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View Full Version : Funky Hair Syndrome (shampoo bar use)



xoLegallyAubrey
May 7th, 2009, 04:40 PM
Hey everybody. :)

I'm currently going through the 'funky hair' time period which follows switching to shampoo bars. This is supposed to be temporary. I really hope so. It's not that bad, but it's not its usual softness, and it's kind of hard to make it do what I want right now.

For anybody who is curious, I just switched from CWCing with Naked Naturals (the one with Avocado and Shea Butter) and I am now using CV's Café Moreno shampoo bar. I have done an ACV rinse, but I really don't like doing those. Aside from the smell (which I'm terribly sensitive to) it tends to have a lightening my hair, which I really don't want anything. Which is why I picked the CV bar for brunette hair.

Any tips or words of encouragement would be wonderful. I really want these to work for me. =) Also, have any of your experiences worked out like mine? With CV bars or any shampoo bars, really.:confused:

Ps- just added a poll!

viking_quest
May 7th, 2009, 04:47 PM
Do you have hard water? I've heard that hard water and shampoo bars aren't the best of friends.

Anje
May 7th, 2009, 05:05 PM
Yeah, hard water and any soap-based (as opposed to detergent-based) shampoo just don't get along for longhairs, though folks with short hair like my hubby don't seem to care. I've got him using Cafe Moreno, too, and he likes it. (Caffeine is supposed to reduce DHT, and I've heard other folks here say that they had less shedding with that bar.)

You might want to look at rinsing with citric acid. It's a little more difficult to come by (check local asian food stores before you buy it online), and it tends to be in a powdered form, but it has very little odor and also functions as a chelator. I think the measurement is something like 1 tsp per liter of water, but that might actually be too strong. Make sure you dissolve it well.

xoLegallyAubrey
May 7th, 2009, 05:20 PM
Oh thanks.

I do have really hard water. Will the shampoo bar not work at all, then?

Kirin
May 7th, 2009, 06:09 PM
Oh thanks.

I do have really hard water. Will the shampoo bar not work at all, then?

In my experience, not really. I have semi-hard water and nothing aside from scrubbing my hair vigilantly with clarifying shampoo would fix it. I tried shampoo bars for a long time, and ended up with a tangled matted mess.... so do be forewarned. Shampoo bars, though SLS free are not damage free, especially in hard water circumstances.

xoLegallyAubrey
May 7th, 2009, 06:12 PM
Aww okay. I really wanted to love this, ya know?

Do you suggest I go back to my old routine? Or anything else?

SpecialKitty
May 7th, 2009, 06:24 PM
You might try a catnip tea rinse after using your shampoo bar. I've had good luck with it, as it is slightly acidic. It doesn't have a strong smell like ACV either. If you leave it in, it can lighten hair, but if you just rinse with it, your hair should be fine. I'm running off to find the link for you.....

Here you go:

Catnip Thread (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/showthread.php?t=476)

Catnip Article (http://forums.longhaircommunity.com/vbjournal.php?do=article&articleid=118)

joyellen
May 7th, 2009, 06:25 PM
I have hard water and as much as I wanted poo bars to work for me, they didn't. I couldn't get past the funky, waxy-yet-dry hair, even with a vinegar rinse. I wish you luck with the poo bars though.

xoLegallyAubrey
May 7th, 2009, 06:33 PM
Thanks so much for the article, Kitty, but I'm kind of paranoid about things that can potentially lighten my hair, so I think I'm going to steer clear.

Joyellen, I'm exactly the same boat. Should I give it another week, or is it just not worth it?

I feel really bad now, though, because before I received my bars, I recommended them to many people in my area, who bought them. We all have hard water.:couch:

joyellen
May 7th, 2009, 06:39 PM
Has your funky-hairedness gotten any better since you started using them? If it has improved a bit and you think one more week of use would be enough to push through the funky phase, I'd say do it. Then maybe you could come back and tell me that there's hope for me, too. :p

andrea1982
May 7th, 2009, 06:50 PM
Aww okay. I really wanted to love this, ya know?

Do you suggest I go back to my old routine? Or anything else?

Are you doing multiple latherings? That sometimes helps. You could try following the bar with a really light conditioner, to help the ph balance of your hair since you're not doing a vinegar rinse. Or, try a final rinse with distilled water maybe? I just moved from a place that had really soft water (shampoo bars worked beautifully!) to a place with much harder water (waxy yucky :( ). I am dissipointed I can't use up my shampoo bars, but this summer I'm going to try washing my hair in the river with the the shampoo bar to see how that works. River/lake water is supposed to be soft, and natural soap is environmentally friendly (or more so than detergent).

xoLegallyAubrey
May 7th, 2009, 07:03 PM
Joyellen, I'll think about it. I think you'll know what I mean when I say that the waxiness is nearly unbearable. I just might do it though. Then I'll know for sure and wont have to wonder and all that.

Andrea, yeah I'm lathering about three times. It is disappointing, isn't it? I was just in Maine and I borrowed my friend's 'poo bar there, and it worked wonders. It just isn't cutting it.

And what's worse, my bunwaves aren't working because of all the waxiness. I may just give up after this weekend. A shame too, the bar smells lovely. I guess I'll just use it for travel because it's not liquid.

lockslessmonstr
May 8th, 2009, 08:46 AM
Dangit! I just bought 4 samples of CV shampoo bars. I was so excited to try a bar for the first time, but I have semi hard water. Ugh.

You know, I have seen shower head filters that soften water. Priced from $25 -$75. Maybe that's worth looking into. Soft water is better for hair and skin anyway. Just a thought.

SimplyViki
May 8th, 2009, 09:13 AM
I also live in Miami, with hard water. I bought a filter for my shower after trying (and giving up) with CV bars... It wasn't too expensive, actually, I think mine was like $20 at Home Depot. I still haven't tried the CV bars with the filter though. I was kinda traumatized by the waxy gunk that was coating my hair, even though I double lathered and vinegar rinsed. For the record though, I gave up pretty quickly - I only gave it a couple of weeks, and that's only maybe 4 or 5 washings. It just seemed like I had soap scum in my hair... but I am half considering mustering up the courage to go ahead and try again now that I have the water filter. If I do, I'll let you know what happens.

SimplyViki
May 8th, 2009, 09:13 AM
Oh and at any rate, the shampoo bars work just fine as a body soap - CV's got me hooked on soaps instead of body wash!

GeoJ
May 8th, 2009, 10:04 AM
I also live in Miami, with hard water. I bought a filter for my shower after trying (and giving up) with CV bars... It wasn't too expensive, actually, I think mine was like $20 at Home Depot. I still haven't tried the CV bars with the filter though. I was kinda traumatized by the waxy gunk that was coating my hair, even though I double lathered and vinegar rinsed. For the record though, I gave up pretty quickly - I only gave it a couple of weeks, and that's only maybe 4 or 5 washings. It just seemed like I had soap scum in my hair... but I am half considering mustering up the courage to go ahead and try again now that I have the water filter. If I do, I'll let you know what happens.

I don't know if the $20 filter from Home Depot will help. I have one and it does not seem to soften my water. I still get hard water deposits (although maybe slightly less) in my shower, and I do get waxy buildup from the shampoo bars. I did feel improvement in my hair with the filter when using AO shampoos.

I have had different results with different bars, the best so far being the honey, beer, and egg bar for me.

I am thinking of trying different rinses, and trying out washing with water from different sources. Well, I am off to break out my hardness test kit and test some waters!

:)

SimplyViki
May 8th, 2009, 12:22 PM
Aww, maybe it won't be such a great idea to try using those things again - I hated the waxies, and I'd miss my cones. I think I'll just stick to using the CV bars as just soap.
Oh where can you get one of those hardness test kits? I've heard about them, but I'm never sure where to get one.

Norai
May 8th, 2009, 12:33 PM
You might try diluting the vinegar further, or using white vinegar instead of apple (can't recall which you said you were using). Anything mildly acidic will work, you can also use a diluted citric acid solution which shouldn't smell at all. :)

I have also heard that salt bar soap lathers better in hard water - I don't know what that will do to your hair, but it is supposedly very good (better than normal soap even) for your skin even with (or because of?) the huge amount of salt in it.

I have some salt bars that won't be usable for about a month yet, I'll try them on my hair for kicks when they're done.

lynnala
May 8th, 2009, 12:49 PM
I have hard water here, and I used to use the Cafe Moreno bars with great success. It did take about a month for my hair to get used to the shampoo bars though, and also, I had to change my own perceptions of how my hair should be. The effects from shampoo bars are just different from shampoo. They gave my hair much more weight and body, but the texture felt completely different from after shampoo. The only reason I stopped using them is because I switched to Indian herb washing, but I still use the Cafe Moreno bar when I don't have any herb mix, and I still like it a lot.

deko
May 8th, 2009, 02:58 PM
Soft water & bad results. I tried and tried, and finally used my shampoo bar as hand-wash. Vinegar rinses didn't work, my hair felt like it was full of wax. No poo bars for me anymore.

xoLegallyAubrey
May 8th, 2009, 03:57 PM
I did consider giving them a try for a while longer, but my hair this morning, instead of coming out in its usual pretty bunwaves, looked like a cow turd. :(

Very very disappointing. And I can tell these are good products, they just are not working. I don't see how it could be working. I need a new obsession. Anyone have an oil recommendation?

Anje
May 8th, 2009, 04:08 PM
I had OK results with hard water and shampoo bars, but it wasn't great. A slightly potent vinegar rinse (typically white vinegar) would always totally fix the waxies. My problem was just that my hair needs conditioner, and I get better results from CO washing.

Eden Iris
May 8th, 2009, 04:44 PM
I had problems with CV bars and hard water, but better results with other brands (right now using Camamu; have used Liggett's; one of these days want to try PLH). I lather twice, condition the ends, then rinse with white vinegar/filtered water 1:10. If I notice some waxy buildup (every month or two) I do a clarifying shampoo. I've noticed no lightening from the vinegar, but my hair is very dark.

As others have mentioned, if the poo bars are a total failure they still make good body soap.

masterofmidgets
May 8th, 2009, 08:46 PM
I have moderately hard water both at home in NM and at school in CA, and I've had pretty good results with CV bars. The first week or two when I first rinsed my hair it was a little scary - very clean, but so waxy I couldn't even run my hands down my hair. But the vinegar rinse fixed that as soon as I poured it on. And now I know my hair's adjusted a lot more - I still do the vinegar rinse, but even before I do my hair doesn't feel weird any more.

I got used to the smell of ACV after a few weeks and I don't even notice it anymore, but if it really bothers you, like other people have said, you can try just white vinegar or a citric acid rinse. One of my RL friends (who also uses shampoo bars) uses lime juice. Maybe add some conditioner to the rinse, or use it like normal afterward? Some people can go without, but my hair throws a fit if I don't slather it in conditioner, even with shampoo bars.

And don't be too upset if you can't get them to work - I love them, but some people just never can get the hang of them. Nothing wrong with that!

UncommonTart
May 8th, 2009, 09:10 PM
If you're set on trying sulfate-free you could try a liquid soap-based shampoo. Aubrey Organics and Burt's Bees both make sulfate-free shampoos. They are soap based, but being liquid, they might work a little better for you than the bars. I'm sure there are some other sulfate free shampoos out there, but that's all that I've got personal experience with.

I'm sorry to hear that the bars aren't working out for you. I just started my CV samples, and I've had as many good hair days as bad so far, so I don't know about the 'poo bars yet, but I sure do love the soaps.

As far as oils go, my favorite is jojoba for my hair. I keep several different essential oils around to add to my jojoba for scent or other benefits. (Rosemary is supposed to be very good for your scalp, for instance. I've never had scalp problems, so I can't say for sure. Unless that means it's working. ;) )

rose_in_bloom
May 8th, 2009, 11:59 PM
If you're set on trying sulfate-free you could try a liquid soap-based shampoo. Aubrey Organics and Burt's Bees both make sulfate-free shampoos. They are soap based, but being liquid, they might work a little better for you than the bars. I'm sure there are some other sulfate free shampoos out there, but that's all that I've got personal experience with.

I second that advice. I have hard water and Aubrey Organics worked well for me, especially with an occasional mild vinegar rinse. I haven't tried Burt's Bees. Nature's Gate Organics shampoos are great too if you're trying to go sulfate free. They contain disodium laureth sulfosuccinate, which is a mild detergent.

I hope you find something that works for you! :)

Nanni
May 9th, 2009, 06:50 AM
We have soft water here so shampoo-bars works great. I have tried different kinds of CV-bars and I love them. I have no problem with getting them to lather up.
Shampoo-bars are the best.

UncommonTart
May 9th, 2009, 09:16 AM
I second that advice. I have hard water and Aubrey Organics worked well for me, especially with an occasional mild vinegar rinse. I haven't tried Burt's Bees. Nature's Gate Organics shampoos are great too if you're trying to go sulfate free. They contain disodium laureth sulfosuccinate, which is a mild detergent.

I hope you find something that works for you! :)

You know, I did not realize that Nature's Gate is sulfate free- how silly was that? Maybe I'll try them sometime. /hijack

Calista
May 9th, 2009, 09:28 AM
There are very few people who use shampoo bars and can get by without a vinegar rinse (or I should probably say an acidic rinse), but for hard water it is absolutely vital that you do one every time you wash. Don´t be afraid to overdose - usually people are too timid rather than going overboard. For instance, I have moderately hard water, and my vinegar rinse is 1:9 (100ml vinegar+900ml water). You could go even more concentrated if you have truly hard water. Without a vinegar rinse your hair will be awful, just as you described.

Also, did you clarify before starting with shampoo bars? Maybe you have some old product buildup. Just a thought, though it doesn´t seem likely from your previous routine.

And FWIW, Café Moreno never gave me good results. CV bars are all very different, because Ida actually uses different ingredients for her shampoos rather than just scenting them differently. You might have better results with a different bar.

Velouria
May 9th, 2009, 07:12 PM
You know, I did not realize that Nature's Gate is sulfate free- how silly was that? Maybe I'll try them sometime. /hijack

Only the Nature's Gate *Organics* line (the smaller bottles, bigger price-tag NG's) are technically sulfate-free....I think that the disodium laureth etc. detergent is practically a sulfate anyway.

The regular NG's (in the big beige bootles) contain straight-out sulfates, SLES usually.

I don't think that Aubrey Organics or Burt's Bees are truly soap-based, either. They're made with these new detergents (coco, decyl, and lauryl glucosides) that, from what I've read, seem to be completely naturally-derived and gentle, but they aren't soap. On the dictionary page on Aubrey's site it says that coco-glucoside (the one they use) is "a natural cleansing and foaming agent made from coconut/palm fatty alcohols and glucose obtained from corn."
That's not how soap is made; these products aren't soap-based. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing; not everyone's hair or water works with soap.

AO shampoos used to be soap-based, but they changed the formula years ago. It says "coconut-corn oil soap" on their labels now, but if you look at the ingredient dictionary on their site, the entry for coco-glucoside says "see coconut-corn oil soap." So they aren't being entirely honest. A quick google will tell anybody that coco-glucoside is a detergent, not a soap.

The Burt's Bees shampoos contain that class of detergent, but they also contain coco betaine, which is definitely not natural, though it is much milder than the sulfates.

UncommonTart
May 12th, 2009, 11:10 AM
Only the Nature's Gate *Organics* line (the smaller bottles, bigger price-tag NG's) are technically sulfate-free....I think that the disodium laureth etc. detergent is practically a sulfate anyway.

The regular NG's (in the big beige bootles) contain straight-out sulfates, SLES usually.

I don't think that Aubrey Organics or Burt's Bees are truly soap-based, either. They're made with these new detergents (coco, decyl, and lauryl glucosides) that, from what I've read, seem to be naturally-derived and gentle, but they completely aren't soap. On the dictionary page on Aubrey's site it says that coco-glucoside (the one they use) is "a natural cleansing and foaming agent made from coconut/palm fatty alcohols and glucose obtained from corn."
That's not how soap is made; these products aren't soap-based. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing; not everyone's hair or water works with soap.

AO shampoos used to be soap-based, but they changed the formula years ago. It says "coconut-corn oil soap" on their labels now, but if you look at the ingredient dictionary on their site, the entry for coco-glucoside says "see coconut-corn oil soap." So they aren't being entirely honest. A quick google will tell anybody that coco-glucoside is a detergent, not a soap.

The Burt's Bees shampoos contain that class of detergent, but they also contain coco betaine, which is definitely not natural, though it is much milder than the sulfates.


That's good to know, thank you. I've used the Aubrey Organics Honeysuckle Rose shampoo and conditioner on and off again since practically forever, but I can hardly use the shampoo anymore since developing an allergy to soy, so I wasn't aware that the formula had ever changed. (I didn't really pay any attention to ingredients until I developed my allergy, and then I discovered that soy is in nearly everything in some form. This must all have occured after the formula change.)