair feels thicker from using shampoo bars I am debating trying one ( I have never ever used a shampoo or soap bar ). But I am worried cause according to the map my water is probably quite hard water and I am not crazy about doing a vinegar rinse. I tried a vinegar rinse before for shine and I didn't notice a difference with it and the smell lingered in my hair. So are there any alternatives to a vinegar rinse?

You could do a rinse with citric acid. Also Dr. Bronners has a rinse that you can use... http://www.vitacost.com/Dr-Bronners-Magic-Organic-Shikakai-Conditioning-Hair-Rinse-Citrus .

If you are interested, I have some soap bars. I can send you a couple of samples.....Pm me if you are interested.

Aries_jb
May 6th, 2009, 10:03 AM
Enabling Alert! I just saw a brand new soap bar from Ida that is due to be released on June 13th. It is called Aloe, Aloe, Aloe! for all of the aloe lovers out there. It looks like another good candidate for use as a shampoo bar, too. I can't wait for this one to be released! :D

I know! I already ordered two bars about a week ago. Ida says I have to patient and wait three weeks untils the bars are hard enough to ship. I really want to try it as a shampoo bar but if it doesn't work I know my skin will love it!

Fractalsofhair
May 6th, 2009, 03:47 PM
Thanks Lesile! Doc Bronners worked very well when I lived in the next town over and had virgin hair(Same water source), and I do have hard water, so I'm not sure why that's the case, since I didn't even use an ACV rinse when I was little. The biggest issue I currently have with Doc Bronners is that they dry out my bleached/heat damaged part of my hair and make the virgin growth really fluffy/a little frizzy, which looks weird with a clear line of fried hair to normal hair! It also isn't too kind to my very very very dry scalp(All of my skin is dry, which is how I actually found out about CV, moisturizing soaps for my body!). I don't think it would be ideal for my hair now that I'm older, and that was children's growth, which was finer than my current hair, and I didn't care about shine or anything, so I'm looking for other companies! I still love Doc Bronners for nearly everything else though. I'll try resending it to her, hopefully it will get thru! I am working on getting rid of the damage over time through trims, but until then I do need heavy moisture, and I might then too. My current shampoo is just liquid African Black soap, from Alaffia(Shea and honey for damaged/dry hair), but the shampoo is a little pricey, though I do love the conditioner! The shampoo helps to hid the damage, and leaves my hair feeling silky, although I still notice the damage, but at $10 for a smallish bottle, I'm interested in trying shampoo bars. Has anyone used this shampoo and switched to shampoo bars? Scents, providing they are just essential oils and other natural scents, usually don't bother me, if it gets to me, I can just rinse more and use a little bit more of an essential oil in my coating of oil for it. If it helps reduce the damage(aka less new damage), I don't really care how it smells. Artificial scents really bother me a lot though, as do many chemicals. I'll try samples definitely, thanks for the advice! There are so many options it's hard to pick one! If she's out of stock, will she generally accept a payment in advance? (Like if I had an order for 5 or so bars and two were out of stock, if I payed separate shipping, would she ship it later, or should I ask her?)

Moonstruck
May 6th, 2009, 08:28 PM
Fractals - because she'd have to ship them separately, I'd imagine that you'd have to pay shipping twice, not so fun. The bars also won't even let you put them in the cart if it says out of stock, haha. I think you can talk to her about it if you really want. However, I feel like she has SO many bars that I'm never lacking in at least choosing 5 different things, and well, that'll take a while to get through anyhow.
For me, split ends and breakage got worse when I switched to 'poo bars, but that was probably because I used cones and such all before that, and it was hiding the damage. It's gotten a lot better though. What I learned to do during that transitioning period was simply use lots of conditioners on the length/ends, haha. I'd also suggest that the soap bars might be totally fine for your hair, especially if it tends to be a little dry - I used honey beer on mine with no ill effects. Seems to strike a nice balance between cleansing and moisturizing, as well as body and shine for me. YMMV.

Fractalsofhair
May 6th, 2009, 09:08 PM
I definitely noticed a shift in my hair when I started using all natural soaps as opposed to cone products. The root line is very healthy right now, but the area I dyed and that has a lot of heat damage, that's very damaged with stuff the cones were hiding(The cones dried out my hair and made it feel funny). My hair feels a lot nicer since switching to all natural products though, detergent free in particular, really silky and shiny as opposed to damaged looking, I just see a lot more split ends and have a lot more breakage(which the cones were hiding)! Paying shipping twice isn't fun, but it would still be cheaper than my current shampoo in the long run if I found a few I liked. Samples are cheap, and if I really hate one on my hair, I'll eventually use it on my body or for handwashing clothes. I hope I won't have a transition, but if I do, I'll remember that bit about the conditioner. Can her lotion bars be used as conditioner? How long was the transition period for you? I'm able to use castile soap sorta on my hair, none of the icky goopy feeling, just very dry and brittle right now and weird effects on the virgin/deflowered hair line! Yeah, she does have a wide selection, but I know I'll be trying a lot of samples. I did the same thing to find the right mineral makeup for me, and that really gave good results. I'll try the extra honey and beer one. How would you describe your hair? Fine, thick, what? Are any of the soap bars really heavy and leave a lot of oil(Great for my skin, but I might not want to try it on my hair), and are any of them really drying?

healingsolitude
May 6th, 2009, 10:43 PM
Aries_jb - I know seeing that bar made me think that I might have to make another order now. It is probably way too moisturizing for my oily scalp to handle, but I still love the idea of an aloe soap bar for the skin. I'm thinking it would be a nice facial bar to use in combination with something more cleansing. It would still be nice to try on my hair just for the fun of experimenting. :D

I'm also curious to try the Hemp Mango Mint lotion bar as a natural deodorant alternative. It has some of the same ingredients as the natural deodorant bars I've found on Etsy. I think I also read where someone did use that as a deodorant bar somewhere online. So far I love it as a lotion bar for my hands and as a lip balm with excellent results. Yet another multi-use product from Ida. I'll have to include an extra of that in my next order to test it out for myself. Or cut off a piece from my current bar and test it out before I order. I like to experiment. lol.

Fractalsofhair - You're welcome! I wonder why the bar worked somewhat for your hair before and not now. There seems to be an exact science behind every result. It could have something to do with your hair having been virgin hair then, it could be because you have a different hair type or texture now, it could be that the town is adding something extra into the water source that it didn't before, or it could be any number of other things. At any rate, your current results with that bar sound similar to what others with hard water report while using that bar. That particular bar seems to most often dry out the hair of those using it in hard water for whatever reason. It doesn't sound like your hair needs to be dried out, so I'd definitely look into something more moisturizing. The Honey Butter from CV is also supposed to be fabulous for dry skin. The Castile & Calendula and Chamomile & Calendula are also said to be very moisturizing. Hmm. What else? You might want to look into Chocolate Almond, Chocolate Orange Twist, Cucumber Lime Yogurt, Olive & Shea, Peppermint Twist (I just noticed it has shea butter, cocoa butter and aloe), Shea Rose Clay, and Sunshine Citrus Garden. Those look like the most moisturizing for the skin alongside the Honey Butter and Calendula bars.

I haven't used the Alaffia shampoo. I am familiar with black soap and how moisturizing it can be, though. Using that with the shea and honey on your hair definitely makes it sound like you need to avoid the more cleansing shampoo bars. I tried all three of the cleansing shampoo bars from CV. The Citrus and Chamomile was the most cleansing for me. It didn't dry out my normal hair but I don't think it would work for your hair type. The Nettle one can either be cleansing or balancing. It still might be too cleansing for your hair, though. I didn't get the chance to test out the Summer Sunshine much since my hair didn't react well to the coconut milk. It seems like the most cleansing is Citrus & Chamomile, followed by Summer Sunshine, then followed by Nettle. I remember reading the most posts about dry issues with the first two, so those are probably best avoided for your hair type. The ones most often said to have a good balance of moisture and cleansing properties are Cafe Moreno, Lavender Spice, Rosemary Lavender Aloe, and Rosemary Mint. The wild cards in the group would be Nettle, Mud & Clay, and both of the Honey bars. The first two are sometimes said to be too cleansing and then sometimes said to be a good balance. The Honey bars vary the most from person to person and is split about 50/50. It seems like half the people who try those say the bars left their hair a dry and stringy mess, while others say those bars are either balancing or moisturizing. I think Herb Garden and Neem have mostly good reviews. Neither too drying or too moisturizing. I can't remember reading about anyone saying the Herb Garden dried out their hair.

I still think your best bet would be to get maybe two of the balancing sample bars to start off with, along with a few of the moisturizing sample bars. Olive Babussu sounds perfect for you if you work up to it. It doesn't seem to be a bar most can use as a first bar with good results. Some found that to be their favorite bar after re-trying it again a few months after making the switch to shampoo bars. It is the most moisturizing of the shampoo bars. Babassu and Marshmallow is another popular moisturing bar. I haven't heard too much about the Coconut Milk shampoo bar so far, but that one and the Carrot one are supposed to be moisturizing on dry hair. You might also be one of the ones who can use the regular soap bars on your hair with good results. And you are right about it being hard to choose between them all. She has a large selection to choose from when you look at both the soaps and shampoos. Then she has all of those other goodies on her site with new stuff being added each year. It can be a dangerous place to explore for our wallets. ;)

You know, I don't think you'd have to pay extra shipping for two separate orders if one is out of stock. It depends on when that product is listed as returning. If there is no return date then you can't order it because she doesn't even have a batch of it curing yet. Some will list when they will be ready to be used and when they will be available to order in the regular cart. Those are the batches she currently has already made and hardening on the shelf. However, I've heard some on here have ordered them and recieved them before they were available to order on the site. The bar just has to be hard enough that it won't be damaged in the mail and you have to promise that you won't use it until the date she writes on it. You also have to make your order in an email for those unless that has changed since I last heard about it. I think you need to use PayPal or a money order during the email orders. Or you could give her a call and make the order over the phone. Some prefer to make orders that way since you'll sometimes find that a bar you want will go out of stock while you are waiting for one to come into stock to make your order.

The lotion bars can be used on your hair as a conditioner. I've read where a few on here or another board used the Three Butter lotion bar as conditioner on their ends. Using that on the ends or the Honey Butter soap seem to be the two popular conditioner alternatives. As for a transitional period, I really don't think you would have one since your hair is familiar with soap products and natural shampoo. That transitional period usually happens for those who go directly from regular detergent shampoo to the shampoo bars without any clarifying treatment done first. It can also happen when you use conditioner with cones in it, which you also no longer use. I'd say your odds of having a smooth transition are rather high.

There is a member on here (ljkforu) who tried some of the soap bars on her hair. She recommends the Carrot Honey Complexion and the Grapeseed Shea Complexion soaps for the hair. I also did a quick search and saw where another user (avraea) also loved the Carrot Honey Complexion soap as a shampoo for her hair. Neither one said it was heavy on their hair. You might be interested in that one since the moisturizing carrot shampoo bar isn't going to be in stock for awhile. I found the Juniper Comfrey Mint and the Rhassoul Yogurt soap bars to be drying with continued use.

Hope this information helps and doesn't make the decision even harder!

Fractalsofhair
May 7th, 2009, 03:23 PM
I finally got an email from CV! I called Sam on his home cell phone, which was on the verge of dying, but he gave me a few suggestions and told me to email him with other questions(Which I have.). He had emailed me this morning letting me know that my emails have been caught in a spam filter. I'm not sure if hotmail is one of the worst ones for that to happen with, but it's happened with me before. My email is fairly normal too, not one with random letters and numbers, so I'm not sure why that happened. Oh well.

Thanks again Lesile! Does hair change a lot from childhood(age 10ish) to mid teens(16 in a few weeks.)? I think that could be a good part of it, along with the virgin/non virgin hair bit. The fluffiness on the top reminds me of the way it used to feel, just a bit more frizzy and fluffy,non shiny hair that just feels soft and is combable is not what I'm going for at this point.

I generally do very well with natural products, and if a product lathers a lot, I don't really care.(In fact, excess lather can get annoying! Gets in my eyes and such.) I care if it works. I think that can be the hard water issue for many people.

I think a cleansing bar might be in order upon occasion, but I doubt I'll need more than a sample. Sometimes my hair in the summer, feels a little greasy and I do need to cut down on conditioner and oils in it. Last summer I didn't even use conditioner for a day or so in the most humid weather. I do think I'll get a bunch of samples, and thanks for the recommendations! It does seem to be dangerous for my wallet, but hey, I'd rather spend the money on all natural products than a fancy spa brand with "herbal extracts" that doesn't help my hair at all. XD

How accurate is Sam's advice usually? He recommended I try Honey Beer & Egg (regular
version), Coconut Milk shampoo and Olive & Babassu shampoo(Which you also recommended).

Good to know it's unlikely I have an extreme transition. How long does it take to tell if one bar is working? Like a week or so? I usually wash my hair daily.

Any bars work well for clogged pores and ingrown hairs? I seem to get those occasionally all over my body, even in places where I exfoliate and I don't remove body hair, so I don't have that as a cause? It reduces when I exfoliate though, just drying to do so.

Also, are any good for sunburns? I get quite a few in the summer.(And yes, I do use sunscreen and reapply. I just burn through it if I'm out in the day!)

Stelmaria
May 7th, 2009, 08:57 PM
Can any of you tell me what the difference is between CV soap and CV shampoo bars? They seem to have the same ingredients, but I am reading that some people prefer to use the soap on their hair. Are they processed differently? What does the soap have more of/less of than the shampoo bars?

swirlytresses
May 7th, 2009, 09:54 PM
Here is the CV site and it explains the difference between the soap and shampoo bars. Hope it answers your question. :)
http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandcraft.com/soapvsshamp.htm

Stelmaria
May 7th, 2009, 10:41 PM
Here is the CV site and it explains the difference between the soap and shampoo bars. Hope it answers your question. :)
http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandcraft.com/soapvsshamp.htm

Thanks so much for answering my question! I feel so silly. I guess I didn't look in the right place. I thought if it wasn't in the FAQ it hadn't been asked. But it does seem counterintuitive, that soap could be more moisturizing because it has less castor oil. I have always thought of added oils as being more moisturizing. I have dry hair so now I'm tempted the try the Honey Butter soap.

zombi
May 7th, 2009, 10:54 PM
Wow, Healingsolitude, I really wish these boards had a "thanks!" button like they do on LHCF! These were really thought-out and informative posts on the different CV bars, and I'm so glad you wrote it all out. :cheer:

healingsolitude
May 8th, 2009, 12:02 AM
Fractalsofhair - You're welcome! I'm glad you were able to get in touch with Sam! I've never actually been given advice by him, but I would think you could trust his advice. He seems to contribute quite a bit to Ida's business. I'm sure he now knows plenty about all of this due to his experience at the store and talking to customers online and on the phone. I think some of the posters here also send him and Ida their feedback on what works and what doesn't.

My hair has changed quite a bit over the years. I could use anything on it when I was very young without a problem. The harshest shampoos and the most moisturizing conditioners all worked for me. My teen years brought forth a big change, though. My scalp and hair both became very oily and flaky. Conditioner on my scalp would result in an oily mess and my hair length didn't even like conditioner anymore. I basically stuck with just a few shampoos that reacted ok with my hair. My 20's gave my hair a more normal balance again. I think my scalp might also not be quite as oily. I'm finding that I can use some conditioners once again. I can even do a Conditioner Only wash with my clarifying conditioner without any issues from my hair or scalp. I'm not sure how normal that is for everyone else, but it is normal in my family for our skin and hair/scalp to change with every new decade. Just one more excuse to constantly be experimenting. ;)

I think your hard water will be the problem instead of your hair. Your hair is already used to natural products and shouldn't have anything left in it from the unnatural products that would cause a bad reaction. Hard water is another story. You'll definitely want to start off with some sort of acidic rinse. ACV, white vineger, citric acid, lemon juice, lime juice are all good options. You can add things to those rinses to help combat the vinegar smell or just to add something that your hair would like. Adding a shot of conditioner or some honey would probably work for you since you need the extra moisture. Most on here recommend that you give the bar a full week of trying it before you decide whether or not you like it. Others say it is better to rotate the bars in order to get the best results. However, that can be confusing when you are first trying a bar. It would be hard to know exactly which bar was giving you the best results if you rotated them from the beginning. I'd suggest just trying to use each one for a full week. You can always rotate them later once you have found which ones work the best for you.

I'm not sure which bars would help with ingrown hairs, though I think you might try the exfoliating bars Ida offers. I found the Cornmeal & Honey bar to be high on the exfoliation side. The honey in the bar could help to keep the process from drying out your skin. Maybe just avoid the Dead Sea bars since the salt in those might sting your skin. It looks like most of the exfolitation bars are sold out for now. I think the only current options are the Cornmeal & Honey, Java Spice, and Lavender Oatmeal Spice. Your skin might also benefit from the Neem & Tea Tree bar, Cucumber Lime Yogurt, Citrus Woods Green Tea (gentle exfoliation and has aloe), and Chamomile Calendula. Putting regular honey on the ingrown hairs is another solution. Or you could get the clear Fruit of the Earth aloe gel and put that on the areas. A recipe I found also suggests adding 4 drops of Tea Tree oil to 50ml of aloe gel. Here is another recipe:

You can also mix four to five table spoons of sugar with some drops of lemon juice, one teaspoon of apple cider vinegar, half a teaspoon of cornstarch, two teaspoons of honey and heat the entire thing till it forms a sticky mass. Dust the painful area with cornstarch. Then spread the cooled mixture on the area and lave on for twenty minutes. When you wash this off with warm water you will notice that the red mumps have gone down. Your skin will also feel very soft.

The exfoliation bars would also work on your clogged pores. Same with the honey bars and the Cucumber Lime Yogurt bar, which would also help when you have a sunburn. Anything with clay would also be a good option for clogged pores. I prefered the Juniper Comfrey Mint bar as a facial bar for clogged pores. That one just needs to be rotated since it is drying if you use it every time. I also prefer to make honey masks for my clogged pores. You can steam your face over some water that has been boiled or hold a hot and wet wash cloth over your face for a few minutes to open your pores. I use three masks to help with my pores following that step. The simple one is to just take a little bit of baking soda that I turn into a paste with a few drops of water, then I spread that onto my face for five minutes. I follow with a slightly moisturizing soap to make sure I rinsed off all the baking soda. My other mask is one tablespoon of honey mixed with some cinnamon powder. I'll leave that on for at least half an hour before rinsing. Other times I'll replace the cinnamon powder with around 5 crushed up dollar store aspirin and leave the honey/aspirin mixture on for half an hour. The only thing I use for my own sunburns is the clear Fruit of the Earth 100% Aloe Vera Gel.

Good luck with however many samples you choose to buy! If you would like a more cleansing bar to use in the Summer, then I'd suggest the Nettle bar if you don't mind strong fragrances. I personally loved the fragrance and thought it reminded me of black jelly beans or licorice. It wasn't overly stripping while it cleaned well and gave some added volume. I can't really say much about the Summer Sunshine since it didn't react well with my hair, but the Citrus & Chamomile is definitely the most cleansing of all the bars.

Stelmaria - I can't remember the exact science behind it, but I do know that some of the posters choose soap bars over the shampoo bars due to the soap bars being more moisturizing, especially for dry and/or curly hair. I believe it has something to do with the soap bars being superfatted. Other posters use the soap bars because a few of the soap bars contain lower amounts of castor oil when compared to the shampoo bars. Some posters have had issues with too much coating on their hair while using the shampoo bars. It was believed that those posters had issues with the amount of castor oil in the shampoo bars. Ljkforu listed the soap bars Ida told her had the lowest amount of castor oil in them. Some have been experimenting around with them to see if those would work if the shampoo bars don't. Hopefully this helps to answer your question!

zombi - Aww, thanks! :o And you are most welcome! :flower:

swirlytresses
May 8th, 2009, 09:28 AM
Thanks so much for answering my question! I feel so silly. I guess I didn't look in the right place. I thought if it wasn't in the FAQ it hadn't been asked. But it does seem counterintuitive, that soap could be more moisturizing because it has less castor oil. I have always thought of added oils as being more moisturizing. I have dry hair so now I'm tempted the try the Honey Butter soap.

Not a problem. As for the honey butter soap, that is my favorite! My hair Loves honey!! I have hard water and hardly ever use a vinegar rinse and have no problems with the shampoo or soap bars. Everyone is different though.

Moonstruck
May 8th, 2009, 11:33 AM
As for superfatting, I believe most body bars are superfatted at around 5%, and 'poo bars at around 3%. Different oils obviously can be more or less moisturizing. And Just cause there's lots of oils listed in a bar doesn't mean that it's more superfatted...just means that they're all in a smaller amount. Superfatting normally doesn't go above 5-6% because then the bar starts to become lousy at cleaning =P

Fractals - you commented on a thread I think with my pic on it - I have coarse East Asian hair, with a slightly oily scalp, so I don't think we'll be using the same bars, haha. My fave of hers so far is the citrus chamomile. =) However, I would be a little careful in getting a very moisturizing 'poo bar right off the bat - I'd start with one of the less moisturizing bars at first and work my way up. A lot of people seem to comment that their hair HATES them and gets super waxy, build-upy, and tangly in the beginning if they are transitioning straight to the more moisturizing bars. Your hair might be more used to it, but just a thought.
Also, I used her lotion bar as conditioning briefly, but for the same reasons why I hate oiling my hair, I disliked the bar usage. I could see that it would work well for others though.

swirlytresses
May 8th, 2009, 05:39 PM
You could always buy samples from CV or see if someone on the swap board has any they are willing to part with, that way you are not out a lot of money. I usually cut my bars into 3rds in case I don't like the particular bar and I can try different ones without having to use the same one for a long time.

healingsolitude
May 8th, 2009, 06:15 PM
You could always buy samples from CV or see if someone on the swap board has any they are willing to part with, that way you are not out a lot of money. I usually cut my bars into 3rds in case I don't like the particular bar and I can try different ones without having to use the same one for a long time.

I forgot to mention about that. I cut my full-size bars into thirds, as well. It helps to make them last longer since only a little bit at a time is getting wet. Then I also cut my shampoo samples in half. That seems to help them last longer, too. It also means I can share the other half with someone else if that particular sample doesn't work for my hair. I gave the unused halves of shampoo samples that didn't work for me as stocking stuffers this Christmas for family and friends.

ljkforu
May 8th, 2009, 10:55 PM
Interesting experiment: I accidentally ended up with Natures Gate Shampoo instead of conditioner from a discount store. I doesn't have sulfates, however it made my scalp feel kind of greasy and waxy compared to the bars.

Not to say that I won't use it again because it smells so awesome. I thought I'd share what happens when a bar user uses a liquid after 10 months of not using one.

Fractalsofhair
May 9th, 2009, 04:28 PM
Thanks again Lesile! I currently use an ACV rinse with liquid soap in effect. Should I increase the strength of it? I'll try a bunch of samples, and yeah, a week sounds like a good amount of time. I doubt the issue will be with the soap bars themselves, but just which particular ones work well for me.

Thanks again moonstruck! I'll try the less moisturizing ones at first, but work up to the more moisturizing ones I think.

Thanks for the idea about cutting the bars in half, I'll have to try that when I spring for a few full size soap bars along with my samples! (I can always put more lotion on if the soap is drying, and if it's not... Then happy fun time for me!)

UncommonTart
May 9th, 2009, 05:39 PM
Fractalsofhair, I doubt you'll find the soaps drying. I've dry sensitive skin, and I had my doubts about soap, but I ordered a few soap samples along with my first round of shampoo bar samples just to see how they'd work out for me. After trying them out, I ordered three full sized bars of soap with my second round of 'poo bar samples. (I know after a day or two whether I like the soap, but it takes me about a week with the shampoo bars.) I had to get more. It's the first soap I've ever used that didn't leave my skin itchy and tight. After the honey butter soap, I didn't even feel like I needed body lotion. She's not kidding when she says that they're moisturising enough to use as conditioner, either.

Sorry about the soap-slanted hijak, but I felt that it had to be said.

healingsolitude
May 9th, 2009, 10:35 PM
ljkforu - Thanks for the update! I've been looking for Nature's Gate products locally around here without any luck. I'd love to try the Rainwater shampoo they have.

Fractalsofhair - You're welcome! I don't think you should have to increase the current amount of ACV you use right now. It will probably be something you'll have to judge after you get your samples. Try the current amount you use now and see how that turns out. If it doesn't work, then just increase or decrease the amount until it does work. Maybe 1 teaspoon of ACV in 8 oz of water? It really depends on how much your hair loves ACV. Most on here have to experiment a bit with the rinses. How much ACV do you normally use?

It definitely often does seem to be an issue with how one persons hair will react to each bar and nothing to do with the soap bar itself. You'll notice that the reactions to each bar can vary a great deal among the posters on this thread. Sometimes it helps to find someone with similar hair and hear their results. The ones with drier hair often report loving the Olive Babassu shampoo bar or the soap bars as shampoo. Good luck with the samples that you choose! I hope to hear your results. :)

Fractalsofhair
May 10th, 2009, 11:13 AM
Thanks Uncommon Tart! I don't think it's thread hijacking, I mean humans are covered with hair, and very few if any people remove hair on their entire body(Back, face, eyelashes, neck, chest on females, along with the normal places for women) except for the head, so I guess any soap is a shampoo in the sense it cleans hair XD. Cool about that, I love moisturizing soaps.

Lesile, I use about a 1/4 ACV rinse. Pretty strong, but it makes my hair extremely shiny. I run into issues if my rinse is mostly ACV. I'll be ordering the bars next week!

Thanks everyone for answering my questions!

plainjanegirl
May 10th, 2009, 12:18 PM
Is it common for shampoo bars to be hard to lather in your hair?

Fractalsofhair
May 10th, 2009, 02:50 PM
I think it's normal for any natural soap to not lather as well as a detergent if you have hard water. Maybe try wetting your hair with an ACV rinse and lathering it in that, then rinsing and using an ACV rinse during the rinsing? That's if it doesn't lather at all.

Moonstruck
May 10th, 2009, 04:58 PM
A lot of people also need more than one lather. Normally, the way I know if my hair is "clean/lathered enough" is when it lathers like a shampoo containing sulfates would normally do in my hair. This doesn't really happen for me on the first lather, with CV soaps it normally took 2, and for some members, even 3. Different bars vary though - I'm finding that my SCH soaps do fine with just one, though sometimes I get a little nervous and do 1.5-ish, haha.
Since soap doesn't strip like a detergent would, each lather takes off progressively more oils/grease and metals (what would make your water hard). So my first lather might be making my hair/water a little softer and removing some excess oils, and my second removing even more oils and replacing some if it takes away too many (2nd part a detergent wouldn't do, since it has no fats/oils at all). What Fractals suggests will essentially eliminate what I described the 1st lather to do, so that works too.

Fractals - I know Manderly had an interesting transition. Her hair hated the Olive Babassu at first, but after she used 'poo bars for a while, her hair LOVED it and that's what she normally uses nowadays, I believe. So don't forget to put the bars away for a while and then come back, too. =)

Wildcherry
May 10th, 2009, 06:44 PM
I tried a couple different CV bars but they sadly didn't work on me. Both times even after using the vinegar rinse I ended up with lank greasy looking hair and I never bothered to stick to it to see if my hair would adjust.
However my hair LOVED Lush Godiva shampoo bar even on the first try. ^^ I know that Lush uses SLS which is probably why I didn't get greasy though.. sigh

plainjanegirl
May 13th, 2009, 11:14 AM
I haven't read all of this thread, but I am having issues.
Thanks to a nice LHC friend I was blessed with some samples to try. Have now washed with the shampoo bars twice this week.
But is dry , rough, tangly hair a common thing from using the bars? I blogged about this and really really like how thick my hair feels but I miss the soft smooth feel that my hair had when using s and c(but then it felt thinner).
Not sure how long i can stick with these.

Dolly
May 13th, 2009, 11:41 AM
I haven't read all of this thread, but I am having issues.
Thanks to a nice LHC friend I was blessed with some samples to try. Have now washed with the shampoo bars twice this week.
But is dry , rough, tangly hair a common thing from using the bars? I blogged about this and really really like how thick my hair feels but I miss the soft smooth feel that my hair had when using s and c(but then it felt thinner).
Not sure how long i can stick with these.

Have you tried a vinegar rinse? I CANNOT use the shampoo bars without one. I even put a little squirt of conditioner in it....makes all the difference. And, then I condition afterwards with a nice coney conditioner....try that with your next wash....

Fractalsofhair
May 13th, 2009, 01:15 PM
Plain Jane, do try the Vinegar rinse. Also try rinsing your hair for the final time in cold water.

Moonstruck
May 13th, 2009, 03:14 PM
May I ask as to what your previous hair care? You might want to try clarifying with BS or something like that if the acid rinses don't help. You'll KNOW if it the rinses work, btw... right after you douse your hair with it, it goes from waxy and strange to silky and smooth and it's magical, I promise!

plainjanegirl
May 13th, 2009, 08:43 PM
Well today I caved and washed with shampoo and conditioner . I waited as long as I could and didn't have any responses on here yet. My hair feels better now but not as silky and soft as usual.


So does anybody alternate between the bars and regular shampoo ( I know some people alternate between cone and no cones) ?

Canarygirl
May 13th, 2009, 10:25 PM
So does anybody alternate between the bars and regular shampoo

I do...I also throw DW use and CO washes for good measure. It's good because it's helping me learn which products create which effects in my hair, how long my scalp stays clean, etc. I certainly haven't had any problems doing this.

Moonstruck
May 13th, 2009, 11:47 PM
I throw in a sulfate shampoo whenever my hair is super duper mucky, or if it's starting to get buildup... maybe once every 2 months, or if I fall off a horse (I ride). My hair doesn't like normal liquid shampoo as much as the bars, and my scalp gets itchier, but it's easier to get out mud and such, haha.

Did you try a vinegar rinse yet?

masterofmidgets
May 13th, 2009, 11:55 PM
So, I finally hit my first snag with my shampoo bars. Last week when I washed my hair, even with the vinegar rinse and my usual gobs of conditioner my hair was very tangly, and once it dried it felt...weird. Sort of too-slick and greasy in places, like I hadn't washed the conditioner out, and badly tangly and hard to comb out in other places. Not cool!

But this weekend I did a wash with an organic liquid shampoo and a SMT, and voila! All silky and soft again, just like normal. I did a poo bar wash this afternoon (Summer Sunshine), and my hair feels great still, no more tangles and no weird feeling.

I've been using poo bars exclusively since mid-February, so I guess 3 months is my wall before my hair throws a hissy fit. Still, I think I can handle a regular wash every 3 months or so to get rid of buildup (or whatever the problem was) - heck, on that timeline I can afford to splurge a little and get a nice shampoo. :D

Moonstruck
May 14th, 2009, 12:14 AM
MasterofMidgets - I swear, the same exact thing happened to me, just a month earlier. Awful, disgusting feeling. If you don't mind me asking - which bars had you been using, mostly? I know there's been some talk of buildup perhaps from the higher glycerin content of bar soap (more than liquid, and much more than detergent, generally), or maybe the castor oil part. I'm just curious.
I did the same as you - one wash with my original liquid shampoo, and good as new. Didn't try the SMT personally, but yeah.

masterofmidgets
May 14th, 2009, 12:20 AM
MasterofMidgets - I swear, the same exact thing happened to me, just a month earlier. Awful, disgusting feeling. If you don't mind me asking - which bars had you been using, mostly? I know there's been some talk of buildup perhaps from the higher glycerin content of bar soap (more than liquid, and much more than detergent, generally), or maybe the castor oil part. I'm just curious.
I did the same as you - one wash with my original liquid shampoo, and good as new. Didn't try the SMT personally, but yeah.

I switch it up a lot - it's just so much fun trying all the different kinds, I can't resist - but the bars I've been using lately are summer sunshine, lavender aloe, lavender spice, and carrot milk, and honey (mostly the first two the last few weeks).

I remember reading about people's problems with castor oil back up in the thread, but I never thought about it with regards to my hair. I'm just glad it seems so easily fixed, because aside from last week, my hair has been so much nicer and healthier looking since I switched, and I'd hate to have to give them up.

zombi
May 14th, 2009, 12:59 AM
Okay. So I tried these bars. I did an ACV rinse, blah blah, but my hair felt -- horrible. In one word: horrible.

It felt waxy, stiff, dry, rough, tangled, just -- horrible! I don't see how I could POSSIBLY have rinsed more than I did, and I followed with an ACV rinse just like everyone's said. Perhaps it's because my hair used to be blue-black (a chemical box blue-black) and I bleached all that off and put on a chemical red which is what it still is now, because I haven't henna'd yet. Do you think that's why?

kdaniels8811
May 14th, 2009, 03:37 AM
Some peoples hair simply does not like shampoo bars. Mine is one of them and I have tried half a dozen with the same results. Same with Dairy Whip. My hair simply does not like it. So it is time to try something different. Dissapointing since others have had really good results.!

Dolly
May 14th, 2009, 05:21 AM
So, I finally hit my first snag with my shampoo bars. Last week when I washed my hair, even with the vinegar rinse and my usual gobs of conditioner my hair was very tangly, and once it dried it felt...weird. Sort of too-slick and greasy in places, like I hadn't washed the conditioner out, and badly tangly and hard to comb out in other places. Not cool!

But this weekend I did a wash with an organic liquid shampoo and a SMT, and voila! All silky and soft again, just like normal. I did a poo bar wash this afternoon (Summer Sunshine), and my hair feels great still, no more tangles and no weird feeling.

I've been using poo bars exclusively since mid-February, so I guess 3 months is my wall before my hair throws a hissy fit. Still, I think I can handle a regular wash every 3 months or so to get rid of buildup (or whatever the problem was) - heck, on that timeline I can afford to splurge a little and get a nice shampoo. :D


When mine gets like that, I do a clarifying wash with Suave clarifying shampoo....it is only $1 at the Dollar Store, and it takes care of the issue....

Dolly
May 14th, 2009, 05:23 AM
Okay. So I tried these bars. I did an ACV rinse, blah blah, but my hair felt -- horrible. In one word: horrible.

It felt waxy, stiff, dry, rough, tangled, just -- horrible! I don't see how I could POSSIBLY have rinsed more than I did, and I followed with an ACV rinse just like everyone's said. Perhaps it's because my hair used to be blue-black (a chemical box blue-black) and I bleached all that off and put on a chemical red which is what it still is now, because I haven't henna'd yet. Do you think that's why?

How many times did you lather? When I first started out with the bars, I wasn't lathering enough. Now I do 2-3 lathers, and really work it in good.....I find that helps...

Dolly
May 14th, 2009, 05:24 AM
Well today I caved and washed with shampoo and conditioner . I waited as long as I could and didn't have any responses on here yet. My hair feels better now but not as silky and soft as usual.


So does anybody alternate between the bars and regular shampoo ( I know some people alternate between cone and no cones) ?


Jane, did you clarify before you started with the bars? Some people had better results when they clarified befire they started using them.....Suave clarifying shampoo costs $1 and it takes off EVERYTHING. That way you have a clean slate to start the bars with.....

Fractalsofhair
May 14th, 2009, 02:29 PM
Zombi, try clarifying, and also trying a few different kids of shampoo bars. I know Doc Bronner's dries out my hair horribly!

Velouria
May 15th, 2009, 12:46 AM
Since I've been doing so well with the Sweet Creek Herbs bars, I tried revisiting a CV sample, thinking that my previous issues with their bars were just "adjustment" difficulties.

No such luck. The same results as always: rough yet waxy hair, with mucho halo frizz. I will say they give a lot of body, but they simultaneously turn most of my curls into frizz or wave. I'm finally going to put all these samples out in the soap dishes, for hands.

So, yes, I'd say one should try bars from a few sources before giving up. I'd tried 3 other brands that didn't work well for me at all, before I found the SCH bars.....which are fast becoming my HG wash.

Tyu
May 15th, 2009, 03:44 AM
I bought a Honey Beer and Egg CV shampoo bar years ago (2006?) and it gave me the waxies still after three or so uses so I stopped using it. I had got a bunch of other samples along with it and found them all again the other day. I was considering putting them up on the swap board but they're rather old and I figured I'd try one more time, a different bar.
<br><br>
My water here is harder than it was where I lived before when I first tried the bars so I didn't have much hope. I broke my Herb Garden sample in half, lathered three times instead of just once like I did previous, and didn't bother with an ACV rinse because I'm far too lazy. I am amazed that I had zero waxies, and that my hair is really silky on top where I scalp washed with it.
<br><br>
So Herb Garden now goes in the "works" pile for me. I may try the HBE again now that I know to lather more than once and see how that turns out. If not, I still have most of a big bar left that I can swap if anyone wants it.

zombi
May 18th, 2009, 02:37 AM
How many times did you lather? When I first started out with the bars, I wasn't lathering enough. Now I do 2-3 lathers, and really work it in good.....I find that helps...

I lathered three times!


Zombi, try clarifying, and also trying a few different kids of shampoo bars. I know Doc Bronner's dries out my hair horribly!

Okay, I won't throw in the towel just yet. I was wondering if maybe they'd work better after I do my first full-head henna, in case the chemical-damage needed extra protection over it? Or not? Bah, I don't know. But girl, it doesn't matter, because DH accidentally used my sample of herb garden in the shower by thinking it was soap.

Ayn
May 18th, 2009, 04:49 PM
Help! I've been using shampoo bars for about 5 weeks now. Started with the chamomile bar from PLH but wanted to try others, so ordered some samples from CV. Have used the CV olive babassu bar for about 5 days. I use an ACV rinse every 2-3 days -- anything more dries me out.

One reason I wanted to try another brand was because I just never got rid of the "waxy" feeling. I used the vinegar rinse every wash at first, but it was too drying. Thought I'd try a different brand of bar and see if that made a difference.

Today, on top of the continued waxy feeling my hair is green! Well, okay, not bright green but definitely that green undertone that us blondies get similar to with chloride. It is still stiff, waxy, crunchy, dry and generally yucky feeling even after it dries and now green and falling out in clumps to boot. I can see my scalp through my part even when dry (part of this hair loss may be stress as mine has been astronomical the last 8 months, but it seems much worse since starting the bars).

My hair is extremely fine anyways so difficult to comb on a good day when wet, but I'm finding I can't even get a comb through the ends (let alone the roots) without some kind of conditioner or detangler.

I was so excited to find the shampoo bars and use something "natural" on my hair -- thought it would be good for it and help in growth/length. Now I'm wondering if I've made a huge mistake.

Anyone else with similar experience? -- waxy feeling won't clear up? (I don't believe my water is too hard, probably average) Green tinge???

Maybe the bars just aren't for me?

I came home this afternoon and tried the Suave clarifying shampoo, a heavy conditioner because I was in panic mode, and my usual detangler (John Frieda root enhancer stuff) -- still feels stiff, but not all the way dry yet -- lost another clump with gentle combing with a wide-tooth comb.

Is it the bars? Should I try a different bar? Should I give up the bars altogether?

Would a citric acid rinse work any different than a vinegar rinse?

So many questions -- Sorry! -- I just really wanted the shampoo bars to work, but today really freaked me and my hair out!

Any advice is welcome! TIA

hennaphile
May 18th, 2009, 05:08 PM
Anyone tried the camelia oil one from mehandi.com?

kdaniels8811
May 18th, 2009, 05:37 PM
Ayn - I also tried several different varieties of shampoo bars and my hair hated them. Made it waxy/greasy and very prone to breakage. They are not for everyone. Also, vinegar is drying, I use about a tablespoon to several cups warm water, very diluted. If your hair is breaking, I would just stop washing, maybe do one clarifying shampoo - dilute the shampoo, also, then just condition only for a while.

If you want to try something natural, look up the catnip tea thread. The stuff is cheap - any pet store carries it for a couple bucks for a bag of dried, and it lasts for months. My hair is fine and breaks easily. That has all but stopped since I started soaking my hair in catnip tea. I use it for conditioner. It may work for you.

Sorry the shampoo bars do not work for you, maybe it is something with fine hair? Others use them and rave over them. Let us know what works for you. Lots of advice and support here.

healingsolitude
May 18th, 2009, 06:52 PM
zombi - There was talk many, many pages back about shampoo bars possibly not working as well on damaged or chemically dyed hair. Some with those hair types said the shampoo bars would work well for their virgin hair coming in on top, but the damaged ends would be waxy, dry, and super tangled. I do think some with damaged or chemically dyed hair have found success with shampoo bars, so I don't know if that is truly the reason those posters had the issues or not. It could have been any number of reasons causing the reactions. However, you could possibly find out that your hair reacts better to the bars once you henna your hair. A few of the current posters having luck with the shampoo bars do henna their hair.

Another possible reason for your reaction could be the particular bar you are using or the rinse. Perhaps your hair simply doesn't like ACV. How much ACV do you use in your rinse? I've found that my hair reacts much better to an ACV rinse if it is extremely diluted. Only about one teaspoon in about 20 ounces of water. Some find that they prefer white vinegar, lemon or lime juice, or citric acid rinses. You might have to play around with the rinse in order to find which one works better for you, although it is true that not everyone can make the shampoo bars work for them. It seems like some get lucky right away, while others have to do a lot of experimenting.

Which shampoo bar are you currently using with this reaction? Have you tried using another one to see if you get a different reaction? Maybe even one from a different seller? Reactions can vary quite a bit between all of the different sellers discussed on this thread. I've tried bars from three different sellers and had different reactions for each one. Your hair could possibly not like the amount of base oils in the bars offered by the seller you are currently using now.

Tyu - Congrats on finding good results with the Herb Garden! I noticed you only commented on trying the Honey Beer and Egg shampoo sample a few years back. Did you only try that one at the time? If so, perhaps your reaction could have also been due to your hair possibly not liking protein? It makes me wonder if that was the main issue since you had better luck with the Herb Garden in harder water and without an ACV rinse.

Ayn - Honestly, I'm kind of wondering if you should maybe hold off on using shampoo bars anymore for awhile. I guess it depends on how you were reacting to whatever you were using prior to shampoo bars. Did you lose plenty of hair with your previous shampoo method? What about the green color in your hair? Did you also have that before or is it something that only started when you switched to the Olive Babassu shampoo bar? I have no idea why your hair has a green tinge since I can't remember reading about anyone having that problem with the bars. The Olive Babassu is also a white colored bar, so that makes it even more confusing.

But, like I said before, I really don't know if it is a good idea for you to continue using the bars while having such a strong reaction. It seems like the main thing would be to do whatever is necessary to get your hair back into the condition that it was in before. I also strongly suggest against using any kind of clarifying shampoo. I am a fine haired type who loses a good amount of hair when using any kind of detergent shampoo. Using a clarifying shampoo when I have a bad reaction only aggravates the situation even further. Instead, I do a conditioner soak with the Suave Clarifying conditioner. I soak my entire hair with that conditioner (family size bottle about $1.27 at Walmart) for at least 15 minutes, then I rinse it all out well without using anything else. It is extremely gentle and doesn't cause more stress to the hair. Using conditioner as a soaking method also causes the conditioner to remove build-up like a shampoo would do, only it is much more gentle. In my experience, the best way to lose the least amount of hair is to cut down on the amount of lathers and steps I use to wash or condition my hair. Just doing a one step conditioner soak to clean and condition my hair cuts back on the amount of hair I lose.

Anyway, I'd suggest trying that for now to see if it helps to calm down the hair loss and green tinge issues. You could also try rinsing your hair with distilled water instead of the faucet water to see if that helps at all. Possibly followed by a cold rinse since that is also good for the hair. Maybe try the bars again once your hair is back to normal, but that would be entirely up to you. A different rinse sounds like something you would need if you started back on the bars again. You might also want to check out the CO thread if you think the bars are not working for you. If nothing else works, then I'd suggest maybe seeing a doctor to see what suggestions he/she would offer. The catnip tea rinse is another good option, though I have no experience with that one.

Good luck to you! I hope you find whatever method works best for you! :flower:

hennaphile - Try doing a search on this thread for the mehandi bars. You'll find a few reviews on them, although not as many reviews as you'd find for the other companies here. Those bars didn't get as many positive reviews when compared to the others here. Most found that those bars created even more of a waxy and build-up problem. A few had success with them. I'd say they are probably not a good option for a first time choice since more posted issues with those than not.

hennaphile
May 18th, 2009, 06:55 PM
Thanks! I used the nettle/mint and loved it, so I guess it works for me, but we all have different hair :D. I'm hesitant to try chargin valley as they seem to leave build up. Are there other good ones? :flower:

healingsolitude
May 18th, 2009, 07:34 PM
You're welcome! You probably wouldn't have a problem with the camelia oil bar from Mehandi if you have success with the nettle/mint one then. I haven't heard too much about successful reactions with them, though. They could be like the CV bars where a different bar gives a completely different reaction for some. Sometimes it can feel like flipping a coin when trying a different bar. :D

Hmm. Different companies... There is Sweet Creek Herbs (so far doesn't seem to be too drying or too moisturizing), Soap Lady Oregon (bars more on the cleansing side), PrairieLand Herbs (bars more on the cleansing side), Serpentine Hair (bars more on the moisturizing side). I think Soap Lady Oregon and Serpentine Hair have more of a waxy/build-up issue discussed on the thread out of those four. Sweet Creek Herbs seems to be the least likely one to cause a build-up issue, though I haven't been able to successfully use them exclusively for more than a few washes at a time. My scalp needs detergents mixed in each week or it goes crazy. I don't recall reading too many build-up issues regarding the PrairieLand Herbs bars. Posters mostly spoke about issues with the bars drying out their hair. Those bars are mostly recommend for normal to oily hair and scalp. Soap Lady Oregon worked for a few and caused build-up issues or dry issues for others. Serpentine worked for some and caused build-up issues for others. Those were mostly said to be too moisturizing and recommended for hair that is more on the dry side. You could probably also do a search on those without getting too many results to browse through. CV seems to be the one mostly talked about on each page.

All in all, I think every company talked about here has given at least one person build-up/waxy issues. It largely seems to have something to do with hair type, the water used in your area, rinse/no rinse issues, the particular bar used, etc. I guess the best thing to do is to check out the ones that are recommended for your hair type (more dry or more oily) then decide which ones sound more appealing based on the description and ingredients listed. Hope this helps! :flower:

hennaphile
May 18th, 2009, 07:39 PM
OOO thanks, this is a long thread to get through! I think I do well with the moisterizing shampoos because my hair tends to be dry, and my scalp has chronic itchies to where if I don't wash everyday I'm in serious pain :P . I think the "oilying" of the mehandi bars is probably good for me because it's hard for me to overmoisterize, whereas some people have plenty of moisture :) . I'm going to try some CV samples, but I noticed that some of their oils like jojoba won't penetrate the hair shaft... are they more for sudsing? **learns** :)

healingsolitude
May 18th, 2009, 08:24 PM
You're welcome! This is a huge thread to navigate. It took me about three days to read it all when it was only back at around 120 pages. Perhaps needing the extra moisture is the reason the Mehandi bar works well for you. I believe that one was said to be like the Serpentine bars in how it is more moisturizing and recommended for hair more on the dry side.

I think some of the oils are used more for their lathering properties (castor oil, coconut oil) while others are used for different reasons. She has a page here (http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandcraft.com/ingred.htm#Base&#37;20Oils%20&%20Butters) listing the various oils you will find in her bars and what they do. Here is part of what it says about the jojoba oil:


Jojoba is believed to promote hair growth and improve the overall health of the scalp and hair. Jojoba actually creates a protective film over the skin and hair that keeps moisture in.

She is also a good seller to email if you have any questions that you can't find the answer to here. Either her or her son tend to respond quickly with helpful answers. :)

Tyu
May 19th, 2009, 09:24 AM
Tyu - Congrats on finding good results with the Herb Garden! I noticed you only commented on trying the Honey Beer and Egg shampoo sample a few years back. Did you only try that one at the time? If so, perhaps your reaction could have also been due to your hair possibly not liking protein? It makes me wonder if that was the main issue since you had better luck with the Herb Garden in harder water and without an ACV rinse.


I had the HBE, and I think Summer Sunshine as well. Both gave me the waxies. My hair doesn't mind protein at this stage in its life, so either it had complaints back then (though this was just after a relaxer process, so one would think it would WANT protein to make up for what it lost), or it was a combination of that, the water, and me just not using the bar properly. I only lathered once.

With the first lather of Herb garden, I had the "thick" coated feeling as well, but it went away after I lathered twice more. I'm due for my next hairwashing on Thurs or Fri, so I'm going to retry the HBE then.

Hedera
May 19th, 2009, 04:37 PM
For those experiencing waxiness; the first 6-12 months or so when I used shampoo bars, my hair didn't feel 'clean' until at least one day after washing.
I have no idea why, something to do with oils being absorbed into the hairshaft perhaps?

Anyway, the effect is much less noticeable now, but my hair is still nicer when it's not right after washing.

And yes, my then-ends, which had been dyed several times, were a bit less good than the rest of my hair. Not horrible, just not as nice as the upper (virgin) section.


A question; I seem to remember severel people here mentioning that they use CV soap bars (so not official shampoo bars) to wash their hair, when they want something extra-moisturizing.
(so not as a conditioner, but really to wash with)

I'm planning my next order, and I'd like to include a soap-bar or two, to see if it works as an in-between wash (for when I know I'll be washing again relatively quickly after that), something extra gentle.

Which CV soap bars did you use (and like) for that?

Aries_jb
May 20th, 2009, 11:22 AM
So far I've tried Shea Rose Clay as a shampoo bar with great results. I have found that you do need to wash more often, so you're planned method to use them would be ideal.

On my list to try as a shampoo bar:

Honey Butter
Honey Beer
Grapeseed Shea
Lavender and Rosemary
Aloe, Aloe, Aloe
Chocolate Almond
Cucumber Lime and Yogurt
Orange Creamsicle

Canarygirl
May 20th, 2009, 11:23 AM
I just bought some of the carrot-honey soap bar from CV because I read good reviews on it here; haven't tried it on my hair yet.

Wondering if there are any fans out there of the CV bar with coffee in it? Forget the name but it's the black shampoo bar. Do you think that it really can darken the hair (coffee content). The lather is just as white as all the other bars. I do like it, as it feels more balanced/moisturized than the summer sunshine I tried before this one.

Aries_jb
May 20th, 2009, 11:30 AM
I've tried Cafe Moreno a few times and I really like it. It's a decent shampoo bar. I can't speak much to the darkening properties as I've only used it a few times.

avraea
May 20th, 2009, 11:56 AM
I've tried all but 3 or 4 of the CV soap and shampoo bars, and my favorites are still all the ones that have goat milk in them, which would be the carrot & honey complexion, goat milk honey oatmeal, and the olive & shea. For some reason the goat milk really agrees with my hair and it's always softer and shinier when I use those bars compared to the other ones.

I actually don't use the shampoo bars anymore because they're either too drying on me or they tend to leave buildup, which make my hair feel dry at times. I think some have mentioned that it's due to the higher castor oil content in the shampoo bars?

Bluebell
May 20th, 2009, 12:01 PM
CV sSoapbars for washing works great for me. Accept the red clay one. Got an itchy scalp from that.
I use cucumber lime and yoghurt, honeybutter, olive and shea and even castille and calendula soap.

Hedera
May 20th, 2009, 12:12 PM
Aries and Bluebell, thank you so much!
That's a nice long list to pick one (or two, or three) from.

I've narrowed down most of the shampoo bars to three or four favorites, with three or four 'also-not-bads'.
Now I can start the whole thing over again with the soap bars... ;)


I do use Café Moreno; it's not one of my super-favorites, but not bad.
I haven't noticed any darkening, but since I switch bars constantly, I probably don't use it more than once a month, if that (wash twice a week, with around 8 different bars in rotation... the edge of my bathtub is getting crowded! :p).

My guess is, though, that you'd have to let it sit on your hair for much longer than you normally would a shampoo for it to have any real effect.

masterofmidgets
May 20th, 2009, 06:38 PM
Canarygirl, Cafe Moreno's one of my favorite CV bars so far. The cloves smell is a bit strong at first, but it fades pretty quickly. I think it's on the low end of the more moisturizing bars, and on my hair (which is pretty dry, especially at the ends) it worked well. Very soft and silky.
I didn't find that it darkened my hair at all, but then I switch bars every week, and with longer use it might do that for you, I don't know. Still, I quite like it.

UncommonTart
May 20th, 2009, 06:48 PM
I've switched from the Honey Beer & Egg to the Summer Sunshine. Things started out beautifully with the HBE, but about a week ago I started noticing that my hair was getting that icky 'enough-with-the-protein-already!' feeling to it. I've always had mixed results with protein, so this isn't a complete surprise, unfortunately. I'm liking the Summer Sunshine so far, and I'll probably get a full bar when they're back in stock. To me, it seems to smell quite strongly like ginger ale, which seems especially weird since there's no ginger in it. Does anyone else think so, or am I crazy? I've also got a sample left of the Extra Honey Beer & Egg, which I'll try when I've used up my Summer Sunshine sample, or whenever I feel like I could use a little protein again. I think it might work better for me than the HBE as a long run shampoo, since there is less egg in it.

Moonstruck
May 21st, 2009, 12:23 AM
Ackk! So recently, the weather here has started HEATING UP, and FAST. my scalp and skin are WAY overcompensating with the ickies, and I've gone from washing my hair every 2-3 days to contemplating whether or not I should wash it a second time every day. Yeah, 2x a day shampoos, fun.

My 'poo bars are not keeping up with me. Does anyone else ever have this issue? I'm already using SCH bars, which for me are less moisturizing than the CV ones, and am having oily, lanky hair. I tried Citrus Chamomile from CV just to double check, and yup, no fault of the bars, but they're too moisturizing right now.
Any tips? Any past experiences like this? What are the least moisturizing brands that you guys have tried with decent results?

Madame J
May 21st, 2009, 10:04 AM
I just wanted to leave a quick note: I'm still loving my JR Liggett bar. I can easily go 2-3 days between shampoos. And I started feeling clean hair right away, even though I had a lot of buildup of sebum and stuff from ineffective natural cleansing routines before. Today I was at a conference, so instead of an ACV rinse, I just used a nickel-sized blob of Kiss My Face Whenever conditioner finger-combed through my shoulder-length hair and rinsed out and got the same silky-yet-clean feeling. I maybe noticed a bit more shedding than usual, but that could also be a remnant of conference nerves.

lockslessmonstr
May 23rd, 2009, 09:53 AM
I got some samples of CV poo bars and tried the mudd and clay one first. I like how it washes but when I rinse, it makes me all tangled and rough/dry feeling. Then when it dries it feels coated in wax, all funky, tangled, dry and just plain bad. I've tried using it 3x in a row, not using condish after, then using condish after, then even tried CWC with it. The conditioner afterwards, helps but it's still not ideal. I have hard water and am considering a water softner. Will this help? I really want to love poo bars!!!!

Fractalsofhair
May 23rd, 2009, 12:41 PM
Try a mix of apple cider vinegar mixed with water as a rinse for your hair after the shampoo bars.

angelhr
May 23rd, 2009, 07:45 PM
For those experiencing waxiness; the first 6-12 months or so when I used shampoo bars, my hair didn't feel 'clean' until at least one day after washing.
I have no idea why, something to do with oils being absorbed into the hairshaft perhaps?

Anyway, the effect is much less noticeable now, but my hair is still nicer when it's not right after washing.

And yes, my then-ends, which had been dyed several times, were a bit less good than the rest of my hair. Not horrible, just not as nice as the upper (virgin) section.


A question; I seem to remember severel people here mentioning that they use CV soap bars (so not official shampoo bars) to wash their hair, when they want something extra-moisturizing.
(so not as a conditioner, but really to wash with)

I'm planning my next order, and I'd like to include a soap-bar or two, to see if it works as an in-between wash (for when I know I'll be washing again relatively quickly after that), something extra gentle.

Which CV soap bars did you use (and like) for that?


Since I Cassia'd my hair, it has become VERY dry, and the CV shampoo bars that worked for me before don't work at ALL. Therefore, I have started experimenting with regular soap bars. The one that I have really had success with (as far as gentleness and moisturizing) is the Chamomile-Calendula. Wonderful!

Moonstruck
May 24th, 2009, 07:35 PM
Hm, I didn't know people ever reported hair being dry for longer than the initial funk/few days. Is Cassia-ing not worth it to you, in your opinion? Or do the benefits for you outweigh the dryness?

Me personally, I think my interest is piqued by this report! I get the greasies so annoyingly fast - if my hair dried out a LOT I think I'd have normal/average hair.

hennaphile
May 24th, 2009, 08:25 PM
Hm, I didn't know people ever reported hair being dry for longer than the initial funk/few days. Is Cassia-ing not worth it to you, in your opinion? Or do the benefits for you outweigh the dryness?

Me personally, I think my interest is piqued by this report! I get the greasies so annoyingly fast - if my hair dried out a LOT I think I'd have normal/average hair.

Maybe I'm lucky, but i got the @#$@#$@# I-just-spent-a-million-bucks-at-a-salon amazing look as soon as it dried. It was nasty to rinse out, but was just as good as henna, even more shiny/thickening perhaps, but with no color for me.

Even for the thickness alone, cassia is worth it for me.

Canarygirl
May 24th, 2009, 09:05 PM
What do people think about poo bars effect on color maintenance (as compared to a gentle, sulfate free shampoo)? I am wondering about this because they have higher ph and would therefore open the cuticle. I read that for best color maintenance you should avoid using a cleansing mechanism that opens the cuticle because that helps color leach out.

What is your opinion on this subject and your experience with poo bars in relation to hair color fading (or not)?

Moonstruck
May 24th, 2009, 10:03 PM
Canary - I believe there have been a number of experience with people saying that Cafe Moreno from CV (and a few other bars, but that one the most) helped for them to remove a color that was undesirable. However, I have not read of anyone doing a more detailed analysis of how quickly/slowly the color was affected by bars vs liquid shampoos.

However, there are a fair amount of henna heads who also use 'poo bars, with no ill effects reported yet. Granted, henna does bind to the protein in a completely different way, so that may be why, but henna does not seem to be affected.

My guess would be that it'd be a double whammy in removing most dyes. The base would open the hair shaft up again, allowing some to come out, and actually, using an acid rinse would do some color removal too, since it'd react with some of the stuff that was NOT removed by the base while closing up the cuticle. As with any shampoo, multiple latherings, like shampoo bars often need, would probably make the color come out even faster.
Just my own two cents. I don't have any personal experience myself.

angelhr
May 25th, 2009, 12:30 AM
Hm, I didn't know people ever reported hair being dry for longer than the initial funk/few days. Is Cassia-ing not worth it to you, in your opinion? Or do the benefits for you outweigh the dryness?

Me personally, I think my interest is piqued by this report! I get the greasies so annoyingly fast - if my hair dried out a LOT I think I'd have normal/average hair.

I don't see many people reporting dryness from Cassia, but I've seen a few. It's been one month, and my hair is still dry. Tangles easily, feels almost matted, and it's really hard to get a comb through it without conditioner. And it feels a little straw-like (didn't feel like that before). Sooooo... maybe it's because I put it over processed (dyed) hair? I may try it again someday when alot of my dye has grown out, but for now, I'm a little afraid to use Cassia again.

Canarygirl
May 25th, 2009, 09:00 PM
Canary - I believe there have been a number of experience with people saying that Cafe Moreno from CV (and a few other bars, but that one the most) helped for them to remove a color that was undesirable. However, I have not read of anyone doing a more detailed analysis of how quickly/slowly the color was affected by bars vs liquid shampoos.

However, there are a fair amount of henna heads who also use 'poo bars, with no ill effects reported yet. Granted, henna does bind to the protein in a completely different way, so that may be why, but henna does not seem to be affected.

My guess would be that it'd be a double whammy in removing most dyes. The base would open the hair shaft up again, allowing some to come out, and actually, using an acid rinse would do some color removal too, since it'd react with some of the stuff that was NOT removed by the base while closing up the cuticle. As with any shampoo, multiple latherings, like shampoo bars often need, would probably make the color come out even faster.
Just my own two cents. I don't have any personal experience myself.

My limited experience is that after doing a henna/buxus gloss, then two days later shampooing with the cafe moreno bar, it seemed like all the buxus came out (or nearly all) leaving the redness of the henna behind. I've bought some shampoo that says it "leaves hair's ph perfectly balanced" that would be Giovanni 50/50...we'll see how that works. Kind of like slamming the barn door after the horses have left, however....

lockslessmonstr
May 26th, 2009, 08:32 PM
I tried the ACV rinse and it worked! The funk is gone - thankgod!
Just curious... how often do you guys wash with a poo bar? I did this morning and want to do tomorrow morning too - is that over-doing it?:confused:

Neoma
May 26th, 2009, 09:04 PM
I tried the ACV rinse and it worked! The funk is gone - thankgod!
Just curious... how often do you guys wash with a poo bar? I did this morning and want to do tomorrow morning too - is that over-doing it?:confused:
lockslessmonstr (love the name -- took me a minute to get it!), I wash with shampoo bars on a daily basis. I have baby fine hair, and if I don't wash every day, my scalp shows through.

In my opinion, shampoo bars are very nourishing and not at all stripping, so, if you need to shampoo every day, I'd say go for it. I'm sure someone will contradict this view, and that's OK. But that's been my experience.

Aries_jb
May 26th, 2009, 09:41 PM
It depends on your hair type, on the bar you're using, products you use along with shampoo bars, etc.

As for me, my scalp is not particularly greasy and in winter I wash once a week. However, with the summer kicking in I wash more often, especially because I also work out and my hair gets dirtier faster. Probably about twice a week. My hair is curly and also pretty tangly after a wash, so I try to stretch them out as long as possible.

masterofmidgets
May 26th, 2009, 11:21 PM
I wash three times a week usually (unless I'm redoing my dyed streaks or I have a new bar I'm too excited to wait to try out), but I don't worry that much about how often I wash, since my hair doesn't feel as dry and stripped as sulfate shampoos used to make it. I think most poo bars are mild enough that you can get away with washing more often - although if you can stretch it out longer, that's good too.

kwaniesiam
May 27th, 2009, 11:05 AM
I just got enough CV bars to last me for the next 8 months :joy:

Does anyone here really like the new coconut milk shampoo? I've tried it once, I love how it has no scent but I'm not sure if my hair really feels "clean" with it.

Madame J
May 27th, 2009, 11:58 AM
So I just discovered a new soapmaker, who is local to me, and sells her wares at local farmer's markets. I would love to transition to totally locavore personal care products, and I currently am loving my 'poo bar, but she says she doesn't make a shampoo bar because she could never get them to work in her own hair, and therefore couldn't in good conscience sell one explicitly as a shampoo. But she does say that some of her customers use them as shampoo. So what should I look for in a soap bar to be used as shampoo? I'm pretty sure she uses an olive oil base in most of her soaps, with some that have a cocoa/shea butter base. And I'm pretty sure she puts coconut oil in some.

She did mention that if she did make a shampoo bar, she would use a high percentage of castor oil. Maybe I'll be able to convince her to try to make one.

So, for the soap-makers out there, is it rude to ask what the superfat percentage of her various soaps are? And if not, what is the typical superfat percentage of a shampoo versus a soap bar? I have pretty nice hair already, if sometimes a little oily, so I'm up for some experimentation, but it would be good to know where to start.

Her company is Mystic Waters Soap (http://www.mysticwatersoap.com/index.htm), and her webpage doesn't give a lot of info about specific ingredients. I was considering trying Simply Soap first, because it's supposed to lather nicely, and doesn't have EOs that would affect my hair. But she makes soaps in all sorts of lovely fragrances!

Moonstruck
May 27th, 2009, 02:56 PM
Locklessmonstr - I wash my hair just about as often as I did with sulfate shampoos. To be honest though, I never saw any real damage from my sulfate 'poos, so I'm probably not a very good judge. I switched cause of the variety of health and environmental benefits that these bars offer.

Very cool, Madame J! I'm trying to be more of a locavore but it's really tricky sometimes, ackk!
I think the first thing to do would be to take a good hard look at your current poo bar (and ones you've used in the past) to try and determine some common ingredients that you really like. I'd personally feel bad if I asked her to make a bar specially for me, and then turned out to not like it over something silly like that. I also don't think it's offensive to ask about superfatting percentages, not when you plan to be buying a product from her, but that may just be me. Instead of asking though, maybe you could say something like... I read online that soap bars can be too oily for my hair type if they're superfatted to say, 5&#37;. Since my hair tends to be a little oily side, I want to watch out for that. Would you have any bars that might be closer to 3%? ('poo bars are normally around 3%)

Simply soap does sound good! I also really like the sound of goat milk, but obviously that's got lots of protein (which my hair generally likes) and EOs (all of which I really like, haha).
The shea butter soap also sounds like it might do the job nicely - lots of people like the shea in their poo bars it seems, including oily heads like me. And obviously, the bath ones depend, but yeah.

Keep in mind that with the castor oil, there are many people that report that it builds up in hair. Many people choose to use soap bars instead simply because they often don't have it at all. Does make for a nice lather, though. =)

Madame J
May 28th, 2009, 01:25 PM
Moonstruck (or any other soap-makers), is there any ambiguity in how superfatting is measured? The soapmaker emailed me back and said that Simply Soap is superfatted to 6&#37;, which seems really high to me. The Shea soap is even higher. Since I don't mind experimenting, and I don't get as oily since I've cut down on my washings, I might try one bar of Simply Soap and one of the Tea Tree and Oatmeal soap, since she says that's her lowest superfat percentage (it's for oily skin). If my hair stinks, I can always go back to the bar I got at the organic store! I still have a bit of bar to use up before I'll start in on the new ones (which I hope to get out to buy this weekend), but I'll let you know how it worked, especially if anyone lives in the DC area and wants to try a local shampoo bar (no shipping!).

mermaid_mama
May 29th, 2009, 09:28 AM
HELP!!!

I have been using cv shampoo bars for 1 week. I wash daily because my hair gets limp and heavy (greasy?) feeling if I go longer than a day and a half. Anywhoo, the water here is hard and I found the first 2 days my hair felt waxy. So, I started rinsing with distilled water and vinegar and my hair felt very soft. I loved it. Last night however, I noticed I am getting little white spots.....kind of like flakes or dust?....but not. The bigger ones feel kinda hard. What is this? What should I do?

Moonstruck
May 30th, 2009, 01:30 AM
Madame J - there shouldn't be any ambiguity, since ratios are ratios and can't really change from recipe to recipe. However... some oils are more or less cleansing, moisturizing, lathering, etc etc etc. So a bar superfatted with coconut oil will be different than one superfatted with olive. So when Ida from CV sells her shampoo bars at 3&#37; superfatting, the chamomile citrus is going to act like it's got less oils than the olive babassu because of what she superfatted it with.
I hope that clears it up a little bit! Let me know how it all works out, haha. Definitely interesting, even though I'm not close enough to really buy them and count it as local.

Mermaid Mama - Yay for vinegar rinses, they really make a crazy world of difference, don't they?
As for the white spots... where are you finding them? If they're on your brush but don't seem readily apparent on your hair, many shampoo bar users seem to get them - some kind of buildup or gunk. I get it only when my hair is feeling waxy (aka when I don't use a rinse) so I suspect it's related to the minerals in the water.
Does your scalp feel like it could be shedding? If it's getting itchy and stuff, it could be an allergic reaction =/ but it doesn't sound like it. It could be old buildup from the products you used to use. It might also be keratin plugs on the skin coming out, which is good. Basically, since you need to actually scrub your scalp when using 'poo bars, it might be ruffling up old junk (think exfoliating of the scalp), and it will probably go away over time, I'd guess. Does that sound about right?

hennaphile
May 31st, 2009, 12:31 AM
Just tried CV Rosemary mint. When I tried it, I have to say I was pretty underwhelmed. Then I rinsed with acv, beer, and rose water and when it dried, WOW! It feels great on my scalp, especially since I wash everyday, and my hair looked and felt better than most conditioners. I think I may start using camelia oil as a leave in just to top it off. Since in the end the result isn't all that different from mehandi, I think i'll stick with these as they're more economical.

manderly
May 31st, 2009, 03:55 AM
HELP!!!

I have been using cv shampoo bars for 1 week. I wash daily because my hair gets limp and heavy (greasy?) feeling if I go longer than a day and a half. Anywhoo, the water here is hard and I found the first 2 days my hair felt waxy. So, I started rinsing with distilled water and vinegar and my hair felt very soft. I loved it. Last night however, I noticed I am getting little white spots.....kind of like flakes or dust?....but not. The bigger ones feel kinda hard. What is this? What should I do?

How many times are you lathering? I would lather 3 times as a beginner and be sure to rinse thoroughly. The white flakes are probably either old buildup being slowly broken down by the poo bars OR they are residue left behind by the poo bars. Either way, lathering 3 times and a vinegar rinse will eliminate that problem in a week or less.

Generally the first lather you get pathetic lather and don't accomplish much. The second lather you should get a bit or real lather. The third lather should be a big fluffy mess of lather, which would confirm that you've got the bar working well. As your hair gets used to the bars, you probably will only have to lather 2 times.....although if your water is hard enough you may have to keep up the routine. Really good rinsing and a vinegar final rinse is imperative for you :)

HTH.

Canarygirl
May 31st, 2009, 02:07 PM
Could we split this thread? It's taking way too long to load anymore at its current size. You know, where there's a link that says "to view the first XXXX portion of this thread, click here" Really, this thing could be split into 3 or more sections and it would work much better. I don't know how to notify a moderator about it...can somebody help me do that?

Neoma
May 31st, 2009, 02:24 PM
Could we split this thread? It's taking way too long to load anymore at its current size. You know, where there's a link that says "to view the first XXXX portion of this thread, click here" Really, this thing could be split into 3 or more sections and it would work much better. I don't know how to notify a moderator about it...can somebody help me do that?

Canarygirl, this thread loads as quickly as any other on my computer. I do realize that it is very long. But, in my opinion, having everything on the topic in one, searchable thread is preferable to having multiple threads. Yes, you could say "Click here for the first 100 pages," but then you would have to search each thread separately to find something that you know is in one of them. Personally, I don't see that as being an advantage.

I believe that we need to determine if the majority of the shampoo bar thread readers feel the way that you do rather than going directly to a moderator and asking them to do it.
:flower:

Canarygirl
May 31st, 2009, 02:37 PM
I believe that we need to determine if the majority of the shampoo bar thread readers feel the way that you do rather than going directly to a moderator and asking them to do it.

good idea. For me, it takes about 90+ seconds to load this thread. I have high speed internet too (cable/modem through Comcast).

Moonstruck
May 31st, 2009, 03:22 PM
^^" I'm a little confused about the loading thing - why would loading a single page of a long thread be any different than loading a single page of a short one? I don't think I've ever noticed a difference, and the amount of data being transferred should be comparable (okay, so the longer one has a few more numbers/links, but no more than many that would reach 10 pages).
Is it maybe just this website instead, or something like that? I wouldn't really care either way, but I'm just curious - I've never heard of such a thing, and I do a fair amount with computers.

Fractalsofhair
May 31st, 2009, 03:30 PM
I've never noticed this page loading any slower. What my computer does is simply loads the page, not page 290, but page 291, and then if I click on page 290, it loads page 290 then, but not before.

Canarygirl
May 31st, 2009, 06:07 PM
I just hit "Reply" at the bottom of post number 2907 and it took ~60 seconds to bring up this window. This is without the corresponding graphics. It's been another 45 seconds now and the different smilie faces are just starting to load, one by one.

However it seems to be the whole website being slow, not just this thread. Someone started a thread about it:

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?p=610925#post610925

sorry to take this thread off track....

manderly
May 31st, 2009, 07:27 PM
I just hit "Reply" at the bottom of post number 2907 and it took ~60 seconds to bring up this window. This is without the corresponding graphics. It's been another 45 seconds now and the different smilie faces are just starting to load, one by one.

However it seems to be the whole website being slow, not just this thread. Someone started a thread about it:

http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?p=610925#post610925

sorry to take this thread off track....


Yes, every so often the site slows to a snails pace and takes forever to load a page. Hopefully we don't have a crash!

Just click on the little triangle in front of the thread title and it will take you to the first unread post in the thread :)

Aries_jb
June 1st, 2009, 11:30 AM
I agree with the site being slow. All other internet pages I visit load fast except for this one. Fingers crossed for no crash!

Dolly
June 1st, 2009, 12:35 PM
I don't have any problems with this thread (or the site in general) loading slowly.....and I also vote for keeping the thread in one piece.....

Aries_jb
June 1st, 2009, 09:45 PM
Does anyone have a washing method they can share that doesn't cause so many tangles? Every time I wash I end up with a big clump of tangles at the back of my head. I usually soap the bar up in my hands, then push the lather through my hair to my scalp and massage the scalp with my fingertips. I know this method is causing the tangles, but I'm not sure how else to wash to minimize this. Suggestions?

rose_in_bloom
June 1st, 2009, 11:40 PM
The entire site (and particularly this thread) was very slow for me earlier today, and no other sites were slow. But now it's fine, so I'm not worrying about it. I personally wouldn't care either way if this thread were split up, but I'm guessing it's up to the majority of LHCers. Maybe you could create a poll to see what people think?

Oh, and I've decided to give my CV bars another chance. I really really want to make them work for me! I'm going to use summer sunshine tomorrow with a citric acid rinse and see how it works. I'll report back tomorrow. :)

ETA: I just ordered samples of the nettle, coconut milk, and chamomile & citrus shampoo bars from CV, and I can't wait to try them!!

manderly
June 2nd, 2009, 03:41 AM
Does anyone have a washing method they can share that doesn't cause so many tangles? Every time I wash I end up with a big clump of tangles at the back of my head. I usually soap the bar up in my hands, then push the lather through my hair to my scalp and massage the scalp with my fingertips. I know this method is causing the tangles, but I'm not sure how else to wash to minimize this. Suggestions?

I wash in a "headband" pattern.

Wet hair thoroughly, rub bar gently from ear to ear. Part hair at ears (like you're doing a half-up), rub gently from ear to ear along part. Hold hair up in a pony, rub gently along nape line and neck, from ear to ear. Re-moisten and work into a lather with your fingertips at the roots and scalp, spread lather down length.

Note: Your hair should not be disturbed while rubbing....it should remain pretty much slicked down from the water. You aren't rubbing hard, just a gentle swipe across the surface.

Hope that helps :)

Canarygirl
June 2nd, 2009, 09:23 AM
The entire site (and particularly this thread) was very slow for me earlier today, and no other sites were slow. But now it's fine, so I'm not worrying about it. I personally wouldn't care either way if this thread were split up, but I'm guessing it's up to the majority of LHCers. Maybe you could create a poll to see what people think?

now that the website seems to be fixed, response time on this thread isn't an issue anymore. :)

Moonstruck
June 2nd, 2009, 08:25 PM
Aries - I do the same thing as Manderly, basically. I pretend I'm trying to brush every inch of my hair into a FANTASTIC ponytail with the poo bar in hand- every hair slicked back, in place. I then rub the bar in my hands and work up some lather, and go through my hair and massage the lather through that way, often taking multiple times to relather up my hands. Always go in one direction, that's the key for me!

Madame J
June 3rd, 2009, 06:13 AM
I also clean like Manderly and Moonstruck, with one difference. After I swipe the soap over my hair like making a ponytail, I also make a half-up, parting my hair horizontally to get soap into the bulk of my hair, since it's so thick. Then I lather my hands and massage my scalp and work the lather through the length of my hair. Then I do it again. Then I rinse very carefully (my hair feels a little sticky at this point). Then I rinse with 1-2 Tbsp. of ACV in a cup of water, and then I rinse again, with warm and then cold water.

Aries_jb
June 3rd, 2009, 10:31 AM
Thanks for the tips! I'll try them the next time I wash. I think the problem is the circular motion I make when I work the lather through. I'll try just going in one direction and see if that works.

Tyu
June 5th, 2009, 12:51 AM
So I retried CV Honey Beer and Egg. I know from previous experience it works fine if used with an ACV rinse, leaving no waxies, but because I'm lazy, I'm trying to find the bars that don't require me to do that.

Even lathering four times, I couldn't get rid of the waxy feeling. The back of my head still feels greasy after drying. So HBE is not for me. I'll use it up as a regular soap, but I can't use it on my hair.

It DOES make it nice and thick though, I'll give it that.

Moonstruck
June 5th, 2009, 03:15 PM
I'm not sure that additional lathers would help get rid of the waxy feeling, since the waxiness is caused from using a soap and hard water together, not oils that might be sitting on your head (which is what additional latherings WOULD do). I know you mentioned that it's okay when you use the ACV - what exactly is the too lazy part? Just needing to use another product?
I think Neoma uses some ACV and conditioner mixed together to get rid of the waxies, and if you're conditioning your hair already, that might let the 'poo bars work without too many additional steps.

Just a thought.

Neoma
June 5th, 2009, 04:51 PM
Just reporting back...

I'm still in love with Sweet Creek Herbs shampoo bars. They cleanse really effectively without stripping. And I don't need to use a vinegar rinse with them. Sometimes I choose to, but usually, I either use the shampoo bars on their own or follow with a bottled, non-cone conditioner.

hennaphile
June 5th, 2009, 06:12 PM
Shed today after CV bar! :shudder: I'm hoping this is a coincedence

Chromis
June 5th, 2009, 06:45 PM
Thanks for the tips! I'll try them the next time I wash. I think the problem is the circular motion I make when I work the lather through. I'll try just going in one direction and see if that works.

Yep that sounds tangly! Try to think more like you are petting a cat :kitten:

rose_in_bloom
June 5th, 2009, 09:06 PM
I got a case of the waxies. So yesterday I washed with AO green tea clarifying shampoo, vinegar rinse, and a little honeysuckle rose conditioner on the ends. Today I had crunchy tangly hair for some reason, so I put a little coconut oil on the ends, and that fixed it. I got all my CV samples today (YAY!!) so tomorrow I'm going to wash with my new chamomile & citrus bar and maybe condition with the honey butter soap. We'll see.

Aries_jb
June 5th, 2009, 09:19 PM
Yep that sounds tangly! Try to think more like you are petting a cat :kitten:

I tried lathering in one direction today. Thanks everyone so much for the advice! I had WAY less tangles this way. My hair is curly so it will always have a tangle or two, but it was much more managable.

rose_in_bloom
June 6th, 2009, 12:23 PM
Okay, so I'm officially in love with chamomile & citrus shampoo bar! :inlove: It cleaned thoroughly with only one lather and made my hair soft. And it smells really nice. I'm still not sure how the length feels because it's still wet and up in a braided bun, but the scalp hair feels wonderful.

I'll definitely get this in a full size bar.

Twitter
June 6th, 2009, 09:25 PM
I just got some samples of CV shampoo bars this week. I love them! I've used the babassu and marshmallow and cafe moreno so far. I really like them both. I followed with a citric acid rinse that I did not rinse out. So for I love shampoo bars, I've been having trouble with washing lately, so I hope these keep working for me.

ljkforu
June 7th, 2009, 03:04 AM
Just a comment, my hair started to break at the damaged ends and I thought "what is going on?" Then I realized that even though I was using all the same bars and various conditioners I had gotten lazy and stopped the vitamin c rinse. My bad back to the rinsing.

Moonstruck
June 7th, 2009, 06:54 PM
Alright, quick question, guys. As summer has started to actually HIT with the occasional heat waves... how do you oily heads cope with shampoo bars? I find that I have to clarify roughly ever week right now, and I THINK it's due to the heat, because I've tried to eliminate all the other possible variables. The silly thing is that once a week clarifying = clarifying every 4th wash or so, so it's really quite frequent. I'm already using shampoo bars tailored towards oily scalps, and it's significantly better than those that are more normal... but this is absurd.
Granted, my normal sulfate shampoos only stave off the oilies for 1.5 days, whereas the 'poo bars are doing too, so it's better.... but any tips?

rose_in_bloom
June 8th, 2009, 01:38 PM
I've got VERY oily hair, and I can't skip more than one day, either with regular shampoo or poo bars. Sometimes I'll skip two days if I'm not going to leave the house. I've only been using CV bars for a week, and I haven't needed to clarify yet. (However I did clarify before I started using the bars to get rid of cone buildup.)

rose_in_bloom
June 8th, 2009, 01:43 PM
Okay, so I have a problem and I need some experts to help me out here! :)

I've been using CV bars for a week now (3 washes). I use either an ACV or a citric acid rinse each time I wash. I lather twice, including the length. I don't use conditioner. So here's my problem: The hair from the ears up feels fantastic and soft and clean, but my length is SUPER waxy and disgusting. I tried really working in the suds and the acid rinses into the length, but it still isn't getting clean. My ends feel fried as well.

I'm not sure what to do here -- I don't want to stop using the bars because they make my scalp hair feel awesome. But the length is frustrating.

Help!

ETA: Oh, and the bars I've used are: Summer Sunshine, Chamomile & Citrus, and Honey Beer & Egg. I used a different bar each wash.

Moonstruck
June 8th, 2009, 02:40 PM
One thing that always helped me for the waxy length was well... I mix my acid rinse up in a little bucket to be poured over my head. I soak my length in it for a few seconds before dumping it over my scalp.
Acid rinses that are too strong can make your scalp greasy faster, but a weaker acid rinse has most of its acidic properties already used up by the time it gets to your length. It's also more difficult to work in a liquid onto the length, in my opinion, since gravity takes its toll haha. That's what I've tried, and for me, it seems to work pretty well.

As for the ends, what are you using? A more super-fatted soap, or conditioner? I love the idea of using a soap and it DOES work for me, but it's hard to get it really effective on the ends/tips of my hair, in my opinion. Maybe my hair is just too damaged and porous there. I have much better success with a good conditioner.

As for the buildup thing - what's confusing me is that when I started the 'poo bars, I only clarified ONCE after three months of continuous 'poo bar usage. I guess my real question is... am I really developing buildup so quickly, or is it the heat and resulting hair oiliness that makes me THINK that it's buildup? Either way, I guess I'd have to clarify, but I'm just wondering if I should be looking to the 'poo bars for certain ingredient combos that might be more effective, or if it's just me. Hehe.

rose_in_bloom
June 8th, 2009, 03:09 PM
That's a great idea, Moonstruck! I'm going to try soaking the length next time I wash. Thanks for the advice. :flower:

I'm not using anything on my ends right now. No conditioner, no oil, just washing them with the shampoo bar and leaving them alone. When I use regular shampoo and conditioner, I put coconut oil on the ends. But now that I'm experimenting with the bars, I thought I'd see how the length would react if I didn't put anything on it at all.

GreyLadyBast
June 8th, 2009, 06:20 PM
I just today started using Kiss My Face's Olive Oil and Lavender bar soap, and it worked fabulously!! Cleaned all the grease out of my hair, smells beautiful, left it fluffy and shiny and beautiful. Follow with an ACV rinse, and Bob's yer uncle. Of course, this is only the first time I've used it, but so far so good. At roughly $3 for a nice big bar, and slippery enough to use as for shaving as well as on face and body, it's a good deal.

Bast

rose_in_bloom
June 8th, 2009, 09:54 PM
To all you Prairieland Herb buyers: Approximately how long did it take for you to get your order? I just ordered a bar of Aloe Fresh today, and I can't wait for it to get here!

ljkforu
June 8th, 2009, 11:20 PM
Let us know what basic water district you are in. Hard water does weird things.

meant for Rose in Bloom

rose_in_bloom
June 9th, 2009, 12:19 AM
I have hard water, based on the chart from the CV website. So yeah, that makes it harder for the bars to work properly.

Sjirsten
June 9th, 2009, 02:13 AM
I have a problem, have been using CV bars (shampoo) for a few weeks and it`s going well, except for one thing. I lather twice and I am doing it very thoroughly, but after every other wash I get a section of waxy hair in the back. The section it about 2 inches wide and it is waxy almost from the roots and down to the ends.

When I discover it, I usually rinse that part all over and that helps a little.

What have I been doing wrong? At the time I am using the rosemary mint bar.

ljkforu
June 9th, 2009, 02:14 AM
I have hard water, based on the chart from the CV website. So yeah, that makes it harder for the bars to work properly.
Okay, hardwater ladies got any good advice for your friend here?

My suggestion is to avoid castor oil in the soap mix to prevent the waxies.

manderly
June 9th, 2009, 02:31 AM
I have a problem, have been using CV bars (shampoo) for a few weeks and it`s going well, except for one thing. I lather twice and I am doing it very thoroughly, but after every other wash I get a section of waxy hair in the back. The section it about 2 inches wide and it is waxy almost from the roots and down to the ends.

When I discover it, I usually rinse that part all over and that helps a little.

What have I been doing wrong? At the time I am using the rosemary mint bar.


When you do your second lather, part your hair ear to ear like you're making a half-up and run the bar across the hair. That usually does it. For some reason it sometimes doesn't penetrate down very well.

Sjirsten
June 9th, 2009, 03:09 AM
Aha, good idea. Thank you very much:)

Norai
June 9th, 2009, 06:25 PM
When you do your second lather, part your hair ear to ear like you're making a half-up and run the bar across the hair. That usually does it. For some reason it sometimes doesn't penetrate down very well.

Yeah, I always have a tough time with that spot under my ears, it never wants to lather and ends up greasy half the time because I don't try hard enough. And I use a big 2 gallon jug for the vinegar rinse so I don't have to refill it all the time... talk about awkward, lol.

Jason
June 11th, 2009, 09:00 AM
I've been dealing with an itchy, flaky scalp for months now. I've tried various shampoos including medicated ones and nothing seems to help much.

I remembered that I had a lot of shampoo bars still on hand from a couple of years ago. I had stopped using them because I found it hard to get my hair really clean with them. I have decided to give them another try because I feel that they might be good for my condition given that they're all-natural.

I tried the clay and mud one last night and my scalp feels pretty good today - better than usual. The itching is way down and the flakes are less too. I'm hoping that with continued use, I'll get even better results.

I'm wondering if any others have used them to treat scalp problems. Are there specific varieties that are better than others for this? Reading the description at the CV site, it would seem the clay and mud would be one of the better ones for this but I'm not sure.

Thanks!

avraea
June 11th, 2009, 10:08 AM
I'm pretty sure CV's Neem & Tea Tree bar and also the Nettle bar are recommended for dandruff or itchyness, so you may want to try those out. Also following up with an acidic rinse will help as well.

kwaniesiam
June 11th, 2009, 10:16 AM
I've been dealing with an itchy, flaky scalp for months now. I've tried various shampoos including medicated ones and nothing seems to help much.

I remembered that I had a lot of shampoo bars still on hand from a couple of years ago. I had stopped using them because I found it hard to get my hair really clean with them. I have decided to give them another try because I feel that they might be good for my condition given that they're all-natural.

I tried the clay and mud one last night and my scalp feels pretty good today - better than usual. The itching is way down and the flakes are less too. I'm hoping that with continued use, I'll get even better results.

I'm wondering if any others have used them to treat scalp problems. Are there specific varieties that are better than others for this? Reading the description at the CV site, it would seem the clay and mud would be one of the better ones for this but I'm not sure.

Thanks!

I'm particularly fond of the Neem and Tea Tree oil CV bar, its my usual though I've also had good results from the Cedarwood and Lavender Dog Shampoo :o Occasionally I get itchies, and a wash with that followed by a very diluted ACV rinse clears it right up. I'm one of the lucky ones who doesn't need an acid rinse with each wash though, which is convenient because I have to wash daily.

Neoma
June 11th, 2009, 11:51 AM
I've been dealing with an itchy, flaky scalp for months now. I've tried various shampoos including medicated ones and nothing seems to help much.

I remembered that I had a lot of shampoo bars still on hand from a couple of years ago. I had stopped using them because I found it hard to get my hair really clean with them. I have decided to give them another try because I feel that they might be good for my condition given that they're all-natural.

I tried the clay and mud one last night and my scalp feels pretty good today - better than usual. The itching is way down and the flakes are less too. I'm hoping that with continued use, I'll get even better results.

I'm wondering if any others have used them to treat scalp problems. Are there specific varieties that are better than others for this? Reading the description at the CV site, it would seem the clay and mud would be one of the better ones for this but I'm not sure.

Thanks!Hi Jason. It's nice to see you and your lovely hair on this thread.

I don't know if this will answer your question or just complicate the issue, but I did want to point out that I am a long-term shampoo bar user. I live in NYC, which has soft water. Whenever I travel to Boston, which is your neck of the woods, shampoo bars don't work for me. The hard water throws my routine out of wack. I suspect that if I lived there I would find a way to make them work, but it would take some tweaking.

hennaphile
June 11th, 2009, 03:21 PM
how do you know if you have hard or soft water?

Neoma
June 11th, 2009, 04:15 PM
how do you know if you have hard or soft water?
hennaphile, you can search for "YOUR CITY'S NAME, water hardness" on the internet.

Fractalsofhair
June 11th, 2009, 04:21 PM
Neoma- don't tell me to google that! My tap water apparently has heavy metals and dye contaminants in it in recent surveys of it!!! :( I knew we had issues in the 70s, but yikes! Copper is fine(For washing, not for the drinking of water I do.), mercury isn't so great. These are of samples taken at my high school, so it's a little bit scary!

Anyways, I live near Boston, and shampoo bars work fine in my hair, Doc bronner's at least, and Alaffia shampoo(soap based) works well. Neither of them lather extremely well, but I've never had soap scum on my tub.

rose_in_bloom
June 11th, 2009, 04:41 PM
Ouch. My city has very hard water. :( No wonder I'm having so much trouble with shampoo bars! I knew I had hard water, but I didn't know it was the very highest level of hardness. Bummer.

Fractalsofhair
June 11th, 2009, 04:46 PM
You can try using distilled water to wash your hair, or get a water filter? ACV rinses work well, you'll just have to use more ACV.

hennaphile
June 11th, 2009, 06:28 PM
Silly question:


[My town] water has slightly more
than 1 grain of harness,
therefore we recommend
as little soap possible.

So slightly more is soft water?

rose_in_bloom
June 11th, 2009, 09:41 PM
Silly question:


[My town] water has slightly more
than 1 grain of harness,
therefore we recommend
as little soap possible.

So slightly more is soft water?

That's not a silly question. :) From what I've read, if your water only has 1+ grain of hardness, that means it's mostly soft. The more grains, the harder the water. My water has 10+ grains, so it's extremely hard.

Disclaimer: I am by NO means an expert on this subject, so somebody please correct me if I'm wrong! :o

Moonstruck
June 11th, 2009, 11:28 PM
Hennaphile, that's pretty soft. Btw, this might be a little nosy... I noticed your posts elsewhere on this forum talking about big sheds, and the big ones after CV bar usage. Obviously this could be related to the physical rubbing of the bar so...I just wanted to let you know that there are some people here that used to liquify part of their bar just prior to usage in the shower, and that seemed to work well for them. It might help in your case too, if you want to look more into it. I think they just mixed a bit of the bar with a bit of water somehow?

Jason - I'm not sure what your hair type is, but I also just wanted to remind you that if your hair wouldn't mind the additional oils... the normal soap bars might have some good ones for you. I use honey beer quite frequently, for instance. Of the shampoo bars, Rosemary Lavender Aloe seems to make my itchiness go away more than Nettle. Lavender and Rosemary are almost necessities in my bars - they make my scalp SOOO much happier.
Also, the vinegar rinse has helped my scalp regardless of what cleaning method I use. So the occasional one might be worth doing, if you're not doing them with 'poo bar washing.

Dachsdragon
June 12th, 2009, 02:20 AM
I've been dealing with an itchy, flaky scalp for months now. I've tried various shampoos including medicated ones and nothing seems to help much.

I remembered that I had a lot of shampoo bars still on hand from a couple of years ago. I had stopped using them because I found it hard to get my hair really clean with them. I have decided to give them another try because I feel that they might be good for my condition given that they're all-natural.

I tried the clay and mud one last night and my scalp feels pretty good today - better than usual. The itching is way down and the flakes are less too. I'm hoping that with continued use, I'll get even better results.

I'm wondering if any others have used them to treat scalp problems. Are there specific varieties that are better than others for this? Reading the description at the CV site, it would seem the clay and mud would be one of the better ones for this but I'm not sure.

Thanks!

I used to get and itchy scalp all the time and it has disappeared since I've been using poo bars, I use Sweet Creek Herbs.

swirlytresses
June 12th, 2009, 09:09 AM
I'm particularly fond of the Neem and Tea Tree oil CV bar, its my usual though I've also had good results from the Cedarwood and Lavender Dog Shampoo :o Occasionally I get itchies, and a wash with that followed by a very diluted ACV rinse clears it right up. I'm one of the lucky ones who doesn't need an acid rinse with each wash though, which is convenient because I have to wash daily.

Ooooo, the dog poo bar..I'm wondering if I should send it with my husband when he goes camping in a couple of weeks...hmm. I wouldn't tell him it's for the dog though...lol. I forgot about it being a bug repellent too. Thanks for the idea. :)

Kimberly
June 12th, 2009, 06:15 PM
Ooooo, the dog poo bar

Funny what a different meaning that phrase has on LHC. ;)

My new order of CV bars just arrived!!! *happydance* Made my other mail smell great!

I received more of my standby, Honey, Beer & Egg, plus the Honey Butter bar that was out of stock when I wanted to try it before. One thing I've been wondering about CV bars is how consistent results will be from batch to batch. I bought a whole bunch of HB&E a couple of years ago (didn't want to run out or not have enough to get by while finding something else if there was a discontinuation or formula change), so every bar I've used so far was presumably from the same batch.

swirlytresses
June 12th, 2009, 10:03 PM
Funny what a different meaning that phrase has on LHC. ;)

My new order of CV bars just arrived!!! *happydance* Made my other mail smell great!

I received more of my standby, Honey, Beer & Egg, plus the Honey Butter bar that was out of stock when I wanted to try it before. One thing I've been wondering about CV bars is how consistent results will be from batch to batch. I bought a whole bunch of HB&E a couple of years ago (didn't want to run out or not have enough to get by while finding something else if there was a discontinuation or formula change), so every bar I've used so far was presumably from the same batch.

:o LOL!! I never even noticed what I typed...:oops: I can't believe myself! Anyway, I'm glad you understood the meaning...dog shampoo...lol...I will go hide under my bed for a while now...:p

rose_in_bloom
June 12th, 2009, 10:53 PM
:o LOL!! I never even noticed what I typed...:oops: I can't believe myself! Anyway, I'm glad you understood the meaning...dog shampoo...lol...I will go hide under my bed for a while now...:p

LOL I hadn't even noticed until now! It does sound pretty funny, especially when you say it out loud...:lol:

hennaphile
June 12th, 2009, 11:24 PM
Hennaphile, that's pretty soft. Btw, this might be a little nosy... I noticed your posts elsewhere on this forum talking about big sheds, and the big ones after CV bar usage. Obviously this could be related to the physical rubbing of the bar so...I just wanted to let you know that there are some people here that used to liquify part of their bar just prior to usage in the shower, and that seemed to work well for them. It might help in your case too, if you want to look more into it. I think they just mixed a bit of the bar with a bit of water somehow?

.

Oh, not nosey at all! :flower: I'm intrigued by this liquifying thing... is there a good way to do it for the mechanically inept :D

manderly
June 13th, 2009, 01:41 AM
Oh, not nosey at all! :flower: I'm intrigued by this liquifying thing... is there a good way to do it for the mechanically inept :D


Pretty much all that's involved is sticking a sliver of soap in a shampoo bottle full of warm water and letting it sit (usually overnight). Very useful when you come to the last of the bar that's too small to use normally :)

hennaphile
June 13th, 2009, 05:33 AM
Pretty much all that's involved is sticking a sliver of soap in a shampoo bottle full of warm water and letting it sit (usually overnight). Very useful when you come to the last of the bar that's too small to use normally :)

Thanks, I just put a sliver of rosemary mint in my squeeze bottle. Maybe now I'll get to keep enjoying shampoo bars until I can restock my MM :cheese:

3azza
June 13th, 2009, 06:50 AM
As an LHCer i'm trying to use more natural stuff and quit the cones, but it's not wroking.
Yesterday was my latest trial with shampoo bars. I prepared shaving of a bar soap (since lathering the bar over my long thick hair takes ages and causes tangles), mixed it with some good herbal tea and used it on my head. The result was dry dry dirty hair. and yes i did use a hair mask with citric acid to overcome the alkalinity, but it did not work :(
Today i had to wash my hair (with cones) again because i could not stand how stiff and dirty it felt.

Fractalsofhair
June 13th, 2009, 08:28 AM
Could be the wrong type of shampoo bar, and you might need to lather more times. Also, if you're using cones, you need to clarify out the cones before being able to use shampoo bars. For a more natural method that can be used with cones, Whole Foods365 brand is great, it doesn't contain cones, but uses SLS to get rid of cones. Also,Burts Bee's super shiny doesn't contain cones, but might be able to be used with cones on a regular basis, though you may still need to clarify once in a while.

rose_in_bloom
June 13th, 2009, 10:47 AM
Just used my new SCH chamomile & ylang ylang bar this morning, and...WOW! I am so happy with the results. My hair was clean and soft all the way down to the ends (which has never happened for me with shampoo bars). I used a very mild citric acid rinse just because I'm a chicken. :)

MandaMom2Three
June 13th, 2009, 10:54 AM
Now that's I've gone no cones again, and also trying to go SLS free too I'm going to give 'poo bars another go. Does anyone know ig any of the "soap works" bars contain SLS?

hennaphile
June 13th, 2009, 04:12 PM
As an LHCer i'm trying to use more natural stuff and quit the cones, but it's not wroking.
Yesterday was my latest trial with shampoo bars. I prepared shaving of a bar soap (since lathering the bar over my long thick hair takes ages and causes tangles), mixed it with some good herbal tea and used it on my head. The result was dry dry dirty hair. and yes i did use a hair mask with citric acid to overcome the alkalinity, but it did not work :(
Today i had to wash my hair (with cones) again because i could not stand how stiff and dirty it felt.


I tried mixing acv with beer and distilled rose water. Worked amazingly well. Maybe try a stroll down vinegar lane? :flower:

Moonstruck
June 13th, 2009, 04:24 PM
Hennaphile - I hope you see better results with that! Additionally, have you ever compared different shampoo bars? I know I've shed TONS with Nettle soaps so far, but there are some here and there that really make my scalp thrilled.

3azza - I agree with hennaphile and fractals. You hair needs to be fairly cone-free at least around the scalp area for the bars to work well, at least in my experience. I can use a coney conditioner, but it just fluffs out and feels crispy if I use that in conjunction with 'poo bars. If I use a coney shampoo though...forget it. My hair AND scalp just feel a combo of waxy, oily, and dry (no idea how that works out, haha). A lot of people actually need to clarify first before starting 'poo bars because of the 'cone buildup.
I'd personally transition like this - cone 'poo & condish -> low cone 'poo & dish -> 1 clarifying wash - > 'poo bars and conditioner, with acid rinse. Just my thoughts on the whole thing.

Rose in bloom - Hahaha, I understand about being a chicken with taking out the acid rinse. I can't go without the way Kathleen suggests, but I can cut the acid amount in half with no ill effects.

Manda - does Soap Works have a link? I found several companies with that as part of the name and I dont want to accidentally um, I dunno. Misinform you?

ljkforu
June 13th, 2009, 04:38 PM
What is in your water is so important regarding how stuff will work.

Personally, I can use any kind of poo or soap bar on my hair and so can all my friend in this soft water district. I can also use as many cones as I can get to stick (or not) it doesn't mater. I use a acid (vit c rinse) because it makes my hair softer and sleeker.

3azza, remind me where you are (is it Lebanon?) If your water is really hard you might have to do some weird things get anything to work. We all love to play with stuff so let us know where your water comes from and we will try and put together a routine for you to try. If you water is extra hard it might involve remelting regular high quality castille with a bit of borax on the stove. I really like soap better than SLS for my hair and there has to be a way to make it work for you.

Moonstruck
June 13th, 2009, 09:21 PM
ljkforu - hm, so rebatching the soap with something acidic works? Or is it because borax is sorta a surfactant, too? I've rebatched a few things before and have wondered about 'poo bars, but didn't know if that made any sense (and didn't want to waste a bar! Haha). Could you tell me more?

ljkforu
June 14th, 2009, 02:20 AM
ljkforu - hm, so rebatching the soap with something acidic works? Or is it because borax is sorta a surfactant, too? I've rebatched a few things before and have wondered about 'poo bars, but didn't know if that made any sense (and didn't want to waste a bar! Haha). Could you tell me more?
You can rebatch any bar you want to suite your needs. In the old days hard water soap contained borax. To rebatch, just great finely and add some water, then add your goodies and melt and remold.

3azza
June 14th, 2009, 07:07 AM
Thank you all for advice.
ljkforu, yeah i'm from lebanon, very hard water. I use high quality hand made 100% olive oil castile soap (sometimes bay leaf castile soap), they're common where i live.
hennaphile, thanks for the recipe, i might try that later, i did try beer on its own and acid rinse on its own but never toegther or with rose water.

MandaMom2Three
June 14th, 2009, 07:18 PM
Manda - does Soap Works have a link? I found several companies with that as part of the name and I dont want to accidentally um, I dunno. Misinform you?

Actually they DO (http://puresoapworks.com/)! :lol: I found it after I went ahead and asked. I didn't see any ingredients, but it DID say that it contained no detergents. SLS/ALS are detergents right? :shrug: .

Moonstruck
June 15th, 2009, 12:14 AM
Very cool, ljkforu. I'll have to try that sometime. I rebatch normal castile soaps to add fragrances I like sometimes, so this shouldn't be too different, I guess. How much do you usually add per 4 ounce bar or so?

SLS and ALS are both detergents, yep! It looks like they have a few main bar soap formulations. Some of the ones that have rounded edges look like they come from a vegetable glycerin base, which leads to a different texture and contains some additional things that I'm not sure what they do on scalp/hair. Others like the goat milk soap (and all the ones that are squarish) are made through hot/cold process soap, and are what we have tried here for our hair (CV, PLH, and SCH bars are all cold process). There are a few oval shaped ones that are NOT the vegetable glycerin base type, but instead might be cold processed and cut into the oval shapes. For instance, the Emu Oil soap says "tallow base," which means that it was primarily tallow with other stuff added. Other cold process soap ones have "coconut and palm" bases written. If you're vegan, you'll want to stay away from tallow bars (that's cow fat), but I personally think tallow makes a nice body soap - no idea what it's like on hair.

Hope that helps!

MandaMom2Three
June 15th, 2009, 05:13 AM
SLS and ALS are both detergents, yep! It looks like they have a few main bar soap formulations. Some of the ones that have rounded edges look like they come from a vegetable glycerin base, which leads to a different texture and contains some additional things that I'm not sure what they do on scalp/hair.

I like the Shampoo & Conditioner one. I've tried the tea tree and the emu oil one too, but S&C is my favourite.

ljkforu
June 16th, 2009, 02:59 AM
Very cool, ljkforu. I'll have to try that sometime. I rebatch normal castile soaps to add fragrances I like sometimes, so this shouldn't be too different, I guess. How much do you usually add per 4 ounce bar or so?

SLS and ALS are both detergents, yep! It looks like they have a few main bar soap formulations. Some of the ones that have rounded edges look like they come from a vegetable glycerin base, which leads to a different texture and contains some additional things that I'm not sure what they do on scalp/hair. Others like the goat milk soap (and all the ones that are squarish) are made through hot/cold process soap, and are what we have tried here for our hair (CV, PLH, and SCH bars are all cold process). There are a few oval shaped ones that are NOT the vegetable glycerin base type, but instead might be cold processed and cut into the oval shapes. For instance, the Emu Oil soap says "tallow base," which means that it was primarily tallow with other stuff added. Other cold process soap ones have "coconut and palm" bases written. If you're vegan, you'll want to stay away from tallow bars (that's cow fat), but I personally think tallow makes a nice body soap - no idea what it's like on hair.

Hope that helps!
Tallow is great on hair and I'd add about 1/8-1/4 tsp of borax to a bar.

Every doctor I've had has recommended Sodium Tallowate supper fatted soap to prevent allergies and it works for me.

rose_in_bloom
June 16th, 2009, 04:34 PM
I tried the PLH aloe fresh bar today, and it did not work well for me. My scalp hair is dry and rough, and my length is gummy. :( Oh well...I guess that bar will have to go in the body wash drawer.

Neoma
June 16th, 2009, 06:01 PM
I tried the PLH aloe fresh bar today, and it did not work well for me. My scalp hair is dry and rough, and my length is gummy. :( Oh well...I guess that bar will have to go in the body wash drawer.
That's one of my favorite shampoo bars, rose in bloom. Do you use an acid rinse? How about adding a shot of conditioner to your acid rinse? Or trying conditioner alone after you shampoo with the PLH bar? Just a thought...:flower:

ljkforu
June 17th, 2009, 12:11 AM
I got lazy lately regarding my acid rinse. With the rinse about 3/4 of my hair feels fried without the rinse 2 inches feel fried. It seems to really make a difference in my hair quality and I'm dealing with supper soft primo water.

Aries_jb
June 17th, 2009, 09:47 AM
I just tried CV Grapeseed Shea as a shampoo bar and I think I like it. I need to try it again with a different conditioner and follow it with a styling product I like better. I'm in the "thinning the product challenge something or other..." thread so I'm not using my favorite things at the moment. My scalp feels good though. Hopefully this bar works well on my face too so I can have a head to toe bath bar.

sagebabies
June 19th, 2009, 06:21 PM
Aries JB, I absolutely love the grapeseed shea bar. I've never tried it as a shampoo bar, but my body and face loves it and I adore the smell.

I'm wondering what other body bars people have used as shampoo bars? I just read on CV's site that they are higher in moisture content and I'd like to try one out. I just ordered several bars.......primrose, aloe aloe aloe, honey butter and a few others.

I know this topic has probably already been covered, but this thread is huge and I've not been able to read it all.

I'm so in love with shampoo bars. I was having major problems with dry scalp and dandruff and itchy-ness. Those problems went away virtually over night when I started using shampoo bars. I also condition after I use the poo bar, but only on my ends.

Anyway, if anyone has any experiences to share about using the regular soap bars for shampoo I'd love to hear them!!

Moonstruck
June 20th, 2009, 12:54 AM
I've tried the Shea Rose (the pink one) with decent results - soft hair, average volume, a little shine (but not much). Honey Beer was better for me - all of the above plus LOTS of shine! I love using it as a conditioner for that reason - my length GLEAMS.

Granted, I've never been overly concerned about "softness." It seems to me that my hair is never "soft" and I'm wondering if this is because East Asian hair has coarse strands? I do feel it when my hair gets wiry and strawlike... but softness? I've never experienced it, not even when I do 20 moisture treatments in a row. It gets very manageable and nicer, though.

Idun
June 20th, 2009, 07:36 AM
I donīt know if this has been asked before, but the thread is now 300 pages, so it is a lot to go through!

I just bought my first shampoobar so I have some questions. Do all of you rinse with vinegar after using a shampoobar? And if so, must you do it every time?

The ingredients of my new soap are: Ingredients: saponified sheabutter, organic cocoabutter, coco oil and ricinus oil. Superfatted with organic jojoba oil and avocado oil and organic olive oil. Honey and glycerin. I bought it here: http://www.fitjarsoap.no/

Madame J
June 20th, 2009, 07:45 AM
I donīt know if this has been asked before, but the thread is now 300 pages, so it is a lot to go through!

I just bought my first shampoobar so I have some questions. Do all of you rinse with vinegar after using a shampoobar? And if so, must you do it every time?

The ingredients of my new soap are: Ingredients: saponified sheabutter, organic cocoabutter, coco oil and ricinus oil. Superfatted with organic jojoba oil and avocado oil and organic olive oil. Honey and glycerin. I bought it here: http://www.fitjarsoap.no/

Vinegar rinsing has more to do with your shower water than with the specific bar of soap, I think. If you have "hard water" (i.e., water with a lot of dissolved minerals in it), you may need to rinse to prevent buildup. That said, I live in a soft water area and vinegar rinse every time I use my 'poo bar. I think it the bar leaves my hair feeling a little sticky, and with a vinegar rinse it feels clean and healthy. You don't need much -- just a tablespoon or two diluted in a cup of water. And I rinse again after the vinegar.

You may find that you don't need a rinse afterwards, but if your hair feels tacky after you wash, you might want to try it. For your first wash, you might try having a rinse on hand, in case your hair feels weird right after you wash it with the bar.

Idun
June 20th, 2009, 08:01 AM
Vinegar rinsing has more to do with your shower water than with the specific bar of soap, I think. If you have "hard water" (i.e., water with a lot of dissolved minerals in it), you may need to rinse to prevent buildup. That said, I live in a soft water area and vinegar rinse every time I use my 'poo bar. I think it the bar leaves my hair feeling a little sticky, and with a vinegar rinse it feels clean and healthy. You don't need much -- just a tablespoon or two diluted in a cup of water. And I rinse again after the vinegar.

You may find that you don't need a rinse afterwards, but if your hair feels tacky after you wash, you might want to try it. For your first wash, you might try having a rinse on hand, in case your hair feels weird right after you wash it with the bar.

Thank you for the advise! I think the water here is a little hard, but I do not really know for sure. Is there some measuring device to establish how hard it is?

Madame J
June 20th, 2009, 08:07 AM
Thank you for the advise! I think the water here is a little hard, but I do not really know for sure. Is there some measuring device to establish how hard it is?

Honestly, I would suggest you see how your hair feels after you wash it with the bar and use that as a gauge. I notice right away, when it's still wet, that it feels almost sticky to the touch and snags on my fingers very easily. I have to handle it even more carefully than usual before I rinse it with the vinegar.

I have heard that, in general, European water is harder than US. You can possibly find a data table with the mineral content in your water online if you search for a while.

Idun
June 20th, 2009, 08:45 AM
Ok, thanks. My daughter swims and she often gets that sticky feeling in her hair, so I do know what you mean. :)

TessieAnn
June 20th, 2009, 09:21 AM
You will find that there is a chemical reaction that occurs with the vinegar rinse. The feel of your hair will change instantly from waxy-feeling to very soft.

You can actually use even less than mentioned above--say a tablespoon in a liter of water.

Aries_jb
June 20th, 2009, 12:48 PM
Aries JB, I absolutely love the grapeseed shea bar. I've never tried it as a shampoo bar, but my body and face loves it and I adore the smell.

I'm wondering what other body bars people have used as shampoo bars? I just read on CV's site that they are higher in moisture content and I'd like to try one out. I just ordered several bars.......primrose, aloe aloe aloe, honey butter and a few others.

I know this topic has probably already been covered, but this thread is huge and I've not been able to read it all.

I'm so in love with shampoo bars. I was having major problems with dry scalp and dandruff and itchy-ness. Those problems went away virtually over night when I started using shampoo bars. I also condition after I use the poo bar, but only on my ends.

Anyway, if anyone has any experiences to share about using the regular soap bars for shampoo I'd love to hear them!!

I'm loving Grapeseed Shea as a body and shampoo bar. It's definitely going back on my reorder list. I need to wait awhile before I can say it's good for my face, though. So far, it doesn't make my face dry or tight and I like the way my face glows with it, but I'm hoping I don't break out. And you're right...it smells SO good!

I've also tried Shea Rose Clay as a shampoo bar and it works pretty well. I have to make sure to massage my scalp more thoroughly with it since it's so gentle. Otherwise I love it.

I should say that my hair is not very fussy when it comes to different "flavors" of shampoo or soap bars. I've never had a bar of either type work terribly for me. Then again, I'm barely getting into a routine of using the same bar all the time and not rotating like I used to, so that may change.

ljkforu
June 21st, 2009, 05:49 PM
Aries JB, I absolutely love the grapeseed shea bar. I've never tried it as a shampoo bar, but my body and face loves it and I adore the smell.

I'm wondering what other body bars people have used as shampoo bars? I just read on CV's site that they are higher in moisture content and I'd like to try one out. I just ordered several bars.......primrose, aloe aloe aloe, honey butter and a few others.

I know this topic has probably already been covered, but this thread is huge and I've not been able to read it all.

I'm so in love with shampoo bars. I was having major problems with dry scalp and dandruff and itchy-ness. Those problems went away virtually over night when I started using shampoo bars. I also condition after I use the poo bar, but only on my ends.

Anyway, if anyone has any experiences to share about using the regular soap bars for shampoo I'd love to hear them!!
I've tried more than 20 so give me an example and I'll tell you what it does in soft water :D

Chromis
June 21st, 2009, 06:00 PM
Thank you for the advise! I think the water here is a little hard, but I do not really know for sure. Is there some measuring device to establish how hard it is?

You bet! You can buy pH and water hardness test kits from aquaruim shops and pool stores :)

ljkforu
June 21st, 2009, 08:12 PM
You will find that there is a chemical reaction that occurs with the vinegar rinse. The feel of your hair will change instantly from waxy-feeling to very soft.

You can actually use even less than mentioned above--say a tablespoon in a liter of water.
The same thing happens for me when I use my vit C crystal rinse (1/4 tsp to 20 oz water). When I apply a cool rinse of it after conditioning my hair just instantly turns to silk. Oh, I have really soft water too.

Cherry_Sprinkle
June 21st, 2009, 08:25 PM
I have a question.. I am thinking of using a bar for the times when I do shampoo and I have a question.. is the ingredients in the bar strong enough to remove color from chemically treated hair? I've had coconut milk pull color but I loved the way it felt after so I would love to use a coconut bar but I am kind of afraid to try..

and any advice for fine, curly, chemically treated hair would be great!

*edit* I am thinking to purchase some samples of the coconut milk, honey beer & egg, and olive babassu from CV.. anyone use these?

Nyghtingale
June 21st, 2009, 09:33 PM
I am going to try the vinegar rinse tomorrow, thanks

Elanor
June 21st, 2009, 11:03 PM
I read the 30 first pages of this thread and got the courage to buy my first shampoo bar at a Finnish natural consmetics store :D Yesterday I washed with it for the first time. I lathered twice, after which my hair felt a little waxy and tangly. I had prepared for that with a vinegar rinse (1 part white vinegar, 10 parts water), and that seemed to soften the hair.

When it dried I was a little disappointed. I have a very slippery hair, and usually I CO, which makes the hair even more slippery. I had hoped shampoo bars would give some body and hold to my hair, but it didn't really make a big difference. My ends feel even drier than usual and my front hairline looks a bit greasy.

We have soft water and my vinegar rinse might have been a bit too strong, so that could be why my ends feel dry. I might try my light, organic hemp conditioner next time, instead of the vinegar.

I'm really hoping this starts to work for me. I've been looking for a natural, organic product to clean my hair with, but the liquid shampoos are always too drying and the conditioners too oily for COing.

Idun
June 22nd, 2009, 01:13 AM
You bet! You can buy pH and water hardness test kits from aquaruim shops and pool stores :)

Great! I will try that. It interests me to find out what the water is like here, and I could not find any info on the web.

manderly
June 22nd, 2009, 01:30 AM
I have a question.. I am thinking of using a bar for the times when I do shampoo and I have a question.. is the ingredients in the bar strong enough to remove color from chemically treated hair? I've had coconut milk pull color but I loved the way it felt after so I would love to use a coconut bar but I am kind of afraid to try..

and any advice for fine, curly, chemically treated hair would be great!

*edit* I am thinking to purchase some samples of the coconut milk, honey beer & egg, and olive babassu from CV.. anyone use these?

I regularly use the O&B and only occasionally use the honey, beer & egg.

I've also used semi-perm, permenant, and henna blends. I did experience fading like I might have from a regular SLS shampoo....however my color seems to be staying put finally, so I think I may have had a porosity issue more than an issue with the poo bars.

HTH

Idun
June 22nd, 2009, 02:04 AM
I read the 30 first pages of this thread and got the courage to buy my first shampoo bar at a Finnish natural consmetics store :D Yesterday I washed with it for the first time. I lathered twice, after which my hair felt a little waxy and tangly. I had prepared for that with a vinegar rinse (1 part white vinegar, 10 parts water), and that seemed to soften the hair.

When it dried I was a little disappointed. I have a very slippery hair, and usually I CO, which makes the hair even more slippery. I had hoped shampoo bars would give some body and hold to my hair, but it didn't really make a big difference. My ends feel even drier than usual and my front hairline looks a bit greasy.

We have soft water and my vinegar rinse might have been a bit too strong, so that could be why my ends feel dry. I might try my light, organic hemp conditioner next time, instead of the vinegar.

I'm really hoping this starts to work for me. I've been looking for a natural, organic product to clean my hair with, but the liquid shampoos are always too drying and the conditioners too oily for COing.

I think my hair is very similar to yours. :) Yesterday I too washed my hair with a shampoobar for the first time, without getting brilliant results. (-Although I think I must work on my teqnique.) I first washed my hair with a clearifier since I have been using conditioners with cones. In retrospect I know I did not need to wash it again with the soapbar, but I wanted so much to try it :D. I lathered once with difficulty, and got a little bit of that sticky feeling in my hair after rinsing it out. Rinsed again with 1 liter water + 1 1/5 - 2 dinnerspoons of 7 % vinegar. It felt much softer after that. I then put a hairtreatment from the same make, waited for 30 min. and rinsed with ordinary water. When the hair was still a little damp I put in 3 drops of camelia oil at the ends. I have never put oil in my hair either so there was a number of new things going on. -From that experience I now know one drop is enough!!

I would say the result is of medium success. My hair is kind of softer and feels heavier somehow. But it is less shiny and has less ... I donīt know the word... - "spring" in it. But I will not give up after one try. Maybe the right amount of vinegar would be a little more than I used and maybe less than you used? Next time I will go with 1 dl. to 1 l. I also wonder if I should have rinsed with vinegar after the treatment?

nueinsel
June 22nd, 2009, 09:58 AM
Hello everyone. Thank you so much for this thread. I finally finished reading it, and there is a lot of good information in its 300 pages.

A very long intro, first: I began using natural hair care products about a year and a half ago. I started with liquid castille soaps (dr. bronners followed by burt's bees), with horrible results. They left my hair incredibly waxy, never lathered even a little bit, and didn't clean terribly well either. Then I tried the no 'poo method for awhile (BS and ACV, also BS and WV, also water only, applesauce, beer, vinegar only, you name it) for about six months, with similarly awful results (lots of greasiness, lots of waxiness, lots of tangliness and breakage).

Finally I switched to shampoo bars (first one from henna for hair, then several from CV), and was extremely pleased because, by comparison they were so much better. While using them I would typically lather two to three times by rubbing the bar on over my roots like a comb, then work the lather in with my fingers. It took usually 3 lathers before I got a good amount of bubbles, but I would also get a lot more of the waxy feeling if I lathered that many times. I used a vinegar rinse (usually 1 tbsp to 2 cups water) after every third wash, because that's when the waxies became noticeably bad. Towards the end of the experiment, I began rinsing with vinegar Before I shampooed, because using vinegar last has always made my hair look very stringy and frizzy (the individual hairs feel awsome, but clump together, and the end of each strand curls up in my otherwise stick-straight hair so I end up with numerous little halos of short hairs). I never followed with conditioner because I hadn't used conditioner regularly since I was about thirteen.

Of the bars I tried, my favorite was probably honey beer and egg. I did this for about nine months, and while the results were much better than the previous natural methods I'd tried, I did still shed a ton, my hair became very fragile (probably because it wasn't protected by the cones anymore), it was always either greasy, waxy, or frizzy, and I was never able to get the lather worked into the hair at the nape of my neck (no matter how many ways I parted my hair in the shower). I really enjoyed the incredible softness of my hair, while using the shampoo bars, and loved using a biodegradable, made-by-a-real-person, minimally packaged product (that was the whole point of switching to natural hair products, not so much my hair health), but the crappy appearance of my hair was getting me down too.

About three months ago, I ran out of my last shampoo bar sample and decided to just go back to commercial shampoo (specifically pantene, since that's what my boyfriend uses and it was already on hand). Currently my routine is to do a heavy oiling with coconut oil the night before I wash, then lather once with the shampoo, rinse, condition the length, and rinse. I do this once every five days, same frequency as with the shampoo bars, and my hair gets greasy on about the same schedule. With this routine, my hair is smooth and very straight, not at all tangly, and the split ends have been mostly covered up by the -cones. The coconut oil helps to soften my hair quite a bit, though without it, my hair feels like dolls hair, very synthetic.

I'm ready, now, to give shampoo bars a second go, because ultimately I don't want to be using commercial products on any part of my body, but I would also like to find a way for my hair to look pretty. So, here are my questions:

1. Any suggestions on making my hair like vinegar rinses, because I too feel they're pretty essential in making the shampoo bars work?
2. For those of you that liquify your shampoo bars, what ratios of water to shampoo do you use, and do you find you get more lather on the first try this way?
3. What would you suggest I keep in my current routine (i.e., will the shampoo bars be cleansing enough to wash out the coconut oil? should I follow with conditioner? if so, before, after or during the vinegar rinse?).
4. Any other general suggestions?

Thank you guys so much in advance, especially those of you who actually read all of my words. I'll post shorter replies from now on, I promise!

Fractalsofhair
June 22nd, 2009, 11:21 AM
You don't need a vinegar rinse, if it doesn't work for your hair. A natural conditioner will do a similar job(I like Alaffia for my VERY dry hair, and it's made to work with a soap based shampoo). If you have soft water, you might not need to use one at all. You generally need to clarify if you used cones before if you want to go straight to soap(Whole foods sells tiny little travel sized bottles of their SLS shampoo that is pretty decent and cheap, and one of those for 1-2 washes should clarify your hair). BTW, Burt's Bee's doesn't make a liquid castile soap, they make a shampoo based off gentle detergents. What I often do is I saturate my hair in coconut milk, and then wash with Doc Bronners, though I do want to try Chagrin Valley.

If you're using pantene, it is VERY high in cones, so I suggest a cone free SLS shampoo daily for a week or so, with a cone free conditioner. Whole foods 365 brand is a cheap great cone free conditioner that comes in big bottles as well, so you waste less packaging(And again much more natural than other products, though not perfect).

Alaffia is a great free trade company as well. What helps to seal my splits is shea butter on a brush, brushed into my hair. It gives me the coney seal, and when followed with coconut or sweet almond oil, I get that shine as well. If you have very hard water(I did a test and it turns out mine and my next door neighbor from childhood have very soft water, which explains why shampoo bars work! I thought I had hard water), you can use collected rainwater or distilled water to wash your hair in. I suggest a rain water barrel if you decide to do this route. If WV/ACV give you waxies, I suggest rinsing them out fully. I use conditioner after washing my hair(Most often with Alaffia liquid, but sometimes with Doc Bronners bars), and then the rinse. It should get the coconut oil out with several lathers, but your hair might look greasy the next day. Soap bars aren't as cleansing, which is great for our hair, but you might not need to oil as much.